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TNA Wrestling on Challenge TV (Part 2) |
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#3501 |
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Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 7,403
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Quote:
Yeah but with WWE they didnt have a case of a bad storyline that TNA obviously did.
The IWC of course hated it, and yes, the acting was obviously hammy, but it drew in viewers. Hence why WWE cloned a huge proportion of it. |
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#3502 |
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Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 12,683
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Quote:
You say "obviously", but can't back it up with facts. Here's a fact, repeated for you a second time - that angle CONSISTENTLY got TNA their highest rated segments, and saw an overall increase in viewership of the program while it ran.
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#3503 |
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Join Date: Sep 2014
Posts: 5,371
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Quote:
You say "obviously", but can't back it up with facts. Here's a fact, repeated for you a second time - that angle CONSISTENTLY got TNA their highest rated segments, and saw an overall increase in viewership of the program while it ran.
The IWC of course hated it, and yes, the acting was obviously hammy, but it drew in viewers. Hence why WWE cloned a huge proportion of it. |
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#3504 |
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Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 17,297
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FMKK your hate for TNA really showing lately. very bias posts.
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#3505 |
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Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 31,653
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FMKK your hate for TNA really showing lately. very bias posts.
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#3506 |
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Join Date: Oct 2003
Posts: 966
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Quote:
And in my experience those people tend not to make extensive use of that technology or they hire assistants that handle those things for them because its not an especially productive way to run a company using technology you don't understand. Take Vince McMahon for example as we all saw on Raw a few years ago he apparently can barely use a phone and yet he seems to function as a businessman and a human being presumably because he has people around him who are capable of handling these issues for him.
I'm a very good web developer of 15 years experience. In those 15 years I once accidentally gave a journalist a senior executive's mobile number. I once deleted an entire production web directory. Accidents happen; sometimes quite serious ones. Somebody getting an email address wrong, or a URL wrong - it's just laughably small-fry! And the fact anyone has tried to make anything out of it shows the extent to which the internet has it in for Carter, and how warped and biased their view of her, and TNA, actually is. |
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#3507 |
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Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 31,653
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Poor Dixie again? Maybe she could stop making gaffes and nobody could pull her up on them.
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#3508 |
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Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 31,653
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Tyrus has been pulled from GFW's upcoming shows due to contract obligations.
Karen Jarrett tweeted this: "Sounds like someone is throwing a temper tantrum in Nashville. Oh you can't control the world darlin!" Apparently in response. |
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#3509 |
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Join Date: Oct 2003
Posts: 966
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Quote:
Poor Dixie again? Maybe she could stop making gaffes and nobody could pull her up on them.
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#3510 |
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Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 17,297
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i should start my own company, everyone else seems to be incompetent.
i would be head to head with WWE within 5 years and based on current creative probably ahead in 7!
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#3511 |
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Join Date: Oct 2003
Posts: 966
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Quote:
i should start my own company, everyone else seems to be incompetent.
i would be head to head with WWE within 5 years and based on current creative probably ahead in 7! ![]() I actually don't think WWE or TNA are that badly written. The problem for WWE is the sheer amount of TV they need to fill every week, budget cuts making shows look formulaic, relentless censorship, and the restricted movesets they impose on talent. Make RAW the only weekly WWE show, cut it to 1.5 hours, allow wrestlers to use their full movesets and give everyone more mic time & freedom to be themselves on the mic, and current RAW could quickly become the best weekly wrestling show ever broadcast. The talent pool is phenomenal. TNA are hamstrung by lack of money, lack of crowds, poor production values, network interference and relentless hostile media coverage. Even through all that, the second Wembley Impact this year was for me one of the best weekly wrestling TV episodes since the heyday of SNME. |
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#3512 |
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Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 31,653
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Quote:
But it's not like anybody ever gives her any credit either, is it? Here's a 50 year old woman who agreed to be powerbombed from the top turnbuckle through a table in an attempt to help her show bump a rating, legitimately breaking her back. Who clearly could be spending her dad's money more selfishly than propping up a failing wrestling company. And what does she get from wrestling fans in return? Nothing but hate.
