Will BT get there act together in time?

freetoview33 · 04-02-2013, 04:24

Sounds to me BT needs to get there act together and get there service up and running in time for the launch of BT Sports otherwise I can't see many people coming over to them and will most likely pay for the channels on virgin and sky as BT are going to need to let them have access to them in order to get cash. Even if they offer a good deal to vision subscribers I dont think Sports alone will be enough to tempt people over.

Though I will be interested to see if BT wins much 4G spectrum and there plans for it other than for rural broadband. Seems like there is a lot of potential for it to take on the likes of Virgin but they need to stay committed and get them selves sorted otherwise the likes of TalkTalk will take advantage.

I'm still surprised EE has not got on board with youview though I bet BT are now glad they didn't!

MJH1962 · 04-02-2013, 11:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by freetoview33

Sounds to me BT needs to get there act together and get there service up and running in time for the launch of BT Sports otherwise I can't see many people coming over to them and will most likely pay for the channels on virgin and sky as BT are going to need to let them have access to them in order to get cash. Even if they offer a good deal to vision subscribers I dont think Sports alone will be enough to tempt people over.

Though I will be interested to see if BT wins much 4G spectrum and there plans for it other than for rural broadband. Seems like there is a lot of potential for it to take on the likes of Virgin but they need to stay committed and get them selves sorted otherwise the likes of TalkTalk will take advantage.

I'm still surprised EE has not got on board with youview though I bet BT are now glad they didn't!

It is well publicised that BT will launch its sports channels on Sky and Virgin, as well as its own platform. I expect they will be used as a leverage to attract new customers to BT Vision / BT Youview, but they will not exclude access through other platforms. There is a wider initiative than just the sports channels in play to build up the BT customer base - just read the press release last week to understand this.

It makes me chuckle when I read some of the advice to BT from posters on here. As multi-billion pound company that is doing very well in terms of its business and profits, I (as a shareholder) trust it to get things right over this. Talk Talk is not its prime threat as it is and will remain far too small, Sky is the provider it is gunning for.

Finally, your comments re 4G and EE are a bit confusing and largely irrelevant in my view. I have not seen any suggestion that BT will be bidding for 4G spectrum. It pulled out of the mobile phone business years ago when it split off Cellnet and there are no indications it will re-enter the market. And why would a molile operrator like EE get involved in Youview?

promo-only · 04-02-2013, 11:53

We all know they'll be retailing the channel to other platforms but pricing is still a major issue here. If the rumoured price of the £15 region are correct then that's hugely detrimental.

Roll on 2015 when we can find out how this will play out.

Hup_73 · 04-02-2013, 12:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by MJH1962

Finally, your comments re 4G and EE are a bit confusing and largely irrelevant in my view. I have not seen any suggestion that BT will be bidding for 4G spectrum. It pulled out of the mobile phone business years ago when it split off Cellnet and there are no indications it will re-enter the market.

My understanding is that BT have bid for some of the 4G spectrum but it's purely from a B2B perspective and they have no plans to re-enter the consumer mobile market. So, yes I agree, it is probably irrelevant to this discussion.

derek500 · 04-02-2013, 12:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by MJH1962

It is well publicised that BT will launch its sports channels on Sky and Virgin, as well as its own platform. I expect they will be used as a leverage to attract new customers to BT Vision / BT Youview, but they will not exclude access through other platforms. There is a wider initiative than just the sports channels in play to build up the BT customer base - just read the press release last week to understand this.

It makes me chuckle when I read some of the advice to BT from posters on here. As multi-billion pound company that is doing very well in terms of its business and profits, I (as a shareholder) trust it to get things right over this. Talk Talk is not its prime threat as it is and will remain far too small, Sky is the provider it is gunning for.

We know that BT will put their sports channels on Sky/Virgin, we don't know if Sky's will be put on BT's Youview (via IPTV) or even stay on BT Vision (via DTT).

I'm a shareholder of both BT and BSkyB, so I'm watching with interest. Bottom line is Sky need BT's sports channels less than BT needing Sky's.

1andrew1 · 04-02-2013, 12:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by MJH1962

And why would a molile operator like EE get involved in Youview?

