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Official Formula 1 Thread (Part 8)
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Fudd
27-07-2014
The first safety car screwed the frontrunners over but what a race that was.
allthingsuk
27-07-2014
Superb drive from Ricciardo. Put Vettel well in the shade. This guy really is the real deal, and he's fast becoming another favourite of mine.

And great damage limitation drive from Lewis despite almost chucking it away on lap 1.

That was probably one of the best Hungarian Grands Prix I've seen in a while.
Si_Crewe
27-07-2014
This new F1 is just boring as f**k, isn't it?

Fair play to DR. He was kinda gifted the win in Montreal but here he just won on pace and strategy.

Shame that Hamilton couldn't pass Alonso but the result demonstrates that Lewis was right not to slow down to let Rosberg past.
Old Endeavour
27-07-2014
I don't know why Hamilton bothers turning up for Qualifying as he seems to do just as well for anywhere! He could take the day off.
allthingsuk
27-07-2014
Originally Posted by Si_Crewe:
“This new F1 is just boring as f**k, isn't it?

Fair play to DR. He was kinda gifted the win in Montreal but here he just won on pace and strategy.”

I wonder what DR could do in a Mercedes rocketship.

Noticed that the Mercs were really struggling with the lower track temps...not sure whether, rather ironically given their tyre issues in the past, they struggle to get their tyres up to temperature.
Fudd
27-07-2014
Originally Posted by Si_Crewe:
“This new F1 is just boring as f**k, isn't it?

Fair play to DR. He was kinda gifted the win in Montreal but here he just won on pace and strategy.

Shame that Hamilton couldn't pass Alonso but the result demonstrates that Lewis was right not to slow down to let Rosberg past.”

You can't necessarily say that considering Hamilton had to drive slightly defensively for a few laps which would have cost him time. Alternactively, the team may have managed second had Rosberg's strategy been allowed to play out - or even the win.
Old Endeavour
27-07-2014
Originally Posted by allthingsuk:
“I wonder what DR could do in a Mercedes rocketship.

Noticed that the Mercs were really struggling with the lower track temps...not sure whether, rather ironically given their tyre issues in the past, they struggle to get their tyres up to temperature.”

Maybe if Hamilton's car had caught fire again it would have warmed up the tyres.
dansus
27-07-2014
Brilliant win for Ricciardo. Looks like hes the real deal.
Si_Crewe
27-07-2014
Originally Posted by allthingsuk:
“Noticed that the Mercs were really struggling with the lower track temps...not sure whether, rather ironically given their tyre issues in the past, they struggle to get their tyres up to temperature.”

Was thinking about that myself.

Clearly Merc' have made huge improvements in the way the car uses the tyres this year but, at the end of the day, Alonso's Ferrari was just as quick on a set of really old options (?) as Hamilton was on a set of not-quite-so-old primes so it looks like the Merc' isn't perfect in all aspects.
Si_Crewe
27-07-2014
Originally Posted by Fudd:
“You can't necessarily say that considering Hamilton had to drive slightly defensively for a few laps which would have cost him time. Alternactively, the team may have managed second had Rosberg's strategy been allowed to play out - or even the win.”

Meh,

As a racing driver you'd have to be pretty daft to willingly do something which gives the other guy an advantage over you.

Doing stuff that helps your team-mate gain position over all the other drivers is fair enough but doing something that gives him an advantage over you is dumb.
allthingsuk
27-07-2014
Originally Posted by Fudd:
“You can't necessarily say that considering Hamilton had to drive slightly defensively for a few laps which would have cost him time. Alternactively, the team may have managed second had Rosberg's strategy been allowed to play out - or even the win.”

The problem was, he couldn't get close enough to Hamilton. But in the turbulent air, it's difficult to get close to it's a self-perpetuating problem. And being in that hot air caused his tyres to wear meaning he dropped further and further back. But, dropping back would have wrecked Hamilton's strategy.

You always guarantee with split strategies to get it wrong on one car.
Fudd
27-07-2014
Originally Posted by Old Endeavour:
“Maybe if Hamilton's car had caught fire again it would have warmed up the tyres. ”

Maybe it's a device to heat them up quickly.

Re. Ricciardo not being gifted today, he was to an extent. The first safety car brought him right into it. But he took advantage of it and looks like an excellent driver.
crake
27-07-2014
Wow. Hamilton's selfishness cost Rosberg and the team a win. I remember the outrage when Vettel ignored team orders, I wonder if the same people will be outraged today?

Is it possible Hamilton will get a penalty for forcing Rosberg wide at the end? Probably not, he usually gets away with dirty racing.
allthingsuk
27-07-2014
Originally Posted by Si_Crewe:
“Was thinking about that myself.

Clearly Merc' have made huge improvements in the way the car uses the tyres this year but, at the end of the day, Alonso's Ferrari was just as quick on a set of really old options (?) as Hamilton was on a set of not-quite-so-old primes so it looks like the Merc' isn't perfect in all aspects.”

And it might be one of the reasons why RB seem closer in changeable conditions. Maybe it's an inherent issue...as in the Merc may have a longer wheelbase car which doesn't get as much heat in the rears as say, a shorter wheelbase car, like the Red Bull looks to be.

