I think there's something to be said for respecting and acquiescing to authority but that doesn't really fit with the Doctor's methods very often!

The Doctor doesn't want a submissive as a companion. He wants someone who will challenge him and stand up to him. In fact, it's been established that he needs companions like that in order to remind him of human values and to keep him on the straight and narrow as, left to his own devices, his lack of human perspective can get him into trouble.

I can't believe I'm saying this, but I loved it.

Everything was better - there was comedy, and warmth, and character.

Clara brings out the best in Matt's Doctor and I really love his Victorian Scooby gang.

Finally, a Moffat episode I genuinely enjoyed.

For me, I think Clara could be the saving of Who.

OK, I see. Two different things. Clara is relevant to both the self contained story and the larger arc. Both of those were overlapping so I don't think it's wrong to think much of the episode centred on Clara. Truthfully she was more of a protagonist than the Doctor.

Interesting metaphor at 18:24, we see the focus on the shiny gold band on her right hand middle finger as she wakes up with a start, wearing white to the sound of a church bell.

19:11 In the carriage her ring is on her left hand before her quick change.

Later entering Vastra’s in governess attire 23:18, “May I take your coat ?”, the ring is on her left hand middle finger.

Checked out the staircase too. Clockwise at the bottom and in the CGIed ascent but anti-clockwise at the top. It can’t be a flopped shot (thanks Dave-H) as at 17:02 we see both the anti-clockwise helix and Tardis on screen.

I wouldn't look too much in to the ring. She has been swapping them around for years. She said she always wears one.

I suppose it depends on how submissive. If it's all the time, then that's definitely a bad thing in my book. Question everything!

The way it came over to me was that it was more about Clara then the Great Intelligence/'main plot', Far more time was spent on her than the rest of it. It was also signposted very heavily that although she died, that was not the end for her (or someone very like her) and the result was the Doctor breaking his 'retirement' to look for her. In that respect I agree it wasn't really resolved within the episode but just part of the ongoing post-Pond series.

I also have reservations about the way Clara came across; I don't think she was necessarily bad or conniving but she certainly wasn't a straightforward typically Victorian girl and I think I would have preferred that rather than yet another 'feisty, smart-talking, sexy girl' who fancies the Doctor and has a mystery attached.

But humans come in all shapes, sizes and personalities, maybe he'd like someone a bit restful occasionally instead of forever being talked back to. He did seem to get very weary of being henpecked by Tegan, the woman never stopped nagging him (until pretty late on, anyway). At least he also had Nyssa who must have been so peaceful to be around after that.

Different Doctors, different taste in companions.

It was clear that this Doctor loved Clara's take charge attitude (and Amy's, for that matter). While I'm sure he grew fond of Rory he would never have been his choice for companion.

Plus, even if he preferred a quiet and compliant companion it would not have been good for him. He needs to be challenged. He needs someone who can make him see when he's wrong. The Universe depends on it

Regarding whether the story was resolved or not…

I don’t really think this is an issue that can be argued about, it’s just down to how the episode made people feel. Most people enjoyed it, therefore the episode did its job and I can’t complain, I can only voice my own opinion and say that to me it felt unresolved. But no one is “right” or “wrong” here. You can never tell someone they are wrong to enjoy an episode, or not to enjoy it.

Also, for the record, I do think Moffat is a fantastic writer and have loved his work since Press Gang, through Fatal Death and Coupling and especially now on Doctor Who. I have always respected him as a writer and used to read interviews with him long before his involvement in Doctor Who. I think he is a great showrunner and certainly would not change that. I have not been questioning his talent, just expressing a few views on the decisions he is making lately. (Part of me, unrealistically, thinks he may read this stuff and take everyone’s views on board.)

Clara: evil?

Sorry GDK, I think this is all very much in the territory of personal opinion and we have different ways of seeing things. I tend to see things differently to most people, largely because of the faith I have in Jesus and his teachings. I enjoy discussing Doctor Who, but I must try to remember in future to avoid bringing opinions that hinge upon moral values, since most people will inevitably see things differently to me!

You praised Clara’s charm, confidence and physical beauty. Personally these are not qualities I see as important or equating to moral goodness. I think Clara is very beautiful and charming but that doesn’t really do anything for me (I would never choose a girlfriend based on her outward appearance). I would much rather have a character who was awkward, shy, ugly, and good-hearted, but this is just my own tastes.

I’m not saying I can’t tolerate companions of questionable moral integrity… it’s just that if we’re going to spend the next couple of years with this character, I would like some redeeming qualities to be able to relate to and at this stage I am more than a little unsure of this girl. And “the whole Amy thing” makes me wary of the kind of companions Moffat is creating.

Submissive companions

I guess we are just going to have to disagree about this.

For me personally, submissiveness is a very important quality (as in: respect, honour and loyalty to higher authorities). A good worker submits to their boss; a good son submits to his parents, and in the case in question, I think the humans should submit to the Doctor’s authority because IMHO he is a higher authority and should lead. That is my ethos, and probably why I found Amy so objectionable as she was so full of herself and quick to belittle other people, including the Doctor. So I saw Amy much more of a villain than a hero.

As Thrombin and others have pointed out, the Doctor does need human guidance, though I would say you can guide and assist your superior without being rude or wanting to take over. If I were the Doctor’s companion, I might second-guess him or question him, but I would always do it gently, with the utmost of respect for his leadership. (Yes, quite likely the Doctor would not choose a person like me to travel with him!)

For me, pledging unquestioning loyalty to one man comes second nature, as my views and attitudes all stem from my own submission to the Lord Jesus. Most people will inevitably disagree with my moral outlook. Though I don’t think anyone can tell me I am evil for wanting to submit and lower myself! I might be a fool, but not evil. For me, moral goodness is not seeking status, superiority, or acquisition for myself, but seeking only to humbly give and serve. It is the opposite mindset of pride, greed, haughtiness, disdain and arrogance, which I see as evil.

Oh, as for Rory, I suppose he is fairly submissive to the Doctor, though I never really thought about that and wasn’t trying to make any particular point. I was just saying that I really loved Rory; I thought he came across as good-hearted, an excellent and faithful husband and a very good role model for young people. So he provided a needed contrast with Amy. (He wasn’t perfect of course, but no one is.)

Grand Dizzy, I certainly agree with you about physical beauty being of limited importance. It is what's inside that counts.

As for the rest, we'll have to agree to disagree. As a scientific, rational and ethical person myself, I don't accept your assertions about faith.

Question everything!

Thank you for your respectful disagreement.

Everything about Clara screams good-hearted all through the episode for me. I'm still at a complete loss why you think there's anything remotely negative about her



I think it's a bit early to be expecting her to respect and obey the Doctor without question. She has no idea who or what he is. Her first impression would have been a bumbling buffoon with his bumbling buffoon sidekick whose first instinct is to forcibly remove the last hour of her memory. A buffoon who apparently is capable of helping but refuses to do so because he's decided to withdraw from society and live on a cloud!

The fact that she seems to be drawn to him and seeks him out for his help is probably more respect than he actually deserves at this point



I'm still not convinced Clara had any of those qualities but the Doctor has several of them in spades. Are you saying that the Doctor is evil?

Personally, I reserve the term evil for when it involves deliberately doing harm to others. Anything less diminishes the term IMO.

A Sequel has been made where the GI tries the old Snowmen attack in the modern day.