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UEFA Champions League on TV
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PaulLFC
05-11-2013
Originally Posted by THOMO:
“The problem with BT Sport is that they don't have any red button service at present, if they win a say all of Tuesday or Wednesday evenings matches, are BT Sport going to introduce a red button service?
Ian.”

I would imagine if BT do bid for the 'all other games' packages they'll just show the "extra" games online, and the 2 or 3 best per day over their channels. The rights document is very keen to stress that the rights are "platform neutral" so I think this would be easiest for BT until their interactive Youview service is up and running.

I wonder if they'll even bid though. They may just concentrate their money on first and second picks.
Dansky+HD
05-11-2013
Originally Posted by Paul_Crawford:
“Yes but there are highlights on MOTD, if ITV get nothing, how will millions of people without BT/SKY going to see any action?

I doubt they will tune into 5live/talkSPORT instead.”

"Pick"

Possible?
Paul_Crawford
05-11-2013
Jake Humphreys is awful they defo need someone else if they win.

For me the best CL TV Presenter was Bob Wilson, top quality!!
PaulLFC
05-11-2013
Originally Posted by Mark.:
“I'd say the bigger problem with BT Sport is that their presentation is god-awful.

Both Setanta and ESPN I'd have been happy to see take some CL rights, because they did things properly. But I don't think I could stomach Jake Humphrey, his cronies and the overall "BT is way cool" attitude for such a prestigious tournament.”

Setanta wasn't even in HD! It's possible (although I think unlikely) that James Richardson could present BT's coverage should they win rights anyway, since they're European games. I'd be very happy if that was the case.
THOMO
05-11-2013
Originally Posted by Dansky+HD:
“"Pick"

Possible?”

Oh dear me!! Not Pick TV again!!
Ian.
Mark.
05-11-2013
Originally Posted by Dansky+HD:
“"Pick"

Possible?”

Head, wall; wall, head.

Originally Posted by PaulLFC:
“Setanta wasn't even in HD! It's possible (although I think unlikely) that James Richardson could present their coverage should they win rights anyway, since they're European games. I'd be very happy if that was the case.”

I know Setanta wasn't in HD, but I'm talking about the overall presentation style.

There's absolutely no way BT would use anyone other than Jake Humphrey to present the games, unless he's replaced as main presenter.
PaulLFC
05-11-2013
Originally Posted by Mark.:
“There's absolutely no way BT would use anyone other than Jake Humphrey to present the games, unless he's replaced as main presenter.”

Very likely true. Although should they win some rights on both nights I think they may end up using more than one presenter.
Belligerence
05-11-2013
Originally Posted by Steve Williams:
“This is the thing, I think, I know it's going a long way back but ITV Digital had Champions League rights and it didn't do much for them. Different era, I know, and the fact they weren't on the Sky platform was a massive factor, but in terms of week in week out action, I don't know if it's such a massive driver of subscriptions.”

On Digital had that 'Champions on 99' channel, didn't they? Not sure if that channel was exclusive to CL football or not; if it was the former I could see why it flopped.

Originally Posted by popeye13:
“The Premier League doesn't get hurt by being only on pay-tv, that gets the headlines, so there is nothing to stop UCL having the same effect....”

True, but different scenarios. A generation of football fans have not seen top-flight football live on the main channels. That isn't the case with the Champions League, a competition more aligned with certain viewers.

I guess the media would act shock if CL football was taken away from ITV, rightly so because the public have been accustomed to it for more than two decades. The European Cup has gone from the nation cheering one, or two English representatives to a competition only interested in preserving the hegemony. The average viewer has become less insular and more knowledgable about the European teams.

The idea of needing a satellite and decoder to watch Premier League football did come as a shock for some, like Alex Ferguson. In hindsight, the 'blow' was only softened as the BBC were awarded the highlights package.
jda135
05-11-2013
Originally Posted by popeye13:
“The Premier League doesn't get hurt by being only on pay-tv, that gets the headlines, so there is nothing to stop UCL having the same effect....”

