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Official Formula 1 Thread (Part 8) |
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#7576 |
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Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Scotland
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Quote:
Yes another dull and boring race and it is all to predictable it was going to be like that. There was good weather today and so I went out and made the most of it. Glad I did it's just not worth the time to watch it live for racing like this. Only watched it while making dinner.
And yet if Ferrari had finished first it would have been a great race full of action and the best team won, Where as I say sod the sun, the toonarmy is a F1 fan And even better is that your beloved Ferrari made a terrible call keeping vettel out causing the tire failure, haha |
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#7577 |
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Join Date: Nov 2007
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There was a fait bit of action, but the result was pretty much assured. I struggled to keep on watching the race - I even found myself wondering if I should watch the race at all, and I'm a fan of Hamilton!
Viewing figures and race attendances dropping are going to damage the financial value of F1 and that is going to translate to races and teams disapearing. Bernie is trying to get ride of the Italian GP. The German GP is supossed to come back in 2016 but it would be no surprise if that somehow doesn't happen. |
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#7578 |
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Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Scotland
Posts: 2,764
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and keeping up with normal practice, what you dont like to hear / read you just ignore
Ferrari lost it through their incompetence, all the talk has been about this Ferrari resurgence, thats funny as there is none, they are still shi*e
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#7579 |
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Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 2,659
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Hearing bad news about Justin Wilson.
http://www.skysports.com/motor-racin...-indycar-race? This guy was quite popular the flying giraffe they called him. Hope he comes out of this. |
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#7580 |
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Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Solihull
Posts: 7,274
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and keeping up with normal practice, what you dont like to hear / read you just ignore
Ferrari lost it through their incompetence, all the talk has been about this Ferrari resurgence, thats funny as there is none, they are still shi*e ![]() |
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#7581 |
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Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Solihull
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Quote:
Yes another dull and boring race and it is all to predictable it was going to be like that. There was good weather today and so I went out and made the most of it. Glad I did it's just not worth the time to watch it live for racing like this. Only watched it while making dinner.
It seems to be the easy option to criticise F1 race after race. |
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#7582 |
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Join Date: Nov 2007
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It seems to be the easy option to criticise F1 race after race.
No updates on Justin Wilson likely to be another thing which takes some time to hear anything. I saw a video of the crash another car had gone in the wall and it looks like Justin hit some debris which was bouncing body work I think. Luckily Justins car came to a stop in quite a gentle manner and so not really a big 2nd impact. |
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#7583 |
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Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Devon
Posts: 48,013
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Easy win for Hamilton in a not very exciting race. As for Vettel well Pirelli were asked by the FIA to make tyres that wear out and the race commentators said he was pushing his luck trying to make them go that far but Pirelli hadn't warned Ferrari that they were taking a risk by running the tyre that long. Perhaps Pirelli need to give the teams a use by n laps for tyres at each race. Rosberg's tyre failure according to Pirelli was caused by a cut.
Meanwhile McLaren's 105 grid places penalty makes a nonsense of engine supplier Honda trying to improve their power plant and try and compete. |
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#7584 |
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Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Buckingham
Posts: 28,549
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It is one thing to make tyres that wear out and lose performance quite another to have tyres that disintegrate with no warning as has appeared to have happened here.
Though I am not sure Vettel did all he could to keep safe once the tyre delaminated but the carcass was still intact. Too much of a hurry to get back to the pits with lack of regard to the risk to himself and to others. |
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#7585 |
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Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: the wild world web
Posts: 28,132
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Havn't tyres always delamintated in F1 near end of life?
I suspect the talk only started after the supplier contract changed. |
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#7586 |
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Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: London
Posts: 2,457
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RIP Justin.
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#7587 |
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Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 2,659
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Sad to hear of this tragic end to Justin's story. May he be at peace.
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#7588 |
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Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Solihull
Posts: 7,274
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Very sad news. The Brits don't have much luck racing in The States. Not quite 4 years since Wheldon's accident.
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#7589 |
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Join Date: Nov 2004
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Quote:
As for Vettel well Pirelli were asked by the FIA to make tyres that wear out and the race commentators said he was pushing his luck trying to make them go that far but Pirelli hadn't warned Ferrari that they were taking a risk by running the tyre that long. Perhaps Pirelli need to give the teams a use by n laps for tyres at each race. Rosberg's tyre failure according to Pirelli was caused by a cut.
Quote:
Think it's too early to lay the blame on Ferrari to be honest. Pirelli gave the tyres a ware life of 40 laps, much further then Vettel had taken them. His lap times suggest they hadn't worn particularly badly. It may turn out they didn't stand up to 28 laps of continual running over the kerbs the way Vettel was doing but again, Pirelli hadn't issued any advice about that despite drivers exploring the track limits all through the weekend. It may just be one of those things and totally unrelated to Rosberg's blow out on Friday but after Silverstone 2013 I don't think Pirelli have ever regained the drivers' confidence completely.
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#7590 |
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Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Scotland
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Interesting to see how they come up with the 40 laps, as far as I know they are not given a recent F1 car and test time on a track to come up with these figures.
