[IvanIV]

Originally Posted by Saltydog1955

Bi-polar my a*se!

As you say greengran they think that's an excuse for bad behaviour. It was PCOS a few years ago, now they're all 'bi-polar'.

Looks like a foot-in-mouth disease and a brain cell density disorder to me.

[gilliedew]

IMO she is so thick, she doesnt realise that she is...............

[RealityRocks]

Ugh, she lives near me. I used to think she was deeper than her character in Corrie, turns out she's far more shallow, quite an achievement!

[Jackie Brown]

Bi-polar? What a load of bunkum! More like a dozy bimbo who cannot engage her brain before speaking / acting.

The 'Im a Celeb' stint was the nail in the coffin of her relationship. The amount of stick on and off the pitch her bf must have got for her performance in there!

[nwda]

The piece was heavily skewed against her. She does appear to be vain and not the brightest bulb, but if she will invite this kind of ill thought out attention, she will do herself no favours.

[fredster]

Originally Posted by nwda

The piece was heavily skewed against her. She does appear to be vain and not the brightest bulb, but if she will invite this kind of ill thought out attention, she will do herself no favours.

What is sad, that she seems to have an endless supply of money. How many twenty two year olds can afford Birkin handbags, eat in expensive restaurants. have their hair done three times a week? She cannot cook or clean. She appears to live a very shallow life, courting the press, shopping and pouting.

[Saltydog1955]

Originally Posted by fredster

What is sad, that she seems to have an endless supply of money. How many twenty two year olds can afford Birkin handbags, eat in expensive restaurants. have their hair done three times a week? She cannot cook or clean. She appears to live a very shallow life, courting the press, shopping and pouting.

The endless supply of money probably comes from the footballer boyfriend. Getting you t*ts out in lads mags won't pay for 5,000 quid bags for long.

I blame the parents. They seem to have suffered from 'Our Little Princess' syndrome and never given her access to the real world when she was growing up.

[Butterface]

You know what annoys me? She refers to herself as "Ditsy" - as if it's endearing.

She is not ditsy at all, merely stupid, thoughtless and not particularly intelligent. Nothing endearing about that in the least IMO.

The endless supply of money probably comes from the footballer boyfriend.

I get the feeling that particular ATM may well be drying up soon, if stories are to be believed

[fredster]

Originally Posted by Saltydog1955

The endless supply of money probably comes from the footballer boyfriend. Getting you t*ts out in lads mags won't pay for 5,000 quid bags for long.

I blame the parents. They seem to have suffered from 'Our Little Princess' syndrome and never given her access to the real world when she was growing up.

But she has two sisters, are they overindulged as well?

[Saltydog1955]

Originally Posted by fredster

But she has two sisters, are they overindulged as well?

Presumably they weren't in a long running soap from the age of nine though.

http://www.reveal.co.uk/showbiz-cele...was-three.html

And from that it looks as if she was a 'Princess' from the age of three. Spoiled brat syndrome possibly?

[Zone_Out]

this news does not surprise me tbh as i`m sure it won`t shock many others
http://www.mtv.co.uk/news/helen-flan...im-a-celebrity

[Tweacle Tart II]

She is just horrible and has absolutely no redeeming qualities and nothing to offer except a big pair of tits

[zx50]

She says she's not a bimbo? Her behaviour on I'm A Celebrity says different.

[DavetheScot]

Originally Posted by Zone_Out

this news does not surprise me tbh as i`m sure it won`t shock many others
http://www.mtv.co.uk/news/helen-flan...im-a-celebrity

It's not really a surprise, no. People who are serious about acting careers should stay well away from reality TV (apart from the Andrew Lloyd Webber casting shows, which actually did work for the aspiring musical theatre stars who appeared on them)

[jerseyporter]

I'm coming at this from a slightly different angle - I didn't know who this person was before I caught her on IAC (don't watch Corrie) and some of the opinions I'm about to give come from professional experience, not just my own personal view (although I suppose one does form the other when you're talking about how children/young adults should and shouldn't be nurtured, and then in turn behaving - I've certainly brought up my own daughters, one of whom is only a couple of years younger than Helen, using a fair amount of what I learned at work, and they've turned out ok!)

