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Chelsea Supporters Thread (Part 4) |
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#1351 |
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Join Date: Jan 2013
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Quote:
You should have. It's a different club to the one he went to first time around.
I thought it was crazy how people assumed it would all work out fine simply cos its mourinho. |
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#1352 |
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Join Date: Jan 2013
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I think the players are to blame here, The manager can only do so much but the players just diddnt perform tonight. Yes its the managers responsibility but i dont think Jose did too much wrong today.
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#1353 |
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Join Date: May 2008
Location: Richmond, Surrey.
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Quote:
Bringing Mikel on when we needed a goal was a strange sub, I have to say.
I thought the panel at the end must have read this thread, they echoed most of the things we've been saying. Jamie Carragher was right in my opinion when he said he couldn't understand why we were so desperate to change the way we've always played. At our best, we played winning football, with a terrific blend of skill and power. Now we want to copy Barcelona..why ? Barcelona won't be able to maintain their superiority playing that style, they currently have a unique group of players, including Messi, one of the greatest the game has ever seen. Let's see if they can replicate that when the time comes for their current team to hang up their boots. We have to give it time, but currently we don't look anything like a Mourinho team. The great man himself has to take some of the blame for that, he was there throughout the transfer window so some of the bizarre decisions must be down to him. It's too late to do much about it now, the second half performance tonight was dreadful but I don't think we'll play as bad as that very often. But we're short of a genuine striker, and will just have to make the best of it until January at least. It's going to be a long season. |
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#1354 |
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Join Date: Jul 2010
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That was pretty poor tonight. An unbalanced squad is going to haunt us. We have added 3 midfield players that just weren't needed. Still time to turn it around thankfully.
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#1355 |
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Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: NW London
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We looked poor in defence and attack which is unusual. Not sure why the media is focusing on Mata since he hasn't looked right whenever he's played for us this season. Hope Jose can get rid of the disjointed, nervous, sloppiness before the weekend.
I'm also positive Lukaku will start scoring with Everton soon so that's another stick we've thrown out there to beat ourselves up with later. |
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#1356 |
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Join Date: Jan 2013
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For the league games at least (which should be our priority) I'd like to see a much more settled side, this constant rotation we're doing to accommodate all the midfielders/forwards in particular is hampering us. There's such a thing as having too many options. We keep chopping and changing to try and keep everyone happy, but it's to the detriment of the team.
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#1357 |
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Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: A Sound Expert
Posts: 13,881
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It was always going to be a case of "too many cooks".
Very predictable. Willian, Schurle, KDB, Van Ginkle added to an already full midfield was madness. |
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#1358 |
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Join Date: Apr 2009
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It's ridiculous to expect to find our best team when you're changing 4 or 5 players in every match. United play a settled side and continue to win stuff regularly.....why do we (and Man City) insist on rotating for every bloody match? ![]() Incidentally, de Bruyne and Oscar are the only 2 attacking players who have impressed, and yet one of them has hardly been seen at all. Quote:
It was always going to be a case of "too many cooks".
Very predictable. Willian, Schurle, KDB, Van Ginkle added to an already full midfield was madness. |
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#1359 |
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Join Date: Jan 2013
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^ I agree about De Bruyne being the only one that's impressed other than Oscar. Hazard's played more than any of them, but has been off the boil. I'd bench him for the time being.
This is the team i'd like to see against Fulham, though it won't happen. Cech Azpi - Cahill - Terry - Cole Ramires - Luiz Oscar - Mata - De Bruyne Eto'o |
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#1360 |
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Join Date: Jun 2006
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This is a real possibility.
We lose up coming games to Spurs and Man City. Could the unthinkable happen this early with either Jose realising he made a mistake coming back, or RM doing what he does best? |
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#1361 |
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Join Date: May 2013
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Quote:
^ I agree about De Bruyne being the only one that's impressed other than Oscar. Hazard's played more than any of them, but has been off the boil. I'd bench him for the time being.
