The Apprentice is a tired show which hemorraged a lot of viewers last year. It will go the same way as Dancing on Ice and XFactor, continuing to lose viewers as viewers get bored of the old stale format. Viewers have seen the buffooons taking part many times over, any new contestant who is really stupid and thick wont make the same impact in terms of buzz as the thick contestants used to do in the past. Contestants saying lines such as "my first word was money not mummy" looks increasingly scripted as year after year, viewers have seen this kind of thing being said. If the show has good contestants mainly however, viewers complain the series is not as entertaining as it used to be. So basically the show is in a no win position either way if they have more bufoons or less of them. The tasks are not very original these days, which reduces viewer excitement. Lord Sugar is running out of great one-liners as he's used up a lot over the last decade, while the winners prize of getting investment just isnt as good as an actual job. Basically The Apprentice is going to decline with the late spring start, especially with Lord Sugar's reputation taking a kicking and his terrible decision to join Twitter which took away his image of a powerful businessman and exposed him as a grumpy old tool who can't type or spell properly.

Breakdown for BBC One and ITV (exc +1), 20:00-21:00:


Programme timings:FGF held up above 2m against EE, even during the break, and put on a few hundred k after EE finished However, it is still a great big stinker.


No problem - I expect you've noticed I put a Neighbours rating in there by mistake, and corrected myself this morning.

And indeed, it was one of the standout ingredients that helped enable C5 hit 5% in the All Day Shares yesterday. It's been a long struggle to get there since CBB ended, but they finally managed it at the 40th time of asking. BBC2 wasn't far ahead on 5.3%.

Do these include +1?

Elsewhere, Broadcast have put up quite a few articles regarding C4. Charlie Parsons launched a stinging attack on the commissioning team last week. Jay Hunt responded in Broadcast by saying;


From top to bottom, my response on the emboldened parts;
[LIST][*]I have seen very little great content. If it was great, it would be out-rating the likes of BBC1 and ITV1 at 8pm/9pm/10pm at least 3 or 4 nights a week.[*]Highlighting Utopia and Complicit as drama highlights shows how weak C4's drama slate is. Both were ok at best.[*]'Slightly mad'. Shows how charming and 'endearing' Jay Hunt is.[*]The 460 part. 460-what? 460 indies or 460 programmes. Please be clearer Jay.[*]21-day response is a good thing. Will be interesting to see how long they keep that promise because I imagine that they will find it too hard to deal with the number of pitches.[*]As far as I am aware, Jay Hunt only worked in news, before moving to a controller/commissioner role. She really doesn't understand how annoying it is pitching to commissioners who give unclear feedback or who try and make wholesale changes to a format idea.[/LIST]To me it all looks a little sugar-coated. The indie sector is divided right down the middle. The next article will explain why. I'll post that in a new post.

You have very unrealistic expectations of what C4 are capable of in that case.

By all means compare with near rivals BBC2 and C5. But C4 are too far behind BBC1 and ITV in Total People to pose the kind of threat in key slots that you describe on a regular basis.

Okay, okay. That's very nice but even if it declines it's the same story. It still pulls above average viewers for the slot. 6m on a Wednesday is very good. And you make the show sound worse than it is. It's tired but not totally done for.

It's starting later this year so I expect it would naturally decline anyway. I agree Cohen does need to start looking for something to takes it's slot. I still think The Apprentice has a future though beyond Sugar. At heart is a really strong format.

I have always thought the BBC should find a weekday entertainment series for the spring and move the apprentice to autumn where BBC One was very weak last year. Probably the weakest I have ever seen the channel. There were repeats and cheep filler. They basically relied on SDC and Last Tango. Anyway cross fingers they have had a pretty good run so far this year.

Small changes and bring the Apprentice back down to earth would fix it. The axing of YA is a good start. That didn't help I don't think.

Ken

Graham Norton's 6 hour Comic Relief chat on BBC Three giving people a chance to kiss a celeb in a kissing booth if you've given money...
"We're gonna give you the chance to kiss an actual celebrity. No tongues, there are standards. We've got loads of hot Comic Relief volunteers waiting for the chance to make out with you, so if you're over 18...this is the new BBC...(the audience gasp) and are feeling lucky, get yourself down to Television Centre, and you could be kissing on national television. No-one thought this through did they?" (audience still laughing at the earlier comment).

It'll be interesting to see how this does tonight - it's kind of like a mini pre-telethon and I suspect will feature more live television than the main telethon if the last Red Nose Day is anything to go by.