In the past 12 months, what in a business sense can she be praised for? She's signed a few international TV deals so good on that account but what else? |
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#3513 |
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Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 12,683
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Quote:
But it's not like anybody ever gives her any credit either, is it? Here's a 50 year old woman who agreed to be powerbombed from the top turnbuckle through a table in an attempt to help her show bump a rating, legitimately breaking her back. Who clearly could be spending her dad's money more selfishly than propping up a failing wrestling company. And what does she get from wrestling fans in return? Nothing but hate.
She's running a business in an industry that she clearly doesn't fully know or understand and with that in mind a lot of the decisions she's made don't look entirely bad (on paper at least). She inherited Russo but keeping him around wasn't in and of itself a terrible idea. He's one of the few people with actual tangible experience in a creative role and as anyone who's got any kind of experience of the words that come out of his mouth he's an expert at spinning his past successes and failures – namely he's responsible for everything that worked and someone else was to blame for everything that didn't. The same basic principle is true of the decision to bring Bischoff and Hogan in. If you don't really know the industry it makes sense that you'd turn to the one guy who had previously taken the fight to Vince McMahon and seen major success with WCW (at least on the surface). And Hulk Hogan is a name and figure those outside of pro-wrestling know the same is broadly true for guys like Flair and Sting etc. The problem is of course that while all of these decisions seem to make sense in reality they were just horrible decisions and pretty much everyone more familiar and knowledgeable of the industry saw those disasters coming a mile away. Obviously this raises questions about why after so many years she still seems largely unaware of the industry in which she's operating but that's another issue for another time. It also doesn't explain why she stuck with Russo for so long or hired him back, over the objections of the network keeping her company alive, which however you slice it was just bad, bad business. I think in part she is a victim of the fact that Vince McMahon has made running a wrestling company look easy (in no small part because of his widespread failures outside of the wrestling business that seem to suggest the man isn't exactly businessman of the year either). Pro-wrestling is a weird industry that though that takes a wide degree of knowledge to navigate (which is part of why WCW fell apart so spectacularly despite being so successful for a while). With that said I think there's very little evidence to suggest that Dixie Carter is a particularly great businesswoman even accounting for wrestling deficiencies. Quite what she's getting out of the continued existence of TNA at this point is hard to tell. Maybe its pride that's keeping her investing her (family) money into the sinking ship who knows. As a company though its poorly run. As in WCW levels of mismanagement which is not an easy bar to clear. |
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#3514 |
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Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 12,683
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Quote:
I actually don't think WWE or TNA are that badly written.
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#3515 |
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Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Edinburgh, Scotland, UK
Posts: 16,709
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Quote:
But it's not like anybody ever gives her any credit either, is it? Here's a 50 year old woman who agreed to be powerbombed from the top turnbuckle through a table in an attempt to help her show bump a rating, legitimately breaking her back. Who clearly could be spending her dad's money more selfishly than propping up a failing wrestling company. And what does she get from wrestling fans in return? Nothing but hate.
How that was supposed to attract any casual viewers I do not know. |
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#3516 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Sep 2014
Posts: 5,371
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Quote:
But it's not like anybody ever gives her any credit either, is it? Here's a 50 year old woman who agreed to be powerbombed from the top turnbuckle through a table in an attempt to help her show bump a rating, legitimately breaking her back. Who clearly could be spending her dad's money more selfishly than propping up a failing wrestling company. And what does she get from wrestling fans in return? Nothing but hate.
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#3517 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 17,297
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the only thing TNA do right is wrestling, the wolves matches vs hardys and dudleys were brilliant and this current series with roode and aries is too(too bad they will do the wrestling unreaistic BS and make sure they win 2 on trot to take it to a decider)
but i just dont really care about the characters, i dont care who wins or loses for most part. fast fwd nearly everything on impact. even the promos take too long. i was TNA biggest supporter back from 2003-end of russo/bisch/hogan era, its just gone downhil now. this smashing pumpkin seems to be another basic minded guy working in creative, makes no sense .....so far. |
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#3518 |
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Join Date: Sep 2014
Posts: 5,371
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I try to catch TNA every now and then but its not really a promotion ive tried to follow on a week to week basis.
