[davetech]

Its a con, a discounting too, for example,

Phone lines have decreased = Prices have gone up
Broadband has increased = Prices have gone up

Line rental is, company's trying to get what they can from very old technology - and if you use it you pay!

Broadband is new technology - you use it but only pay for the amount just a flat monthly payment (in most cases) - this does not give give company's additional £££ like it would if you picked the phone up,

The whole start of on-demand tv was to charge for some items thus making more £££ - as Tv was a flat monthly price!

Everyone needs to start kicking these company's into the teeth, No Landline = More expensive = No Thanks

I have just removed my virgin Tv and Phone as just removing the phone would have made my bill increase, this is because they blur the lines and offer bundles and each item is cross subbed so we are not the wiser as to what the true price is, as they offer additional discounts for those that try and cancel!

So line rental is a dead in the water, but they try and earn from it, the only word of caution is this,

If we jack the phone line and Tv in and use broadband you watch the broadband price shoot up, why cos they ain't making £££ from phone and Tv

I am on 30mb broadband and pay £22.50 shortly to increase to £24.25 (i think ish)

I am willing to say that in 5 years the price will be in excess of £50+ they will between now and then increase the speed, but do we need all this speed? maybe another double up on your speed at no extra cost? and then we can put the bills up... again on the excuse we are increase speed, increase technology etc... etc... its just B-S--t

If I buy a popular product it becomes cheaper - if i buy a popular product from telecommunication company's the more popular the more it cost's - the price never goes down!
even if 2 million more people joined the price would always go up!

Oh how long to fibre optic cable last? I bet is longer then Copper? but we need to put the price up, those fibres need a polish up, and so does out next AGM where the food is so so good. thank everyone for the food and drink, lolssss

[zaax]

Originally Posted by TeeGee

Maybe so but even without the "Standing Charge" you will pay at a significantly higher rate for, say, the first 225 KwH used per quarter so if you use it at all you get shafted by higher prices.

With some ethical suppliers the price difference is only a couple of pence per kWh.

As BT Openreach is a monopoly to most consumers in the country they should be hived off from BT and nationalised like rail track, which would make then equal to other countries in the EC who are also government owned companies.

[bowland37]

I use a 3 dongle. £16.50 a month for 15GB usage at around 6MB speed.

[1andrew1]

Originally Posted by zaax

As BT Openreach is a monopoly to most consumers in the country they should be hived off from BT and nationalised like rail track, which would make then equal to other countries in the EC who are also government owned companies.

Which countries in the EU have state-owned telephony infrastructure, I'm not aware that any do?

[SteveMcK]

Originally Posted by koantemplation

Why do we pay line rental in the first place?

Surely it should be part of the price of either having a phone or BB?

BT Openreach owns the line, and the ISP has to rent that line from BT so that they can use it to send you your broadband. They call it out as a separate charge for the same reason that airlines try and list the taxes separately from the fares, it's to show that the charge isn't part of their income but is a mandatory fee that gets paid to someone else.

[flagpole]

On a fully unbundled line a provider has to pay £100pa to BT wholesale for the use of the line.

that is the main reason for line rental.

[Ray266]

Interesting thread, People who are with BT & have online billing why not pay up 12 months in advance Line Rental Saver that works out at about £10.75 a month that's better than nearly £15 a month isn't it.

[iangrad]

I have not had a land line for years as I use three 3g , I phoned BT to ask about BT broadband and for a slower connection but perhaps more reliable ? It was much mere expensive with the line rental added .

Just wait till 4g rolls out over the UK -- I certainly wont be buying any BT shares !

[The Sack]

Originally Posted by Pretinama

Well, I suppose it's a bit like 'water rates'...

No its not, with your water rates you arent also paying a pipe rental are you.

[Gazinuk]

switch to Virgin, no need for a phone line for the Internet. Which is great as ive been playin the BT landline / internet on someone else game for years an it leaves such a sour taste in my mouth as i never used the phone line besides the internet, was never a phone connected to it, was no need. Back onto virgin an bam the phone lines gone, just have internet.

[iniltous]

Originally Posted by Gazinuk

switch to Virgin, no need for a phone line for the Internet. Which is great as ive been playin the BT landline / internet on someone else game for years an it leaves such a sour taste in my mouth as i never used the phone line besides the internet, was never a phone connected to it, was no need. Back onto virgin an bam the phone lines gone, just have internet.

So you dont pay line rental with your VM broadband but you do pay £22-£26 per month, you could easily match or better this with a line rental/broadband package(and also have a phone line ) and you think you are getting a better deal because you don't pay line rental....

[Gazinuk]

I personally am getting a better deal from what I was getting paying before 16mb (theorectial) Internet with sky an line rental to 100mb (actual) line no line rental for less than what I was paying

[tghe-retford]

Originally Posted by moox

Is that the "free" caller ID thing? The threshold is pathetically low, something like 5 chargeable (or inclusive) calls per month or something. They've done that for years.

