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Old 30-01-2013, 13:48
thomas2400
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A lot of people these days use emulators of old video game consoles such as the SNES and Megadrive and some use the argument that as the games aren't widely available anymore and the the company isn't making money from them anymore that it is ok to steal them

I disagree with that notion, most consoles now provide classics at a fee, such as the sonic or mario games being available on console stores today, it's clear that companies still want to make money from old games that emulation prevents them from making that money

The only time i would say emulation is ok is if you actually own a psychical copy (or the way things are now a digital copy) that you have bought and paid for
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Old 30-01-2013, 14:15
Mark A
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My thoughts are, I've heard all the arguments, both for and against, over, and over, and over, and over, and over again. Must we have all the same ol', same ol' trotted out yet again?

Regards

Mark
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Old 30-01-2013, 14:23
thomas2400
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To be honest i've never seen it discussed on here or at least i don't recall it off the top of my head hence why i started this thread i didn't know i'd get such a hostile reception to starting a thread that may have be discussed before

Regards

Thomas
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Old 30-01-2013, 15:26
PinSarla
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I don't know really. A lot of oldies from the 8 bit & 16 bit era are really difficult to come by, and any sales will doubtless be second hand, therefore no money will be received by the publisher or dev. emulation of PS2 & GC titles is different, but still most of them will be purchased second hand if not available as an HD reissue, or for download. In saying that, I don't see why people would emulate games from the previous generation as the emulators are supposedly several years (if ever) away from being able to run those games in a stable way.

I mean, if I wanted to play an old Megadrive game that I used to own or enjoy (such as the one where you played as sort of skeleton/cyborg type things, I've forgotten the name!), then I would have to emulate, or purchase second hand. Really I don't see much of a difference between both since the publisher and dev receives zero money from either way. Which then leads onto the whole second hand market issue, and I'm not talking about the pre-owned section in GAME. If a guy was selling a Megadrive with shit loads of games I used to enjoy when I was a kid then really it's not much different from emulating. Sure, at one point Sega etc. will have received some money for it, but then at one point games will surely have been purchased to enable the emulators to make the ROMs?

Legally it might be black and white, but morally it's prehaps more of a grey area.
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Old 30-01-2013, 16:39
Cryolemon
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I think there's a (moral, at least) difference between emulating SNES games and pirating a new game.
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Old 30-01-2013, 16:51
hsellors
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I think emulating a really old game from megadrive / snes is a credit to the developer in that it shows the longevity of a good game. I think if you can't purchase something legally then it should be OK to emulate it.

When I say legally I mean from a retailer rather than second hand on ebay. Like Pinsarla said I don't think there is much difference.
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Old 30-01-2013, 16:59
thomas2400
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I think there's a (moral, at least) difference between emulating SNES games and pirating a new game.
its that like saying there is a moral difference between stealing from a rich young healthy person and an old poor sick person

its a crime either way surely
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Old 30-01-2013, 17:46
SimonB79
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I think there's a (moral, at least) difference between emulating SNES games and pirating a new game.
I agree... How much money are nintendo gonna loss by someone playing some crappy nes / snes game from 20yrs ago via an emulator??? ... only afew nintendo headbangers will pay 4/5 quid for a virtual-console ROM so it can't be much LOL... everyone else ain't so stupid. ... I bet there more concerned with people pirating Wii / 3DS / WiU titles.
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Old 30-01-2013, 17:52
MP3_4_Life
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Emulation keeps old games and systems alive, I play Snes and N64 games on a regular basis on my tablet, in fact emulation got me back in to playing games.

Its one thing pirating a game that is relatively modern and can be sold at a profit

Its another thing entirely playing a game that has no value except nostalgia.
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Old 30-01-2013, 17:59
Alan1981
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Nintendo stopped hassling the sites that provide the roms. It was only when they released the virtual console warez that they tried to get them shut down again.
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Old 30-01-2013, 18:58
The Terminator
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Frankly, there are bigger, more serious concerns out there in the world for me. If people want to pirate, I say have at it.
My thoughts are, I've heard all the arguments, both for and against, over, and over, and over, and over, and over again. Must we have all the same ol', same ol' trotted out yet again?

