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Any of these cheap plasmas any good?


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Old 26-05-2013, 10:49
davidge62
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Can anyone tell me which of these 4 are the best - and if any are worth buying? Thanks.

Samsung PS43E450A1WXXU
LG 42PA4500
Panasonic TX-P42X60
Samsung PS43F4500AWXXU
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Old 26-05-2013, 11:35
poppasmurf
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I wouldn't describe any of those makes you mention as being 'cheap'.

Cheap are the own branded rubbish you find in Tesco and other stores under names you've never heard of like Watsatui or Fairhaven (names I've just made up).
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Old 26-05-2013, 12:07
mac2708
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It looks like the Panasonic TX-P42X60 and Samsung PS43F4500AWXXU have FreeviewHD tuners and the other two don't.
The Panasonic appears to be more economical to run and also has a USB socket for playing back media files from a USB device. File support is listed as AVCHD, AVI, MKV and MP4, ASF, FLV, 3GPP, PS, MOV and TS containers

So, of the four the Panasonic would be my (personal) choice but only you know what you want.
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Old 26-05-2013, 13:37
davidge62
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Many thanks for the advice.

I am leaning towards the Panasonic.
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Old 27-05-2013, 00:25
jjne
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There are a lot of 1024x768 plasmas around at the moment at very cheap prices.

These are old stock, and to be honest I'd have no problem whatsoever in buying one of them.

50" examples have been selling for as little as 350 from all three of the major plasma manufacturers.

Plasma panels IMO are more reliable than LCDs (and the PSUs tend to be more rugged as a result of the higher current requirements). They use more juice, but you pay your money and make your choice really. I certainly wouldn't be unduly concerned about reliability -- they'll certainly all be more likely to last than a cheap LCD set from an unknown manufacturer (or a known one that uses Vestel, UMC or the like).
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Old 27-05-2013, 10:34
Nigel Goodwin
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Plasma panels IMO are more reliable than LCDs (and the PSUs tend to be more rugged as a result of the higher current requirements).
Quite the opposite, their higher power consumption and higher running temperatures mean they are less reliable. However, the fact there's hardly any companies making Plasma these days means you've only got the choice of a top make (Panasonic) and two middling makes (LG/Samsung). So you can't buy cheap crap make Plasma sets, so don't have the huge amount of cheap crappy ones out there as you do with LCD's.

Back when Vestel made (and badged) Plasma sets, they had similar (or slightly poorer) reliability to their LCD sets.

However, if you're going to buy one of these cheap Plasmas (I can't comment on the more expensive ones) make sure you compare it on both SD and HD to similar priced LCD sets. In my experience (with my own Plasma, customers sets, and sets in the shop) HD on HD Ready Plasma sets is exceedingly poor, and not worth watching over SD.

Although I have a Freeview HD box connected via HDMI to mine I almost never use it, preferring to watch via Sky+ in SD.

So ask to see the sets, side by side, on both SD and HD - bearing in mind that at your home, and not in direct comparison, it won't look as bad.
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Old 27-05-2013, 10:55
noise747
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My Philips plasma is 5 years old, in fact it could be over 5 years old by now and is still working fine. It uses a bit more power than newer plasmas i must admit, but not enough to think about getting a new TV.

I prefer plasmas
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Old 27-05-2013, 22:05
iangrad
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Any TV with a 1024 x 768 panel is odd to watch as that very old computer panel resolution means that the image has to be scaled to fit , this results in dots on the picture particularly in areas of black & red . At first glance you don't see it but after a few mins its very noticable , If you are viewing from a huge distance away you wont see it -- but then you should have got a larger screen .

No need to buy old technology duds like this as good kit is not expensive these days .
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Old 27-05-2013, 22:44
noise747
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What are you saying is old technology, plasma or the fact that some only go to 720?

Mine is full HD by the way.
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Old 28-05-2013, 09:01
Nigel Goodwin
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What are you saying is old technology, plasma or the fact that some only go to 720?
Hardly any sets were ever made that only went to 720, they were really pretty rare.
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Old 28-05-2013, 11:45
jjne
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Quite the opposite, their higher power consumption and higher running temperatures mean they are less reliable.
I see. Does that mean that CRTs, with their higher power consumption and higher running temperatures are "less reliable" than LCDs as well?

You yourself have commented in the past about the fact that Samsung plasma TVs don't have the same capacitor plague problems that beset their LCD sets of 5 or 6 years ago.

LCD panels, especially on the newer, thinner sets are beset with tab problems in particular. To the point where I wouldn't have one unless it was cheap -- it just isn't worth investing a lot of money in a technology that routinely expires after three or four years (regardless of manufacturer).

However, the fact there's hardly any companies making Plasma these days means you've only got the choice of a top make (Panasonic) and two middling makes (LG/Samsung).
Why do I get the impression that this wouldn't be a problem for you if Sony were making plasma TVs? The fact is that three of the four most prominent manufacturers of TVs make plasmas.