Originally Posted by lexi22

The above is fair comment - we do make allowances for those we get/like - but Helen would need far greater comedic abilities for her actions to be seen in a humorous or self-deprecating light because she comes across as so utterly self-involved and oblivious to the world around her.

Really, as I said, harmless, and in the scheme of things, deserves little more than an eyeroll, but for her own sake, she really should get a grip, see how irritating her very insular and self-involved take on things can be, and make an effort to build a career for herself that relies on something a little bit more substantial than this dopey dizzy ditzy persona.

BIB - yes, you'd think someone in Helen's world would be trying to broaden her horizons for her own good, especially as they profess to be so concerned at all the negative things that are said about her and how upset she is about being 'misunderstood'. Ideally that role should have been fulfilled by her parents long before now, but instead they seem (from the interviews I've seen/read in their own words) have thought they were doing Helen a favour in 'protecting' her from anything other than what Helen wanted to think/do - they've certainly validated a lot of the things that people find so irritating now.

It's been done out of love, in this case, that much is clear, but it's been misplaced love. So many times I've seen parents who are afraid to guide their children in any way - sometimes because they think it will 'stifle' them, sometimes because they think any kind of negative comment will reduce their child's love for them, sometimes other reasons, but all done for the best of intentions - but the effect is that you end up with a child who does not have a balanced view of how the world works. People always seem to think that it's neglect or a lack of parental love that leads to inappropriate behaviour in older teenagers and young adults, but that's far from the case - it's just that no one sees the damage that 'over-loving' (that's not a real term, I can't think of the right one at the moment!) can do, as much as not loving enough.

Originally Posted by DavetheScot

I think Helen probably really is frustrated that everything she says and does seems to get jumped on. As pointed out, this doesn't happen with everyone and a more popular celebrity might not get treated in the same way.

I think she hopes to show us what she's really like. Contrary to what she thinks, though, I don't think she is very intelligent or deep, and I think she is rather thoughtless in some of her acts. But I don't see any evidence that she is deliberately unkind and I do think she seems rather vulnerable. I think she'd be better shutting up for a bit and getting herself together in private, and care a bit less about what strangers think.

BIB 1 - See, coming from my point of view of not knowing who she was before IAC, and reading some of the comments on DS before the show started, I got the impression she was quite popular, and liked, for her role in Corrie! I did watch IAC thinking "wow, some of the people who said they liked this girl must be wondering who they're watching now", and it seems that quite a few others did too - and now, suddenly, in a matter of a few months, she isn't very popular at all. Maybe I've got that wrong, but from an outsider's point of view that's how it seemed/seems to me in the cold light of day.

BIB 2 - I think you, and others who have expressed similar thoughts, have it largely right here. She DID show people what she was really like in IAC, and people didn't always like what they saw. No, she's not unkind, deliberately or otherwise - and I don't think I've read a single comment anywhere ever saying that she is - but being 'kind' is no defence for not being sensible, nor is it an excuse for being immature and insular in your thoughts, deed and words at the age of 22.

Helen's problem isn't one of how intelligent, or not, she is, it's more basic than that - something that, actually, has nothing to do with intelligence at all. What's she's lacking is good old common sense - a very undervalued thing, and so often overlooked in today's world where only paper qualifications seem to be valued as 'proof' of having achieved anything. She seems to think people will think more of her if she went back and studied, that it would suddenly change how she's viewed, but she's missing the point. Many people who find her frustrating don't care about the fact she hasn't done A Levels, or a degree, they're frustrated because she seems to lack something far more fundamental, and yet far more necessary than qualifications, and that's good old common sense.

Originally Posted by Porcupine

I see she isn't wearing her engagement ring in the new piccies on the mail site. So, has the footballer got rid ?