Originally Posted by Old Endeavour:
“Maybe if Hamilton's car had caught fire again it would have warmed up the tyres. ”

Hahaha
Si_Crewe
27-07-2014
Originally Posted by crake:
“Wow. Hamilton's selfishness cost Rosberg and the team a win. I remember the outrage when Vettel ignored team orders, I wonder if the same people will be outraged today?

Is it possible Hamilton will get a penalty for forcing Rosberg wide at the end? Probably not, he usually gets away with dirty racing.”

Hush now.

Grown-ups are talking.
geemonkee
27-07-2014
Originally Posted by Old Endeavour:
“I agree! If Rosberg can't even catch Hamilton then Hamilton is not holding Rosberg back at all.”

The gap was down to 0.6 seconds at one point.
Old Endeavour
27-07-2014
Originally Posted by crake:
“Wow. Hamilton's selfishness cost Rosberg and the team a win. I remember the outrage when Vettel ignored team orders, I wonder if the same people will be outraged today?

Is it possible Hamilton will get a penalty for forcing Rosberg wide at the end? Probably not, he usually gets away with dirty racing.”

You are Hamilton's agent and I claim my £5!
Fudd
27-07-2014
Originally Posted by Si_Crewe:
“Meh,

As a racing driver you'd have to be pretty daft to willingly do something which gives the other guy an advantage over you.”

In other words he potentially screwed the team up to help himself. And potentially screwed himself up too as he had to go defensive against Rosberg.

As long as people don't moan if Rosberg does the same thing further down the line.

And in a bizarre way Hamilton's disastrous qualifying worked in his favour as he was in the right place to take advantage of the first safety car.
allthingsuk
27-07-2014
Originally Posted by crake:
“Wow. Hamilton's selfishness cost Rosberg and the team a win. I remember the outrage when Vettel ignored team orders, I wonder if the same people will be outraged today?

Is it possible Hamilton will get a penalty for forcing Rosberg wide at the end? Probably not, he usually gets away with dirty racing.”

I'm inclined to agree. Yes, Hamilton pretty much stopped Rosberg from winning the race and disobeyed a team order. He wouldn't have disobeyed it if Brawn had said it. But unfortunately, to be a world champion, you have to be a bit nasty and ruthless. If Rosberg won, he would have extended the gap by 10 points if Hamilton was 3rd, if not more. Those are crucial points he can't afford to lose.

Yes, he may not have played the team game and yes, I'm slightly critical of it, but he's closed the gap and that's all that matters to him. He'll take a bit of flak short term for the longer-term gains - a little bit like Vettel in Malaysia last year.
crake
27-07-2014
Originally Posted by allthingsuk:
“I'm inclined to agree. Yes, Hamilton pretty much stopped Rosberg from winning the race and disobeyed a team order. He wouldn't have disobeyed it if Brawn had said it. But unfortunately, to be a world champion, you have to be a bit nasty and ruthless. If Rosberg won, he would have extended the gap by 10 points if Hamilton was 3rd, if not more. Those are crucial points he can't afford to lose.”

True enough, but he may well pay for it in the future. Will Rosberg move aside in the future, even if he has nothing to lose? I think we'll be hearing a lot more about this...
Si_Crewe
27-07-2014
Originally Posted by Fudd:
“In other words he potentially screwed the team up to help himself. And potentially screwed himself up too as he had to go defensive against Rosberg.

As long as people don't moan if Rosberg does the same thing further down the line. ”

Don't really recall Hamilton being particularly defensive.
At the time it seemed like Hamilton was more concerned with trying to find a way past Alonso.

Well, as I said, if one driver's actions damages the other driver's race against everybody else then it's a bit spiteful but I don't think you can criticise a driver for doing something that's going to harm his own result.
roger_50
27-07-2014
Mercedes say they allow both of them to race - they were effectively telling Lewis to allow Nico to finish ahead of him. That's not allowing them to race.

As it turned out Lewis was right - if he'd slowed down and let him through earlier he would have finished behind Nico at the end.

Can't have it both ways, either you officially allow your drivers to race or you officially nominate a priority driver and run the team that way. The team were seemingly doing the latter today for some reason.

I was happy to see Lewis put his foot down here actually. Nip it in the bud right now, otherwise he just weakens his position in the team.
Fudd
27-07-2014
Hamilton might have finished fourth but the team would have gained more from Rosberg who would have finished first or second.

Sky just seeing it from Hamilton's view as per normal.
Ed Sizzers
27-07-2014
Originally Posted by crake:
“Wow. Hamilton's selfishness cost Rosberg and the team a win. I remember the outrage when Vettel ignored team orders, I wonder if the same people will be outraged today?”

Don't be silly. Hamilton not letting Rosberg pass will doubtless be hailed as great racing and standing his ground and true British Grit and blah blah blah.

If the roles had been reversed however, you can guarantee there'd be cries of how unsporting Rosberg had been. and Lewis would probably write a couple of sulky tweets about it being like sooooo unfair.
Si_Crewe
27-07-2014
Originally Posted by Fudd:
“Hamilton might have finished fourth but the team would have gained more from Rosberg who would have finished first or second.

Sky just seeing it from Hamilton's view as per normal.”

If the team are that bothered about gaining every possible point for the Constructors championship I'd suggest they start by addressing their reliability issues.
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