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Old 12-05-2013, 10:13
John259
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The most obvious being the inability to run most software available on the market.
Agreed, Chromebooks can't Windows EXE programs and for some users (but not everyone) that would be a very significant disadvantage. However, the same restriction applies to tablets (except the Surface Pro) and with Apple computers and Linux emulators are required.

As has already been said in this thread, potential purchasers of Chromebooks need to understand exactly what these devices can do and what they can't do, and then decide if they are suitable for their requirements or not.
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Old 12-05-2013, 10:27
Diane
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I don't need it to run any software I have an i7 Dell laptop for that! I just want something that is portable and that I can type on when away from home, and my samsung series 3 chromebook fits the bill perfectly.
Same with me, have a decent desktop pc at home to fulfll my needs, just wanted something light with a keyboard to use to browse the web away from home in all those lovely free wifi hotspots and from reading everyone's commenys this fits the bill perfectly.

Off to get mine tomorrow , will report back in a month or so as to what I think.

Thanks for everyone's help.
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Old 12-05-2013, 10:35
alanwarwic
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............Chromebooks are for users who aren't computer savvy and can't protect themselves from malware, avoid phishing etc?
A bit of each. At the moment, all the happy buyers will be savvy enough to actually buy it in the first place.

There is also the long term problem of popular web sites being encouraged to move off the web.
If no one actually competes on the web then we all have to head to Sky subscription like territory.

With Chromebooks I don't quite trust Google here. The web relies on services being non platform dependent.
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Old 12-05-2013, 10:51
rosetech
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There is also the long term problem of popular web sites being encouraged to move off the web.
If no one actually competes on the web then we all have to head to Sky subscription like territory.

With Chromebooks I don't quite trust Google here. The web relies on services being non platform dependent.
I dont follow your first comment re SKY, but Google Chrome apps are HTML5 based.
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Old 12-05-2013, 10:52
John259
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With Chromebooks I don't quite trust Google here. The web relies on services being non platform dependent.
IMHO that is a valid concern but AFAIK at the moment Chromebooks can access non-Google services, and all Google's services can be accessed from non-Google browsers. The danger of course is Google might in the future make it an Apple/Android/Metro-like walled garden, especially if the Chrome OS is merged with Android.
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Old 12-05-2013, 11:40
rosetech
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IMHO that is a valid concern but AFAIK at the moment Chromebooks can access non-Google services, and all Google's services can be accessed from non-Google browsers. The danger of course is Google might in the future make it an Apple/Android/Metro-like walled garden, especially if the Chrome OS is merged with Android.
Unlike the other systems mentioned Chrome OS is open source - its actually just a layer on top of Linux, so little chance of that happening.
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Old 12-05-2013, 11:45
TheBigM
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Agreed, Chromebooks can't Windows EXE programs and for some users (but not everyone) that would be a very significant disadvantage. However, the same restriction applies to tablets (except the Surface Pro) and with Apple computers and Linux emulators are required.

As has already been said in this thread, potential purchasers of Chromebooks need to understand exactly what these devices can do and what they can't do, and then decide if they are suitable for their requirements or not.
The argument is that for not much more money, you can have a laptop that isn't limited.

You can still buy netbooks at the price of Chromebooks too and even these are more capable than a chromebook.
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Old 12-05-2013, 11:51
John259
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The argument is that for not much more money, you can have a laptop that isn't limited.
Sure. However, for some people the simplicity of usage of Chromebooks compared to that of conventional computers is a significant factor. Bear in mind that we know live in a world where a lot of customers are saying "anything except Windows 8". Those who don't want a keyboard are turning to tablets, some of those who do want a keyboard are turning to Chromebooks.
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Old 12-05-2013, 12:11
TheBigM
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Sure. However, for some people the simplicity of usage of Chromebooks compared to that of conventional computers is a significant factor. Bear in mind that we know live in a world where a lot of customers are saying "anything except Windows 8". Those who don't want a keyboard are turning to tablets, some of those who do want a keyboard are turning to Chromebooks.
The ones who are saying no to Windows 8 are the more advanced users, those would crave power and flexibility over simplicity.

For those who want simplicity, you have metro-land in windows 8. Plus, the desktop and the rest for those moments when simplicity isn't enough.

Metro-land is pretty secure. PCs can auto-update just like Chrome OS. And chromebooks use pretty weak hardware. When you want to run a "heavy" website or flash etc the power on tap in a cheap laptop (core i3) is much nicer.