Again, not knowing anything about her, I was confused that in the jungle she sometimes wore it on her ring finger, and other days on her middle finger (are both fingers the same size?). Are they really engaged, or is it her just wishing they were and him buying a nice ring for her middle finger than just occasionally finds its way on to her ring finger? She is certainly not emotionally mature enough to be taking the step of marriage and children yet, and he doesn't seem to want to be tied down yet. The signs aren't good, reading between the lines and watching the body language, but she either can't see that or doesn't want to.

Originally Posted by kieranyeah123

I don't get why people dislike her so much. From what I've seen on her on TV and everything, yeah she's an attention seeker but she's not actually a horrible person. I've not seen her be horrible to anyone so I don't know why she deserves all this hate.

She's like 22 or something isn't she? She's been a 'star' so to speak since she was a child and probably had everything she wanted in life so I don't really see it being her fault as she doesn't know any different. I just don't understand why so many of you are so spiteful towards her when there's plenty of girls her age who are exactly the same. Like I said before, at least she's not a horrible person to people!

Does anyone actually 'hate' her? That's a strong word. Do they dislike her (haven't seen much evidence of that either) or do they just dislike the things they see and hear her do? They are separate things. Has anyone actually been 'spiteful'? I've not read any spite.

It does annoy me when people immediately jump on someone giving valid comments on someone's behaviour, not the person themselves, and accuse them of a 'hater' or 'disliking the person' or being 'spiteful' and 'jealous' when it's been nothing of the kind. I don't 'hate', 'dislike' or 'envy' Helen (or anyone I've never met for that matter - how can I?) and spite in anyone is horrible, but I do see behaviour traits in people (some of them flaunted with such pride we can't miss them) which are unattractive or inappropriate (as in Helen's case). But that doesn't mean I 'hate' or 'dislike' the person, nor is it a sign of 'spite' or 'jealously'. It's separating the sin from the sinner, if you want to use that expression - a very important part of dealing with anyone with any kind of inappropriate behaviour, including in your own children.

Originally Posted by nwda

The piece was heavily skewed against her. She does appear to be vain and not the brightest bulb, but if she will invite this kind of ill thought out attention, she will do herself no favours.

Again, a little bit of common sense and she would see this for herself. But in the absence of that, where are the people around her to provide that common sense on her behalf? If they are advising her, and she's just doing it regardless, then Helen really is bringing it on herself, either because she seems no harm in it regardless of what others say (yet always seems to regret it afterwards - has she never heard the expression 'once bitten, twice shy'?!) or because she's desperate to remain in the public eye. Either could be the reason, or a combination of both. Neither are going to do her any favours in the medium to longer term, though.

Originally Posted by fredster

What is sad, that she seems to have an endless supply of money. How many twenty two year olds can afford Birkin handbags, eat in expensive restaurants. have their hair done three times a week? She cannot cook or clean. She appears to live a very shallow life, courting the press, shopping and pouting.

Originally Posted by Saltydog1955

The endless supply of money probably comes from the footballer boyfriend. Getting you t*ts out in lads mags won't pay for 5,000 quid bags for long.

I blame the parents. They seem to have suffered from 'Our Little Princess' syndrome and never given her access to the real world when she was growing up.

The parents, though clearly loving Helen very much, have sadly created 'Frankenstein's monster' in their over-indulgence of Helen. They only want her to be happy - a noble thought, but they're going about it in the wrong way. They think making her happy is validating her every thought and whim, reducing the boundaries instead of setting them, lowering expectations instead of raising them. That might seem like a 'kind' thing to do to a child, but actually it scares them.

Children like to have boundaries, rules, clear expectations (and high ones). Give children goals and they'll rise to them; if that's set in childhood it will naturally carry on in teenager-hood, and adulthood. Helen's parents, unfortunately, either on their own or under misguided advice, seemed to think that they had to compensate for her by going in the completely opposite direction - they will defend it as 'protection' and 'love' and 'kindness', and yes it's good to have that, and bring them out in your child in the process, but it's only half the story. Helen could, and should, have been encouraged to learn how to cook at home, to clean, to use a washing machine etc by her parents, and she'd have done it - her unusual 'job' wasn't a reason for her not to learn those life skills, but now she seems to wear her inability to cope like a badge of honour around her neck. Very odd, and very odd that her parents still seem unable to move away from validating Helen's behaviour even though she's now 22. I suppose if they did they'd have to face up to the fact that they haven't really done her any favours!

