What I believe is much more complicated than that.

Improvement is just one of many factors.

I'm feeling a bit sorry for Robin in this thread TBH - I thought in his first year he did a great job with Patsy and really got her to improve (plus a lot of his choreography was quite interesting), but since then he's been stuck with celebrities who haven't really been capable of improving and thus the routines have suffered.

You can only make a routine as good as your celebrity - and falling short of full-on Widdy/Grant-style gimmicks (the use of which Robin has been fairly restrained in), there aren't that many ways to make it 'different' if your celeb isn't up to the job of improving their abilities.

For my money Robin's still a more interesting and imaginative choreographer than either of the Jordans - as well as being a much nicer fella than James - and I'd happily keep him, especially as a package with Kristina, who's been a gem in all of her series.

The person I'd most like to get rid of is Erin, who while being a great teacher hasn't appeared to give a stuff since Austin. If that meant Anton going too - well, I wouldn't weep, but he does have an important role to play as the squire of the ungainly and unprepossessing. Then we could bring in Iveta and any DWTS male pro of the FMs' choice

Checking things again, possibly the least improved could also apply to Kimberly who has hardly budged in score from week 5 (33) all the weeks following to date (34).

James - good jive and Charleston. Keep.

Vincent - no question. Keep.

Anton - Go.

Artem - Keep/go.

Pasha - Keep.

Brendan - Keep.

Girls:

Ola : Keep.

Erin: Borderline Keep.

Flavia: Keep. Don't like some of her quirky stuff but you couldn't let her go. No, no, no.

Karen: Keep (unconvincing but deserves another chance).

Natalie: Keep. By golly, yes!

Kristina: Keep (borderline).

Aliona : Go.

"Aliona can't reply fairly, for private reasons!"

Eh, what's this all about, tangoqueen??? Spill!

Current Star Pros

Natalie has shone the last 2 years firstly with Audley and getting him as far as he did and this year with Michael. She is an excellent choreographer and teacher too.

Pasha too I think has been an excellent addition to the show; inventive choerpraphy and someone who excels in both latin and ballroom. Would be interesting to see how he would cope with a lesser able celeb as opposed to the 2 naturals he has had.

As for the rest...

Bin

James seriously needs to go, I dont get how is still there. Horrific personality and a dull choreographer.

Ola I think too needs to go, I dont mind her, but she has lost her sparkle.

Anton, I dont understand how he can still be on the show. He is a walking cliche and whilst he is good at the one liners I just dont see what he is getting out the show; other than sending himself up.

Erin, I think she's had her time on the show and should be replaced as well. Its a shame she hasn't really been given a contender since Austin, however I just think she's become a bit stale.

Aliona – Haven’t missed her at all. Didn’t like her anyway – but I’d imagine she will stay next year. Personally I would get rid in favour of Iveta

Robin – Personally Can’t really stand him

Keep
Vincent - A good choreographer, however dont really like his personality. But I would keep him.

Flavia - I like her and she is good at coming up with interesting routines. Louis is a quite person and she has done well at attempting to draw him out of his shell. Keep

Karen – Nicky has come on so much in the past few weeks and Karen needs to take some of that credit. Sure she has had a couple of misfires this series, but she deserves a second go.

Artem – Excellent at doing routines. Not a massive fan of his personality, but his dancing skills are brilliant

Brendan – I’ve warmed to him over the years; he’s good at creating routines and now he has settled down a far bit is quite fun too.

Kristina – On the fence about Kristina really, but I think she has created some good dances, even if she usually gets an early exit.


Bring Back Matthew and Ian!!!

I ADORE Robin! He must stay! Get rid of Anton and James and bring back Brian (definitely!) and either Ian or Matthew. To be honest if both were to come back you could get rid of Pasha for me- he seems sweet but meh. I'm probably going to get slaughtered for that. The only people I would definitely keep would be Vincent, who's grown on me tremendously this year, and Artem who's a genius.

For the girls definitely bring back Katya. She was my favourite! Get rid of Erin and Aliona. Natalie and Kristina are the best ones. The rest I couldn't really care less about.

Brian is a good call. I never did know why he was ditched. Or did he jump? Katya was OK so she could come back.

I forgot Robin in my list. I think he's a hoofer. I'd certainly let him go.

The feeling I have got from this year is that the producers have exercised more control over things like music choices and 'steering' the show in directions they want.

I think that has reduced the performance of many of the pro dancers. I dont think we have seen enough dances of the quality the celeb lineup could have delivered.

I agree completely. I've been very disappointed this year. I haven't seen a single WOW dance and it feels as though the whole thing has been scripted.

Uncanny! I would say almost exactly the same about each one! I'd just add that I wasn't a fan of Katya at all and that I adored Ian (who doesn't?)

That's an intriguing remark about Aliona, tangoqueen! I like her.

Hello All

This is my first - and quite possibly last - post on here but I wanted to firstly say how much I enjoy reading the discussions, and secondly to say that

1. I know nothing about dance. Nothing.
2. Saturday nights are a very important time for me and mine.
3. Personality and charisma always trump talent for me (Robbie v Gary...)

So, I watch the show to be entertained, to have a few laughs and the odd 'aww' moment with the family and to see who is contributing what.