However, if you're going to buy one of these cheap Plasmas (I can't comment on the more expensive ones) make sure you compare it on both SD and HD to similar priced LCD sets. In my experience (with my own Plasma, customers sets, and sets in the shop) HD on HD Ready Plasma sets is exceedingly poor, and not worth watching over SD.
Conversely, SD picture quality on many of the LCD sets (and I include Sony in this; their newer TVs have sunk like a stone in this area and I wouldn't have one as a result) is borderline unwatchable -- a problem that typically does not afflict the plasma sets. Horses for courses.
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Old 28-05-2013, 12:46
Nigel Goodwin
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I see. Does that mean that CRTs, with their higher power consumption and higher running temperatures are "less reliable" than LCDs as well?
Certainly so - statistically LCD sets are considerably more reliable than CRT's were.

However, the running temperatures of CRT sets weren't as high as early Plasma sets.


You yourself have commented in the past about the fact that Samsung plasma TVs don't have the same capacitor plague problems that beset their LCD sets of 5 or 6 years ago.
Presumably they fitted better capacitors in the Plasma's?.


LCD panels, especially on the newer, thinner sets are beset with tab problems in particular. To the point where I wouldn't have one unless it was cheap -- it just isn't worth investing a lot of money in a technology that routinely expires after three or four years (regardless of manufacturer).
It happens in a small number of cases, just as CRT faults happened on CRT sets.


Why do I get the impression that this wouldn't be a problem for you if Sony were making plasma TVs? The fact is that three of the four most prominent manufacturers of TVs make plasmas.
What 'problem'? - I simply posted the facts. HD Ready Plasma sets are crap on HD

The Sony HD Ready Plasma's were just as crap on HD as everyone else's - and of course they dropped Plasma long before Full HD ones became possible.


Conversely, SD picture quality on many of the LCD sets (and I include Sony in this; their newer TVs have sunk like a stone in this area and I wouldn't have one as a result) is borderline unwatchable -- a problem that typically does not afflict the plasma sets. Horses for courses.
I don't know where you have been looking?, Sony LCD sets (and many others) look pretty damn good on SD programming, and I've not noticed any deterioration on the newer sets (and I installed two this morning).

If a Plasma is as good as an LCD on HD, then it's also going to suffer from poorer SD pictures, for EXACTLY the same reason. HD Ready Plasma's seem better on SD simply because they have far less sharpness to their picture (they blur the edges of the artefacts together, making them less visible), and that's why they are crap on HD.
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Old 28-05-2013, 14:04
d'@ve
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In my experience (with my own Plasma, customers sets, and sets in the shop) HD on HD Ready Plasma sets is exceedingly poor, and not worth watching over SD.
Utter nonsense - and I have an HD ready plasma, full HD LCD and a full HD computer monitor with satellite HD TV tuner card.

My 5 year old 42 inch 1024 x 768 panasonic plasma produces a far better picture than any SD TV that I've ever seen, even the visible dots if I sit on the floor to get within 8 feet of it are not displeasing, and at most people's typical living room viewing distance (9 - 12 feet) they aren't even noticeable.

1024 pixels horizontal resolution is 42% to 45% greater than most SD channels (and 88% greater than some SD channels). Vertical resolution is 41% greater than SD channels. HD compression artifacts are essentially invisible on HD material viewed on a good HD ready plasma TV. Temporal resolution is exactly the same as full HD and in that respect, 720p/50 would be better if they ever bothered.

The overall effect when viewing HD material on say a 42 inch good quality HD ready plasma viewed from a typical living room distance is of watching a picture far superior to pretty well anything anyone has ever viewed on an SD TV, professional equipment included.

Your "not worth watching over SD" assertion is misleading, even when you take value for money out of the equation. In value for money terms, a 350 - 400 HD ready Panasonic (say) 42 or 50 inch plasma set is pretty well unbeatable in your average living room. I might even get one as a second set, at half the price of my 5 year old "bargain price" one!
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Old 28-05-2013, 16:04
Deacon1972
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What 'problem'? - I simply posted the facts. HD Ready Plasma sets are crap on HD.
Wow, that's a bold statement.

What facts, all I can see is an opinion, a poor one at that.
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Old 28-05-2013, 17:22
Nigel Goodwin
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Wow, that's a bold statement.

What facts, all I can see is an opinion, a poor one at that.
Just try them and see, next to an LCD set - new Panasonic and Samsung HD Ready Plasma's seem just as poor as the old ones were (we've just taken a Panasonic one off display as it looked so poor in comparison).
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Old 28-05-2013, 19:51
Deacon1972
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Just try them and see, next to an LCD set - new Panasonic and Samsung HD Ready Plasma's seem just as poor as the old ones were (we've just taken a Panasonic one off display as it looked so poor in comparison).
So you were referring to two HD ready plasmas you had in your shop, I see, for one minute I thought you were referring to every HD ready plasma when you said " HD Ready Plasma sets are crap on HD".