But the upshot is Helen is clearly vulnerable and unsure of herself, unable often to face any kind of personal challenge without a 'get out clause' excusing her from it (because she's always been given one) and as much as I'm bound to be accused of all sorts of things in saying so, her 'kind and loving' parents have contributed to that more than anyone else simply by wanting to make her life as 'simple' and 'easy' as possible within the unusual circumstances in which Helen was living her teenage years.

Does Helen have the medical conditions she also uses to 'excuse' and 'explain' her behaviours? Hard to say for sure without knowing her, and certainly ADD and ADHD manifest themselves in different ways and can be managed very succesfully in various ways, but I have a friend with bi-polar and he doesn't see the traits he recognises in himself in Helen (or some other celebrities who 'claim' to have it for that matter). But it's easy to claim depression - you can't 'see' it like you can a broken leg, and it's easy to read up on the symptoms and pretend if you want to (plenty do). But it does seem to have become the latest celebrity trend, and that does any genuine sufferer a huge disservice

Apologies for such a long post. I certainly don't think Helen is unkind or horrible, and I don't hate her, but the fact remains that she is awfully lacking in the emotional and social awareness one would expect to see in a 'normal' 22 year old, and it can't all be blamed on her unusual job as a child - a child's greatest influence is always its parents, for good or bad. They clearly love Helen very much, but I wonder if they had their time again, with hindsight, they'd do it differently? I think we'd have seen a very different Helen if they had...

[greengran]

Good points Jersey. I actually feel a little sorry for her, I think she behaves as she does because, as you said, she's never been taught any better.she's like a small child in a toy shop with indulgent parents who say, go on, you can have anything you want.she needs to be educated in normal behaviour and stop preening and pouting all the time. Her obsession with her looks doesn't do her any favours either. In IAC she was constantly patting her face and her lips to the great amusement of the others.

[mary patricia]

Originally Posted by greengran

Good points Jersey. I actually feel a little sorry for her, I think she behaves as she does because, as you said, she's never been taught any better.she's like a small child in a toy shop with indulgent parents who say, go on, you can have anything you want.she needs to be educated in normal behaviour and stop preening and pouting all the time. Her obsession with her looks doesn't do her any favours either. In IAC she was constantly patting her face and her lips to the great amusement of the others.

I'll probably get called a jealous hater for this but I don't think she's anything special to look at It was more the outfits and story lines in Corrie that made her into some sort of Lolita.

[DiamondDoll]

Originally Posted by jerseyporter

I'm coming at this from a slightly different angle - I didn't know who this person was before I caught her on IAC (don't watch Corrie) and some of the opinions I'm about to give come from professional experience, not just my own personal view (although I suppose one does form the other when you're talking about how children/young adults should and shouldn't be nurtured, and then in turn behaving - I've certainly brought up my own daughters, one of whom is only a couple of years younger than Helen, using a fair amount of what I learned at work, and they've turned out ok!)



BIB - yes, you'd think someone in Helen's world would be trying to broaden her horizons for her own good, especially as they profess to be so concerned at all the negative things that are said about her and how upset she is about being 'misunderstood'. Ideally that role should have been fulfilled by her parents long before now, but instead they seem (from the interviews I've seen/read in their own words) have thought they were doing Helen a favour in 'protecting' her from anything other than what Helen wanted to think/do - they've certainly validated a lot of the things that people find so irritating now.