EE is the fifth largest ISP after the big four with over 700,000 subscribers. It may feel that it is threatened by not having a TV offering now that all the big four do. Other smaller ISPs have come on board the YouView bandwagon - KCom in Hull plus operators in the Channel Islands so it's not to be entirely ruled out.
However, EE's model is to use broadband to make its mobile offering more compelling so it may not have much leeway to offer subsidised boxes.

freetoview33 · 04-02-2013, 17:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by 1andrew1

EE is the fifth largest ISP after the big four with over 700,000 subscribers. It may feel that it is threatened by not having a TV offering now that all the big four do. Other smaller ISPs have come on board the YouView bandwagon - KCom in Hull plus operators in the Channel Islands so it's not to be entirely ruled out.
However, EE's model is to use broadband to make its mobile offering more compelling so it may not have much leeway to offer subsidised boxes.

Orange were interested at an early stage http://www.webtvwire.com/channel-fiv...-replace-them/

Gray77 · 04-02-2013, 17:39

I think they're missing a trick in waiting until July/August to start the Sports channels up. There will be alot of pressure to get it right and get it right very quickly when they start, and they aren't going to give themselves alot of time to get the required interest and subs if they start up just weeks before the new PL season.

I also think there are contracts and sports available right now that they could have bought and used them as 'guinea pigs' to wrinkle out any creases in their coverage. Stuff like the NBA, NRL, Aussie Rules, Copa Libertadores, Brasilian football etc all run through the Summer and BT could have snagged them and used them to get the channels up and running.

Give them away free for BT BB subscribers on YouView and stick the channels on Sky for free for a few months, and then when the football and RU seasons kick in around mid August give people warning that the channel will go to a subsciption service. This way they could get decent contracts for sports that start in the Spring and Summer (and will be useful in following years), get their channels into peoples minds, and allow themselves months to get stuff right.

Merely starting in July and telling everyone to subscribe to a channel that most will not even have heard of, whilst missing out on lots of 'filler sports' because they don't fit in with a July start date just seems like a risky venture.

VisionMan1 · 04-02-2013, 18:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by derek500

We know that BT will put their sports channels on Sky/Virgin, we don't know if Sky's will be put on BT's Youview (via IPTV) or even stay on BT Vision (via DTT).

I'm a shareholder of both BT and BSkyB, so I'm watching with interest. Bottom line is Sky need BT's sports channels less than BT needing Sky's.

Derek, thats simply not true. But I've seen you say this many times now. Why do you think that there is even a possibility that Sky Sports will not be on the YouView from BT platform? Or BT Vision, either?

promo-only · 04-02-2013, 18:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gray77

I think they're missing a trick in waiting until July/August to start the Sports channels up. There will be alot of pressure to get it right and get it right very quickly when they start, and they aren't going to give themselves alot of time to get the required interest and subs if they start up just weeks before the new PL season.

I also think there are contracts and sports available right now that they could have bought and used them as 'guinea pigs' to wrinkle out any creases in their coverage. Stuff like the NBA, NRL, Aussie Rules, Copa Libertadores, Brasilian football etc all run through the Summer and BT could have snagged them and used them to get the channels up and running.

Give them away free for BT BB subscribers on YouView and stick the channels on Sky for free for a few months, and then when the football and RU seasons kick in around mid August give people warning that the channel will go to a subsciption service. This way they could get decent contracts for sports that start in the Spring and Summer (and will be useful in following years), get their channels into peoples minds, and allow themselves months to get stuff right.

Merely starting in July and telling everyone to subscribe to a channel that most will not even have heard of, whilst missing out on lots of 'filler sports' because they don't fit in with a July start date just seems like a risky venture.

Huge problem with that is the lack of live linear channels on the YouView platform and BT's insistence on not offering theirs until they're able to be placed in the EPG. Launching them now would effectively have the same impact as not launching them until the summer because such a small amount of people, other than a few Vision customers, would be able to see them. They're hardly going to test live solely on satellite or cable because that would throw too much emphasis and association on those platforms and take light off BT Vision.

They can be forgiven for a few glitches here and there when launched in the summer but with such a large scale launch, surely the amount of in-house prep work will see any such problems are ironed out before the public join the party.

1andrew1 · 04-02-2013, 19:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by VisionMan1

Derek, thats simply not true. But I've seen you say this many times now. Why do you think that there is even a possibility that Sky Sports will not be on the YouView from BT platform? Or BT Vision, either?

