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the worst managed winner ever


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Old 05-12-2012, 18:46
chinchin
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I think the song that made Shayne sound like a chipmunk finished him off. As has been said , bad choice of material. What a waste of a wonderful voice. Who could forget his version of 'If you're not the one'?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rc5bfxp9TSo
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Old 05-12-2012, 18:58
MrsGraham
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Shayne Ward.

When he won X Factor, it was so exciting - he seemed like he could really be a British competitor to Justin Timberlake who was huge at the time. Somehow it never quite happened.
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Old 05-12-2012, 19:05
The_Shawster
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To quote Matt: He explained: "I was given the opportunity to stay at Sony, do some writing and 'see how it was going to go' or walk away and go it alone. And I chose to walk."
It's also easy to find quotes where Matt says he has sold more than two million records (he hasn't), and quotes where he claims Letters was certified platinum (it wasn't).

Just last week he was quoted as saying he didn't think Cher Lloyd had cracked the USA any more than he had, because they had both played shows there. Besides the fact that he conveniently ignored her platinum selling single in the States, he made it sound as if he toured there—the truth is he played one late-afternoon set at a club in LA in May before about thirty people.

Not very "credible".
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Old 05-12-2012, 19:06
Yeah_Jackie
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I think the song that made Shayne sound like a chipmunk finished him off. As has been said , bad choice of material. What a waste of a wonderful voice. Who could forget his version of 'If you're not the one'?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rc5bfxp9TSo
The fella has it all. Except the career he should have had.

Over The Rainbow
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Old 05-12-2012, 19:14
AJmaestro
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Leon Jackson for sure. I feel really sorry for how badly managed he was. He had so much potential and made a phenomenal album but Simon Cowell wasn't interested in him and gave him no promotion whatsoever, nevermind making his second single release one of the weakest from the album when there were so many amazing ones - and let's not forget the big hype over his third single which was set to be sure of chart success - only to have Syco make it a promotional single at the last minute. They then considered him a flop and dropped him. It was THEIR fault he wasn't very successful due to terrible management. It's even making me angry now thinking of it after all these years still. Anyway, he hasn't given up. He's been working very hard on new music for the last few years and once he perfects it, he'll release it.
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Old 05-12-2012, 19:24
AMS13
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It's also easy to find quotes where Matt says he has sold more than two million records (he hasn't), and quotes where he claims Letters was certified platinum (it wasn't).

Just last week he was quoted as saying he didn't think Cher Lloyd had cracked the USA any more than he had, because they had both played shows there. Besides the fact that he conveniently ignored her platinum selling single in the States, he made it sound as if he toured there—the truth is he played one late-afternoon set at a club in LA in May before about thirty people.

Not very "credible".
So HMV stating that "Letters" is a platinum selling album is just Matt bragging? When you include "Heroes" the charity single that sold around 400,000, "When We Collide" sold 1,000,167 copies, "Letters" 270,000, and then you include "Run For Your Life", "Amazing", "Starlight", "The Fire", then the figures add up and can easily be substantiated.

Why should he know what Cher Lloyd is upto and was it a direct quote by him, or just hearsay? I know I do not obsess about artists or music that has no appeal to me. He showcased in LA and never had the promotion or backing that Syco or one of their partners gave the artist that came fourth Cher Lloyd, which brings us back to what the thread is about.
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Old 05-12-2012, 19:33
Patti-Ann
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Steve had a chance of a second album but fell out with Simon over doing more covers....

Shayne was unfortunate to be followed by Leona, who became Simon's no 1 priority. Sure he had chart success for a while (including overseas), but then disappeared for about three years - why did we never see him on TV spots, or releasing singles to keep him in the public eye

With Leon, I think a lot of people voted to 'give him a career' (thinking if he didn't win, he wouldn't be signed). But then failed to back it up by buying his album.

Leona, probably the most successful winner so far, but they seem to be messing that up now - her latest album hasn't done as well as expected

Alexandra - who knows why it's all gone so disastrously wrong I think she's the best of the winners, she sings as well as Leona but is such a fantastic performer aswell

Joe was given a 'pop' album when he isn't that kind of singer. PSOS came at the right time and he unexpectedly found a niche that suited him. His latest album (mostly ballads) hasn't done so well so I think he'd be better sticking to the classical cross over stuff.

Matt, pulled the most votes every week bar one, but has failed to take off in a huge way. Already on a different label.

Too early to see how Little Mix will pan out
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Old 05-12-2012, 19:35
ageappropriate
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I think all the winners have been badly managed so it's hard to pick the worst one.

Um, on paper Shayne was probably the most marketable one with great potential so I reckon that was the biggest failure. I mean, he was super hot and could sure as hell sing - and always in tune, unlike the vocally challenged trio of munters we have this year.
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Old 05-12-2012, 19:37
Yeah_Jackie
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I think all the winners have been badly managed so it's hard to pick the worst one.