It's been done out of love, in this case, that much is clear, but it's been misplaced love. So many times I've seen parents who are afraid to guide their children in any way - sometimes because they think it will 'stifle' them, sometimes because they think any kind of negative comment will reduce their child's love for them, sometimes other reasons, but all done for the best of intentions - but the effect is that you end up with a child who does not have a balanced view of how the world works. People always seem to think that it's neglect or a lack of parental love that leads to inappropriate behaviour in older teenagers and young adults, but that's far from the case - it's just that no one sees the damage that 'over-loving' (that's not a real term, I can't think of the right one at the moment!) can do, as much as not loving enough.



BIB 1 - See, coming from my point of view of not knowing who she was before IAC, and reading some of the comments on DS before the show started, I got the impression she was quite popular, and liked, for her role in Corrie! I did watch IAC thinking "wow, some of the people who said they liked this girl must be wondering who they're watching now", and it seems that quite a few others did too - and now, suddenly, in a matter of a few months, she isn't very popular at all. Maybe I've got that wrong, but from an outsider's point of view that's how it seemed/seems to me in the cold light of day.

BIB 2 - I think you, and others who have expressed similar thoughts, have it largely right here. She DID show people what she was really like in IAC, and people didn't always like what they saw. No, she's not unkind, deliberately or otherwise - and I don't think I've read a single comment anywhere ever saying that she is - but being 'kind' is no defence for not being sensible, nor is it an excuse for being immature and insular in your thoughts, deed and words at the age of 22.

Helen's problem isn't one of how intelligent, or not, she is, it's more basic than that - something that, actually, has nothing to do with intelligence at all. What's she's lacking is good old common sense - a very undervalued thing, and so often overlooked in today's world where only paper qualifications seem to be valued as 'proof' of having achieved anything. She seems to think people will think more of her if she went back and studied, that it would suddenly change how she's viewed, but she's missing the point. Many people who find her frustrating don't care about the fact she hasn't done A Levels, or a degree, they're frustrated because she seems to lack something far more fundamental, and yet far more necessary than qualifications, and that's good old common sense.



Again, not knowing anything about her, I was confused that in the jungle she sometimes wore it on her ring finger, and other days on her middle finger (are both fingers the same size?). Are they really engaged, or is it her just wishing they were and him buying a nice ring for her middle finger than just occasionally finds its way on to her ring finger? She is certainly not emotionally mature enough to be taking the step of marriage and children yet, and he doesn't seem to want to be tied down yet. The signs aren't good, reading between the lines and watching the body language, but she either can't see that or doesn't want to.



Does anyone actually 'hate' her? That's a strong word. Do they dislike her (haven't seen much evidence of that either) or do they just dislike the things they see and hear her do? They are separate things. Has anyone actually been 'spiteful'? I've not read any spite.

It does annoy me when people immediately jump on someone giving valid comments on someone's behaviour, not the person themselves, and accuse them of a 'hater' or 'disliking the person' or being 'spiteful' and 'jealous' when it's been nothing of the kind. I don't 'hate', 'dislike' or 'envy' Helen (or anyone I've never met for that matter - how can I?) and spite in anyone is horrible, but I do see behaviour traits in people (some of them flaunted with such pride we can't miss them) which are unattractive or inappropriate (as in Helen's case). But that doesn't mean I 'hate' or 'dislike' the person, nor is it a sign of 'spite' or 'jealously'. It's separating the sin from the sinner, if you want to use that expression - a very important part of dealing with anyone with any kind of inappropriate behaviour, including in your own children.




Again, a little bit of common sense and she would see this for herself. But in the absence of that, where are the people around her to provide that common sense on her behalf? If they are advising her, and she's just doing it regardless, then Helen really is bringing it on herself, either because she seems no harm in it regardless of what others say (yet always seems to regret it afterwards - has she never heard the expression 'once bitten, twice shy'?!) or because she's desperate to remain in the public eye. Either could be the reason, or a combination of both. Neither are going to do her any favours in the medium to longer term, though.





The parents, though clearly loving Helen very much, have sadly created 'Frankenstein's monster' in their over-indulgence of Helen. They only want her to be happy - a noble thought, but they're going about it in the wrong way. They think making her happy is validating her every thought and whim, reducing the boundaries instead of setting them, lowering expectations instead of raising them. That might seem like a 'kind' thing to do to a child, but actually it scares them.