No Premier League match has ever got 9m overnight though has it?! The Man Utd v Real Madrid match on ITV got that earlier this year.

It will be a shame if ITV lose the rights. There coverage might not be the best, but at least they show a match that everyone can watch for free. ITV's association with the Champions League stretches back 21 years (a hell of a long time for a consecutive sports rights contract) and they have brought the wider audiences many big moments over that time.

Whilst the status quo being kept is looking increasingly unlikely, I feel Sky will do a good job if they get the full lot. Their coverage is professional and slick and since they got the Champions League rights back in 2003, they have always made it feel special.

BT's legacy may turn out to be a negative one if the CL stays off free-tv for the foreseeable future. What they have managed to achieve since they turned up on the scene is to dilute the market to the point of saturation. 38 PL matches per season is not worth £246m per season, they have massively overpaid for something that has added very little overall value to the company. BT Sport may do quite a bit of damage to the free-tv sports scene over the next few years. Shame really.
PaulLFC
05-11-2013
Originally Posted by jda135:
“BT's legacy may turn out to be a negative one if the CL stays off free-tv for the foreseeable future. What they have managed to achieve since they turned up on the scene is to dilute the market to the point of saturation. 38 PL matches per season is not worth £246m per season, they have massively overpaid for something that has added very little overall value to the company. BT Sport may do quite a bit of damage to the free-tv sports scene over the next few years. Shame really.”

If it wasn't BT it would be another broadcaster. Sky can't show all Premier League matches so there will always be competition that will want other rights to go with their Premier League matches.
THOMO
05-11-2013
Originally Posted by jda135:
“No Premier League match has ever got 9m overnight though has it?! The Man Utd v Real Madrid match on ITV got that earlier this year.

It will be a shame if ITV lose the rights. There coverage might not be the best, but at least they show a match that everyone can watch for free. ITV's association with the Champions League stretches back 21 years (a hell of a long time for a consecutive sports rights contract) and they have brought the wider audiences many big moments over that time.

Whilst the status quo being kept is looking increasingly unlikely, I feel Sky will do a good job if they get the full lot. Their coverage is professional and slick and since they got the Champions League rights back in 2003, they have always made it feel special.

BT's legacy may turn out to be a negative one if the CL stays off free-tv for the foreseeable future. What they have managed to achieve since they turned up on the scene is to dilute the market to the point of saturation. 38 PL matches per season is not worth £246m per season, they have massively overpaid for something that has added very little overall value to the company. BT Sport may do quite a bit of damage to the free-tv sports scene over the next few years. Shame really.”

Personally I would like to see BBC TV have a Champions League Match instead of ITV, but the costs would be to high for the BBC to pay and I do have Sky Sports and BT Sport.
Ian.
Gray77
05-11-2013
Originally Posted by popeye13:
“The Premier League doesn't get hurt by being only on pay-tv, that gets the headlines, so there is nothing to stop UCL having the same effect....”

The Premier League has TWENTY teams and exists over THIRTY EIGHT rounds of games. It is ever present and is the national top flight league so of course it 'gets the headlines'. But, alot more people can actually go to games live every weekend than can do the same in the CL with only 4 (or less) domestic sides involved.

And the Premier League would be nowhere near its current level of 'non football fan' interest where it not for MOTD being available to everyone every weekend. 4 million people watch MOTD which is well over twice as many as the average Sky live game. Take away the free highlights and the Premier League would become a niche competition that everyone knew about but half the people could not see.

Of course the CL games would make headlines the day after in the papers and football fans would make an effort to catch games down the pub or at mates houses if they didn't have Pay TV. But, how many half-hearted fans would make the effort? How many people would just stop bothering?

It's not a big deal if you're a committed football fan who forks out for pay TV to watch games like a lot of us do on here.

But, when people go on about the Champions League as being the pinnacle of European football that means that it is the competition that the most people want to watch, and therefore it should be made available to the most people.