OK, I'm not Derek

but I think he might be suggesting BT may lose the CAT Appeal on Wednesday?

VisionMan1 · 04-02-2013, 19:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by 1andrew1

OK, I'm not Derek

but I think he might be suggesting BT may lose the CAT Appeal on Wednesday?

It was my understanding the above is in regard to the wholesale price of SS 1&2, not third party access. Or am I wrong on that?

indiekid76 · 05-02-2013, 10:18

Yeah, it's the price, isn't it?

BT have been paying the extra, that Sky want, in to a pot and Sky get that if they win.

promo-only · 05-02-2013, 10:41

The way I've been reading this thing was that the appeal is to decide upon the 'Wholesale Must Offer' obligation as a whole, and not just pricing.

VisionMan1 · 05-02-2013, 11:31

I've found this Guardian article on the matter from 2010, and it is just the prices that are being contested/appealed -

"BSkyB must reduce the wholesale price at which it sells Sky Sports 1 and Sky Sports 2 to rivals such as Virgin Media and BT by 23.4% from the current £13.88 to £10.63 per subscriber per month. On the basis that most subscribers buy packages including the sports channels, the reduction for a bundle is 10.5% from £19.15 to £17.14.

The new wholesale pricing is effective immediately, the regulator said, and BSkyB now has six weeks from today to make a "reference offer", effectively a template contract, to other pay-TV providers. BSkyB, however, intends to apply to the Competition Appeal Tribunal for a stay on implementing the ruling.

Ofcom has also said that BSkyB must offer wholesale high-definition versions of Sky Sports 1 and 2 to rivals but stopped at setting a price. "To help to promote future innovation Ofcom ... requires them to be offered on fair, reasonable and non-discriminatory terms."

http://www.guardian.co.uk/media/2010...orts-price-cut

indiekid76 · 05-02-2013, 12:11

The courts ruled in Sky's favour in November, I don't know what that case is linked above; perhaps a BT appeal?

promo-only · 05-02-2013, 14:00

Yes it is a BT appeal - they're the ones who aren't happy. Depending on what happens, Sky technically would only be obliged to offer Sky Sports 1 & 2 to Virgin customers due to a much older ruling. There are plenty of twists and turns but complete worst case scenario would see Sky pull SS 1 & 2 off BT Vision... If it did come to that, it'd just mean negotiations would sway in Sky's favour because BT would need those channels a lot more than what Sky would need BT's channel.

powar · 05-02-2013, 14:16

You can't help but sense that BT are totally out of their depth, I could be wrong though... There should be a multi national advertising campaign in full swing by now. I hope they succeed, as competition brings out the best in companies as they will always strive and innovate new products.

promo-only · 05-02-2013, 14:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by powar

You can't help but sense that BT are totally out of their depth, I could be wrong though... There should be a multi national advertising campaign in full swing by now. I hope they succeed, as competition brings out the best in companies as they will always strive and innovate new products.

Competition does bring out the best but in reality it's not as rosy as that. It should never have been allowed for the service/platform provider to be the same as the content provider. I've always thought that Sky should either provide the programming, win the football rights etc OR provide the platform. In fairness to them though, they've been allowed to do it so they've only looked after their own and protected what they have. It should never have been allowed in the first place in the interests of competition but that's where we're at.

powar · 05-02-2013, 15:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by promo-only

Competition does bring out the best but in reality it's not as rosy as that. It should never have been allowed for the service/platform provider to be the same as the content provider. I've always thought that Sky should either provide the programming, win the football rights etc OR provide the platform. In fairness to them though, they've been allowed to do it so they've only looked after their own and protected what they have. It should never have been allowed in the first place in the interests of competition but that's where we're at.

In hindsight, your right. Sky gambled when others didn't dare in the past. It appears BT are doing the same, in this economic climate it is very, very risky.

VisionMan1 · 05-02-2013, 22:59

BT have invested billions in these new services. And a multi-billion pound company won't get that wrong. Could they lose access to Sky Sports? That would be highly doubtful. Could they lose their appeal on the CAT ruling re the wholesale prices? Maybe.

promo-only · 05-02-2013, 23:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by VisionMan1

BT have invested billions in these new services. And a multi-billion pound company won't get that wrong. Could they lose access to Sky Sports? That would be highly doubtful. Could they lose their appeal on the CAT ruling re the wholesale prices? Maybe.