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#3519 |
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Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 7,403
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Quote:
She didnt break her back neither did trish back in 2000 because Bubba takes the full force.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AKzHpRyAsRA |
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#3520 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Sep 2014
Posts: 4,700
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She did actually break her back with that table stunt.
The reason for the powerbomb was very simple. The point was to have the younger members of the roster who were against her onscreen and the ones siding with her onscreen (EC3, Spud) to get noticed more and by teasing Bubba putting her through a table it was a recurring storyline week to week, everyone knew it was going to happen but it was just a case of when, every week Dixie would push and push and manage to escape. The desired outcome would be fans who fell away from the show to tune in to see when she would get put through the table and hopefully see the younger roster perform and like what they see enough to keep watching the show after she finally does go through the table. I imagine it's the same thing with when WWE brings back The Rock or Brock Lesnar. They are hoping that fans who no longer watch due to it being like a Saturday morning kids show might take a look at a Dolph Ziggler or a Adam Rose and they might think oh....this is ok, i'm here to see The Rock but I might watch the rest of the show or I really enjoyed seeing those guys I've never heard of before I'll maybe watch next week too.. That's all it is. Try to bring back older fans or fans that fell away and expose them to new talent that they haven't seen before or maybe present them in a different way and hope that enough people like it to keep watching every week. Vince Russo interviewed Billy Corgan this week. I haven't seen it yet, it's on his paid site, I don't even know if Russo is putting it up this week but since they are friends and have been friends since 1999 I'm sure Russo will ask him what he will do creatively at TNA. Anything different is good. It's 2015. This talking for 20 minutes and wrestling matches for 15 minutes and big stages and video screens and commercials running through matches needs to go. It's in the stone ages. Even the Attitude Era is the stone age. It's just so old and outdated. Wrestling needs to be presented differently in 2015 and the truth of the matter is no one knows how to fix it. No one has the right answer. Not a McMahon. Not a Carter. No one. What they do know however and what we all know is that what is being done just now isn't working. They don't have the same numbers of people paying money to see house shows or TV tapings. The TV ratings aren't as good as they used to be. The interest just isn't there anymore and let's face it. Nothing will change until push comes to shove. Maybe TNA losing their contract with DA is a good thing because they talked about doing the reality stuff on the show and that never amounted to anything. If Dixie is really proud and doesn't want to step down and admit defeat then maybe this is the last chance saloon to actually do something for once and go through with it 100%, sink or swim. WWE will never change unless the TV ratings get so low they need to change or their investors kick up a fuss or USA Network decides that a 2.7 on prime time TV every Monday just isn't good enough. And even then WWE has Triple H and Stephanie lol. Even I'm laughing as I type this. It makes no difference, it's the same thing. Same mind. Same way of doing things. They haven't got a clue what an 18 year old man or a 35 year old man wants to see in 2015. Maybe they do i don't know but I can't see them being any different to Vince. Sometimes you need to roll the dice. Vince did it in the 80's with the expansion and Wrestlemania. Sink or swim. Bischoff did it with Turner's money and when Bischoff was left alone to his own devices, WCW flourished. McMahon did the same thing with Russo in 1995 and it got him the best ratings not only in WWF history but wrestling history, as soon as Russo left in late 1999, WWF went downhill and still goes downhill to this day. It's never recovered. Nearly a 17 year period that has never recovered and the industry hasn't either. If you ever want wrestling to be popular again then you need to hope someone rolls the dice soon. Someone has to take a chance. The fanbase gets smaller by the day no matter how much profit is made. The question is how bad does it need to get. WWE gets a 2.7 for Raw. How much lower does that rating need to be before someone, either an investor or the USA Network themselves starts to open their mouth? How much money does Dixie Carter need to lose before she starts making some real moves and getting the right people hired who know what they are doing behind the scenes in the office? That's when you'll see big changes in wrestling. |
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#3521 |
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Join Date: Jun 2012
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How many times hazy? Seriously, how many times?
