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Official Formula 1 Thread (Part 8)
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bingoman
28-03-2014
Just out of curiosity can the Fuel Sensors be tampered with while on the car because it seems odd that all the other teams have had no Problems with sensors just Red Bull
Si_Crewe
29-03-2014
Originally Posted by Si_Crewe:
“In other news, apparently somebody asked Renault if they've got enough money to properly develop the car and compete with the top teams and the reply was something like "Top teams? Right now we don't even have the same budget as Marussia or Caterham" ”

Just realised I wrote "Renault" when, in fact, I meant "Lotus".

I told you I was ill.
Si_Crewe
29-03-2014
Originally Posted by bingoman:
“Just out of curiosity can the Fuel Sensors be tampered with while on the car because it seems odd that all the other teams have had no Problems with sensors just Red Bull”

Just watching THIS and it seems Perez's f/m was non-functional for the entire race.

The consensus seems to be that most, if not all, the teams are seeing variations between what the f/m shows and what the engine-management says but what everybody else chose to do was add an offset (or "fiddle factor") to the engine-management readings to govern fuel-flow when/if the f/m went wrong.

So, for example, if a car was going flat-out along a straight (with an apparently functional f/m) and the FIA f/m was reading 99.6 kg/hr, the team's EM system might be saying they're using 94.6 kg/hr.

If the team then notices, at some point, that on the same bit of track, the f/m is reading 101.8 kg/hr when the EM says they're now using 93.4 kg/hr then the team can assume that the f/m has developed an inaccuracy and fall back an using their EM system to ensure compliance with the rule.

They'd look at the time when the f/m was considered to be working properly, realise that there was a 5kg/hr difference between the f/m and EM readings (99.6 - 94.6) and then add that to the current EM reading to get the theoretical true reading.
So, 93.4 + 5 = 98.4 kg/hr, which means the car is still within the rules even though the f/m has started saying it's breaking the rule.


In DR's case, it seems that RBR are saying that they noticed the f/m was drifting away from what the EM telemetry was saying and they did go through the motions of applying an offset to the EM readings and use that to control the fuel-flow but the FIA are saying that they don't think the f/m was actually faulty.

Trouble is, RBR certainly are capable of deliberately generating a situation which might undermine the credibility of the f/m so they can claim it's faulty and use that as an excuse to ignore it but, then again, it's up to the FIA to provide a tool that's robust enough not to be susceptible to those kind of shenanigans.
Hoffmister
29-03-2014
SKY Brunos voice is boring my ears off..smashing guy but his voice is just a drone for me
U.R.Correct
29-03-2014
Torrential rain has delayed qualifying

15 mins so far but it's absolutely lashing down
Hoffmister
29-03-2014
yikes....
gomezz
29-03-2014
Have to go to work soon so I have set extra timers to record BBC1, BBC2 and the Red Button up to 11:30 am and also the quali rerun show this afternoon.
Hoffmister
29-03-2014
gomezz... smart move
Andy_Thomas
29-03-2014
The Red Bulls are lot faster than people thought they would be then, after testing. I can see Vettel winning yet another title.
Mark F
29-03-2014
All teams are having trouble deciding which tyres to use!

Going to make it interesting tomorrow if its a wet race.
coughthecat
29-03-2014
A bit silly if it now takes two laps to fully recharge the energy-recovery system. If you're baulked on a quick lap in qualifying, you can potentially lose three laps in total. That can equate to around six minutes in a single session!
gds1972
29-03-2014
If it's a full wet race it could still play in to Buttons hands a little for using inters in Q3
gomezz
29-03-2014
I thought you were not tied to starting tyre choice if you qualified on a wet or inter?
TheToonArmy
29-03-2014
Originally Posted by gomezz:
“I thought you were not tied to starting tyre choice if you qualified on a wet or inter?”

I believe you are correct
coughthecat
29-03-2014
Originally Posted by Andy_Thomas:
“The Red Bulls are lot faster than people thought they would be then, after testing. I can see Vettel winning yet another title.”

I think it was always rumoured to be good aerodynamically (as you'd expect from Newey) but was being let down by the engine.

I love how in such a high-tech sport, Vettel's problem in Q1 was apparently solved by the old trick of switching it off, and switching it on again!
Nessun Dorma
29-03-2014
Originally Posted by dee_eff:
“Those are my thoughts exactly, but we all know that, when under pressure, the FIA can always find, or create a loophole in order to placate those whom they see as vital to F1.
With Mateschitz reported as saying his company could quit Formula 1 if he is not happy with the way the sport is run, this just may be enough pressure to ensure the appeal's overturning.”