It's unlikely but very much a possibility. It does not matter how many billions BT may have when are you going to realise this? They themselves have said this is very much a gamble and if it works, great, they'll bid again on football rights in 2015. If it doesn't, they'll cut their losses and move on. It's very much an unknown area for them - they've taken a gamble so yes, a multi-billion pound company could well get it wrong!

I'm not saying they will get it wrong, I'm not saying they won't, only time will tell!

VisionMan1 · 06-02-2013, 22:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by MJH1962

It is well publicised that BT will launch its sports channels on Sky and Virgin, as well as its own platform. I expect they will be used as a leverage to attract new customers to BT Vision / BT Youview, but they will not exclude access through other platforms. There is a wider initiative than just the sports channels in play to build up the BT customer base - just read the press release last week to understand this.

It makes me chuckle when I read some of the advice to BT from posters on here. As multi-billion pound company that is doing very well in terms of its business and profits, I (as a shareholder) trust it to get things right over this. Talk Talk is not its prime threat as it is and will remain far too small, Sky is the provider it is gunning for.

Yeah. They, and Virgin Media. But the truly ironic thing about this is it's not the other suppliers TV custom they want, it's actually their telephone and broadband customers.

04-02-2013, 04:24	#1
freetoview33 Forum Member Join Date: May 2005 Location: Bristol Posts: 2,786	Will BT get there act together in time? Sounds to me BT needs to get there act together and get there service up and running in time for the launch of BT Sports otherwise I can't see many people coming over to them and will most likely pay for the channels on virgin and sky as BT are going to need to let them have access to them in order to get cash. Even if they offer a good deal to vision subscribers I dont think Sports alone will be enough to tempt people over. Though I will be interested to see if BT wins much 4G spectrum and there plans for it other than for rural broadband. Seems like there is a lot of potential for it to take on the likes of Virgin but they need to stay committed and get them selves sorted otherwise the likes of TalkTalk will take advantage. I'm still surprised EE has not got on board with youview though I bet BT are now glad they didn't!

04-02-2013, 11:36	#2
MJH1962 Forum Member Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: East Sussex Posts: 163	Quote: Originally Posted by freetoview33 Sounds to me BT needs to get there act together and get there service up and running in time for the launch of BT Sports otherwise I can't see many people coming over to them and will most likely pay for the channels on virgin and sky as BT are going to need to let them have access to them in order to get cash. Even if they offer a good deal to vision subscribers I dont think Sports alone will be enough to tempt people over. Though I will be interested to see if BT wins much 4G spectrum and there plans for it other than for rural broadband. Seems like there is a lot of potential for it to take on the likes of Virgin but they need to stay committed and get them selves sorted otherwise the likes of TalkTalk will take advantage. I'm still surprised EE has not got on board with youview though I bet BT are now glad they didn't! It is well publicised that BT will launch its sports channels on Sky and Virgin, as well as its own platform. I expect they will be used as a leverage to attract new customers to BT Vision / BT Youview, but they will not exclude access through other platforms. There is a wider initiative than just the sports channels in play to build up the BT customer base - just read the press release last week to understand this. It makes me chuckle when I read some of the advice to BT from posters on here. As multi-billion pound company that is doing very well in terms of its business and profits, I (as a shareholder) trust it to get things right over this. Talk Talk is not its prime threat as it is and will remain far too small, Sky is the provider it is gunning for. Finally, your comments re 4G and EE are a bit confusing and largely irrelevant in my view. I have not seen any suggestion that BT will be bidding for 4G spectrum. It pulled out of the mobile phone business years ago when it split off Cellnet and there are no indications it will re-enter the market. And why would a molile operrator like EE get involved in Youview?

04-02-2013, 11:53	#3
promo-only Forum Member Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: Liverpool Posts: 2,935	We all know they'll be retailing the channel to other platforms but pricing is still a major issue here. If the rumoured price of the £15 region are correct then that's hugely detrimental. Roll on 2015 when we can find out how this will play out.