I guess the figure is come about from simulated tyre ware and actual tyre ware from the 3 testing sessions. Interesting that more fuss is made of a tyre failure than a front/back wing exploding on a straight as has recently happened, but then tyres are not team made/designed so are easy targets. |
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#7591 |
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Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Downforce Radio
Posts: 9,226
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Think it's too early to lay the blame on Ferrari to be honest. Pirelli game the tyres a ware life of 40 laps, much further then Vettel had taken them. His lap times suggest they hadn't worn particularly badly. It may turn out they didn't stand up to 28 laps of continual running over the kerbs the way Vettel was doing but again, Pirelli hadn't issued any advice about that despite drivers exploring the track limits all through the weekend. It may just be one of those things and totally unrelated to Rosberg's blow out on Friday but after Silverstone 2013 I don't think Pirelli have ever regained the drivers' confidence completely.
Righttttttt.... Ferrari pushed their luck on this one, fair enough they were trying to push the margins in the hopes of a good finish but at least have the decency to admit you're the one at fault when it all blows up in your face. Vettel's classless swearing at Pirelli when he had no evidence at that point about the cause of the failure except for the extreme strategy he knew he'd been running will win him few fans and probably lose him what little he has. Show some class, kid. |
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#7592 |
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Join Date: May 2010
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I see we're back to canopy discussion again, it always happens and never happens.
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#7593 |
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Join Date: Nov 2004
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You mean the silverstone 2013 when the teams went against Pirelli's recommendations and were doing stupid things like having left rear tyres on the right rear for competitive reasons then completely threw Pirelli to the media wolves because of a problem that was their own creation?
Righttttttt.... Quote:
Ferrari pushed their luck on this one, fair enough they were trying to push the margins in the hopes of a good finish but at least have the decency to admit you're the one at fault when it all blows up in your face.
Vettel's classless swearing at Pirelli when he had no evidence at that point about the cause of the failure except for the extreme strategy he knew he'd been running will win him few fans and probably lose him what little he has. Show some class, kid. |
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#7594 |
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Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 2,659
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Pirelli recommended the tyres would last 40 laps. That's 40 laps before they 'hit the cliff' and needed changing, not 40 laps before they blew up! 2 seconds earlier and Vettel would have been on his way to the biggest accident of his career.
The FIA are considering mandated tyre guidelines which I think is fairy unprecedented. One thing I notice about the Pirelli tyres on all cars in quite a bit of growth. The sidewalls bulge and this possibly increases the contact patch. It also increase the likely hood of damage to the sidewall and cuts to the tyre. |
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#7595 |
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Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 506
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I see we're back to canopy discussion again, it always happens and never happens.
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#7596 |
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Join Date: Nov 2007
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Indeed, it will never happen unless they enlarge the closed cockpit dimensions to LMP levels.
It might not be a completely closed cockpit but some sort of extra protection. |
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#7597 |
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Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Solihull
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I think the issue is the concept of acceptable level of risk. You will never make F1 100% safe. Nothing in life is 100% safe. Would close cockpits make the sport safer or would it bring it's own new risks? There was a discussion on here a few weeks ago about whether the perceived danger associated with the sport was part of its appeal.
The sort of accident that caused Wilson's death would be extremely unlikely in F1 due to the more open nature of the tracks meaning the risk of debris flying around on track for a passing car to intercept it low. The only accident we've had in recent times that is similar was Massa's caused by another car shedding a part. That said it's quite clear that a driver's head is the most vulnerable part of their body in a modern F1 car. Can the modern day crash helmet be improved to give more protection? |
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#7598 |
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Join Date: Oct 2011
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One thing I notice about the Pirelli tyres on all cars in quite a bit of growth. The sidewalls bulge and this possibly increases the contact patch. It also increase the likely hood of damage to the sidewall and cuts to the tyre.
But there are guidelines on minimum pressures etc for the tires, and teams not following them can find themselves in hot bother. If the sidewalls are bulging too much for cuts, and the teams are within the guidelines, then the guidelines need to be revised. |
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#7599 |
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Join Date: Nov 2007
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Pirelli give the teams guidelines on tyre pressures at the start of the race. I'm not sure if there
Is any thing in the sporting or technical regs stating teams can be sanctioned for not following these. Not that the rule book counts for much the stewards were quite happy to make it up as they went along when Williams ran two tyre compounds. It wasn't like they even changed it straight away so I am fairy sure that was a breach of the technical regulations and generally thr punishment for that is disqualification. They got off quite lightly with a drive through which I don't think is defined anywhere for a breach of tyre regulations. |
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#7600 |
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Join Date: Oct 2011
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Pirelli give the teams guidelines on tyre pressures at the start of the race. I'm not sure if there
Is any thing in the sporting or technical regs stating teams can be sanctioned for not following these. Compliance is enforced by the Race Director, so if he instructs a team that's outside of the tire limits set my Pirelli to change them, failure to do so amounts to a sporting reg penalty, which may be a drive through, stop and go, a DSQ or forced retirement (the "Meatball flag"). Quote:
Not that the rule book counts for much the stewards were quite happy to make it up as they went along when Williams ran two tyre compounds. It wasn't like they even changed it straight away so I am fairy sure that was a breach of the technical regulations and generally thr punishment for that is disqualification. They got off quite lightly with a drive through which I don't think is defined anywhere for a breach of tyre regulations.
It's covered by the racing regulations. Section 25.2c says;Quote:
A set of tyres will be deemed to comprise two front and two rear tyres all of which must The stewards can then decide which penalty applies by looking into section 16 of the sporting regulations. You can download all of the relevant info from http://www.fia.com/regulations/regul...ampionship-110
be of the same specification. |
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