If I stopped eating meat, how would my body cope?

Phylan78 · 05-07-2013, 16:06

Hi been trying to reduce my meat intake for a long time. However I've struggled to develope alternatives. If I didn't and just ate more fruit and veg, how would my body cope?.

I eat beans which are apparently high in protein and I'd still be prepared to ear eggs.

Thanks

K

ameew · 05-07-2013, 16:11

Your body needs protein ,so you need to have alternatives to meat.Would you still eat fish?

Beans and pulses such as lentils are good sources of protein,as are dairy products.Theres also lotss of meat substitutes from Linda McCartney ,Quorn etc to experiment with.

molliepops · 05-07-2013, 16:20

It is so much easier these days to be vegetarian so many different foods you can have instead of meat. When I started in 1973 it wasn't quite so easy or accepted and I know at the time several people told me how easy I had it compared with them when they started in the 30's and 40's LOL

Phylan78 · 05-07-2013, 16:53

Thanks, very little options when I'm in restaurants, usually nothing. So I'm thinking of just taking veg?.

Area88 · 05-07-2013, 20:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by ameew

Your body needs protein ,so you need to have alternatives to meat.Would you still eat fish?

Beans and pulses such as lentils are good sources of protein,as are dairy products.Theres also lotss of meat substitutes from Linda McCartney ,Quorn etc to experiment with.

Beans and pulses are incomplete proteins by themselves, you would need to combine them with other foods to get the full amino acids.

You need PROTEIN to MAINTAIN MUSCLE and for the body to repair cells and tissue in the body.

Fish is complete proteins, so is Milk and Dairy. Eggs are complete proteins as well but you need to eat a lot as 4 eggs is only 24g of protein.

WinterFire · 06-07-2013, 00:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by Area88

Beans and pulses are incomplete proteins by themselves, you would need to combine them with other foods to get the full amino acids.

You need PROTEIN to MAINTAIN MUSCLE and for the body to repair cells and tissue in the body.

Fish is complete proteins, so is Milk and Dairy. Eggs are complete proteins as well but you need to eat a lot as 4 eggs is only 24g of protein.

It's very easy to get sufficient protein of sufficient quality on a strict vegetarian diet. (Let alone an ovo-lacto one). But just eating 'fruit and veg' isn't the way to go about it. Beans, pulses, nuts, grains, and many other foods contain protein. Typically people eating western diets will complete their proteins by mixing beans/nuts with grains. E.g. beans on toast.

I'm a strict vegetarian and have been so for decades. My advice for anyone considering becoming vegetarian is to take some time out and study some reliable sources on human nutrition. First, knowledge of nutrition will help someone choose the correct foods as they change their diet. And second, knowledge of nutrition will help someone realise that much advice about nutrition given in our society, even if well meaning and sometimes even if given by professionals, is wrong.

Another thing to watch out for is the total calorie intake. Typically vegetable foods tend to be less calorie dense than animal foods. (There are noted exceptions). Hence, someone adopting a vegetarian diet may need to eat more total weight in food than before. But that greater volume can be important in taking on required nutrients. E.g. potatoes appear to be low in protein as they have typically 2g protein per 100g of potato. But, they're also generally calorie sparse, with about 77kcal per 100g. If you do the sums, that's over 10% of the calories of potatoes coming from protein. Which is a useful amount. If we compare the nutrition profile of red kidney beans, they have about 14% of their calories from protein, which is more than the potato, but not a world away. The kidney beans are more calorie dense than the potato, but if you're aiming at eating a fixed number of calories per day, then the density becomes less important. As if you're eating less calorie dense foods, you eat more of them.

Generally that's how it works with vegetarianism. You get protein from everywhere. But you have to eat enough food. I've seen people go vegetarian and then embark on truly weird diets of nearly all calorie sparse foods, and not enough of them. Such that they must be eating many fewer calories than they need per day. That doesn't work.

That's why I suggest reading up on nutrition first. Because there are a number of simple errors people can make which are easy to avoid with a bit of knowledge of nutrition.

