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Old 21-04-2013, 02:03
egghead1
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Lots more stuff coming out now the journos are getting to work

FOX 25 News Boston ‏@fox25news 8m
Suspect 2 reportedly dragged brother 30 feet before ditching stolen car and fleeing on foot Thurs
http://www.myfoxboston.com/story/220...e-who-led-whom
Another interesting report from Doctors at hospital about the one who died explains he had lots of injuries and chest cut open which contradicts the "morgue" picture which surfaced,
http://bigstory.ap.org/article/docto...ounds-head-toe
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Old 21-04-2013, 02:08
WinterLily
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You need your ears syringing http://newsfeed.time.com/2013/04/19/...hootout-video/

26 secs onwards gunfire and explosions,even the person filming it says there;s gunfire and explosions. They werent throwing bombs its not hollywood with huge bangs,more like firecrackers sounds.
Just seen this footage which I agree appears to suggest some form of explosives. The police did say they were throwing explosives and bombs usually do make a loud bang. They were probably using gunpowder (or maybe not, who knows) as opposed to dynamite therefore the 'bang' would not be as loud.

However, the footage I have seen ...from MSN news shows roughly the same visual footage but a different sound with no evidence of explosives, gunpowder of dynamite explosives.
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Old 21-04-2013, 02:09
JasonWatkins
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I believe I have offered some explanation as to why this does not 'feel right'. However, my explanations maybe not be as 'clear' as you would like
I've read back, as you asked, and with the greatest of respect, your "explanation" just screams 'conspiracy'. I've pulled a few points.

Offering an opinion and qualifying it with "...as told by the police". It's just a roundabout way of saying ".. what we're told to believe" IMO.

Questioning why pictures or 'evidence' wasn't shown of the act itself is another favourite of the conspiracy crowd. I'll point you to the pentagon attack on 9/11 as the most famous example - the phrase usually goes something like "it's the most heavily surveilled building in the world so why can't we see footage of the plane crashing into the building?".

You have questions, fair enough, but, for me, they all follow a pattern seen many times before where a theorist will often avoid the most logical (and often correct) explanation in favour of something more sinister..

Simply look at their posture....those backpacks are light and do not contain anything heavy. I have not used a pressure cooker for a long time but I remember them as quite bulky
I have ready stories of eye witnesses talking of a shoot out....but not of explosives being thrown at police. The only mention of explosives I have heard were the one's strapped to the body of the elder brother....as told by the police
Two young men picked out in the crowd. Two young men with backpacks. Two young men in the right place to place the bombs but did they? Do the photos show them with the bombs in their backpacks or not?
If the police are saying these pics were shown before they placed the bombs then I simply do not believe them. These bombs would have been heavy. The way they are walking, their posture, the way they are holding their backpacks do not suggest heaviness
Is there any footage of them placing a bomb? Or simply just walking around....there are many other people walking about with backpacks. What is it about these two which makes them different?
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Old 21-04-2013, 02:20
WinterLily
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I've read back, as you asked, and with the greatest of respect, your "explanation" just screams 'conspiracy'. I've pulled a few points.

Offering an opinion and qualifying it with "...as told by the police". It's just a roundabout way of saying ".. what we're told to believe" IMO.

Questioning why pictures or 'evidence' wasn't shown of the act itself is another favourite of the conspiracy crowd. I'll point you to the pentagon attack on 9/11 as the most famous example - the phrase usually goes something like "it's the most heavily surveilled building in the world so why can't we see footage of the plane crashing into the building?".

You have questions, fair enough, but, for me, they all follow a pattern seen many times before where a theorist will often avoid the most logical (and often correct) explanation in favour of something more sinister..
I am not suggesting anyone has lied. I am not suggesting there is anything sinister here. I am simply stating the evidence (for me anyway) is not so straightforward.

If to have a different opinion makes me a conspiracy theorist....then as I have previously stated...so be it.
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Old 21-04-2013, 02:28
bollywood
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I am not suggesting anyone has lied. I am not suggesting there is anything sinister here. I am simply stating the evidence (for me anyway) is not so straightforward.