I'd say it was personal choice to which picture looks the best on each technology. If I was asked for my preference I'd say plasma as it produces a more natural picture, I have LCD, but for me the picture looks overly processed and unnatural, that's not saying it's crap, just that my preference leans towards plasma. I also have DLP which I prefer over plasma and LCD because it gives the better cinematic picture.
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Old 29-05-2013, 04:26
hardylane
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I have a older Pioneer PDP-505 that has a native pixel size of 1280 x 768. It is absolutely stunning in 1080i, and outperforms many current screens, IMHO... making blanket statements about "HD Ready being crap in HD" is not only a gross generalisation, it's inaccurate.

See the screen you are considering with an HD and, if possible, SD source connected. Let your eyes decide.

Bargains are out there to be had, especially if will be watching lots of SKY+HD, as opposed to Blurays
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Old 29-05-2013, 09:19
Nigel Goodwin
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So you were referring to two HD ready plasmas you had in your shop, I see, for one minute I thought you were referring to every HD ready plasma when you said " HD Ready Plasma sets are crap on HD".
I was referring to EVERY HD Ready Plasma I've seen, which is a fairly considerable number, but specifically to current Panasonic and Samsung sets - I haven't seen a current LG HD Ready Plasma, so can't comment on them (but as the 'lack' is because it's a Plasma, then they aren't likely to be any different).

The cheapest crappiest supermarket HD Ready LCD are stunning on HD, so why aren't HD Ready Plasma's?.
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Old 29-05-2013, 12:11
noise747
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Hardly any sets were ever made that only went to 720, they were really pretty rare.
768? sorry, I missed that. Oh no, I would not like that.

Next set is still certainly going to be a plasma if I can still get one.
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Old 29-05-2013, 12:14
noise747
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I was referring to EVERY HD Ready Plasma I've seen, which is a fairly considerable number, but specifically to current Panasonic and Samsung sets - I haven't seen a current LG HD Ready Plasma, so can't comment on them (but as the 'lack' is because it's a Plasma, then they aren't likely to be any different).

The cheapest crappiest supermarket HD Ready LCD are stunning on HD, so why aren't HD Ready Plasma's?.

i presume when you say HD ready, you don't mean full Hd?

The Hd on my plasma is great, even if it is getting on now, oh and it is easier to clean than most LCD/LEd sets as it have glass on the front.
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Old 29-05-2013, 13:00
Nigel Goodwin
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i presume when you say HD ready, you don't mean full Hd?
No, of course not - HD Ready LCD's are absolutely stunning on HD, HD Ready Plasma sets are rubbish on HD - for 'hardylane' the absolute worst ones I've seen have been old Pioneer ones, there's a fair few media box Pioneers around.
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Old 29-05-2013, 15:36
noise747
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No, of course not - HD Ready LCD's are absolutely stunning on HD, HD Ready Plasma sets are rubbish on HD - for 'hardylane' the absolute worst ones I've seen have been old Pioneer ones, there's a fair few media box Pioneers around.
I have never seen a HD ready plasma in operation, so i would not know, but I would not buy one anyway, or a HD ready LCD. no point as i watch Blue-rays, i may as well what them to their full quality.
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Old 29-05-2013, 20:22
Deacon1972
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I was referring to EVERY HD Ready Plasma I've seen, which is a fairly considerable number, but specifically to current Panasonic and Samsung sets - I haven't seen a current LG HD Ready Plasma, so can't comment on them (but as the 'lack' is because it's a Plasma, then they aren't likely to be any different).

The cheapest crappiest supermarket HD Ready LCD are stunning on HD, so why aren't HD Ready Plasma's?.
I'll say again, a bold statement, in fact it's absurd.
No, of course not - HD Ready LCD's are absolutely stunning on HD, HD Ready Plasma sets are rubbish on HD - for 'hardylane' the absolute worst ones I've seen have been old Pioneer ones, there's a fair few media box Pioneers around.
Considering Pioneers are still the reference TV of today, HD ready included, is why what you say should be taken with a pinch of salt.
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Old 29-05-2013, 22:24
iangrad
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I think we are all missing the point that most of the "old" plasma TV's that we are reminiscing about having good pictures were a built and designed to be the very best in terms of TV screen drive ( think graphics card for your tv ) . Also most of these old TV's were 1366 x 768 resolution IE 16 x 9 not the 4 x 3 1024 768 which can never match any normal transmission even with scaling .

Most low end to mid range TV's have been hugely down graded in the past few years and a lot are just junk by comparison to hi end models designed just to be sold to gullible price only buyers .
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Old 29-05-2013, 23:59
hardylane
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I'll say again, a bold statement, in fact it's absurd.


Considering Pioneers are still the reference TV of today, HD ready included, is why what you say should be taken with a pinch of salt.
...or perhaps a great dollop of bullcrap....
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