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THE PUBLICITY is the PROBLEM with MOFFATS who. |
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#26 |
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Join Date: Jun 2008
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Who is this 'we' you speak of? Also you just admitted you hate the show. Time to stop watching perhaps? I hate Miranda. I don't watch it. Quite simple really.
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#27 |
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Join Date: Sep 2012
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I've seen a preview of the voiceover for the Season 8 trailer....
'Hi. You know Doctor Who? Yeah. That show. Its back again soon. Not sure when. Some stuff will happen. Here's some randomly edited shots of some stuff literally happening. On screen. There's the Doctor. Yep. Same old guy. That's his back there. Oh and there he is talking to someone. No idea who. Anyway. Don't pay too much attention. Its coming back to BBC one. At some point. Not sure when. Check the TV listings. You know what its like. Probably be rubbish. But watch if you want. It keeps Steven Moffat busy when Sherlock isn't being made. Oh look. A shot of a cyberman. They're boring aren't they? But they're back again. Watch it if you want. Or don't. I couldn't care either way. Yes Doctor Who back again. Hooray' Much better. |
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#28 |
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Join Date: Oct 2010
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I thought this was going to be a thread talking about how the BBC seem to have forgot the show is even in the middle of a mini series on the 50th year. Since the show began I don't think I've seen an "advert" for Doctor Who on the beeb. (I know they don't do ads but they normally slap on a plug for the doctor during the week...they only seem concerned about the voice now though)
So yea, not the previews for next week but the lack of promotion outside of the 6-7 slot on a saturday night. |
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#29 |
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Anyway. More on topic. I think most things these days get over hyped. Just the way it is. Look at Hollywood. You have teasers for teasers for web exclusive clips etc etc. It seems to be de rigueur.
I don't think DW has always delivered on the trailers. How could it. Some of the things in the trailers look great but let you down and vice versa. Its always been that way. I remember seeing the clips of the Crouching Tiger dudes in Tooth and Claw and thinking 'blimey!'. The episode was mostly forgettable and the wire work turned out to be embarrassingly amateurish and shoehorned in. But damn it looked sweet in that preview trailer. |
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#30 |
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Join Date: Nov 2012
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For this series the issue to me is that it seems the Dr Who trailers have strayed into "Hollywood movie" territory for some reason.
We watch the trailer (and get all excited) and then when we watch the actual episode we find all the best bits where shown in the trailers, the episode is nothing like they lead us to believe, it's all rushed at the end and we end up coming out of our living rooms,full of overpriced popcorn and blinking in the evening dusk-light, feeling a bit cheated and wondering if the Directors Cut will actually make anymore sense if it comes out. Then maybe that's just me
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#31 |
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Since I thought series 6 was some of the best stuff on TV I've ever seen, I don't think the trailers were a set up for a let down.
And yes- there do seem to be a lot of POSTS about "This episode was crap" etc. when you look at the actual poll results it becomes obvious that it is just a loud minority shouting how crap everything is, when in reality the opinion of each episode is mostly on the good-excellent side. It is fair enough to not like some episodes. No one can possibly like every single thing. The evidence that does exist is from viewing figures and poll results. Both are good and healthy and suggest the conclusion that the series as a whole is still very well loved by people in general. On a Doctor Who forum I'd expect that most poll ratings to rate good or higher. The negative poll ratings and posts are equally as valid as over time they act as a barometer to measure different episodes against each other. I don't think it's about reaching a conclusion as such where you say that this bunch of people are more right than some other bunch of people because they make up the majority. I think all posts and discussions should be taken with a pinch of salt and not be used to reach a consensus conclusion. I think that they should just to be used to compare opinions and inspire discussion and thought. I think it's a mistake to use polls and discussion as evidence to prove that some episode or the series in 'reality' is good or not. I don't think that should be the point. If you like an episode then you like it, if you don't then you don't. A poll or a thread shouldn't change that, as it is just there for interest to see what other people think and inspire discussion. If you look to polls to prove any reality to yourself then all you're doing really is using the opinions of other people to validate your own opinion to yourself. |
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#32 |
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I certainly think they hyped up series 7 too much. Asylum of the Daleks has been the only memorable episode for me to be honest.