I suppose, although it would be a massively controversial acquisition that would give BT a load of negative publicity.

The other thing about buying the Six Nations, I suppose, is that the deal when they sold the England games was so controversial, you'd have to liaise with all six nations and I think Wales, Scotland and Ireland would be far less interested in going to pay TV than England would.

It's like when Setanta had Setanta Golf, which was of minimal value because the Beeb and Sky had all the interesting golf that was enough for all but the most demented golf fan.


Of course last year we speculated it had been put at 10.35 at the last minute because it wasn't good enough for primetime, except it was 35 minutes long and now this new series is in the exact same slot. It's alright as panel shows go but it is exactly the same format as Room 101 and I'm amazed that not only are both on the same channel, but one's starting within a fortnight of the other one finishing. And in this day and age, you shouldn't be having panel shows with an all-male panel.


I don't know why people complain about Sarah Millican going on panel and chat shows, she's a comedian, that's what comedians do, they go a panel and chat shows. She doesn't even do that many.

There were plenty of trailers for Parks and Recreation on BBC1 and BBC2, and it's wrong to say it needs to be on a "higher profile" channel than BBC4. Everyone can get BBC4, buy a television and you have it. It's right at the start of the EPG.


Probably going to be on later than 1am as well as Graham Norton will doubtless overrun. This is going to be great fun, actually, twenty minutes in he was already discussing the concept of Tipping Point with Little Mix, so heaven knows what we'll get five hours in.

'stEnders is on next Wednesday because there's none next Friday. Dunno why it's on this Wednesday, maybe they miscounted.


No surprise to see C4 boasting about how "brave" they are, they always do that. I remember ten years ago they blabbed to Broadcast how no other channel in the world would be brave enough to commission a new entertainment show stripped daily like they did with The Games, only for ITV to write in and point out they'd already done two series of I'm A Celebrity. Surely the Richard III thing was going to happen anyway regardless of whether C4 covered it.

And I don't think they're very brave either, their comedy line-up is balls, a load of panel games and chat shows and those thrusting young new talents Gervais and Kay. Said in the Guardian Guide this weekend that they didn't want to comission Anna and Katy until they'd seen them in the Harveys adverts.


I never notice that until you point it out.

Here is the second article


The first embolded part is alarming. I am aware who the figures and bosses in question are (but I will not say out of privacy). I agree C4 interfere a hell of a lot. Programmes that are commissioned will be fiddled and changed until the point they are unrecognisable from the ones that were initially pitched.

The second part is pretty scary. They're not comfortable with dissent of any kind. From a broadcaster that regularly challenges the most powerful voices in our society, it seems they like their own opinion is more important than those of their suppliers.

What? They had New tricks, HIGNFY, WDYTYA, The Paradise, Merlin, Watchdog, George Gently in early Autumn and Crickley Hall after Downton .


You're talking about 1-2 weeks before Christmas which is nearly always weak on BBC ONE. They're hardly going to start new shows 2 weeks before Christmas. Go check the listings from 2 years previously or 2011 when they burnt off the flop Young James series across 3 nights.

Secondly they already aired The Apprentice in the autumn and it did poorly!

Did better than most things and I've.

I was talking though about the whole autumn schedule not 2 weeks before Christmas. They were weak.

7,650,000
8,100,000
7,530,000
6,490,000
8,200,000
7,560,000
7,710,000
8,070,000
7,530,000
8,140,000
8,770,000
8,630,000

They are the apprentice numbers for the autumn. I't doesn't look "Poor" what so ever. It should go to autumn where it can live the rest of it's life out. Allows them to find something new for march onwards. Won't happen though because BBC one just can't find entertainment series very well.

It's refreshing to moan about the channel. I seem to have a habit of praising them to often.

Ken

C4 so brave nowadays they're doing a third episode of 8 out of 10 Cats does Countdown. Jay Hunt and David Abraham need to go - simple.