Um, on paper Shayne was probably the most marketable one with great potential so I reckon that was the biggest failure. I mean, he was super hot and could sure as hell sing - and always in tune, unlike the vocally challenged trio of munters we have this year.
HAhahaha. I can hardly breath laughing so much on here tonight. Very unusual
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Old 05-12-2012, 19:37
slappers r us
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Shayne Ward

its a shame Simon didnt put as much effort into him as he has with wand erection
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Old 05-12-2012, 19:38
slappers r us
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I think all the winners have been badly managed so it's hard to pick the worst one.

Um, on paper Shayne was probably the most marketable one with great potential so I reckon that was the biggest failure. I mean, he was super hot and could sure as hell sing - and always in tune, unlike the vocally challenged trio of munters we have this year.
never has a truer word been said
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Old 05-12-2012, 19:47
The_Shawster
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So HMV stating that "Letters" is a platinum selling album is just Matt bragging? When you include "Heroes" the charity single that sold around 400,000,...
LOL, it isn't HMV that certifies platinum sales, it's BPI. Go to their website, it's quite easy to look up certifications. No sign of Letters.

And double LOL at "Heroes," not exactly a Matt Cardle single now is it?
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Old 05-12-2012, 19:52
Popsmartz
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To quote Matt: He explained: "I was given the opportunity to stay at Sony, do some writing and 'see how it was going to go' or walk away and go it alone. And I chose to walk."

Cardle's debut album Letters reached platinum status in February after shipping 300,000 copies (he sold over 270,000 copies).
My guess is that Matt told porkies, and not for the first time. He told porkies on the show to beef up his desperate sob story and has never quite stopped telling them since. For example, his claim of a 'sell out tour' was later amended to 'near sell out tour'.

Letters was never certified platinum. The claim (note: 'claim', not certification) was made somewhat prematurely and now, some 8 months later, the record is still impossibly short of platinum sales. Units shifted and returned unsold do not count.

Hope that helps.
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Old 05-12-2012, 19:57
Popsmartz
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Just last week he was quoted as saying he didn't think Cher Lloyd had cracked the USA any more than he had, because they had both played shows there. Besides the fact that he conveniently ignored her platinum selling single in the States, he made it sound as if he toured there—the truth is he played one late-afternoon set at a club in LA in May before about thirty people.

Not very "credible".
Ha ha ha. Did he really say that? As I recall, his one single gig in LA was in front of 200-300 (EDIT: 190) people and was almost certainly an unpaid performance. Mind you, I think it did coincide with his wild night on the town with er, Robbie Kean. Rock and Roll baby!!! Led Zep eat your hearts out!!!

Oh and did he point out that (unlike those of Cher, 1D and Rebecca Ferguson) none of his records were ever actually released in the US?
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Old 05-12-2012, 20:07
AMS13
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LOL, it isn't HMV that certifies platinum sales, it's BPI. Go to their website, it's quite easy to look up certifications. No sign of Letters.

And double LOL at "Heroes," not exactly a Matt Cardle single now is it?
"The British Phonographic Industry awards certificates for music releases in Britain. The level of the award varies depending on the format of the release and the amount sold. BPI certificates are not automatic; the record company must pay a fee to the BPI and they carry out an audit into the release in question. Certificates are awarded on the basis of the amount of units the release has shipped to retailers, rather than the amount it has sold."

Why would a record company pay the certification fee for an artist that is leaving their company? Matt shipped 300,000 copies and sold over 270,000 copies. With regards "Heroes", I am sure the other X Factor artists are including their contribution to their confirmed sales.
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Old 05-12-2012, 20:18
AMS13
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Ha ha ha. Did he really say that? As I recall, his one single gig in LA was in front of 200-300 (EDIT: 190) people and was almost certainly an unpaid performance. Mind you, I think it did coincide with his wild night on the town with er, Robbie Kean. Rock and Roll baby!!! Led Zep eat your hearts out!!!

Oh and did he point out that (unlike those of Cher, 1D and Rebecca Ferguson) none of his records were ever actually released in the US?
He performed a showcase and did he acuallly state it was for 200-300 people or is that another quote attributed to him which cannot be substantiated?

With regards his records not being released in the USA, well he was under contract to Syco/Columbia and the winner of 2010 X Factor, which explains what this thread is all about. Bad management post X Factor, well that is unless Simon Cowell supports the act and then they need to get in quick, as he appears to get bored with each and every one of his acts within a three year period.
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Old 05-12-2012, 20:18
MrsGraham
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PMSL... Hadn't heard that one before!
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Old 05-12-2012, 20:21
The_Shawster
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Ha ha ha. Did he really say that? As I recall, his one single gig in LA was in front of 200-300 (EDIT: 190) people and was almost certainly an unpaid performance. Mind you, I think it did coincide with his wild night on the town with er, Robbie Kean. Rock and Roll baby!!! Led Zep eat your hearts out!!!

