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Jimmy Saville to be revealed as a paedophile? (Part 7)


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Old 06-03-2013, 00:22
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Old 06-03-2013, 00:37
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Document for the Jersey Committee of Inquiry into historical child abuse
http://www.statesassembly.gov.je/Ass...BTadier%5D.pdf

Rico Sorda posting a link tomorrow as audio will be online.
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Old 06-03-2013, 01:05
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More about the DPP's speech
http://news.sky.com/story/1060589/se...of-savile-case
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Old 06-03-2013, 02:05
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Louis Theroux has got a blog about Savile here http://louistheroux.com/blog/jimmy-savile/ in which he counted him as a friend.
The comments underneath start off all in praise of JS, then they turn, with some turning on Louis.
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Old 06-03-2013, 07:03
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News channels leading with the Director of Public Prosecutions, Keir Starmer's speech he's making today

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-21673703
http://news.sky.com/story/1060589/se...of-savile-case
http://www.itv.com/news/story/2013-0...licy-overhaul/

Good to see some action at last, albeit v-e-r-y s-l-o-w-l-y.
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Old 06-03-2013, 07:06
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"Jersey's Chief Minister has confirmed lawyers are likely to get up to twice as much money as victims as a result of the Historic Child Abuse Redress Scheme. "

http://www.channelonline.tv/channelo....asp?ID=504176

Wonderful.


Rico Sorda ‏ @RicoSorda
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-jersey-19505496 … Link For #childabuse debate #jersey #coijersey Should start about 11am.
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Old 06-03-2013, 07:32
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BBC News has Keir Starmer on in a few minutes.
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Old 06-03-2013, 08:08
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Esther Rantzen will also be talking about it on BBC Breakfast around 8:35am.
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Old 06-03-2013, 08:17
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Esther Rantzen will also be talking about it on BBC Breakfast around 8:35am.
Thanks - I will put the telly on! Although I don't like ER is will still watch it.
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Old 06-03-2013, 10:00
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Thanks - I will put the telly on! Although I don't like ER is will still watch it.
Sorry I seemed to get the timing wrong there, it didn't seem to start until 08:43am hope you caught it.
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Old 06-03-2013, 11:33
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Sorry I seemed to get the timing wrong there, it didn't seem to start until 08:43am hope you caught it.
Yes ER did quite well I thought. She put the case for the children being called liars and fantasists as par for the course by prosecution counsel though being completely unacceptable. I thought the point about the judge stopping a trial because he considered the prosecution 'child abuse' in itself was a good one.

The interviewer put the case for the other side being wrongly accused and while Esther conceded that not all children tell the truth, she said that the balance has been strongly weighted against the alleged victim so far.

I think that the character assassination of young children she was talking about is inexcusable.
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Old 06-03-2013, 13:07
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"Jersey's Chief Minister has confirmed lawyers are likely to get up to twice as much money as victims as a result of the Historic Child Abuse Redress Scheme. "

http://www.channelonline.tv/channelo....asp?ID=504176

Wonderful.
This is old news. I don't know about UK, but here we have compensation claims in which the lawyer gets at least 50% to 70% of the money.
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Old 06-03-2013, 16:12
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Ellie Cumbo ‏@EllieCumbo

Looking forward to Keir Starmer's speech on child abuse prosecutions later, which I'll live-tweet.
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Old 06-03-2013, 16:18
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Gary Burgess ‏@GaryBurgessITV

Politicians vote 43-0 in favour of the historical child abuse inquiry in Jersey. My report: http://www.channelonline.tv/channelo....asp?ID=504196
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Old 06-03-2013, 16:43
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Bridget Harris, one of Rennard's alleged victims, was on Victoria Derbyshire this morning
http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode...re_06_03_2013/
From 7mins in.
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Old 06-03-2013, 16:49
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Ellie Cumbo ‏ @EllieCumbo
Speech starts on recent police/CPS history on sexual offences: specialist prosecutors etc. Convictions and guilty pleas up

But Operation Span (the Rochdale grooming case) exposed lack of protection for vulnerable victims deemed not credible

Savile non-charging decisions investigated: subsequent report was 'uncomfortable reading.' Most victims had never come fwd

Reasons given by Savile victims for not coming forward included fear of not being believed

However, main identified shortcomings: first, tests for credibility of witnesses risk leaving a vulnerable group unprotected

That barriers to credibility (youth, alcohol use etc.) are very characteristics that make victim vulnerable=fundamental flaw

Following measures agreed with ACPO: clearing of decks (a review of ACPO practice guidelines revealed no fewer than 90)
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Old 06-03-2013, 16:59
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Ellie Cumbo ‏ @EllieCumbo (cont)

Instead, one overarching approach is needed- applicable to all police forces. To be drawn up by new College of Policing

CPS will also draw up own prosecution guidance for child sexual abuse. Advice will also be provided on lessons from Savile