UEFA brag about the Final now being bigger than the Super Bowl, yet the only reason that has happened is by millions of half-hearted fans or actual non-fans tuning in for something that they think is really important. Take away their link with the competition for the rest of the year and they will be less likely to care. You only have to compare the interest in Ashes victories in the pre and post free TV eras to know what happens. Committed fans of those sports carry on as normal, but the outside world things change, and things go from being national events to peripheral events overnight.
Gordie10
06-11-2013
Originally Posted by Gray77:
“You only have to compare the interest in Ashes victories in the pre and post free TV eras to know what happens. Committed fans of those sports carry on as normal, but the outside world things change, and things go from being national events to peripheral events overnight.”

Your comments have reminded me of the recent debate after England's latest Ashes win about why England's cricket team isn't as popular as it "should be". Maybe this is one of the reasons, especially as comparisons were typically made with the 2005 team, when the series was shown live on Channel 4.
hendero
06-11-2013
Originally Posted by THOMO:
“Personally I would like to see BBC TV have a Champions League Match instead of ITV, but the costs would be to high for the BBC to pay and I do have Sky Sports and BT Sport.
Ian.”

Why? Surely it is better for all sports fans if ITV have the CL and the BBC spend that money on something else, like 6 Nations rugby, F1, etc.
hendero
06-11-2013
Originally Posted by Gordie10:
“Your comments have reminded me of the recent debate after England's latest Ashes win about why England's cricket team isn't as popular as it "should be". Maybe this is one of the reasons, especially as comparisons were typically made with the 2005 team, when the series was shown live on Channel 4.”

England's cricket team seems pretty popular to me, they are the only Test nation that regularly sells out virtually every one of its home matches, and contributes a decent number of fans to away matches. They get plenty of newspaper coverage. They didn't get an open topped bus tour after they won the most recent Ashes (thankfully), but that's because they were expected to beat Australia this time around. The MBE's in 2005 were a little ridiculous, more of an indictment about how cr*p the team had been the previous 18 or so years.
malcy30
06-11-2013
Originally Posted by Gordie10:
“Your comments have reminded me of the recent debate after England's latest Ashes win about why England's cricket team isn't as popular as it "should be". Maybe this is one of the reasons, especially as comparisons were typically made with the 2005 team, when the series was shown live on Channel 4.”

I fully agree that the lack of free TV on cricket has had a massive impact on casual fans. When on free TV my dad used to regularly watch on BBC and then C4. Moved to Sky and even with free highlights on C5 he has completely lost interest and never mentions it.

In terms of kids only one I know interested is my managers son but that's because he plays cricket at our local club, the school don't play it. Others are only interested in cricket or rugby.
batdude_uk1
06-11-2013
Personally I hope that Sky win the lot, it is annoying to have to leave the seven match screens, to change the channel to ITV HD, to see some of that match, then to go back to Sky Sports 4 HD, press the red button, wait for it to load up, then see the seven screens again.

I far prefer it, when on Wednesdays, there are all the matches in one place to select from.
That is how things should be, rather than faffing about changing channels back and forth.
Dansky+HD
06-11-2013
Originally Posted by batdude_uk1:
“Personally I hope that Sky win the lot, it is annoying to have to leave the seven match screens, to change the channel to ITV HD, to see some of that match, then to go back to Sky Sports 4 HD, press the red button, wait for it to load up, then see the seven screens again.

I far prefer it, when on Wednesdays, there are all the matches in one place to select from.
That is how things should be, rather than faffing about changing channels back and forth.”

I wish they would put the screen on for the "ITV" game
show the latest score
and have an audio/radio stream of the game and
maybe do sort of text updates like the internet show.
BenFranklin
06-11-2013
CL viewing figures on ITV aren't nearly as good as they used to be, easy to get carried around and think it attracts a bigger casual audience than it actually does.
Leewich
06-11-2013
Originally Posted by BenFranklin:
“CL viewing figures on ITV aren't nearly as good as they used to be, easy to get carried around and think it attracts a bigger casual audience than it actually does.”

