[John259]

Originally Posted by Y Me

I wish people could explain why the Metro interface is such a problem for them.

Here are some possibilities:
Launching seldom used programs is awkward.
The Charm icons sometimes appear when they're not wanted.
Metro mode is sometimes invoked accidentally.

All fixed with one of the utlities such as Classic Shell or Start8.

[Y Me]

Originally Posted by John259

Here are some possibilities:
Launching seldom used programs is awkward.
The Charm icons sometimes appear when they're not wanted.
Metro mode is sometimes invoked accidentally.

All fixed with one of the utlities such as Classic Shell or Start8.

Seldom used programmes will need 2 clicks not one if run from Desktop - this is awkward?

Shortcut Charm icons and Metro mode invoked accidentally - yes this has happened a few times but is it really an inconvenience warranting the pages of Microsoft aimed abuse - these people really need to get a life and move on - talking of which - so should I.

Very minor rant over

[John259]

Originally Posted by Y Me

Seldom used programmes will need 2 clicks not one if run from Desktop - this is awkward?

Without one of the fixing utilities wouldn't you have to switch to Metro mode, then scroll horizontally until you find the program, then if there isn't a tile find the All Apps facility if you can remember where it is? Probably ok if you remember how to do all that I suppose.

[John259]

Originally Posted by Y Me

is it really an inconvenience warranting the pages of Microsoft aimed abuse

It's one factor amongst many - and in any case it can be fixed by the utilities.

[RichmondBlue]

Originally Posted by Y Me

Seldom used programmes will need 2 clicks not one if run from Desktop - this is awkward?

Shortcut Charm icons and Metro mode invoked accidentally - yes this has happened a few times but is it really an inconvenience warranting the pages of Microsoft aimed abuse - these people really need to get a life and move on - talking of which - so should I.

Very minor rant over

Yes, but with a product that has been aggressively pushed in all the high street chains, the extensive advertising, and sales of 60 million, shouldn't we be reading thousands of consumers singing the praises of Windows 8 ?

Surely any "upgrade" is about benefits to the consumer. I've never tried it hands-on, and I'm not knocking Microsoft. For all I know it might be great, just what I've been waiting for. But all the evidence (from other ordinary punters) says otherwise.
The switch appears to be either downright disliked, or merely tolerated. Why is that ?
After all, it's not much of a recommendation for a new product when you can't find (anywhere, not just in these forums) glowing reports about the benefits of switching to Win8.

[IvanIV]

Originally Posted by John259

Without one of the fixing utilities wouldn't you have to switch to Metro mode, then scroll horizontally until you find the program, then if there isn't a tile find the All Apps facility if you can remember where it is? Probably ok if you remember how to do all that I suppose.

If you know the name just start typing it on a start screen, it will appear after you'll have typed 2-3 letters. If you don't remember the name, buy yourself some ginkgo extract

[IvanIV]

Originally Posted by RichmondBlue

Yes, but with a product that has been aggressively pushed in all the high street chains, the extensive advertising, and sales of 60 million, shouldn't we be reading thousands of consumers singing the praises of Windows 8 ?

No. MS is not Apple, they do not have enthusiastic fans. You'll only hear something if somebody is unhappy about something and then you hear it repeatedly and very loud, this thread is the proof.

[DotNetWill]

Originally Posted by Tassium

This is a clue as to how generally unpopular Win8 is, it's a minority OS with acolytes.

How do you know it's generally unpopular? Vocal and majority are the not the same thing.

[TheBigM]

Originally Posted by RichmondBlue

Yes, but with a product that has been aggressively pushed in all the high street chains, the extensive advertising, and sales of 60 million, shouldn't we be reading thousands of consumers singing the praises of Windows 8 ?

Surely any "upgrade" is about benefits to the consumer. I've never tried it hands-on, and I'm not knocking Microsoft. For all I know it might be great, just what I've been waiting for. But all the evidence (from other ordinary punters) says otherwise.
The switch appears to be either downright disliked, or merely tolerated. Why is that ?
After all, it's not much of a recommendation for a new product when you can't find (anywhere, not just in these forums) glowing reports about the benefits of switching to Win8.

Several reasons:

1) Hardware: the hardware that it works best on hasn't been widely available or displayed: basically devices with either touchscreens or good multi-touch trackpads. Also, people have continued their habits of buying the crappy, cheap windows laptops, they are not used to paying more for the quality machines and devices. On the Apple side, they have no choice and stump up the cash but get good hardware in return.

2) The app ecosystem: the existence of metro makes sense when there are actually apps to use with it. Right now there are very few and so metro adds less value right now.

3) Change: People are resistant to change, there are always whiners. Plenty of people claimed 7 wasn't great or worth it when it came out, now opinion has changed. Also people are approaching Windows 8 with the same mindset they've always had to operating a computer so they are looking for a start menu button to press, looking for a soft button to shut down the pc, looking for a close window button. People just aren't used to chrome-less design, they aren't used to the windows key on their keyboard, they aren't used to pressing the hardware power button on their laptops to turn off the machine.