If you can make more money from less people, as a business what is wrong with that? In a purely financial sense, what is wrong with that? |
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#3522 |
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Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 31,653
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The first Wrestling Wednesday ratings are in
ROH: 20:00 - 163,000 23:00 - 110,000 Total - 273,000 TNA: 21:00 - 297,000 00:00 - 72,000 Total - 369,000 TNA did 570,000 on its final Friday but obviously the show has changed night and the replay is now after the ROH replay and aired an hour later than usual. I think ROH had a good night. |
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#3523 |
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Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Edinburgh, Scotland, UK
Posts: 16,709
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lol tna- spoiler-
Spoiler
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#3524 |
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Join Date: Sep 2014
Posts: 4,700
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I know there's a few women on here that will obviously dismiss this but for anyone wanting to hear Billy Corgan talk. Vince Russo has posted the first part of his interview with him for free on video and audio. This is the video part.
http://www.relmnetwork.com/#!THE-SWE...f2e4994fad372c And Billy says many things I have said. Wrestling is behind the times. Shows like Breaking Bad and Boardwalk Empire show sofisticated characters. TV viewers are not stupid. They want to be challenged. They want to be challenged. They want stories they can sink their teeth into. |
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#3525 |
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Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 12,683
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Not a bad start for RoH. That's a hefty drop for TNA but not unexpected. We'll see where things go from here. Quote:
The reason for the powerbomb was very simple. The point was to have the younger members of the roster who were against her onscreen and the ones siding with her onscreen (EC3, Spud) to get noticed more...
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I imagine it's the same thing with when WWE brings back The Rock or Brock Lesnar.
Only it isn't because the audience has a pre-existing connection to The Rock or Brock Lesnar and therefore when they show up on television its an event that triggers with the audience. Putting a woman the audience doesn't know or care about through a table doesn't trigger that and speaks to the absolute worst of pro-wrestling. Quote:
Anything different is good.
No it isn't. Different and good aren't the same thing. They sometime overlap to be sure but they aren't interchangable. Being different just to be different is not a good thing. Quote:
This talking for 20 minutes and wrestling matches for 15 minutes and big stages and video screens and commercials running through matches needs to go. It's in the stone ages. Even the Attitude Era is the stone age. It's just so old and outdated.
So to be clear wrestling and segments that advance stories are outdated and need to go. What exactly does that leave? I'd also just point out that the Attitude Era didn't reinvent the wheel. Nor did the nWo fueled explosion of WCW. They were effectively doing the same thing that pro-wrestling has always been just with a fresh lick of paint. The idea that you need to reinvent the wheel here is fundamentally flawed. It needs a fresh coat of paint but the wheel still works. Quote:
They haven't got a clue what an 18 year old man or a 35 year old man wants to see in 2015.
Which might explain why WWE have put a lot of effort, time and money into trying to expand their audience beyond the single demo you're obsessed with. Quote:
Bischoff did it with Turner's money and when Bischoff was left alone to his own devices, WCW flourished.
That's a debatable point and really depends on your perspective. If you use the only metric that Vince Russo and Eric Bischoff seemed to care about (television ratings) then sure WCW flourished for a while but beyond that it gets a bit shaky. I'd also point out that Bischoff left to his own devices also helped bring about the downfall of WCW. Quote:
McMahon did the same thing with Russo in 1995...
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA! Quote:
as soon as Russo left in late 1999, WWF went downhill and still goes downhill to this day.
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!Quote:
WWE gets a 2.7 for Raw. How much lower does that rating need to be before someone, either an investor or the USA Network themselves starts to open their mouth?
Since absolutely no one with any knowledge uses the household numbers as a worthwhile metric for success or failure you're barking up the wrong tree here.
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