Children like to have boundaries, rules, clear expectations (and high ones). Give children goals and they'll rise to them; if that's set in childhood it will naturally carry on in teenager-hood, and adulthood. Helen's parents, unfortunately, either on their own or under misguided advice, seemed to think that they had to compensate for her by going in the completely opposite direction - they will defend it as 'protection' and 'love' and 'kindness', and yes it's good to have that, and bring them out in your child in the process, but it's only half the story. Helen could, and should, have been encouraged to learn how to cook at home, to clean, to use a washing machine etc by her parents, and she'd have done it - her unusual 'job' wasn't a reason for her not to learn those life skills, but now she seems to wear her inability to cope like a badge of honour around her neck. Very odd, and very odd that her parents still seem unable to move away from validating Helen's behaviour even though she's now 22. I suppose if they did they'd have to face up to the fact that they haven't really done her any favours!

But the upshot is Helen is clearly vulnerable and unsure of herself, unable often to face any kind of personal challenge without a 'get out clause' excusing her from it (because she's always been given one) and as much as I'm bound to be accused of all sorts of things in saying so, her 'kind and loving' parents have contributed to that more than anyone else simply by wanting to make her life as 'simple' and 'easy' as possible within the unusual circumstances in which Helen was living her teenage years.

Does Helen have the medical conditions she also uses to 'excuse' and 'explain' her behaviours? Hard to say for sure without knowing her, and certainly ADD and ADHD manifest themselves in different ways and can be managed very succesfully in various ways, but I have a friend with bi-polar and he doesn't see the traits he recognises in himself in Helen (or some other celebrities who 'claim' to have it for that matter). But it's easy to claim depression - you can't 'see' it like you can a broken leg, and it's easy to read up on the symptoms and pretend if you want to (plenty do). But it does seem to have become the latest celebrity trend, and that does any genuine sufferer a huge disservice

Apologies for such a long post. I certainly don't think Helen is unkind or horrible, and I don't hate her, but the fact remains that she is awfully lacking in the emotional and social awareness one would expect to see in a 'normal' 22 year old, and it can't all be blamed on her unusual job as a child - a child's greatest influence is always its parents, for good or bad. They clearly love Helen very much, but I wonder if they had their time again, with hindsight, they'd do it differently? I think we'd have seen a very different Helen if they had...

You perceptive posts are always worth reading jp.

[fredster]

Originally Posted by DavetheScot

It's not really a surprise, no. People who are serious about acting careers should stay well away from reality TV (apart from the Andrew Lloyd Webber casting shows, which actually did work for the aspiring musical theatre stars who appeared on them)

Why ever does she imagine she will get offered any acting work. playing an empty air headed bimbo in corrie for several years is as much as she has done isn't i

[InMyArms]

Wouldn't be surprised if Helen popped up in more reality TV shows, beginning with Celebrity Big Brother in the summer.

[DiamondDoll]

Originally Posted by InMyArms

Wouldn't be surprised if Helen popped up in more reality TV shows, beginning with Celebrity Big Brother in the summer.

Thing is she's really not very entertaining.
I think we've seen her full skill set already.

She not even very likeable.

[Tweacle Tart II]

Originally Posted by mary patricia

I'll probably get called a jealous hater for this but I don't think she's anything special to look at It was more the outfits and story lines in Corrie that made her into some sort of Lolita.

Nope, you're spot on, she's a right munter especially without her make up

[fredster]

Originally Posted by InMyArms

Wouldn't be surprised if Helen popped up in more reality TV shows, beginning with Celebrity Big Brother in the summer.

Along with katie price, should be interesting, the meeting of two divas.

[JasonWatkins]

Originally Posted by DiamondDoll

You perceptive posts are always worth reading jp.