If I'm right, the FA Cup will be shared between the BBC and BT Sport from next season, meaning ITV's live football will be reduced to Champions League, England friendlies and qualifiers, and of course the World Cup and Euro finals. Surely they wouldn't want to be left with just international football by losing the Champions League deal too?

EDIT: And the Europa League as well, but they tend to shove them on ITV4.
batdude_uk1
06-11-2013
Originally Posted by Dansky+HD:
“I wish they would put the screen on for the "ITV" game
show the latest score
and have an audio/radio stream of the game and
maybe do sort of text updates like the internet show.”

I wish they would do something, as it is just so annoying having to flick back and forth between the two channels, and the red button.
Neil_Harris
06-11-2013
Originally Posted by Leewich:
“
EDIT: And the Europa League as well, but they tend to shove them on ITV4.”

I imagine the Europa league whould be shunted to ITV1 if they lost the champions league
Steve Williams
06-11-2013
Originally Posted by Belligerence:
“On Digital had that 'Champions on 99' channel, didn't they? Not sure if that channel was exclusive to CL football or not; if it was the former I could see why it flopped.”

When it was ONDigital it was indeed shown on a specific channel (two channels, actually, though one was just an opt-out of Carlton Cinema), though in the ITV Digital days it was on the ITV Sport Channel. Course, it was less essential because the only other football they had was the Football League and League Cup so for most fans of top-flight teams there was no reason to subscribe because they'd never be on it. But the USP for ITV Digital is that they had Sky Sports as well so you had to get ITV Digital to get all the football on all channels. But it turned out people were happy to miss what ITV Sport had.

In those days, lest we forget, ITV wasn't on Sky either, so between 2001 and 2003 you went from Sky viewers getting none of it to only Sky viewers being able to see all of it.

Originally Posted by Gray77:
“It's not a big deal if you're a committed football fan who forks out for pay TV to watch games like a lot of us do on here.

But, when people go on about the Champions League as being the pinnacle of European football that means that it is the competition that the most people want to watch, and therefore it should be made available to the most people.”

Yes, I've mentioned it before but even as a non-Man U fan, their run to the final in 1999 felt like a proper big deal, a real event, thanks to its prominent position on ITV. It's like the League Cup, these days the final just seems like any other Premier League game on Sky, whereas if it was still on FTA it would seem special because casual viewers would tune in.

Originally Posted by BenFranklin:
“CL viewing figures on ITV aren't nearly as good as they used to be, easy to get carried around and think it attracts a bigger casual audience than it actually does.”

That's the case with all programming on all channels, though, and can be seen as a side effect of the competition being bigger so that the individual games seem less important, especially in the group stage. And of course more people have Sky and there's more football on FTA TV than there used to be. I used to watch a lot of Champions League ten years ago because it was one of the few chances you had to watch live football on TV.

Still very important for ITV, though, it's one of the few things I watch on that channel.
mikey1980
06-11-2013
Originally Posted by Leewich:
“If I'm right, the FA Cup will be shared between the BBC and BT Sport from next season, meaning ITV's live football will be reduced to Champions League, England friendlies and qualifiers, and of course the World Cup and Euro finals. Surely they wouldn't want to be left with just international football by losing the Champions League deal too?

EDIT: And the Europa League as well, but they tend to shove them on ITV4.”

It's getting increasingly congested in the football broadcasting world, now that BT Sport are here to stay and have plenty of money to burn.

Channel Five have already dropped out because they couldn't compete. It sounds incredible, but in the next few years ITV are going to have to make a decision on whether they're up for broadcasting football on a regular season by season basis, or whether they'd prefer to stick to the bi-annual summer international tournaments, and focus on other less expensive sports.

Having said all that, having lost their FA Cup rights, I imagine ITV will have the money to make a significant bid to keep the Champions League rights they have.
madmusician
06-11-2013
I reckon that ITV will keep it, Sky will keep their share and BT will gain most of the Europa rights (with ITV having the final, too).

I just can't see UEFA abandoning FTA over here yet...
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