No, it's across the board now as part of the terms and conditions of your line rental.

[moox]

Originally Posted by The Sack

No its not, with your water rates you arent also paying a pipe rental are you.

My water company charges a significant amount as a standing charge - and that does not include any water consumed or sewerage discharged. Presumably some of this is used to pay for network maintenance.

My phone line rental includes calls to UK landlines and certain non-geographic numbers are certain times of the day, as well as paying to maintain the line.

[alcockell]

The "last mile" or local loop is often the most expensive part of the connection.

[noise747]

Originally Posted by Ray266

Interesting thread, People who are with BT & have online billing why not pay up 12 months in advance Line Rental Saver that works out at about £10.75 a month that's better than nearly £15 a month isn't it.

You can do that with Talk Talk and Sky, but sky don't advertise it much. the problem here is that not everyone can afford to pay 12 months in advance.

The other problem is that people may want to separate their line rental from their broadband. I got line rental for around £11 from First telecom, without paying 12 months in advance, but if I wanted to get broadband from sky, Talk Talk or Bt, i would have to get line rental from them.

With Bt at least you used to be able to just get their broadband, Sky as well for a while.

the other thing is that even at £10 a month, if you don't use the phone service, it is still to expensive.

[noise747]

Originally Posted by iangrad

I have not had a land line for years as I use three 3g , I phoned BT to ask about BT broadband and for a slower connection but perhaps more reliable ? It was much mere expensive with the line rental added .

The problem with 3G is that it can work out more expensive and as you found out is not reliable. you try streaming on 3G for any amount of time and see how much you pay.

Just wait till 4g rolls out over the UK -- I certainly wont be buying any BT shares !

Again price is the problem, they will charge as much as they can and people will go for it because it is a bit faster. You only have to look at the prices that EE charge at the moment.

Reliability have also not been proved and from what I have heard it don't penetrate indoors as well as 3G.

[moox]

Originally Posted by iangrad

I have not had a land line for years as I use three 3g , I phoned BT to ask about BT broadband and for a slower connection but perhaps more reliable ? It was much mere expensive with the line rental added .

Just wait till 4g rolls out over the UK -- I certainly wont be buying any BT shares !

I wouldn't say that. BT can do so much more with their all fibre or fibre/copper network than you'll ever be able to do with LTE.

There just isn't the spectrum to give everyone insanely high speeds all of the time. LTE isn't lightyears ahead of 3G (at least not yet) in terms of capacity.

LTE may have a place in providing faster rural broadband and where demand is fairly low (which BT, no less, has trialled in Cornwall) but I just can't see it being a replacement for BT or Virgin's networks in urban areas.

[shoestring25]

virgin 30mg broadband with no line rental £22.50 a month. with line rental and line rental saver £24.50 a month

[Kolin Klingon]

Originally Posted by neo_wales

You need the line for broadband or telephone or both...you need to rent it. It is separate from the broadband service you pick.

Then if you absolutely need and must have it to get their broadband (as you must) then advertising it without that cost included is a con.

I can not get Sky broadband for the stated £7.50.

[Kolin Klingon]

Originally Posted by moox

Some of us don't buy phone and broadband from the same company. I would rather the prices and choices reflected the price of the actual service (broadband) and not something you probably have anyway (a phone line).

But you can't get any broadband without it and so to state that Broadband costs £XXX is a con. As you can't get it for that cost.

It should clearly be stated (for example) "Our broadband costs £25 (£14.95 of that cost is for the line rental of your choice)"

[Kolin Klingon]

Originally Posted by The Sack

No its not, with your water rates you arent also paying a pipe rental are you.

That's a good point. Can you imagine the outcry if people started getting water bills stating that it was £50 for the water you have used and £30 for using the pipes to get it to you.

That is THEIR problem.

And what a pathetic excuse it would be if they said "Oh well we sold all the pipes to someone else and so have to pay them so that is why you have to pay us!" That's is all the company's fault and problem. We should pay for what we get. Getting it to us is their problem.

Same with broadband.

[koantemplation]

I think I would prefer if the cost of the line was shared amongst the various providers and they included the cost in the price of broadband and or phone.

[1andrew1]

Originally Posted by noise747

The other problem is that people may want to separate their line rental from their broadband.

Why on earth would anyone want to do this? It's more hassle and it pushes up the supplier costs as two billing systems have to be run.

[moox]

Originally Posted by Kolin Klingon

But you can't get any broadband without it and so to state that Broadband costs £XXX is a con. As you can't get it for that cost.

It should clearly be stated (for example) "Our broadband costs £25 (£14.95 of that cost is for the line rental of your choice)"

The broadband price really is £xxx and that is what you are paying for the broadband service. It may require a phone line but that is a separate service that happens to share the same cable.

But the line rental could cost anything from less than £10 to £25, no ISP could accurately tell me how much the total price would be.

I don't see what the problem is with separating the prices, I'm sure mental arithmetic or using a calculator is not beyond most people.