The niche for a chromebook is tiny, proven by the fact that all chromebooks put together have been outsold by the Surface RT.
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Old 12-05-2013, 12:35
John259
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The ones who are saying no to Windows 8 are the more advanced users
That's not the impression I get on this forum and elsewhere. Experts who have the confidence and desire to explore and experiment tend to favour W8, while users who lurch from one computer disaster to the next tend to hate it.
For those who want simplicity, you have metro-land in windows 8.
Metro isn't simple. It looks childish, but because of the lack of visual clues and the random distribution of functions, finding options beyond launching apps is difficult and using those options is awkward.
PCs can auto-update just like Chrome OS.
Windows can auto-update. Firefox and Chrome updating is simple, but add-ons can be tricky and most other software needs manual updating.
The niche for a chromebook is tiny, proven by the fact that all chromebooks put together have been outsold by the Surface RT.
Can't argue with that.
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Old 12-05-2013, 12:47
rosetech
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The niche for a chromebook is tiny, proven by the fact that all chromebooks put together have been outsold by the Surface RT.
The crucial point for me would be why buy new hardware when you can load Chrome onto old hardware?

RT is based on Windows so you would expect better sales figures. Chrome is a new operating system so sales would understandably be slow to begin with. Looking at the two markets I think you will see different trajectories for each.
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Old 12-05-2013, 12:56
paulbrock
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Only thing stopping me getting a Chromebook is the inability to edit RAW-format photographs. Everything else would be fine for me. On my windows PC I have installed a few games and photo editing software. That's it.
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Old 12-05-2013, 13:59
TheBigM
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The crucial point for me would be why buy new hardware when you can load Chrome onto old hardware?

RT is based on Windows so you would expect better sales figures. Chrome is a new operating system so sales would understandably be slow to begin with. Looking at the two markets I think you will see different trajectories for each.
RT is a new operating system - it has a completely new runtime, runs on a new architecture and, with the exception of Office, only runs new applications.

There is not much "Windows" pull to it apart from the fact it is still a proper desktop-class OS with networking, file system etc.

Both OSes have a heavyweight tech company behind them.

With a separate process for every tab, Chrome is designed to soak up hardware resources, hardware that is much more limited than on a Windows PC.

I generally wouldn't buy a Surface RT but given the choice between a Chromebook and a Surface with Type Cover, I would pick the Surface.
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Old 12-05-2013, 14:03
TheBigM
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The hardware on the chromebook seems weaker than on a £179 netbook.

The netbook has the Intel Atom, the chromebook has the celeron.

The chromebook is £300 from PC World, the netbook is £180 from PC World.

http://cpuboss.com/cpus/Intel-Celero...tel-Atom-N2600
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Old 12-05-2013, 14:13
John259
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The hardware on the chromebook seems weaker than on a £179 netbook.

The netbook has the Intel Atom, the chromebook has the celeron.

The chromebook is £300 from PC World, the netbook is £180 from PC World.

http://cpuboss.com/cpus/Intel-Celero...tel-Atom-N2600
The new Samsung Chromebook has a Samsung Exynos processor which is an ARM-based system on a chip (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Exynos_...tem_on_chip%29). It's £229 on Amazon and PC World. There's also a £199 Acer model. Amazon have the old Samsung model for £240. PC World also have a new HP model for £250.
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Old 12-05-2013, 14:29
PPhilster
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I don't need it to run any software I have an i7 Dell laptop for that! I just want something that is portable and that I can type on when away from home, and my samsung series 3 chromebook fits the bill perfectly.
I was answering someone else but seeing that you also have a normal PC my comment doesn't apply to you.
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Old 12-05-2013, 14:36
PPhilster
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Agreed, Chromebooks can't Windows EXE programs and for some users (but not everyone) that would be a very significant disadvantage. However, the same restriction applies to tablets (except the Surface Pro) and with Apple computers and Linux emulators are required..
I wasn't comparing Chromebooks to tablets. Tablets are not pretending to be PC or Mac replacements.

Comparing Macs to Chromebooks is also ridiculous, especially when Macs can run Windows.


As has already been said in this thread, potential purchasers of Chromebooks need to understand exactly what these devices can do and what they can't do, and then decide if they are suitable for their requirements or not.
And that is why I have shared my opinion on their very obvious limitation.
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Old 12-05-2013, 14:50
rosetech
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RT is a new operating system - it has a completely new runtime, runs on a new architecture and, with the exception of Office, only runs new applications.