Regards

Mark
As far as I can tell, nobody is forcing you to contribute in any way. Must we always get one smart arse git who trots out the "do we really have to do this again???" rubbish?
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Old 30-01-2013, 21:40
Ben Etchells
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I don't agree with it and think people should pay for and play the games as they were intended.
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Old 30-01-2013, 22:10
mred2000
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Emulators I have no problem with, I prefer the real thing, though I know how hard it is to get some stuff.

Pirating, equally, it happens and was certainly rife in the playground when I was a kid growing up, swapping tapes became Amiga/ST discs until everyone got into cartridge gaming and then it dried up.

Many creators acknowledge pirating as an advanced form of demoing games, it's mainly the money men who complain about it. Funnily enough, the most folk I know who pirate are from the games dev demographic. Go figure.
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Old 30-01-2013, 22:28
whoever,hey
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its that like saying there is a moral difference between stealing from a rich young healthy person and an old poor sick person

its a crime either way surely
No its not like saying that at all.

Its more like the difference with robbing someone that alive or dead with no descendents.
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Old 30-01-2013, 22:57
Jen-B
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Emulation and piracy aren't always one and the same.

For instance, I use the DOS emulator DOSBox on my PC for the games that no longer work on Windows 7. It's very useful for getting old games to work, and I use it with games I already own. Some of the old games you can buy from Steam use DOSBox as well, so emulation and piracy aren't the same thing.
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Old 30-01-2013, 23:14
Jimmy_McNulty
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I have no problem with either, although I don't pirate games because the availability and accessibilty of games is now much better, and the only emulators ive used have been from DOSBox on gog.com.

Arguments against both go out of the window when you get a game dev who helps with technical issues on a torrent site.
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Old 31-01-2013, 00:22
Ladyxxmacbeth
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I have a few emulators on my PC. However I have started to collect old windows games from the mid 90s and have had real problems with getting them to work. I have tried does box, etc. and decided to get an old windows 95 PC....I couldn't find one!
Wen I asked about it people thought i was crazy. But someone has made me a windows 98 machine from two old ones he had laying around. I'm excited to pick it up on saturday!
there is a place for emulators if the physical hardware is hard to come by...but I don't agree with copying games for current generation gaming.
I would rather own the physical unit over an emulator but sometimes that is not possible because they are either too expensive or hard to come by. I think after 20 years games should be free for everyone to play. Let everyone who was going to play the game buy it and when it is no longer profitable let people enjoy them for nothing.
Copying games makes people lose their jobs, Encourages crime and makes pandas cry! They love an original pandas do !
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Old 31-01-2013, 02:11
2Dshmuplover
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A lot of people these days use emulators of old video game consoles such as the SNES and Megadrive and some use the argument that as the games aren't widely available anymore and the the company isn't making money from them anymore that it is ok to steal them

I disagree with that notion, most consoles now provide classics at a fee, such as the sonic or mario games being available on console stores today, it's clear that companies still want to make money from old games that emulation prevents them from making that money

The only time i would say emulation is ok is if you actually own a psychical copy (or the way things are now a digital copy) that you have bought and paid for
My opinion is each to his own. If it doesn't directly affect my life then I don't care what someone does. I do see a pretty huge distinction between emulating old games to current gen ones, and since I've done both in the past I know for fact they are not the same thing from a moral standpoint.

There are some legitimate retro games available on modern machines but mostly only the classics as you state, that's ok if all you want to play is Mario and Sonic but In the case of something like Amiga, PC Engine, Master System or arcade games then your only choice is the real thing or to emulate. In fact I'd go so far to say over 95% of retro games from the 80's and 90's are not available to the public to buy in any legitimate, downloadable form.

Even then, regardless if companies have them for sale, why should I buy the same copy of Sonic or Streets of Rage 20 times for different formats? You could argue that point. Especially when a lot of the times emulation they use is NOT up to scratch and as a consequence are overpriced.

You only need to look at Nintendo's VC for proof, of course being overpriced is a subjective thing but when the conversions are 50hz/bordered (as is the case with both Wii ad Wii U) then I think they absolutely are, so I choose to emulate.
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