If to have a different opinion makes me a conspiracy theorist....then as I have previously stated...so be it.
The police said they are holding back information that only the ones who placed the bombs would know. Maybe that is a reason for not releasing more footage from the security cameras. I bet the police cars were filming also. We have to wait and see what they have.
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Old 21-04-2013, 02:46
JasonWatkins
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I am simply stating the evidence (for me anyway) is not so straightforward
.. avoiding the most logical reason that a lot of it would have been deliberately held back and also would likely be used as evidence in any subsequent criminal trial.

I doubt very much they would have just randomly pulled two people from the crowd and said "you know what? they'll do"
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Old 21-04-2013, 02:50
Bulletguy1
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Just seen this footage which I agree appears to suggest some form of explosives. The police did say they were throwing explosives and bombs usually do make a loud bang. They were probably using gunpowder (or maybe not, who knows) as opposed to dynamite therefore the 'bang' would not be as loud.

However, the footage I have seen ...from MSN news shows roughly the same visual footage but a different sound with no evidence of explosives, gunpowder of dynamite explosives.
WL

The louder more rapid fire you hear with deeper sound comes from semi automatics more than likely Heckler & Koch which take a 30 round magazine clip of 5.56mm. The 416's can fire up to 800 rounds per min and can also facilitate a grenade launcher.

I very much doubt either of the two suspects would have been in possession of one of these as they are far too visible to carry around. They would have used easily concealed 9mm hand guns.
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Old 21-04-2013, 03:26
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Officials say decision to release photos of suspects was motivated in part to limit damage done by amateur sleuths on Reddit leading to innocent people being accused.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/...1_story_1.html
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Old 21-04-2013, 03:37
slick1two
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Okay this is interesting so I will put it out there. Ties in with the Mother's claim that The older brother Tamerlan was involved with the fbi for the past 3 or 5 years. What that means exactly we don't know. But here is an article from the NY Times which discusses the FBI setting up terror plots by roping in a potential terrorist except they had not even attempted anything until the fbi had set up the plot. Then nabbing the perpetrator before they have carried out the attack. The author gives many examples of such plots.

Not saying this is what has happened but if the FBI are doing this it does beg the question of how true is the mother's claim regarding Tamerlan's case.

She perhaps is not thinking clearly and trying her best to defend her son or there is something in this which ties in with what is discussed in this article.

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/04/29/op...anted=all&_r=0
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Old 21-04-2013, 06:12
thomas pain
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apparently dzokhar went partying after the bombing. he's a smoker and has a girlfriend. he doesn't have the characteristics of an islamist. his father, mother, friends, class mates are shocked .. they cannot believe he bombed innocent people.
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Old 21-04-2013, 06:46
Gilbertoo
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I am not suggesting anyone has lied. I am not suggesting there is anything sinister here. I am simply stating the evidence (for me anyway) is not so straightforward.

If to have a different opinion makes me a conspiracy theorist....then as I have previously stated...so be it.
Firstly, how many murders are caught on camera or, at the very least, have images of the murderer just before or after they've carried out their crime? Surely it has to be a tiny number, right? Yet somehow, there's enough evidence for a guilty verdict to be given in many of these cases.

Secondly, ever been in a car crash? I have and it's amazing how differently people recall what took place.

Now, remembering these two points, do you think there'll be more evidence other than CCTV and photos available? I do. Do you also think any witness statement taken may contradict other versions of events? I do.
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Old 21-04-2013, 07:14
Thomas007
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apparently dzokhar went partying after the bombing. he's a smoker and has a girlfriend. he doesn't have the characteristics of an islamist. his father, mother, friends, class mates are shocked .. they cannot believe he bombed innocent people.
I would say he was sucked in by the beliefs of his older brother, who was the more "devout muslim" and the kid merely tagged along.
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Old 21-04-2013, 08:34
stoatie
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Do "you people" have this phrase ready to cut and paste into threads?
Has anyone said used "doesn't add up" or "all the hallmarks" yet? I've nearly got a full house.
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Old 21-04-2013, 08:36
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We already know your reasoning is flawed - you're religious.
If that isn't discrimination, I don't know what is. You aren't the arbiter of what is right or wrong, of whether being religious means you cannot reason. It's just another method by which to supersede and dismiss the progress of discussion with respect to either Islam or Muslims in the context of terrorism and generalisations/stereotypes.
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Old 21-04-2013, 08:40
2+2=5
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Unless there's some evidence I haven't seen, Arab Muslims don't appear to be involved in this. Which does make a change from previous attacks if it does turn out to be some form of Islamic terrorist attack. Which I'm still not sure has been formally established by the experts and police investigating the bombing.
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Old 21-04-2013, 08:41
chinchin
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Boston bombers: FBI hunting 12-strong terrorist “sleeper cell” linked to brothers Tamerlan and Dzhokhar Tsarnaev
From the Mirror:

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/world-n...strong-1844844
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Old 21-04-2013, 08:46
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Mr Tsarni said he had last seen his nephews in December 2005.