Phylan78 · 06-07-2013, 07:37

Thanks,can you give me some examples of pulses? and is there much protein in Wheetabix?.

Every time I eat meat, (now only fish and fowl) I get image's of blood and carcasses, even if I try to let it pass, nibble through my food, I don't enjoy it.

Didn't I hear as a child that eggs are high in cholesteral?

Thanks again
K

bornfree · 06-07-2013, 10:37

I have been a vegetarian all my life. However, 5 years ago had to start eating fish as I was very ill. Now I am what they call a pescatarian and feel much healthier. I eat fish 3/4 times a week. I still find it hard to eat mackeral and other very oily fish but once the fish is filleted, I season it heavily. My favourite is salmon as it is so versatile. You can curry it, use it in Italian cooking and also have it wil potatoes and veg as a sunday dinner. I also eat a lot pulses.

bornfree · 06-07-2013, 10:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by WinterFire

It's very easy to get sufficient protein of sufficient quality on a strict vegetarian diet. (Let alone an ovo-lacto one). But just eating 'fruit and veg' isn't the way to go about it. Beans, pulses, nuts, grains, and many other foods contain protein. Typically people eating western diets will complete their proteins by mixing beans/nuts with grains. E.g. beans on toast.

I'm a strict vegetarian and have been so for decades. My advice for anyone considering becoming vegetarian is to take some time out and study some reliable sources on human nutrition. First, knowledge of nutrition will help someone choose the correct foods as they change their diet. And second, knowledge of nutrition will help someone realise that much advice about nutrition given in our society, even if well meaning and sometimes even if given by professionals, is wrong.

Another thing to watch out for is the total calorie intake. Typically vegetable foods tend to be less calorie dense than animal foods. (There are noted exceptions). Hence, someone adopting a vegetarian diet may need to eat more total weight in food than before. But that greater volume can be important in taking on required nutrients. E.g. potatoes appear to be low in protein as they have typically 2g protein per 100g of potato. But, they're also generally calorie sparse, with about 77kcal per 100g. If you do the sums, that's over 10% of the calories of potatoes coming from protein. Which is a useful amount. If we compare the nutrition profile of red kidney beans, they have about 14% of their calories from protein, which is more than the potato, but not a world away. The kidney beans are more calorie dense than the potato, but if you're aiming at eating a fixed number of calories per day, then the density becomes less important. As if you're eating less calorie dense foods, you eat more of them.

Generally that's how it works with vegetarianism. You get protein from everywhere. But you have to eat enough food. I've seen people go vegetarian and then embark on truly weird diets of nearly all calorie sparse foods, and not enough of them. Such that they must be eating many fewer calories than they need per day. That doesn't work.

That's why I suggest reading up on nutrition first. Because there are a number of simple errors people can make which are easy to avoid with a bit of knowledge of nutrition.

Very informative

JumpTheShark · 07-07-2013, 13:51

Your body would probably be much better off without it, assuming you don't replace the meat with cheese and eggs (a common mistake that new vegetarians make, leading to a lot of those "I was vegetarian for a week and felt so ill!!!11" stories).

Quote:

Originally Posted by Area88

Beans and pulses are incomplete proteins by themselves, you would need to combine them with other foods to get the full amino acids.

You need PROTEIN to MAINTAIN MUSCLE and for the body to repair cells and tissue in the body.

Fish is complete proteins, so is Milk and Dairy. Eggs are complete proteins as well but you need to eat a lot as 4 eggs is only 24g of protein.

The idea that you need "complete" proteins in every meal was debunked decades ago. Plus, quinoa is just one example of a plant food that is a complete protein.

bornfree · 07-07-2013, 14:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by JumpTheShark

Your body would probably be much better off without it, assuming you don't replace the meat with cheese and eggs (a common mistake that new vegetarians make, leading to a lot of those "I was vegetarian for a week and felt so ill!!!11" stories).

The idea that you need "complete" proteins in every meal was debunked decades ago. Plus, quinoa is just one example of a plant food that is a complete protein.