This is the team i'd like to see against Fulham, though it won't happen. Cech Azpi - Cahill - Terry - Cole Ramires - Luiz Oscar - Mata - De Bruyne Eto'o Cech Azpilicueta Cahill Terry Bertrand - Cole needs a rest. Luiz / Mikel Oscar De Bruyne Mata Schurrle Eto'o Give Hazard time on the bench because he has massively underperformed so far. I don't understand Hazard, he has everything needed to take on players but all he does is run, come inside, then play a 5 yard pass. He's not making the most of his ability. I don't want to see Luiz in defense anymore, i can't stand his style. He never contains, he just rushes into a tackle, it's reckless. And if he isn't doing that he is charging up field all the time leaving gaps all over the place. He's a great footballer but i think he is an awful CB. |
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#1362 |
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Join Date: Dec 2006
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Quote:
I'd like to see
Cech Azpilicueta Cahill Terry Bertrand - Cole needs a rest. Luiz / Mikel Oscar De Bruyne Mata Schurrle Eto'o Give Hazard time on the bench because he has massively underperformed so far. I don't understand Hazard, he has everything needed to take on players but all he does is run, come inside, then play a 5 yard pass. He's not making the most of his ability. I don't want to see Luiz in defense anymore, i can't stand his style. He never contains, he just rushes into a tackle, it's reckless. And if he isn't doing that he is charging up field all the time leaving gaps all over the place. He's a great footballer but i think he is an awful CB. Luiz in defence has always looked suspect really, either a red card or a lapse in concentration leading to a goal. I agree i think he looks much more solid in midfield, i still think his best position is there but there isnt any sign he will be played there. The only reason rafa played him there was because we were very short of players in CM at the time, but once they returned he was back to CB. |
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#1363 |
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Join Date: Oct 2002
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I think Cole has been getting forward more than I've seen him do for a long time. Unfortunately, it seems to be taking it out of his defensive performances and he's had very little help/cover from whoever is playing in front of him on that day. Hazard could still be injured, he's looked poor since the international break. I'm not sure Mata is fit either as the couple of times he's played he's been very quiet. Lampard looked a bit tired. Eto'o's (??) touch was poor and he was a bit off the pace, willing enough though to his credit. This would be the perfect time to refresh the deck (except for Eto'o who should get at least the next 5 match starts).
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#1364 |
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Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 2,130
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This is a real possibility.
We lose up coming games to Spurs and Man City. Could the unthinkable happen this early with either Jose realising he made a mistake coming back, or RM doing what he does best? I think we are getting ahead of ourselves abit, it is not panic stations at the club yet, even if we have lost 2 in a row(and not against top top sides). The CL loss isnt a big deal it just makes it harder for us to qualify, but we have more than enough time to resolve the problem and it isnt the hardest of groups. 2nd should be no problem for us at the very least. I was angry about the result last night but today ive calmed down and chalked it off as a bad night. The only annoying thing is that we are just out of the summer transfer window but we havent progressed as a team since last season really, we had all summer to sort some of our problems but our transfer dealings have done nothing and perhaps even added to our problems by having 6 bloody attacking midfielders now. The Willian signing is still boggling my mind and i cant fathom why we have signed him. Last night he diddnt really add anything we diddnt already have. All the other signings were probably decent deals. The only thing i can think of is we did it just so Spurs diddnt get him, but that in itself is just stupid. Would Abram do such a thing? Quite possibly when he has so much money. |
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#1365 |
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Join Date: Jan 2013
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The Willian signing is still boggling my mind and i cant fathom why we have signed him. Last night he diddnt really add anything we diddnt already have. All the other signings were probably decent deals. The only thing i can think of is we did it just so Spurs diddnt get him, but that in itself is just stupid. Would Abram do such a thing? Quite possibly when he has so much money.
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#1366 |
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Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Alberto Del Rio's Car
Posts: 2,290
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Give Hazard time on the bench because he has massively underperformed so far. I don't understand Hazard, he has everything needed to take on players but all he does is run, come inside, then play a 5 yard pass. He's not making the most of his ability. I don't want to see Luiz in defense anymore, i can't stand his style. He never contains, he just rushes into a tackle, it's reckless. And if he isn't doing that he is charging up field all the time leaving gaps all over the place. He's a great footballer but i think he is an awful CB. |
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#1367 |
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If Mourinho's not going to put Luiz in midfield (unlikely, I know) then I'd give Essien a chance.
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#1368 |
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Chalobah joining Nottm Forest on loan 'til January.
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#1369 |
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Again, it just shows how we have not strengthened our key areas. There is hardly any movement from the middle - all our play seems to come from our fullbacks. Van Ginkel is still a work in progress. Ramires' first touch still haunts me. Mikel is Mikel and Lamps can't play every game and he has periods where he goes missing. Finally we have Essien who hasn't even featured in any of our games yet.
I do find it hard to understand Jose's thinking during the summer. Against United he started without a recognised striker, which shows he had little confidence in Torres or Ba from the start. It wasn't a great surprise to see Rooney stay at Utd, so did he believe Eto'o will solve the problem ? It seem a massive gamble to me, there weren't many other top clubs chasing after Eto'o and his agent was touting around for offers. I like Ramires, I think we missed him last night. But he's a workhorse, someone who will run all day and occasionally come up with an important goal. He would be fine playing alongside an experienced holding player. Mikel should have been that player, but it's just not worked out for him. Lampard does his best, but he's a square peg in a round hole playing in front of the back four. We don't know about Essien yet, but his injuries looked to have taken their toll last time he appeared for us. Van Ginkel looked out of his depth, he appears more of a candidate to go on loan than some of the others who have been shipped out. Our best bet might be to move Luiz up as we have been saying for years. It worked on a few occasions last season, but would he want to play in that role. He's established in the Brazilian team as a CB now, wouldn't it jeopardise his chances in a World Cup year ? Oh well, it should be interesting. |
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#1370 |
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Join Date: Jan 2013
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We don't know about Essien yet, but his injuries looked to have taken their toll last time he appeared for us.