And worth quoting in their entirety as well i see

[DavetheScot]

Originally Posted by jerseyporter

I'm coming at this from a slightly different angle - I didn't know who this person was before I caught her on IAC (don't watch Corrie) and some of the opinions I'm about to give come from professional experience, not just my own personal view (although I suppose one does form the other when you're talking about how children/young adults should and shouldn't be nurtured, and then in turn behaving - I've certainly brought up my own daughters, one of whom is only a couple of years younger than Helen, using a fair amount of what I learned at work, and they've turned out ok!)



BIB - yes, you'd think someone in Helen's world would be trying to broaden her horizons for her own good, especially as they profess to be so concerned at all the negative things that are said about her and how upset she is about being 'misunderstood'. Ideally that role should have been fulfilled by her parents long before now, but instead they seem (from the interviews I've seen/read in their own words) have thought they were doing Helen a favour in 'protecting' her from anything other than what Helen wanted to think/do - they've certainly validated a lot of the things that people find so irritating now.

It's been done out of love, in this case, that much is clear, but it's been misplaced love. So many times I've seen parents who are afraid to guide their children in any way - sometimes because they think it will 'stifle' them, sometimes because they think any kind of negative comment will reduce their child's love for them, sometimes other reasons, but all done for the best of intentions - but the effect is that you end up with a child who does not have a balanced view of how the world works. People always seem to think that it's neglect or a lack of parental love that leads to inappropriate behaviour in older teenagers and young adults, but that's far from the case - it's just that no one sees the damage that 'over-loving' (that's not a real term, I can't think of the right one at the moment!) can do, as much as not loving enough.



BIB 1 - See, coming from my point of view of not knowing who she was before IAC, and reading some of the comments on DS before the show started, I got the impression she was quite popular, and liked, for her role in Corrie! I did watch IAC thinking "wow, some of the people who said they liked this girl must be wondering who they're watching now", and it seems that quite a few others did too - and now, suddenly, in a matter of a few months, she isn't very popular at all. Maybe I've got that wrong, but from an outsider's point of view that's how it seemed/seems to me in the cold light of day.

BIB 2 - I think you, and others who have expressed similar thoughts, have it largely right here. She DID show people what she was really like in IAC, and people didn't always like what they saw. No, she's not unkind, deliberately or otherwise - and I don't think I've read a single comment anywhere ever saying that she is - but being 'kind' is no defence for not being sensible, nor is it an excuse for being immature and insular in your thoughts, deed and words at the age of 22.

Helen's problem isn't one of how intelligent, or not, she is, it's more basic than that - something that, actually, has nothing to do with intelligence at all. What's she's lacking is good old common sense - a very undervalued thing, and so often overlooked in today's world where only paper qualifications seem to be valued as 'proof' of having achieved anything. She seems to think people will think more of her if she went back and studied, that it would suddenly change how she's viewed, but she's missing the point. Many people who find her frustrating don't care about the fact she hasn't done A Levels, or a degree, they're frustrated because she seems to lack something far more fundamental, and yet far more necessary than qualifications, and that's good old common sense.



Again, not knowing anything about her, I was confused that in the jungle she sometimes wore it on her ring finger, and other days on her middle finger (are both fingers the same size?). Are they really engaged, or is it her just wishing they were and him buying a nice ring for her middle finger than just occasionally finds its way on to her ring finger? She is certainly not emotionally mature enough to be taking the step of marriage and children yet, and he doesn't seem to want to be tied down yet. The signs aren't good, reading between the lines and watching the body language, but she either can't see that or doesn't want to.



Does anyone actually 'hate' her? That's a strong word. Do they dislike her (haven't seen much evidence of that either) or do they just dislike the things they see and hear her do? They are separate things. Has anyone actually been 'spiteful'? I've not read any spite.