So, in other words, Red Bull will be taking over where Ferrari left off. All this blow and bluster is not doing the sport any good at all. What happenes when Red Bull break the rules again? Will Mateschitz use the same threat and have the FIA bow to his demands again?
Nessun Dorma
29-03-2014
Originally Posted by dee_eff:
“What piques my interest is the possibility of RBR, who are supremely confident that they will win their appeal, also ignoring the rules this weekend, or will they suddenly find that their flow-meter is within acceptable range.
Not long to wait. ”

I don't really see why they should expect that at all. They knew the rules, but decided that they didn't apply to Red Bull, like they do to all the other teams. Is this now Formula One, as sponsored by Red Bull?
guypd
29-03-2014
Originally Posted by Andy_Thomas:
“The Red Bulls are lot faster than people thought they would be then, after testing. I can see Vettel winning yet another title.”


Of course. He'll only stop winning when he retires, which I guess happens once he's bagged Schumaker's record. I'm only watching this now out of sheer habit plus nothing better to do. I cannot understand how the collective might of all the other teams cannot work out how to make a car to beat the Red Bulls.
Jesse Pinkman
30-03-2014
In case you are watching it later I'll spoiler tag this.

Spoiler
Hamilton on pole position.
Not messing up the start.
Vettle not sailing through.
Retaining his lead and building it to over 12 seconds in front.
His car is still working.

Is it April the 1st already?

Woodentop
30-03-2014
Boring !!
kendoguk
30-03-2014
Originally Posted by Woodentop:
“Boring !!”

Quite
dee_eff
30-03-2014
I enjoyed today's race, plenty of little battles all the way to back, and a bit of controversy as well. Great shame about Ricciardo, it seems the Gods are conspiring to wipe the smile off his face, but he seems to be the sort of chap that will bounce back and give Vettel a run for his money.
It looks like were in for a fascinating season under the new formula.
gomezz
30-03-2014
Makes you wonder if the Jonah in the team was not Mark Webber but one of the pit crew Daniel inherited.
Si_Crewe
30-03-2014
The fuel information on the BBC was interesting.

Vettel might've seemed to be doing a fairly good job of hanging on to Rosberg but he was using a helluva lot more fuel that either of the Merc's, and especially Hamilton, to do it.

Last time I saw the fuel graphic was on, I think, lap 48 and it had Hamilton listed as using 80, Rosberg as 82 and Vettel at 90.

Interesting thing being, it seems like the Merc's currently have enough of an advantage that they can simply put in less fuel and run lighter so, when the competition starts to catch up, they'll be able to just bung more fuel in and turn up the engine a bit to regain the advantage... for a while, at least.

Really seems that RBR aren't getting "the rub of the green" any more, with DR particularly.
Seems like he got a double penalty for his unsafe release. He got a drive-through AND he was then given a grid penalty for next week as well.
And, of course, both penalties punish the driver rather than the team who made the mistake, which seems a little unfair.
Surely docking team points for such infringements would be fairer?
Course, some teams would probably try to manipulate such a system if they thought it could help them win a WDC at the expense of a WCC.

Not much in the way of a Rocky-style comeback for Raikkonen after his puncture. Seems like the FI4T just about has the pace to hang on to the front runners but it doesn't have anything in reserve for actually making up ground.
Also, no sympathy for Kimmi there, given the way he deliberately tried to chop Lewis' rear tyres a few years ago.
Wonder if Alonso is starting to think any future championship might not be had in a red car at all?

Not sure I'd care to speculate on a "drive of the day".
People seem to be congratulating Hulk' and he did okay but, in typical ForceIndia tradition, all he really did was do one less pitstop and then hang on by the skin of his teeth.
zieler
30-03-2014
I think you are being a bit harsh on Hulkenberg, he did well to get fifth. Not the most thrilling of drives but you can say that about pretty much everyone in the field.

I'd probably give it to Hamilton for being completely dominant. Provided he gets good reliability I think the championship is his to lose, Rosberg isn't a bad driver but I don't think he is on the same level as Hamilton. It seems harsh saying that about someone who has come first and second in the two races though...

Not sure about the double penalty from the stewards. While the first penalty didn't exactly hurt him I think it is unfair to give him a grid penalty as well. Would have thought a fine would have been much more appropriate.

I liked the fuel graphic as well. Really did show how comfortable Mercedes were.
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