I am pretty sure Moffat said Dr Who would take over TV in 2013 and so far we have had a few alright episodes and crap. |
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#33 |
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Join Date: Aug 2005
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The fact is he can't deliver. At least, not often enough for his place as showrunner not to be called into question. Moffat is very good at talking the talk...
Seeing as Caroline Skinner walked out on the show with no explanation, this strongly suggests production issues. |
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#34 |
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Join Date: Apr 2009
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Im fed up of what sound like crucial lines in the post-Christmas trailer, like "Right Clara Oswald, time to find out who you are", which sounded at the time to be quite important, and it ended up being just a finishing line. Or the trailer for Hide, where the Doctor says "I am the Doctor and I am afraid", was really exciting in the trailer, but in the episode its just him trying to convince the creature that he afraid...I just don't want to trust any interesting lines as they end up being let downs.
Oh and episodes are also being too rushed, they need two parters.
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#35 |
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The fact is he can't deliver. At least, not often enough for his place as showrunner not to be called into question. Moffat is very good at talking the talk...
Seeing as Caroline Skinner walked out on the show with no explanation, this strongly suggests production issues. |
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#36 |
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Join Date: Jun 2010
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Well, to be fair I don't think publicity per se is the issue. I mean, of course the show is going to be publicised with teasers, trailers etc
It's more the "this is going to be EPIC and you're going to LOVE it" thing and then it just - isn't and I don't. (well, Ok, occasionally I do. I really liked this week's ep for example). But that road usually just leads to damp squibsville for me - or just plain annoyance. I don't like being told how I'm meant to feel about the lead writer's writing - by the lead writer. Y'know? As in life - always underpromise and overdeliver. Surprising or hidden gems are always so much more satisfying, I find. |
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#37 |
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Join Date: Oct 2009
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The fact is he can't deliver. At least, not often enough for his place as showrunner not to be called into question. Moffat is very good at talking the talk...
Seeing as Caroline Skinner walked out on the show with no explanation, this strongly suggests production issues. There are some that think all this lying is funny, or a clever way to hype up the show. Me, I just think it's pathetic. Fortunately, there are many that see through his bulls*** and are not taken in anymore. Unfortunately, there are still quite a few that are willing to put up with lies that spew out of his mouth. Same goes for the problems in the production team. The people that questioned Moffat, are not longer involved with Doctor Who. Only ones that are left are 'yes' men. |
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#38 |
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Join Date: Sep 2012
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^^ This. Moffat is extremely good at lying his curly head off. Trouble is, it comes back to bite him in the ass when the episodes air.
There are some that think all this lying is funny, or a clever way to hype up the show. Me, I just think it's pathetic. Fortunately, there are many that see through his bulls*** and are not taken in anymore. Unfortunately, there are still quite a few that are willing to put up with lies that spew out of his mouth. Same goes for the problems in the production team. The people that questioned Moffat, are not longer involved with Doctor Who. Only ones that are left are 'yes' men. |
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#39 |
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Now you see. There's constructive criticism and then there are posts such as this... Quote:
^^ This. Moffat is extremely good at lying his curly head off. Trouble is, it comes back to bite him in the ass when the episodes air.
There are some that think all this lying is funny, or a clever way to hype up the show. Me, I just think it's pathetic. Fortunately, there are many that see through his bulls*** and are not taken in anymore. Unfortunately, there are still quite a few that are willing to put up with lies that spew out of his mouth. Same goes for the problems in the production team. The people that questioned Moffat, are not longer involved with Doctor Who. Only ones that are left are 'yes' men. |
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#40 |
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Join Date: Aug 2010
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Oh no Amos....the Trailers we love....the actual show we hate
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#41 |
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Join Date: Sep 2012
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Whatever your views on the show can some people please refrain from this insidious lie about how anyone who actually enjoys the show is somehow deluded and blinkered and its only those that tear it to shreds who have somehow got special access to 'truth' and 'facts'? Its arrogant nonsense.