Also Microsoft haven't done themselves any favours, many of the controls and interfaces are hidden making it harder for people to adjust. The implementation of Metro on Windows Phone is fantastic making it perhaps the easiest mobile operating system. The implementation on Windows 8 is ok but nowhere near as good.

[DotNetWill]

Originally Posted by TheBigM

.. good multi-touch trackpads....

This to me the right evolution of touch on desktops/laptops. I spent a tiny amount of time getting to know them on OSX on my MBA and they just add so much to my workflow. At the same time the though of touching my monitor goes against I've ever known,

[anniebrion]

Originally Posted by DotNetWill

This to me the right evolution of touch on desktops/laptops. I spent a tiny amount of time getting to then on OSX on my MBA and they just add so much to my workflow. At the same time the though of touching my monitor goes against I've ever known,

I had this feeling too, but since getting an iPad I have found that the finger marks are not noticeable when using the iPad and can easily be removed, unlike a normal TFT where it takes weeks to remove smudges.

[TheBigM]

Originally Posted by DotNetWill

This to me the right evolution of touch on desktops/laptops. I spent a tiny amount of time getting to then on OSX on my MBA and they just add so much to my workflow. At the same time the though of touching my monitor goes against I've ever known,

For desktops and older laptops, perhaps try out a new multi-touch trackpad by Logitech. (Make sure to buy the right one, not the older one!).

http://www.logitech.com/en-gb/produc...t650?crid=1153

[DotNetWill]

Originally Posted by anniebrion

I had this feeling too, but since getting an iPad I have found that the finger marks are not noticeable when using the iPad and can easily be removed, unlike a normal TFT where it takes weeks to remove smudges.

I've got an iPad and that doesn't bother me because that's just how you use it. It's very differnet with a laptop or desktop where for decades I've never touched the screen or had any desire to.

[zz9]

Originally Posted by RichmondBlue

Well, I've got no axe to grind, I'm still using XP. But I've been thinking of buying a new desktop, and was looking around at all-in-one computers. It appears impossible to avoid Windows 8, despite the distinctly luke-warm response from consumers. It seems to me that we are being dragged kicking and screaming into buying a new OS that very few people actually like or wanted.
I've seen very few enthusiastic reviews of Win8 from ordinary consumers, most say they are just muddling along and wishing they could go back to 7, XP, or even Vista.
If it's so different, and so user-unfriendly, it does make me wonder if I should finally take the leap to Apple and get an iMac. I wonder if other people are thinking the same ?

I went from XP to W8 thanks to their upgrade offer and am very happy. Though, and this is a big point, I have installed Classic Shell that puts back the XP style Start button and menu.

I had upgraded my mobo a couple of years ago and XP was never really designed to run dual core CPUs properly and so W8 is far faster and smother in every way.

Outlook Express isn't included, since W7, so I got Thunderbird, which was a doddle and converted all my OE mail to Thunderbird format.

The really big downside is Solitaire is gone! You can download a MS Games collection with Solitaire as a Metro app but it's not as good.

In short, I went from XP to W8 and am very glad I did.

[zz9]

Originally Posted by and101

The main problem with windows 8 is that it is different to windows 7 and people hate change. Windows 8 is getting the same luke-warm reception that Windows XP got when that was released. I can remember lots of people complaining that XP was a terrible OS with a fisherprice interface and had tons of compatibility problems. Now the same people are complaining about Windows 8 while claiming that XP was the best OS ever released.

I remember those complaints about the Fisher Price look, as I was one of those people! The difference is XP had a menu option "Select Classic Windows look" and that was it.
W8 does not have a "Switch off Metro and use Classic Windows start menu" option.

That is what Classic Shell does. The sooner MS include that with W8 the better.

[zz9]

Originally Posted by Y Me

I wish people could explain why the Metro interface is such a problem for them.

Since Windows 95 and every upgrade except Vista I have a blank desk top with a photograph of my grand-daughters on it and all the programmes I use regularly on the task bar.

For Windows 8 I have placed a re-start and shutdown button on the task bar, so I have to click once to get to my desk top or browser from the Metro screen.

Is this really an inconvenience?

I'm not having a go at anybody but I am curious.

How did you have all your regular programmes locked on the taskbar in XP? My XP only had currently open applications on the taskbar.

[Stig]

Originally Posted by zz9

How did you have all your regular programmes locked on the taskbar in XP? My XP only had currently open applications on the taskbar.

Quick Launch Toolbar probably.

[cnbcwatcher]

Originally Posted by zz9

I remember those complaints about the Fisher Price look, as I was one of those people! The difference is XP had a menu option "Select Classic Windows look" and that was it.
W8 does not have a "Switch off Metro and use Classic Windows start menu" option.

That is what Classic Shell does. The sooner MS include that with W8 the better.

I was also one who complained about XP. I used to say it looked like a toy. I even used the Classic Windows look a few times to make it look more like Windows 2000, but eventually I gave into the Luna interface (as it was called).