CPS/ACPO also propose creation of national panel to review past cases that led to no further action

Panel membership not yet determined but it's hoped it will include an independent element alongside police and CPS

'Let us be clear- on their own, these measures are not enough.. others [besides police and CPS] have responsibilities too'

Has been a shift, says Starmer. In 2003, concern was that police were over-eager in approaching victims. Not with Savile

Was even a 2003 proposal that there should be a higher threshold for charging child sexual abuse cases- 'rightly rejected'

'If all that we achieve is a set of guidelines that are jettisoned in 5yrs..we will have let down victims in a profound way'
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Old 06-03-2013, 17:17
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Ellie Cumbo ‏ @EllieCumbo (cont)

If we consider a test that isn't solely victim-specific but looks at accused/patterns of behaviour, 'we may find an answer'

Consultation and draft guidelines will follow. We need 'a national consensus.. a collective response'

Speech finishes and floor open for questions to Starmer and his principal legal adviser
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Old 06-03-2013, 17:17
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CPS ‏@cpsuk

The full text of the DPP’s speech on tackling child sexual abuse is now on our website: http://bitly.com/Zg71t9
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Old 06-03-2013, 17:27
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Ellie Cumbo ‏ @EllieCumbo (cont)

Starmer points to research showing girls aged 16-19 most at risk of intimate partner violence. Most perpetrators same age

Victims need to know how they'd be dealt with and that if case comes to court there's 'a pretty good chance' it will succeed

Starmer notes the importance of Independent Domestic Violence Advisers- vital their funding continues http://www.google.co.uk/search?hl=en...p&q=idva&btnG=

Discussion now on cross-examination. Touchstone is relevance; we now realise e.g. past sexual history/clothing not relevant

Starmer's principal legal adviser explains what matters isn't who's making the allegations, but the allegations themselves

Observation from audience: prosecutors don't challenge irrelevant questions to complainant often enough: need more training
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Old 06-03-2013, 18:07
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Ellie Cumbo ‏ @EllieCumbo (cont)

Starmer: it's inherent in the adversarial system that a defence advocate will put to the complainant that they are lying

Event now over and I'm off to spill some free cranberry juice on my white jacket. Normal Twitter service to resume shortly..
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Old 06-03-2013, 18:27
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"” I regularly briefed Jenny Tonge on child abuse in Richmond” -children’s director"

http://davidhencke.wordpress.com/201...rens-director/
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Old 06-03-2013, 18:41
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Rico Sorda reacts to Jersey finally setting up an Inquiry into historical child abuse
http://ricosorda.blogspot.co.uk/2013...passed-by.html


Abuse committee of inquiry terms agreed
http://www.thisisjersey.com/news/201...-terms-agreed/


'No evidence' of eastern European sex ring in Jersey
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-jersey-21670808
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Old 06-03-2013, 19:18
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New guidelines on investigating sexual abuse are a step in the right direction.
The attention generated by the Savile case has at last resulted in a will to take vulnerable children's allegations seriously

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisf...ight-direction
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Old 06-03-2013, 19:59
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Yes ER did quite well I thought. She put the case for the children being called liars and fantasists as par for the course by prosecution counsel though being completely unacceptable. I thought the point about the judge stopping a trial because he considered the prosecution 'child abuse' in itself was a good one.

The interviewer put the case for the other side being wrongly accused and while Esther conceded that not all children tell the truth, she said that the balance has been strongly weighted against the alleged victim so far.

I think that the character assassination of young children she was talking about is inexcusable.
Yes, it was a good segment. Its very frustrating to hear of a case like that - the accused being let off because they felt it was too damaging to the witness to give her testimony? ugh is there a double jeopardy type law that means they can never be tried again if someone else were to come forward?. I wonder if things like giving evidence by video link, possibly recorded beforehand, could help? but they'd still have to be able to answer questions and so on, of course.

I don't think its necessarily right to presume every single accusation is completely accurate, some kids may be looking for attention/sympathy or have other issues and lie about things. There's a scene on an episode of Outnumbered where the young boy is in a shop with his parents and is annoyed his dad won't buy him something (or something along those lines), so when dad grabs his hand and says their leaving the shop, he starts shouting 'HES NOT MY DAD! HELP!' etc

I remember there was an episode of Law & Order: SVU where a man was accused of child abuse and it turned out that the child had been manipulated by their parents to make the claims because they were so suspicious of the accused, they felt there was something dodgy about them and didn't want them in their community, wanting them behind bars before anything did happen, so they told the child what to say had happened, basically fabricating it, on the basis that it would prevent genuine acts of abuse from happening in the future I can't remember why they thought this person was so dodgy but it was quite a creepy story - the parents were the abusers at the end of the day, putting pressure on their kid to convince people they'd been assaulted, ugh.
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