There is not much "Windows" pull to it apart from the fact it is still a proper desktop-class OS with networking, file system etc.

Both OSes have a heavyweight tech company behind them.

With a separate process for every tab, Chrome is designed to soak up hardware resources, hardware that is much more limited than on a Windows PC.

I generally wouldn't buy a Surface RT but given the choice between a Chromebook and a Surface with Type Cover, I would pick the Surface.
My point is it is marketed as Window RT not simply RT - a standalone operating system with nothing whatsoever to do with MS Windows

Chrome is actually very efficient - the fact it uses a separate process for management events is a good thing and takes its lead from the underlying Linux foundation.
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Old 13-05-2013, 12:49
alanwarwic
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My point is it is marketed as Window RT not simply RT - a standalone operating system with nothing whatsoever to do with MS Windows
Chrome is actually very efficient - the fact it uses a separate process for management events is a good thing and takes its lead from the underlying Linux foundation.
Windows RT is essentially Microsoft's competitor to IOS.
And the light version of Office supplied is for non business use only.

You could argue that if supplied as a laptop it could actually surpass the abilities of Chromebook.
Essentially Chromebook, IOS and RT are 'walled garden systems'. User lockout means they all need less upkeep.
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Old 13-05-2013, 12:57
John259
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Essentially Chromebook, IOS and RT are 'walled garden systems'. User lockout means they all need less upkeep.
I don't think the Chromebook qualifies as a walled garden system, although I guess it has the capability to become one and Google might well do that if they perceive a commercial advantage to it.

As it stands AFAIK (put me right please if I'm wrong) a Chromebook can access any cloud service including Microsoft's SkyDrive and their cloud version of MS Office, and you're free to visit any web site. I'm not too sure about Chromebooks allowing Java and Adobe Flash Player though.

I agree that Android, iOS and RT are walled gardens, although in the case of Android that sub-divides into various separate app stores run by Google, Amazon, etc.
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Old 14-05-2013, 01:12
cnbcwatcher
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In my opinion Chrome laptops are a waste of money. For just a bit more you can get a Windows laptop that can actually run most of the software in existence, unlike what the crippled Chrome laptops allow.
I agree Chromebooks are limited but they do have their uses. They would be handy for carrying out and about or for having in the house for guests and visitors to use as you wouldn't have to worry about them reading your files I reckon hotels should rent them out to guests.
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Old 15-05-2013, 17:45
alanwarwic
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....and you're free to visit any web site. I'm not too sure about Chromebooks allowing Java and Adobe Flash Player though.
I agree that Android, iOS and RT are walled gardens, although in the case of Android that sub-divides into various separate app stores run by Google, Amazon, etc.
I'm not sure how you get to class Android as a walled garden.
Alternative stores, alternative Android systems and sideloading apps mean it is a classic OS system.

IOS removes desktop mode to promote apps and also hide the dreaded ' this website requires Flash' message.
Getting sent to the mobile web is only a small part of the walled garden experience.

Chrome OS is certainly walled garden, far more so than IOS
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Old 15-05-2013, 17:54
John259
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I'm not sure how you get to class Android as a walled garden.
Because it ties the purchaser of a device to a specific app store. Experts can defeat that, but not normal users.
Chrome OS is certainly walled garden
Only in the sense that it doesn't let the user download and install conventional programs. Within the web browser you can do pretty much whatever you wish.
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Old 15-05-2013, 19:39
alan1302
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Because it ties the purchaser of a device to a specific app store. Experts can defeat that, but not normal users.
No, it doesn't at all.

Obviously Google want you to use the Play Store but Amazon will let you install their app store and there are plenty of other choice for experts and non-experts alike.
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Old 15-05-2013, 21:57
alanwarwic
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Because it ties the purchaser of a device to a specific app store. Experts can defeat that, but not normal users.
Experts? Some will say that about drag and drop soon too I'm sure.

There is a settings tick box to allow in non market apps, which in themselves can install another market.
Then you can also visit a developers web site and install from there.
The original walled garden was cloud services(remember AOL?). Apple brought the hardware walled garden into fruition.

Talking of the walled garden web, will IOS 7 bring in Apple's commitment to Webgl in HTML 5?
Seemingly it is only RT and IOS that do not allow it for interactive web and 3D. It is also needed if web development is not to get too frozen in time. Of course, not allowing a 'desktop web' as default in mobile Safari is part of that web freeze.
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