For what its worth, Natalie, Flavia and Ian Waite have always seemd to me to have the "most about them", to get more out of their partners than anyone believed possible (Audley ? Michael ? Matt ?) and to really enjoy the WHOLE of the show.

I also really enjoyed Brian's whole attitude and energy and cannot understand for the life of me why James and Ola ever get asked back.

To me its about who brings something to the party and Anton clearly does, so does Brendan and so did Katya, all 3 of whom may or may not be good dancers and fab choreographers. Artem may be a dance genus, but he's just not adding value.

Finally I too have a very personal reason for not commenting too much on Aliona - I'm very happy in my relationship and dont want my partner to read my innermost thoughts or else.....!!!

Enjoy the show tomorrow, Kimberley to go, Denise to be saved despite James. Dani to win in a shock over Louis in the final...

I'd replace Anton and Erin with Ian Waite and Katya.

If I was to get rid of anyone else it would be Robin.

Michael's not in the competition because perspiration will only take you so far - he just couldn't do the party latin - no reflection on him or Nat - you can't help where your talents lie but you can help how much you try.

Natalie actually reminds me a lot of Ian - a personal favourite, and an undeniably good teacher, but it never really seems to translate into an actual affinity with the public or a strong vote for any of their partners. I doubt she'll ever win, but I'll always love her.

Everyone's actually been more or less as I've expected to be honest, except that I think James has generally underperformed, especially in ballroom, and in terms of not...you know, forgetting routines and kicking his partner in the feet, or whatever it was he did in the American Smooth. Flavia's been mostly good with one/two shockers ; Vincent's been consistant, and occasionally inspiring ; Pasha's definitely one of my favourites ; Robin definitely isn't.

I disagree with those who think Erin was disengaged this year though. I think this has been the hardest she's tried since Austin. The fact that she got someone who was clearly only cast as a second-rate Russell and fodder all the way to Wembley is testament to the fact that she was actually switched on this year (that and that the judges saving him repeatedly in the dance-off obviously).

I really wish we had a more fluid pro line up like DWTS which would allow for a more changeable lineup and not the endless "deserves a contender" expectations.

Well, we had a pretty big clear-out of some of the long-term pros not so long ago - and I think I'm correct in saying that the show has never had the same line-up of competitive pros two years running, so it's not that static.

I can't see many big changes, but I do hope that we see Iveta back next year.

Personally, I haven't missed Aliona one bit from this series (I've never made secret I thought she was terrible with Matt, and extremely lucky Harry had the pre-show support he did or they would have got nowhere near the finals with her choreography!) and would be glad to see her not return in favour of Iveta next year;

My biggest disappointment this series has to be Ola! I understand the issues she had with her mother but the Tango/Cha Cha choreography, knowing Sid could dance (Waltz and Salsa), really weren't good! With Robbie, she played so well to his strengths and by his elimination he was massively improved, but with Sid, it seemed like her heart wasn't in it anymore. I hope this was just a blip due to her personal life, and pending her return next series, she can sparkle like she has done before.

I like Erin greatly! I think her stuff with Austin proved how good she is, and hasn't been given anywhere near a shot since, maybe since Anton got his "quirky" character in series 8 and they want more pro dances from them both, but I loved Erin's choreography, thought she did an admirable job with Richard, and would like to see a bit more of her and Anton, if they must go, let it be with a bang and not a whimper considering their longevity. Give them a shot next series, then Anton as host and Erin as judge would be acceptable.

I love Ola, she has had such a bad year.

Damehepa, Ola didn't choreograph the Cha cha - she was away in Poland seeing to her mother and only got back on the Friday to learn the routine that had been given to her for the Saturday night. The tango I do agree was pretty poor but perhaps something happened during that week but I do think she was genuinely disappointed that Sid left early as you could see her apologising profusely to him when they exited. I personally don't think it was entirely her own fault for the early exit! I would say after the tango that Sid's attitude changed and he could have improved the situation by being more positive and at least putting more heart and soul into the performances even if he didn't like the choreo.

I think some allowances have to be made for Ola after what she has been through this year.

There are some pros who continually get duds I'd like to see them get contenders to see how they could actually shine rather than write them off. I can't remember the last time Anton had anyone who could be considered a finalist, Erin hasn't had a great parther since Austin Healy, Ola was never expected to win with Chris I don't remember her ever having someone who could be considered a contender from the start.
There are some who have contenders and still haven't shown themselves to be great: James springs to mind straight away, he may well still win it but he hasn't done an awful lot to make that happen. I agree with those who find Flavia a bit hit and miss also.
I agree with the calls to bring Matthew and Brian back, I miss them as pros although I do like Artem and Natalie has shown herself to be great this year. I've never been a great Vincent fan but I have to agree with those who have said he does always get on with and get the best out of his partners.
I'd give Karen another year, she's done quite well with Nicky now that she's settled in.
Feel free to contradict me btw my memory isn't always great with these things

This has probably been covered in n number of threads which I haven't read, so apologies, but I hate the introduction of so many props and faffing around. ( I sound like Len!) For me that's one of the reasons there hasn't been many WOW dances.....though nothing anyone does will compare to seeing Ramps' AT the first time.

Disclaimer: I know absolutely zero about dance and choreography, so I may be missing the mark. I just know if a routine makes me inwardly cheer.

What happened during that week was that she was given music which is not a Tango and was pretty impossible to dance a Tango to!