There had never been any apparent sign of "hatred toward the US" or else he would have turned them over to the police himself, he added.

Asked what he thought provoked the bombings, the uncle said: "Being losers, hatred to those who were able to settle themselves.

"These are the only reasons I can imagine of. Anything else, anything else to do with religion, with Islam, it's a fraud, it's a fake."
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-22219116

I think there is something really important in that. How well does one settle in a country once they move there? The brothers had been in the US for over 10years. Doe the older one just get jealous of not being a part of the American Dream? And his younger brother latched onto it?

It's all guesswork and theory and supposition right now. But their uncle clearly has a few ideas.
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Old 21-04-2013, 08:54
chinchin
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Boston bombers: FBI hunting 12-strong terrorist “sleeper cell” linked to brothers Tamerlan and Dzhokhar Tsarnaev
From the Mirror:

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/world-n...strong-1844844
Latest from Sky News:
Boston Bombing: Suspect Still Unable To Speak



http://news.sky.com/story/1080870/bo...nable-to-speak
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Old 21-04-2013, 08:58
basdfg
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http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-22219116

I think there is something really important in that. How well does one settle in a country once they move there? The brothers had been in the US for over 10years. Doe the older one just get jealous of not being a part of the American Dream? And his younger brother latched onto it?

It's all guesswork and theory and supposition right now. But their uncle clearly has a few ideas.
The youngest one become a citzien only last year. Considering they had green cards they were in no need to do so. I wonder how long they had been planning it. I've got a felling the youngest one wasent involved for too long
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Old 21-04-2013, 09:03
andersonsonson
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Why havent the fbinreleased the cctv of him dropping the bag
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Old 21-04-2013, 09:10
TheToonArmy
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Why havent the fbinreleased the cctv of him dropping the bag
I think it will be released, but not at the moment.

If my son had been killed by one of the bombs I don't think I would like to see a video of the bag being dropped next to him.

Anyway, it's evidence.

In any case, the CT'ers will only say it's fake
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Old 21-04-2013, 09:16
andersonsonson
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I dont think this was a set up however I was waytching 7th july london bombing conspiracy videos yesterday, the ripple effect, and it was interesting to say the least
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Old 21-04-2013, 09:19
Pete Grain
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Just total kudos to all the law enforcement who flooded Watertown and worked so hard to find him. They needed the public to help them, and obviously it was indeed a member of the public who discovered him. Fact is, at least they were there in such numbers, and able to take him into custody alive.

The conspiracy theorists twist it any way an incident plays out. The cops are damned if they act, and damned if they don't - and by default every last incident - be it there or here - is a 'cover up' to mask a different agenda.

Apparently
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Old 21-04-2013, 09:21
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Why havent the fbinreleased the cctv of him dropping the bag
1. there may or may not be CCTV evidence of him actually dropping the bag. It was very crowded where they were standing.

2. They do not have to have evidence of the bag actually being put down. They have clips of him wearing a backpack; they have remnants of the backpack concerned. That will provide evidence of explosives.

3. Evidence is usually held back fro the public in order to present a case in court.

4. Why should they release any evidence/photos just to satisfy public demand. Juries decide not the public.
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Old 21-04-2013, 09:28
stoatie
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Why havent the fbinreleased the cctv of him dropping the bag
Why should they? I assume they will at some point in the future (probably to a TV company for a documentary or something) but what possible reason could there be for releasing it now? They released the other pictures so the public could help track the suspects down... now they've done that, there's really no point.

It may seem like an awesome TV show to a lot of people... but it really isn't, and I doubt the FBI see it that way either. They're not gonna release stuff just because the viewing public would like to see it.
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