[quote=SamuelW;64649660]The Apprentice is a tired show which hemorraged a lot of viewers last year. It will go the same way as Dancing on Ice and XFactor, continuing to lose viewers as viewers get bored of the old stale format. Viewers have seen the buffooons taking part many times over, any new contestant who is really stupid and thick wont make the same impact in terms of buzz as the thick contestants used to do in the past. Contestants saying lines such as "my first word was money not mummy" looks increasingly scripted as year after year, viewers have seen this kind of thing being said. If the show has good contestants mainly however, viewers complain the series is not as entertaining as it used to be. So basically the show is in a no win position either way if they have more bufoons or less of them. The tasks are not very original these days, which reduces viewer excitement. Lord Sugar is running out of great one-liners as he's used up a lot over the last decade, while the winners prize of getting investment just isnt as good as an actual job. Basically The Apprentice is going to decline with the late spring start, especially with Lord Sugar's reputation taking a kicking and his terrible decision to join Twitter which took away his image of a powerful businessman and exposed him as a grumpy old tool who can't type or spell properly.[/QUOTE]



Read your own posts do you? Hilarious.

Lord Sugar will (in your words elsewhere) not be getting any sleep and will be in discussions with the BBC executives about the forthcoming ratings crisis..... that language sound familiar to you? :yawn:

Yes, very good - the man has made a fortune and will be really worried...

Channel 4 still commission some good stuff - drama like Utopia is the kind of ambitious programming they should be making, there just doesn't seem to be enough of it at the moment.

Did I say Lord Sugar would be worried by the probable Apprentice ratings drop ? It's you who's saying that!

Yes I know. You said the Autumn schedule was full of filler and repeats. Was New tricks, HIGNFY, Good Cop, WDYTYA, The Paradise, Merlin, Watchdog, Hunted, Last Tango, George Gently, SPOTY,Crickley Hall etc all filler?
Would you like to look at the 2011 Autumn schedule??


They were up year on year last Autumn.


Compared to the previous series especially the later episodes they were down. There is a reason why it was moved back.


Yeah where it will die quicker.


No problem with you moaning, just try to use facts.
BBC ONE was up year on year last Autumn and that was despite Eastenders being significantly down year on year and SCD was also slightly down too.

They haven't been brave for 10 years at least. Who would you replace them with exactly? Do you know somebody with a magic wand? C4 are now paying for it's over reliance on property shows, Shameless and Big Brother throughout the noughties under Kevin Lygo. Hunt and Abraham have to rebuild a channel and a brand and it isn't going to be easy.

Channel 4 are very capable of reaching the same levels of ITV and BBC1. Comparing them with C5 is unrealistic. Channel 5 have fallen way behind C4 in the 8pm and 9pm hour. Channel 4 may have lost it, but C5 should be looking at comparing themselves to ITV3, Sky1 and BBC Three.

Complete and utter nonsense. Either you are looking at incorrect data or you're interpreting the figures wrong. There's about 1 or 2 share points separating BBC2, C4 and C5 most days with the top multichannel at least 2 share points further back.

As for your ridiculous suggestion that "C5 has fallen way behind C4 at 9pm", do you have any stats to back this up? If we take last night as an example, NCIS was down about 300k on the equivalent episode last season. One Born Every Minute meanwhile lost 1.2 million. So on Wednesdays at 9pm the gap has narrowed overall by nearly a million. That's just one timeslot I'm focussing on there, but with the likes of Embarrassing Bodies also well past their best, I doubt the situation is vastly different across the week and I certainly don't believe the gap is increasing as you appear to be implying.

I'm afraid you are being wholly unrealistic about not only what Channel 4 can achieve going forwards, but also where they are currently at.

I can't decide whether that's good or not for Parks and Rec, but I think it's probably about what I'd expect.

Have BBC4 shown any imported US shows before, and if so, how did they perform comparably if anybody knows.

I really don't think you could claim that Parks and Rec has been a "big hit" in the US.

It's critically acclaimed but gets about 3.5m viewers at the moment which is pretty shameful for US network TV.

But I love it and am glad it survives - even if it only manages it because NBC's other sitcoms do even worse!

It,s being reported that Jay Leno is set to retire as host of NBC,s The Tonight Show at the end of the next season in May 2014 to be replaced by Jimmy Fallon with the official announcement expected at this May,s NBC Upfront event

The reason being that although he still wins most nights Jay,s Show is losing in the all important 18-49 demographic to Jimmy Kimmel Live which ABC moved to 11.35pm in January

Don,t they risk that whole Conan O Brian situation again although I understand NBC,s thinking this time round

David Letterman,s contract with CBS also runs out next year so do you think 2014 could be the start of a new era for US Late Night talk shows

Can things get any worse for NBC? Is Conan O'Brien still doing a talk show?

I'm glad Kimmel's ratings have picked up. Underrated talent.

Delighted meanwhile to see NBC and Leno go backwards. The way they handled the Conan situation was just dreadful and they got what they deserved.