[Smudged]

Originally Posted by zz9

The really big downside is Solitaire is gone! You can download a MS Games collection with Solitaire as a Metro app but it's not as good.

There's a way of installing the MS Games (Solitaire etc.) on Windows 8 by copying them from Windows 7. See instructions here. Sounds complicated but it's very easy when you've got the right files.

If you don't have access to Windows 7 to get the files I can point you in the right direction (not sure I can post the link here but PM me). Same goes for anyone else needing them.

[d'@ve]

Originally Posted by Y Me

Seldom used programmes will need 2 clicks not one if run from Desktop - this is awkward?

For lesser used programs, when you aren't sure of the exact name or spelling, two clicks? Not quite.

For Metro and a 1920x1080 screen it's (at most):

• Move mouse pointer to bottom bar
• right click
• move mouse pointer over to the right-bottom
• click the "All Apps" icon
• Scan 86 small icons of mixed-up programs, apps and section names (not even in line with each other)
• if not found, click bottom bar again to scroll right for next screen
• scan another 91 mixed-up programs, apps and section names (not even in line with each other)
• if not found, click bottom bar again to scroll right for next screen
• scan another 26 mixed-up programs, apps and section names (not even in line with each other)
• When found, click on launch-program icon.

[For 1024x768 resolution, four extra screens]

• click-scroll
• scan
• click-scroll
• scan
• click-scroll
• scan
• click-scroll
• scan

Compared to the Classic Start Menu method, it's (at most):

• Move pointer to bottom left
• Click Start button
• Hover pointer on either "Programs" or "Apps"
• Scan flyout vertical alphabetical column of 50 program group names all neatly in line
• Hover on required program group for flyout sub-list
• Click on required launch-program name

No peering, always two clicks plus a couple of fast hovers, job done in no time at all.

Metro is a perishing nightmare and I am unlikely ever to use it seriously on my desktop. Compared to Classic Shell and similar, it looks and works on a desktop PC like it was designed by my five year old grand daughter.

[cnbcwatcher]

Originally Posted by zz9

The really big downside is Solitaire is gone! You can download a MS Games collection with Solitaire as a Metro app but it's not as good.

So what games do Windows 8 users play to waste their time then?

[d'@ve]

Originally Posted by cnbcwatcher

So what games do Windows 8 users play to waste their time then?

Write long comparison lists of how to open lesser-used programs in Metro and with Start Menu!

[emptybox]

Originally Posted by d'@ve

For lesser used programs, when you aren't sure of the exact name or spelling, two clicks? Not quite.

For Metro and a 1920x1080 screen it's (at most):

• Move mouse pointer to bottom bar
• right click
• move mouse pointer over to the right-bottom
• click the "All Apps" icon
• Scan 86 small icons of mixed-up programs, apps and section names (not even in line with each other)
• if not found, click bottom bar again to scroll right for next screen
• scan another 91 mixed-up programs, apps and section names (not even in line with each other)
• if not found, click bottom bar again to scroll right for next screen
• scan another 26 mixed-up programs, apps and section names (not even in line with each other)
• When found, click on launch-program icon.

[For 1024x768 resolution, four extra screens]

• click-scroll
• scan
• click-scroll
• scan
• click-scroll
• scan
• click-scroll
• scan

Compared to the Classic Start Menu method, it's (at most):

• Move pointer to bottom left
• Click Start button
• Hover pointer on either "Programs" or "Apps"
• Scan flyout vertical alphabetical column of 50 program group names all neatly in line
• Hover on required program group for flyout sub-list
• Click on required launch-program name

No peering, always two clicks plus a couple of fast hovers, job done in no time at all.

Metro is a perishing nightmare and I am unlikely ever to use it seriously on my desktop. Compared to Classic Shell and similar, it looks and works on a desktop PC like it was designed by my five year old grand daughter.

Not sure why you are doing all the clicking? You can scroll through the All Apps screen with the arrows keys if you don't have a mouse.

[ShaunIOW]

I bought Windows 8 when it first came out and after trying it out for the past couple of months replaced it with Windows 7 this weekend as although it had some nice features I just found it too annoying to use (and thats with using Start8) as I got fed up with the side bits intruding if I happened to move the mouse slightly too far one way (like using when IE's back button) and some programs exiting to the metro interface. I tried using the metro intrerface and quite liked it but found it pointless as some apps wouldn't appear on it and it wasn't customisable enough for me.

[d'@ve]

Originally Posted by emptybox

Not sure why you are doing all the clicking? You can scroll through the All Apps screen with the arrows keys if you don't have a mouse.

Because a) someone mentioned two clicks, b) I prefer to use the mouse whenever possible and c) keyboard scrolling doesn't solve all the squinting at over 200 messy icons, names and section titles. It doesn't speed things up at all, in fact.

Metro is SLOOOOOW cumbersome, poorly designed and completely unsuited to mouse-driven desktop PCs with many different programs in regular use.

On the other hand, W8 with Classic Shell is a joy to use.