Cheese and eggs within reason are good. But I do know a few vegetarians who eat a awful cheese and eggs. You are right about quinoa. Very tasty with veg curry.

brangdon · 07-07-2013, 17:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by WinterFire

It's very easy to get sufficient protein of sufficient quality on a strict vegetarian diet.

Strange use of the word "easy". Your post illustrates how difficult it is to get right. Maybe it's easy if you know what you are doing, but then you say even professionals get it wrong.

Hypnodisc · 08-07-2013, 23:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by brangdon

Strange use of the word "easy". Your post illustrates how difficult it is to get right. Maybe it's easy if you know what you are doing, but then you say even professionals get it wrong.

Although I'm not a vegetarian, I have a few veggie friends and they seem to manage easily enough. They just eat a generally balanced, healthy diet.

It was my understanding the one to watch out for is Vitamin B12 deficiency if you're a vegetarian. But that's remedied with generous helpings of Marmite on toast

theid · 09-07-2013, 00:12

Probably the biggest problem for people who want to be vegetarians is that you have to learn to cook. The quickest healthy meal, as someone has already mentioned, is baked beans on wholemeal toast, but otherwise a diet of pasta and sauces won't cut it. There are loads of terrific vegetarian recipes on line, so have a go. I like tasty things and don't use salt (v. high in Marmite) so I have a good variety of spices in my kitchen and grow a lot of herbs. I can't think of a single fruit or vegetable that I don't like and rice, pulses and grains figure in a fair number of my meals. Soya cream is perfectly acceptable as a replacement for dairy cream if you need it in a recipe - and it's good for you. Vanilla soya milk is great with all breakfast cereals, muesli and porridge. There are plenty of vegetarian cheeses around, and even - if you want to give up dairy, too - dairy-free cheese.

I've been vegetarian for 62 years now and am fitter than a lot of people much younger than me, but I do accept that some people, for whatever reason, may need to eat some form of cadaver to be well. Give it a go and see how you feel. Good luck.

bobcar · 09-07-2013, 16:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by brangdon

Strange use of the word "easy". Your post illustrates how difficult it is to get right. Maybe it's easy if you know what you are doing, but then you say even professionals get it wrong.

It is very easy. I've been vegan for 20 years and make no effort to try and get enough proteins. As long as you eat a varied and healthy diet you will get enough protein, most foods contain protein. I have on a couple of occasions calculated my protein intake of typical days and I've always been well above the amount required.

The only people who wouldn't get enough are those who are calorie deficient or who eat a monoculture such as living off crisps or other such snack foods.

Living healthily as a vegan is much easier than living healthily as a meat eater.

JumpTheShark · 09-07-2013, 22:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by brangdon

Strange use of the word "easy". Your post illustrates how difficult it is to get right. Maybe it's easy if you know what you are doing, but then you say even professionals get it wrong.

It's very difficult to not get enough protein. If you're consuming enough calories it's almost a given that you will be getting all the protein you need. There must be some people that eat such a strangely unbalanced diet that they don't but, really, you'd have to have serious food issues to manage that.

brangdon · 09-07-2013, 22:20

^^ It may be easy, but WinterFire's post made it look difficult to me. It was full of warnings, caveats, traps and pitfalls.

bornfree · 09-07-2013, 22:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hypnodisc

Although I'm not a vegetarian, I have a few veggie friends and they seem to manage easily enough. They just eat a generally balanced, healthy diet.

It was my understanding the one to watch out for is Vitamin B12 deficiency if you're a vegetarian. But that's remedied with generous helpings of Marmite on toast

Love marmite on toast

barbeler · 09-07-2013, 22:38

I've given people lasagne and bolognese I've cooked with the Linda McCartney vegemince and they didn't know it wasn't meat. Quorn mince is equally good, although the difference is more obvious. I'm not one of those vegetarians who think you shouldn't eat anything that tastes like meat. If you like the taste and it isn't real meat then so what? It's only a taste.

Quorn fillets make an excellent substitute for chicken, but take my tip: don't fry or grill them, simply put them into a microwave steamer for about five minutes. So simple, but the taste is as good as chicken and it has a similar texture.