04-02-2013, 12:35	#4
Hup_73 Forum Member Join Date: Apr 2010 Posts: 301	Quote: Originally Posted by MJH1962 Finally, your comments re 4G and EE are a bit confusing and largely irrelevant in my view. I have not seen any suggestion that BT will be bidding for 4G spectrum. It pulled out of the mobile phone business years ago when it split off Cellnet and there are no indications it will re-enter the market. My understanding is that BT have bid for some of the 4G spectrum but it's purely from a B2B perspective and they have no plans to re-enter the consumer mobile market. So, yes I agree, it is probably irrelevant to this discussion.

04-02-2013, 12:48	#5
derek500 Forum Member Join Date: Feb 2002 Posts: 20,375	Quote: Originally Posted by MJH1962 It is well publicised that BT will launch its sports channels on Sky and Virgin, as well as its own platform. I expect they will be used as a leverage to attract new customers to BT Vision / BT Youview, but they will not exclude access through other platforms. There is a wider initiative than just the sports channels in play to build up the BT customer base - just read the press release last week to understand this. It makes me chuckle when I read some of the advice to BT from posters on here. As multi-billion pound company that is doing very well in terms of its business and profits, I (as a shareholder) trust it to get things right over this. Talk Talk is not its prime threat as it is and will remain far too small, Sky is the provider it is gunning for. We know that BT will put their sports channels on Sky/Virgin, we don't know if Sky's will be put on BT's Youview (via IPTV) or even stay on BT Vision (via DTT). I'm a shareholder of both BT and BSkyB, so I'm watching with interest. Bottom line is Sky need BT's sports channels less than BT needing Sky's.

04-02-2013, 12:52	#6
1andrew1 Forum Member Join Date: Feb 2009 Posts: 3,981	Quote: Originally Posted by MJH1962 And why would a molile operator like EE get involved in Youview? EE is the fifth largest ISP after the big four with over 700,000 subscribers. It may feel that it is threatened by not having a TV offering now that all the big four do. Other smaller ISPs have come on board the YouView bandwagon - KCom in Hull plus operators in the Channel Islands so it's not to be entirely ruled out. However, EE's model is to use broadband to make its mobile offering more compelling so it may not have much leeway to offer subsidised boxes.

04-02-2013, 17:31	#7
freetoview33 Forum Member Join Date: May 2005 Location: Bristol Posts: 2,786	Quote: Originally Posted by 1andrew1 EE is the fifth largest ISP after the big four with over 700,000 subscribers. It may feel that it is threatened by not having a TV offering now that all the big four do. Other smaller ISPs have come on board the YouView bandwagon - KCom in Hull plus operators in the Channel Islands so it's not to be entirely ruled out. However, EE's model is to use broadband to make its mobile offering more compelling so it may not have much leeway to offer subsidised boxes. Orange were interested at an early stage http://www.webtvwire.com/channel-fiv...-replace-them/

04-02-2013, 17:39	#8
Gray77 Forum Member Join Date: Jun 2012 Location: London Posts: 861	I think they're missing a trick in waiting until July/August to start the Sports channels up. There will be alot of pressure to get it right and get it right very quickly when they start, and they aren't going to give themselves alot of time to get the required interest and subs if they start up just weeks before the new PL season. I also think there are contracts and sports available right now that they could have bought and used them as 'guinea pigs' to wrinkle out any creases in their coverage. Stuff like the NBA, NRL, Aussie Rules, Copa Libertadores, Brasilian football etc all run through the Summer and BT could have snagged them and used them to get the channels up and running. Give them away free for BT BB subscribers on YouView and stick the channels on Sky for free for a few months, and then when the football and RU seasons kick in around mid August give people warning that the channel will go to a subsciption service. This way they could get decent contracts for sports that start in the Spring and Summer (and will be useful in following years), get their channels into peoples minds, and allow themselves months to get stuff right. Merely starting in July and telling everyone to subscribe to a channel that most will not even have heard of, whilst missing out on lots of 'filler sports' because they don't fit in with a July start date just seems like a risky venture.

04-02-2013, 18:07	#9
VisionMan1 Inactive Member Join Date: Dec 2012 Posts: 2,107	Quote: Originally Posted by derek500 We know that BT will put their sports channels on Sky/Virgin, we don't know if Sky's will be put on BT's Youview (via IPTV) or even stay on BT Vision (via DTT). I'm a shareholder of both BT and BSkyB, so I'm watching with interest. Bottom line is Sky need BT's sports channels less than BT needing Sky's. Derek, thats simply not true. But I've seen you say this many times now. Why do you think that there is even a possibility that Sky Sports will not be on the YouView from BT platform? Or BT Vision, either?