It does annoy me when people immediately jump on someone giving valid comments on someone's behaviour, not the person themselves, and accuse them of a 'hater' or 'disliking the person' or being 'spiteful' and 'jealous' when it's been nothing of the kind. I don't 'hate', 'dislike' or 'envy' Helen (or anyone I've never met for that matter - how can I?) and spite in anyone is horrible, but I do see behaviour traits in people (some of them flaunted with such pride we can't miss them) which are unattractive or inappropriate (as in Helen's case). But that doesn't mean I 'hate' or 'dislike' the person, nor is it a sign of 'spite' or 'jealously'. It's separating the sin from the sinner, if you want to use that expression - a very important part of dealing with anyone with any kind of inappropriate behaviour, including in your own children.




Again, a little bit of common sense and she would see this for herself. But in the absence of that, where are the people around her to provide that common sense on her behalf? If they are advising her, and she's just doing it regardless, then Helen really is bringing it on herself, either because she seems no harm in it regardless of what others say (yet always seems to regret it afterwards - has she never heard the expression 'once bitten, twice shy'?!) or because she's desperate to remain in the public eye. Either could be the reason, or a combination of both. Neither are going to do her any favours in the medium to longer term, though.





The parents, though clearly loving Helen very much, have sadly created 'Frankenstein's monster' in their over-indulgence of Helen. They only want her to be happy - a noble thought, but they're going about it in the wrong way. They think making her happy is validating her every thought and whim, reducing the boundaries instead of setting them, lowering expectations instead of raising them. That might seem like a 'kind' thing to do to a child, but actually it scares them.

Children like to have boundaries, rules, clear expectations (and high ones). Give children goals and they'll rise to them; if that's set in childhood it will naturally carry on in teenager-hood, and adulthood. Helen's parents, unfortunately, either on their own or under misguided advice, seemed to think that they had to compensate for her by going in the completely opposite direction - they will defend it as 'protection' and 'love' and 'kindness', and yes it's good to have that, and bring them out in your child in the process, but it's only half the story. Helen could, and should, have been encouraged to learn how to cook at home, to clean, to use a washing machine etc by her parents, and she'd have done it - her unusual 'job' wasn't a reason for her not to learn those life skills, but now she seems to wear her inability to cope like a badge of honour around her neck. Very odd, and very odd that her parents still seem unable to move away from validating Helen's behaviour even though she's now 22. I suppose if they did they'd have to face up to the fact that they haven't really done her any favours!

But the upshot is Helen is clearly vulnerable and unsure of herself, unable often to face any kind of personal challenge without a 'get out clause' excusing her from it (because she's always been given one) and as much as I'm bound to be accused of all sorts of things in saying so, her 'kind and loving' parents have contributed to that more than anyone else simply by wanting to make her life as 'simple' and 'easy' as possible within the unusual circumstances in which Helen was living her teenage years.

Does Helen have the medical conditions she also uses to 'excuse' and 'explain' her behaviours? Hard to say for sure without knowing her, and certainly ADD and ADHD manifest themselves in different ways and can be managed very succesfully in various ways, but I have a friend with bi-polar and he doesn't see the traits he recognises in himself in Helen (or some other celebrities who 'claim' to have it for that matter). But it's easy to claim depression - you can't 'see' it like you can a broken leg, and it's easy to read up on the symptoms and pretend if you want to (plenty do). But it does seem to have become the latest celebrity trend, and that does any genuine sufferer a huge disservice

Apologies for such a long post. I certainly don't think Helen is unkind or horrible, and I don't hate her, but the fact remains that she is awfully lacking in the emotional and social awareness one would expect to see in a 'normal' 22 year old, and it can't all be blamed on her unusual job as a child - a child's greatest influence is always its parents, for good or bad. They clearly love Helen very much, but I wonder if they had their time again, with hindsight, they'd do it differently? I think we'd have seen a very different Helen if they had...

Certainly a very interesting and well-considered post. I'm not sure if I would define normality within such a narrow range though; there are many ways of raising children and I'm not sure the way Helen's parents did it is so clearly wrong as you reckon it. I'm probably a little biased here, as so much of what you say about Helen is true of me (the not being taught to cook, clean, work a washing machine etc; I still live with my parents and do very little housework), and yet I am in most ways very unlike her (I think I am capable of a little more thought than her, but I am also rather less kind - or that's my assessment)