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#42 |
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Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 1,076
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^^ This. Moffat is extremely good at lying his curly head off. Trouble is, it comes back to bite him in the ass when the episodes air.
There are some that think all this lying is funny, or a clever way to hype up the show. Me, I just think it's pathetic. Fortunately, there are many that see through his bulls*** and are not taken in anymore. Unfortunately, there are still quite a few that are willing to put up with lies that spew out of his mouth. Same goes for the problems in the production team. The people that questioned Moffat, are not longer involved with Doctor Who. Only ones that are left are 'yes' men. You've got to have a certain amount of arrogance to be in the showrunner role - RTD did as well, and it was that in part that got the show back on the road. But I think Moff is less good at the publicity side and overeggs it. Personally, I do find him a bit smug (and did as far back as Coupling, tbh) - but his first episodes for Who were great, and so is Sherlock. I think he's talented but publicity isn't his forte. And poss not showrunning on two major shows. |
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#43 |
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Join Date: Mar 2009
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The best thing about Dr Who, the marketing.
Those "posters" they produce, and as the OP says; the trailers. But take that away and it would still be a disappointing show, currently at least. |
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#44 |
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Join Date: Jul 2009
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Its marketing itself as a soaring, epic, emotional and involving TV experience, but they're delivering, bumbling, rambling comedic banter between the doctor and his companions set against a mildly entertaining backdrop.
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#45 |
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Join Date: Mar 2009
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For this series the issue to me is that it seems the Dr Who trailers have strayed into "Hollywood movie" territory for some reason.
We watch the trailer (and get all excited) and then when we watch the actual episode we find all the best bits where shown in the trailers, the episode is nothing like they lead us to believe, it's all rushed at the end and we end up coming out of our living rooms,full of overpriced popcorn and blinking in the evening dusk-light, feeling a bit cheated and wondering if the Directors Cut will actually make anymore sense if it comes out. Then maybe that's just me ![]() ------------------------------------------------ My feeling is that the show needs to be rebooted as either: a) 90 minute TV movies (6 x year) b) 30 minute serials (20 x year) |
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#46 |
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Join Date: May 2011
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The directors cut is a great idea, "Dr Who Extended"
------------------------------------------------ My feeling is that the show needs to be rebooted as either: a) 90 minute TV movies (6 x year) b) 30 minute serials (20 x year) |
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#47 |
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Join Date: Sep 2012
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That's always the case though. Not every single episode can be as good as each other. people often judge the episodes relative to each other.
On a Doctor Who forum I'd expect that most poll ratings to rate good or higher. The negative poll ratings and posts are equally as valid as over time they act as a barometer to measure different episodes against each other. I don't think it's about reaching a conclusion as such where you say that this bunch of people are more right than some other bunch of people because they make up the majority. I think all posts and discussions should be taken with a pinch of salt and not be used to reach a consensus conclusion. I think that they should just to be used to compare opinions and inspire discussion and thought. I think it's a mistake to use polls and discussion as evidence to prove that some episode or the series in 'reality' is good or not. I don't think that should be the point. If you like an episode then you like it, if you don't then you don't. A poll or a thread shouldn't change that, as it is just there for interest to see what other people think and inspire discussion. If you look to polls to prove any reality to yourself then all you're doing really is using the opinions of other people to validate your own opinion to yourself. I'm saying you can't use that as proof, when in the same thread there is a poll showing the complete opposite. And the ratings for each episode aren't dropping, so the whole country is not switching off. Some people will like an episode and some wont. All that example shows is that the ones that don't like it are currently shouting a lot louder I haven't liked the odd episode here and there, but when that happens I have specific things I didn't like about that particular one. Mostly it's good stuff, which is why I will keep watching. With the ones I didn't like as much, I don't suddenly think that the one or 2 things I didn't like about an episode must therefore equal a huge disaster of a screw up for the Dr Who production team and the BBC as a whole, and every individual involved must be sacked immediately for not living up to my individual expectations. I was talking to a couple of people at work last week. One of them has been a casual-ish viewer and started really getting in to it properly in series 6 because they loved the big story arcs going on (also my favourite series lately). I think their boyfriend is more into it and he's a fan. They think that the writing has gone down hill a bit in series 7, with conclusions that are too easy and not much linking it all together to keep you hooked for the next week. That's fair enough. There were bits they liked about episodes too and they want to keep watching because there is the Clara mystery that's keeping them interested a bit. Another one was saying he'd heard from people that this series was good and was going to start watching with his son, but was worried he couldn't just start because he'd missed a few and wouldn't know what was going on. After talking to the first person I mentioned, he was going to watch because they explained this series was more individual than series 6 had been and you could just pick up anywhere. They said all you need to know is that he met this girl 2 times before and she died then he met her again and is trying to figure her out- that's why she's on the Tardis with him. Everything else is part of the individual episode. So the thing the first person didn't like was perfect for the second to watch with a young son. The one that was a bit turned off now since series 6 actually persuaded the other, making it sound perfect for them. |
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#48 |
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Join Date: Aug 2010
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I think I've pinpointed my disdain for the Moffat era.