04-02-2013, 18:52	#10
promo-only Forum Member Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: Liverpool Posts: 2,935	Quote: Originally Posted by Gray77 I think they're missing a trick in waiting until July/August to start the Sports channels up. There will be alot of pressure to get it right and get it right very quickly when they start, and they aren't going to give themselves alot of time to get the required interest and subs if they start up just weeks before the new PL season. I also think there are contracts and sports available right now that they could have bought and used them as 'guinea pigs' to wrinkle out any creases in their coverage. Stuff like the NBA, NRL, Aussie Rules, Copa Libertadores, Brasilian football etc all run through the Summer and BT could have snagged them and used them to get the channels up and running. Give them away free for BT BB subscribers on YouView and stick the channels on Sky for free for a few months, and then when the football and RU seasons kick in around mid August give people warning that the channel will go to a subsciption service. This way they could get decent contracts for sports that start in the Spring and Summer (and will be useful in following years), get their channels into peoples minds, and allow themselves months to get stuff right. Merely starting in July and telling everyone to subscribe to a channel that most will not even have heard of, whilst missing out on lots of 'filler sports' because they don't fit in with a July start date just seems like a risky venture. Huge problem with that is the lack of live linear channels on the YouView platform and BT's insistence on not offering theirs until they're able to be placed in the EPG. Launching them now would effectively have the same impact as not launching them until the summer because such a small amount of people, other than a few Vision customers, would be able to see them. They're hardly going to test live solely on satellite or cable because that would throw too much emphasis and association on those platforms and take light off BT Vision. They can be forgiven for a few glitches here and there when launched in the summer but with such a large scale launch, surely the amount of in-house prep work will see any such problems are ironed out before the public join the party.

04-02-2013, 19:16	#11
1andrew1 Forum Member Join Date: Feb 2009 Posts: 3,981	Quote: Originally Posted by VisionMan1 Derek, thats simply not true. But I've seen you say this many times now. Why do you think that there is even a possibility that Sky Sports will not be on the YouView from BT platform? Or BT Vision, either? OK, I'm not Derek but I think he might be suggesting BT may lose the CAT Appeal on Wednesday?

04-02-2013, 19:25	#12
VisionMan1 Inactive Member Join Date: Dec 2012 Posts: 2,107	Quote: Originally Posted by 1andrew1 OK, I'm not Derek but I think he might be suggesting BT may lose the CAT Appeal on Wednesday? It was my understanding the above is in regard to the wholesale price of SS 1&2, not third party access. Or am I wrong on that?

05-02-2013, 10:18	#13
indiekid76 Forum Member Join Date: Jul 2010 Posts: 299	Yeah, it's the price, isn't it? BT have been paying the extra, that Sky want, in to a pot and Sky get that if they win.

05-02-2013, 10:41	#14
promo-only Forum Member Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: Liverpool Posts: 2,935	The way I've been reading this thing was that the appeal is to decide upon the 'Wholesale Must Offer' obligation as a whole, and not just pricing.

05-02-2013, 11:31	#15
VisionMan1 Inactive Member Join Date: Dec 2012 Posts: 2,107	I've found this Guardian article on the matter from 2010, and it is just the prices that are being contested/appealed - "BSkyB must reduce the wholesale price at which it sells Sky Sports 1 and Sky Sports 2 to rivals such as Virgin Media and BT by 23.4% from the current £13.88 to £10.63 per subscriber per month. On the basis that most subscribers buy packages including the sports channels, the reduction for a bundle is 10.5% from £19.15 to £17.14. The new wholesale pricing is effective immediately, the regulator said, and BSkyB now has six weeks from today to make a "reference offer", effectively a template contract, to other pay-TV providers. BSkyB, however, intends to apply to the Competition Appeal Tribunal for a stay on implementing the ruling. Ofcom has also said that BSkyB must offer wholesale high-definition versions of Sky Sports 1 and 2 to rivals but stopped at setting a price. "To help to promote future innovation Ofcom ... requires them to be offered on fair, reasonable and non-discriminatory terms." http://www.guardian.co.uk/media/2010...orts-price-cut

05-02-2013, 12:11	#16
indiekid76 Forum Member Join Date: Jul 2010 Posts: 299	The courts ruled in Sky's favour in November, I don't know what that case is linked above; perhaps a BT appeal?