Nuts are a good source of protein too and also have essential fatty acids and minerals. I've heard they're easier to digest if you soak them overnight, especially almonds. Sounds weird but I might give it a go.

Water cress and alfalfa sprouts are very good for vegetarians too, as they are a good source of iron.

WinterFire · 10-07-2013, 22:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by Phylan78

Thanks,can you give me some examples of pulses? and is there much protein in Wheetabix?.

There is a big list of pulses on the Wikipedia page: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pulse_%28legume%29 It also lists some legumes that aren't considered pulses, such as oil seeds.

According to weetabix's own site, theres 11.5g of protein in 100g of weetabix, or 11.5% by weight. http://www.weetabix.co.uk/products/cereals/weetabix

For many products, it's possible to google "<name of product> nutrition" and find nutritional breakdowns. Many of the supermarket online sites also include nutritional breakdowns, eg. Ocado.

WinterFire · 10-07-2013, 22:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by brangdon

Strange use of the word "easy". Your post illustrates how difficult it is to get right. Maybe it's easy if you know what you are doing, but then you say even professionals get it wrong.

It's easy to get it right, but also easy to get it wrong.

E.g. I said that professionals get it wrong, but that's because they haven't bothered looking up easily available information. The example I gave was an NHS nutritionist saying that bread had 2% protein in it. It's not exactly difficult to find the nutritional breakdown of bread, it's printed on bread packaging! Clearly it's not difficult to find the correct information, it's all over the place. But it's also not difficult for someone (even a professional nutritionist it seems) to never actually read that exceptionally easy to obtain information and therefore be ignorant of it.

I've met people who have gotten it very wrong. E.g. one person who ate nothing but chips and baked beans for meal after meal. That didn't go well.

There are a few general rules in my post, but I wouldn't agree that it's 'full of caveats'. E.g. I say that one thing that people can get wrong is to change to a diet without enough calories. But it's not difficult to just read a few packets and to be aware of how many calories they should be eating each day. E.g. I should be eating about 2300. Whether or not someone's changing their diet, it's useful to know how many calories your diet includes, and whether you're eating too few or too many. It's not difficult to work this out, there are apps and online websites that can help you. But it's also easy to remain ignorant about how many calories you're eating, and therefore not take in enough, or take in too much leading to weight gain. And that applies to everyone, not just those changing their diet.

If my post makes it look difficult to turn vegetarian, then I suspect that you would benefit from learning more about food and nutrition. Whether or not you're considering changing your diet. Suggestions such as 'make sure you eat enough calories' should be easy to follow if you understand how many calories there are in various foods you might choose to eat.

edEx · 10-07-2013, 22:57

The proteins in beans (inc. soya) go some of the way, but supplement it with occasional eggs or dairy if you want an easy life. I'm sure there are others here who can suggest ways of avoiding both of those food groups if you really want to, but I find that's the easiest way to maintain protein levels without eating meat or fish.

WinterFire · 10-07-2013, 23:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by edEx

The proteins in beans (inc. soya) go some of the way, but supplement it with occasional eggs or dairy if you want an easy life. I'm sure there are others here who can suggest ways of avoiding both of those food groups if you really want to, but I find that's the easiest way to maintain protein levels without eating meat or fish.

Soy beans themselves are a complete protein source. http://www.nsrl.uiuc.edu/aboutsoy/soynutrition.html

bobcar · 11-07-2013, 13:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by WinterFire

I've met people who have gotten it very wrong. E.g. one person who ate nothing but chips and baked beans for meal after meal. That didn't go well.

If they had eaten beans on toast rather than chips and beans then there would have been no problem with protein. A diet consisting of just that would not be healthy as it is missing a lot but the same thing applies to any restricted diet.

Yes it is possible to get a vegan or vegetarian diet wrong but the same is also true of an omnivorous diet. The ratio of omnivores suffering from the lack of plant nutrients massively outweighs the ratio of vegans suffering from too little protein. Just eat a varied healthy vegan diet and protein is not an issue at all, it is very easy.