yes it is my opinion, just like you have your opinion.
yes you do have choice of remove the skin by rooting, but isn't that just the same as jailbreaking to modify the look of iOS?

in my opinion all the manufacturers that insist on using skins should give the owner a choice of skinned or non-skinned, that would be a "real" choice.

But then how would manufacturers differentiate their products ?? In addition they get paid to include apps in their image. If you want non-skinned then go for the nexus devices.

differentiate with hardware specs, and optional downloadable content.
as i said, just give the owner the option of skinned or non-skinned.

differentiate how in hardware specs ? Screen size, CPU, camera, sensors, looks, etc, etc are pretty much the same. The only big differences are in software these days. I can't see how vendors can offer non-skinned phone.

Provide the option. If the skin is good, people will choose to use it.

Roll your eyes all you like. It's not a case of how easy it is to just install an app or two. What you'd be suggesting to these hypothetical friends is that they should stop using what they currently use that's always worked for them, that's built in, easy to use and integrated into the OS, and instead use something else, just to fit in with you.

I dunno. Maybe it just depends on how geeky these hypothetical friends are and how important you are to them. Those of a geeky persuasion would maybe be okay with jumping through a few minor hoops to try different things they're not used to. But in my observation, normal people aren't like that. They like simple. And there's nothing simpler than using what's built in and just works out of the box.

And before your eyes roll so much they get stuck in the back of your head, this is not an iPhone (user) vs Android (user) thing. Technically 'apathetic' folk are not limited to one platform or the other. I'd be offering the same perspective if it were the other way around.

never going to happen. Same as why phone companies put their own branding on subsidised phones

its not about being geeky, my mrs is technophobic and who I would describe as a typical user has no problems using app store, I'm sure apple store is even easier to use.

There are no hoops to jump through !

Sorry but if someone isn't able to download an app for either an Android or Apple phone then they are to stupid to own a smartphone

No, you're not getting it. I said right at the start, "It's not a case of how easy it is to just install an app or two."

Installing an app is a hoop, but granted, not the significant one. Using something that isn't built in and integrated into the OS, when the same functionality is already there, is a hoop.

What are you on ?

When you download an app thats built for an OS it becomes integrated be it Android, Apple , Windows or even Symbian, Whatsapp Viber etc offer functionality that isn't inbuilt into a system and as they will work cross platform , just because friends may have Android , Apple or Windows phones it doesn't mean you have to follow

I have Android the other half has Apple yet we can easily message, share photos and videos

I if you want plain Android you have the choice of Nexus and that is it...not really much of a choice!

Guess it depends on how much of a friend you are and they actually want to talk to you I suppose to go to that tiny effort

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In relation to skins a launcher will remove a skin if you really want it to so not any real problem

And going back to ios from android would limit your flexibilty a lot

So let's get this straight. When you install the likes of Whatsapp or Viber on an iPhone, it is just as integrated as iMessage and FaceTime is?

or installing a custom ROM, granted not what most novices will want to do but its an option

Yes, it becomes an icon on your screen. When you press on it, it launches the app, same as imessage and facetime. And whatsapp will happily integrate with your contacts, don't know about viber but I suspect it will as well.

So I don't know what further level of integration you are referring to ?

It will also share photos, videos and location at the touch of a button as well as immediately send a photo you take or video you make and allow VOIP calls so you don't use your minutes Viber also does the same ,I can't think how much more integrated you can get either

I would assume the integration being referred to is this:

Option 1 - Pick up iPhone and say "Facetime my Mum" and it happens vs.
Option 2 - Pick up iPhone and navigate to Viber app, open contacts in Viber and then find Mum in the list. Press 'call'.

I'm thinking about if you receive a phone call, there'll be a button there to seamlessly switch to a video chat, al la FaceTime. And if you receive a text, it will automatically detect where best to send your reply to, i.e. SMS or your chosen alternative, al la iMessage. That would be integrated. Do these alternatives do that? Seriously, I don't know.

Google has Google+ hangouts already. That is their video calling app, and its fab.



I thought the rumour mill was pretty dry for Google Voice now? Be great if it was coming - are you sure?

True, but it's a pain to do sometimes and often bits don't work correctly and some phones/tablets don't get them...would be so much better if there was an option to take the basic Android version on any phone/tablet.

You can do video calls with Android anywayor you can Skype if your contact has Viber you can use it to reply to SMS but if you both have Skype Whatsapp or Viber why would you use SMS or normal calls ?, they are all free and don't come out of your contract allowance

There are so many apps out there for messaging and VOIP or video calls you don't need the ones that come bundled in with your OS and they all give you free calls or messages

Have you misunderstood what I'm asking?

I am asking, do these alternatives integrate with the iPhone's existing built in phone/messaging system as seamlessly and idiot-proof as FaceTime/iMessage does? Because if they don't, that's a hoop some of you are suggesting the OP should be asking his friends to jump through just to fit in with him. And you don't see a problem with that?

These apps are all cross platform and integrate into any OS , no hoops to jump through, I don't see a problem with any of them and as I said if people do have trouble with them they are better off with two cams and a piece of string as even a normal phone is beyond them

the don't integrate, they run on top of the OS.
i think that's the point being made.