05-02-2013, 14:00	#17
promo-only Forum Member Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: Liverpool Posts: 2,935	Yes it is a BT appeal - they're the ones who aren't happy. Depending on what happens, Sky technically would only be obliged to offer Sky Sports 1 & 2 to Virgin customers due to a much older ruling. There are plenty of twists and turns but complete worst case scenario would see Sky pull SS 1 & 2 off BT Vision... If it did come to that, it'd just mean negotiations would sway in Sky's favour because BT would need those channels a lot more than what Sky would need BT's channel.

05-02-2013, 14:16	#18
powar Forum Member Join Date: Aug 2012 Posts: 263	You can't help but sense that BT are totally out of their depth, I could be wrong though... There should be a multi national advertising campaign in full swing by now. I hope they succeed, as competition brings out the best in companies as they will always strive and innovate new products.

05-02-2013, 14:32	#19
promo-only Forum Member Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: Liverpool Posts: 2,935	Quote: Originally Posted by powar You can't help but sense that BT are totally out of their depth, I could be wrong though... There should be a multi national advertising campaign in full swing by now. I hope they succeed, as competition brings out the best in companies as they will always strive and innovate new products. Competition does bring out the best but in reality it's not as rosy as that. It should never have been allowed for the service/platform provider to be the same as the content provider. I've always thought that Sky should either provide the programming, win the football rights etc OR provide the platform. In fairness to them though, they've been allowed to do it so they've only looked after their own and protected what they have. It should never have been allowed in the first place in the interests of competition but that's where we're at.

05-02-2013, 15:31	#20
powar Forum Member Join Date: Aug 2012 Posts: 263	Quote: Originally Posted by promo-only Competition does bring out the best but in reality it's not as rosy as that. It should never have been allowed for the service/platform provider to be the same as the content provider. I've always thought that Sky should either provide the programming, win the football rights etc OR provide the platform. In fairness to them though, they've been allowed to do it so they've only looked after their own and protected what they have. It should never have been allowed in the first place in the interests of competition but that's where we're at. In hindsight, your right. Sky gambled when others didn't dare in the past. It appears BT are doing the same, in this economic climate it is very, very risky.

05-02-2013, 22:59	#21
VisionMan1 Inactive Member Join Date: Dec 2012 Posts: 2,107	BT have invested billions in these new services. And a multi-billion pound company won't get that wrong. Could they lose access to Sky Sports? That would be highly doubtful. Could they lose their appeal on the CAT ruling re the wholesale prices? Maybe.

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Will BT get there act together in time?

05-02-2013, 23:09	#22
promo-only Forum Member Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: Liverpool Posts: 2,935	Quote: Originally Posted by VisionMan1 BT have invested billions in these new services. And a multi-billion pound company won't get that wrong. Could they lose access to Sky Sports? That would be highly doubtful. Could they lose their appeal on the CAT ruling re the wholesale prices? Maybe. It's unlikely but very much a possibility. It does not matter how many billions BT may have when are you going to realise this? They themselves have said this is very much a gamble and if it works, great, they'll bid again on football rights in 2015. If it doesn't, they'll cut their losses and move on. It's very much an unknown area for them - they've taken a gamble so yes, a multi-billion pound company could well get it wrong! I'm not saying they will get it wrong, I'm not saying they won't, only time will tell!

06-02-2013, 22:46	#23
VisionMan1 Inactive Member Join Date: Dec 2012 Posts: 2,107	Quote: Originally Posted by MJH1962 It is well publicised that BT will launch its sports channels on Sky and Virgin, as well as its own platform. I expect they will be used as a leverage to attract new customers to BT Vision / BT Youview, but they will not exclude access through other platforms. There is a wider initiative than just the sports channels in play to build up the BT customer base - just read the press release last week to understand this. It makes me chuckle when I read some of the advice to BT from posters on here. As multi-billion pound company that is doing very well in terms of its business and profits, I (as a shareholder) trust it to get things right over this. Talk Talk is not its prime threat as it is and will remain far too small, Sky is the provider it is gunning for. Yeah. They, and Virgin Media. But the truly ironic thing about this is it's not the other suppliers TV custom they want, it's actually their telephone and broadband customers.