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Our best bet might be to move Luiz up as we have been saying for years. It worked on a few occasions last season, but would he want to play in that role. He's established in the Brazilian team as a CB now, wouldn't it jeopardise his chances in a World Cup year ?
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#1371 |
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Join Date: May 2008
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I think we actually have to do what's best for us. If Luiz spits his dummy out because he only wants to play CB, then so be it. Let him leave. I like Luiz, but he's proved on too many occasions he's not disciplined enough to play there, so there's no point in persisting with it just to keep him happy.
Watching him for Brazil, he rarely puts a foot wrong. For us, his surging runs foward are a joy to watch. I would hate to force him out because we have failed to invest in a quality holding player. But I accept, it's a difficult one. |
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#1372 |
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That's where I disagree with you. I think Luiz has the potential to become one of the worlds great CB's. If he doesn't want to play in a DM position, we may have to live for a while with his lapses in concentration.
Watching him for Brazil, he rarely puts a foot wrong. For us, his surging runs foward are a joy to watch. I would hate to force him out because we have failed to invest in a quality holding player. But I accept, it's a difficult one. |
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#1373 |
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Join Date: Jan 2011
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Chalobah joining Nottm Forest on loan 'til January.
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Exactly. The only ray of light I can see is that we shouldn't be any worse than last season. We have an extra striker, a few extra attacking midfield players, and decent cover for Cech In goal. But how different it could have been if we had strengthened in the key areas.
I do find it hard to understand Jose's thinking during the summer. Against United he started without a recognised striker, which shows he had little confidence in Torres or Ba from the start. It wasn't a great surprise to see Rooney stay at Utd, so did he believe Eto'o will solve the problem ? It seem a massive gamble to me, there weren't many other top clubs chasing after Eto'o and his agent was touting around for offers. I like Ramires, I think we missed him last night. But he's a workhorse, someone who will run all day and occasionally come up with an important goal. He would be fine playing alongside an experienced holding player. Mikel should have been that player, but it's just not worked out for him. Lampard does his best, but he's a square peg in a round hole playing in front of the back four. We don't know about Essien yet, but his injuries looked to have taken their toll last time he appeared for us. Van Ginkel looked out of his depth, he appears more of a candidate to go on loan than some of the others who have been shipped out. Our best bet might be to move Luiz up as we have been saying for years. It worked on a few occasions last season, but would he want to play in that role. He's established in the Brazilian team as a CB now, wouldn't it jeopardise his chances in a World Cup year ? Oh well, it should be interesting. I like Ramires too. He's always a big game player but his first touch cost us a goal at Goodison Park. I just don't understand how a Brazilian CM can have such a poor first touch at this level? But yeah, aside from that you can't fault his commitment to the club. Even when he's having an off day he still contributes to the team any way he can. In the EL final, he was having a really bad game; fouls everywhere. But I think it was him who won the corner by pressing the opposition. (Can't remember who it was exactly - my memory is awful )Quote:
How long are you prepared to give Luiz to fulfill that potential though? He turns 27 next april. The likes of Terry, Carvalho, and Gallas were much better CB's at that age. Luiz is a great player, but just not in that position.
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#1374 |
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That's where I disagree with you. I think Luiz has the potential to become one of the worlds great CB's.
Either Jose didn't lay into him about it or he just ignored him.......he was still doing it Wednesday. Quote:
I'm in the camp where I think Luiz is a great CB. It's true, Luiz was leaving gaps in defence on Wednesday night but can you blame him?
His roaming forward is a problem because he hardly ever gives a shit when he loses the ball. He's shown that on far too many occasions in his 3 years here. The only times he even comes close to winning the ball back is by committing one of those ridiculous fouls he is far too fond of. Cahill and Terry both carry the ball forward without giving away chance after chance. They care when they lose it, too. Believe it or not, I like the guy too. I really wish he were as good as we need him to be, but he really isn't. When you have a 26yo defender who has been here for 3 years and you're still mentioning potential and defending him against his critics by praising his attacking play instead of his defensive ability, it's pretty clear he's really not that good. |
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#1375 |
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Join Date: May 2008
Location: Richmond, Surrey.
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How long are you prepared to give Luiz to fulfill that potential though? He turns 27 next april. The likes of Terry, Carvalho, and Gallas were much better CB's at that age. Luiz is a great player, but just not in that position.
Having said that, I don't think Luiz is too far behind. He's better than any of those you mention going foward. His distribution can be sublime, he's great at dead-ball kicks and his enthusiasm is second to none. If he can just improve his concentration and reading of the game we'll have a genuine world class player on our hands. He would still be one of my first names on the team sheet, either at CB or DM. |
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