Unfulfilled promises. I am of course talking about the publicity engine. Lets take series 6 as an example. An Utterly Epic Trailer. In fact one of the most exciting and amazing Who Trailers we've ever had. That set the bar pretty high. Each episode we get the a little tease of characters and a tease of potentially amazing story lines. When it comes to the mid season reveal, were promised a game changer of a storyline. What we get Falls flat. More trailers promise epic and bold and big and amazing on a huge scale. What we get is a damp, confusing mess of a finale which doesnt work. At the moment it doesnt know what it wants to be. Its marketing itself as a soaring, epic, emotional and involving TV experience, but they're delivering, bumbling, rambling comedic banter between the doctor and his companions set against a mildly entertaining backdrop. Don't get me wrong Humour is good, banter is good. But It just seems confused. Clara has potntial to be an amazing character, but Jenna (whilst she started out strong) comes across as very stage school and overly expressive. She (for me ) doesn't do subtle emotion very well. Take for example saturdays trip through the Tardis when she kept being led back to the control room. Her over the top, expressive frustration wouldn't be out of place in an oliver twist musical on the stage. It was too much The run time also seems to keep everything moving along far to quickly for these types of episodes. Fine if you want to be Bold and big with the story but give it room to breath. HIDE was a masterclass in Dr Who episode storytelling. Best episode since season 4 for me. Because it knew exactly how to play the entire story, didnt confuse the genres and delivered on all its promises. Im willing and hoping and praying this massive Season Finale were promised delivers the goods. The stuff about S7 , I can't agree with much. I think Clara is a delight and am enjoying her story line more than any other recent compistant. The stories have had excellent, good, good, good, good, excellent, excellent, average, good, excellent (twice if could!) excellent from me and I have never marked a series so consistently high before. Can't explain why and what the sudden improvement in the programme is down to. Matt Smith, though, is probably a lot to do with it. I just think he is The Doctor, and when a Doctor is this good it takes a lot for me not to like Who Finally, as a piece of poetry, your post is a bit lacking. It doesn't scan well, feels a bit pinched in places and tries to cram too many of the same sentiments into lines that rambled a bit compared to others. Perhaps it could be a bit more punchy? P.S. Hide was top, top stuff wasn't it? |
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#49 |
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Join Date: Jul 2011
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Feels like the OP is a throwback to a gentler time before exaggeration became de rigeur. It's like a complaint that Utterly Butterly tastes nothing like real butter. Trailers are marketing and... The Marketer lies. (Blimey, there a sh1t new timelord for you right there).
How about you don't watch the trailers? I hate the "coming up next" bit in Who anyway - I'm a fan, I'm going to watch next week, regardless. One of my best moments this (half) season was when the chap in the haunted house turned round... and it was Dougray Scott! Wow! Now I wouldn't have got that feeling if I'd been trailered and spoilered up to my eyeballs. If the publicity is affecting your enjoyment of the show, there's a pretty easy answer. |
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