Oh and did he point out that (unlike those of Cher, 1D and Rebecca Ferguson) none of his records were ever actually released in the US?
Yes, this is the quote:

"Someone recently asked me about how I felt about One direction and Cher Lloyd cracking America…One direction have cracked the universe- that’s amazing. I’m not sure about Cher Lloyd- I was like ‘has she?’ I mean, hats off to her if she has, but I wasn’t aware of it. I’ve played shows over there, doesn’t mean I’ve cracked the US.”

http://www.gossipdrip.com/5-minutes-...tt-cardle.html

No, of course he didn't mention not having any US releases, let alone not appearing on US television like Cher, ID, and Rebecca. I don't think the crowd was that big at his Hotel Cafe gig either. It was far from packed on the YouTube video I watched and the capacity is less than 200 there. Plus his set was before dark on a holiday.

On the topic of management though Matt's fans think his manager has done a brilliant job, getting him gigs opening for Steps at the Stockport light switch on and such.

Shayne should be so lucky I suppose.
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Old 05-12-2012, 20:23
Yeah_Jackie
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Yes, this is the quote:

"Someone recently asked me about how I felt about One direction and Cher Lloyd cracking America…One direction have cracked the universe- that’s amazing. I’m not sure about Cher Lloyd- I was like ‘has she?’ I mean, hats off to her if she has, but I wasn’t aware of it. I’ve played shows over there, doesn’t mean I’ve cracked the US.”

http://www.gossipdrip.com/5-minutes-...tt-cardle.html

No, of course he didn't mention not having any US releases, let alone not appearing on US television like Cher, ID, and Rebecca. I don't think the crowd was that big at his Hotel Cafe gig either. It was far from packed on the YouTube video I watched and the capacity is less than 200 there. Plus his set was before dark on a holiday.

On the topic of management though Matt's fans think his manager has done a brilliant job, getting him gigs opening for Steps at the Stockport light switch on and such.

Shayne should be so lucky I suppose.


IN credible.
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Old 05-12-2012, 20:26
The_Shawster
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"The British Phonographic Industry awards certificates for music releases in Britain. The level of the award varies depending on the format of the release and the amount sold. BPI certificates are not automatic; the record company must pay a fee to the BPI and they carry out an audit into the release in question. Certificates are awarded on the basis of the amount of units the release has shipped to retailers, rather than the amount it has sold."

Why would a record company pay the certification fee for an artist that is leaving their company? Matt shipped 300,000 copies and sold over 270,000 copies. With regards "Heroes", I am sure the other X Factor artists are including their contribution to their confirmed sales.
You really don't get it, do you?

A release isn't platinum unless it is certified by BPI. Letters is not.

End of.

What is the source for the 300,000 shipping claim, in any event? Credible Cardle?

Nice to know you are "sure" about the other artists. That settles it, then.
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Old 05-12-2012, 20:28
kitten12
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So Alexandra Burke's fall from grace was nothing to do with her thoroughly dislikable personality, awful Boney M material and disastrous performance as an X Factor judge then? Shite.com
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Old 05-12-2012, 20:31
The_Shawster
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http://menmedia.co.uk/stockportexpre...ghts-switch-on

Steps will headline the event at Merseyway.
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Old 05-12-2012, 20:33
Zack06
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So Alexandra Burke's fall from grace was nothing to do with her thoroughly dislikable personality, awful Boney M material and disastrous performance as an X Factor judge then? Shite.com
Unfortunately-not.net
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Old 05-12-2012, 20:33
Mr Jazzman
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Matt made two albums. The first, entitled 'Letters' was a co-written poprock album, complete with a cover track and Gary Barlow-penned lead single sold 285k in 12 months. Matt and his people claimed 'platinum sales' about 8 months ago. Truth is, it is still not certified platinum today and appears unlikely ever to get there. Matt was dumped by Sony Columbia earlier this year. He or his PR people (his PR has been a complete disaster from day one) decided, unwisely, to claim that he had left Sony owing to artistic differences. Swallowing this whole, some of his hardcore fans speculated that he had in fact jumped ship to rival mega-player Universal. One fan recently claimed here on this forum that Columbia had wanted to keep Matt on as a songwriter, a bizarre claim considering that they hadn't even allowed Matt to write songs for his own album without 'help' from established professionals. A quick look at the sales figures explains the truth about Matt's 'parting' with Columbia records. Months later, it was announced that Matt had joined a small label called 'So What?' and he soon after released a second co-written solo album, including a cover of 'First Time Ever I Saw Your Face', a song he had sang twice on X Factor and had previously released on an EP during his Columbia period. Some big money was spent on targeted promo (TV ads at peak times, around shows like X Factor and Coronation Street) but after debuting at #8 it plummeted down the charts and to date has sold 34k in five weeks. Hope that answers your question.
Thank you for the response.
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Old 05-12-2012, 20:48
AMS13
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You really don't get it, do you?

A release isn't platinum unless it is certified by BPI. Letters is not.

End of.

What is the source for the 300,000 shipping claim, in any event? Credible Cardle?

Nice to know you are "sure" about the other artists. That settles it, then.
POT, KETTLE, BLACK "the record company must pay a fee to the BPI and they carry out an audit into the release in question".
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