Again, I'm with you 100%. It never ceases to amaze me the people that go on Dragon's Den and haven't even got a basic grasp of their figures.

How anyone can go on the Apprentice claiming to be a solid business person and yet not know the difference between turnover and profit is just beyond me.

It makes you wonder if these people have never ever seen the shows that they have applied to go on!

You are, of course, right.

How she didn't get ejected from the interview (like Jordan) when she revealed she just made the figure up, is beyond me.

She could have been crucified, but got off incredibly lightly.

She got to the final by default - can't think of anything she contributed over the weeks that was task-winning....

I have to defend her since I think she should have won on her business plan which was the simplest and best.
One doesnt eject from the interview for not knowing something however important as long as the plan is good and workable.
She most likely has an accountant doing all her bookkeeping and leaves everything to him. She is basically a dancer and a hard worker and doesnt have time for her bookwork. I suppose she did her CV in the 'house' and is not allowed to contact him there so she had to make up the figures she didnt know.
Although you dont seem to realise this it seems the interviewers do and didnt dismiss her. Even LS didnt because of this. Although I consider him mistaken.

I'm sorry but this simply doesn't wash. She is an experienced 32 years old woman and has been self-employed for 10 years. An accountant prepares accounts but you have to read and sign them as accurate and sign your tax form (and write a cheque for the tax!). There is no way you cannot know how much money your business made - ball park figure at least. 'They' do not 'do their CV' in the house - they do it in advance as part of the selection process, and while they may well tweak their business plan before the interviews, we all know (from the comments made throughout the series in the boardroom) that they are seen by Alan Sugar and his side kicks at the outset of the process so they are prepared before filming begins. If you claim to have a successful business (or three) under your belt, the first thing you are going to produce to convince someone to lend you money is three years accounts.

We saw them doing a lot of typing. I suppose their CV only means what they have been doing till now and a few silly questions about their 'shoes'. And what their business plan basically is.
It wont contain their income tax returns.
It is very possible and likely that they all have to do the business plan in the 'house'.
I cannot believe that if it was done in advance Francesca would not have the correct figures. Remember these 'figures' are not 'projected' ones which she didnt know and made up but actual ones.

The £5,000,000 figure wasn't part of her business plan. It was part of her application form to be on the show in the first place.

I am sure that someone in business for ten years has had to use a bank sometime for a loan or overdraft. Is it really possible that they never have asked her to provide figures. It is impossible that she should have absolutely no idea of them. Maybe she wanted to impress and thought they wouldnt notice. I dont know. LS has just said on the TV tonight that he couldnt trust her to run a large outfit. I agree, I also dont think she can ALONE. But with help she certainly could and he ought to have offered it.

Exactly.

It was in her 'marketing' piece.

Most business peoples PR and marketing people make up a ridiculously inflated figure of what they're worth. It's what gets them noticed, it's what get them in the door.

Take the books and look at them and you'll discover it is BS. But if they have a good plan that looks like it might make profit then the BS that got them noticed doesn't matter so much.

On the flip side it does make you look stupid and dishonest but it might just have been that little deciding factor between getting noticed or not.

My guess - she signs the accounts presented to her without really scrutinising them.

She said a randomly inflated figure to get noticed. I was quite impressed.

She wasn't the right person to implement it, though. As was said on the programme, she'd be good at running an exercise club, but she'd done nothing to make me think she'd be good at running a chain of them.

I agree!

PENGUIN!!

Francesca has been AWFUL in the tasks - she hasn't had one moment of brilliance. Jordan has been one of THE best. The only reason he got fired was because of the invalidity of his business plan.

How can you back someone to win if they've got the worst business skills in the process? She was by far the weakest after a point just above possibly Natalie. But Rebecca and Jason did not deserve to be fired over her!

And remember how she ripped Jason to shreds?...are you seriously saying she's nice???!!!

She had reason to be annoyed with Jason, as he'd wrongly accused her of mistrepresenting her market research. That doesn't make her a bad person.

As it happens, I think she should have been fired over Rebecca in the awayday task, but certainly not over Jason on the dating task.

Although I value your judgement can you explain your comments.
Also why you think Leah would be better who hasnt even run one yet.
And what makes you think Louisa would be so good at running something like a chain.

At the moment with her dance company I would be surprised if Francesca has less employees than Louisa.

I fail to see how you can tell this from the tasks. I may mention that in many of them they lost the plot as LS calls it. They were not enthusiastic about products they were 'forced'; to sell and therefore 'lost' them to the other team.

I do agree that Louisa 'found' the plot in all the tasks but again that is not enough reason to dismiss the others saying they wouldnt be able to run a chain.

Please remember that Louisa started with 'money' behind her. Francesca didnt. She is most likely at least she comes across that way a lot 'harder' than Louisa and would make for a lot 'harsher' boss and stand less nonsense.

So I think you and LS are wrong in that she cant run a chain. She may need a bit of help but she is quite capable of it.
Someone mentioned that she didnt reply about she would go about training her staff and managers. I dont think one can really expect a reply to such a question.
One trains staff then sends them out to all the branches. She has been in business ten years so one must give her some credit that she knows what she is doing.

That is not the way the system works. If she was AWFUL in the tasks she should have been fired THEN.
She got to the end. Now it all depends on business plan. Not what happened in the tasks. That is all forgotten now.
If her business plan is the best and she is considered capable of carrying it, out mainly by having experience SHE WINS. Unless LS wants to take risks with the others she has won.

The tasks aren't irrelevant to the end, they are used to determine whether or not someone is good enough to be Lord Sugar's business partner. He liked her business plan, and I reckon if either Neil or Jordan had had that plan, they would have got to the final. However, Francesca had it, and while in theory the plan was good, she had not proved to him that she was capable of delivering it. Whereas Leah and Luisa have both proved to be very competent workers.

It was pretty clear Francesca does not know what turnover means, and probably she does not even know the word has a technical meaning: at one point, she claims £5 million: at another, she thinks it means profit, and she must know she did not make £5 million profit.

I wonder too if she knows what profit means or whether she thinks it is what she pays herself. Of course, profit is what is left after she pays herself if (as appears to be the case) she works in the business as well as owns it, even if she takes salary as dividends for tax reasons.

Do you really believe that someone in business for ten years has no idea. Do you think in that time she has never had to go to a bank for an overdraft or loan and explain her business. I keep on writing this it seems to no avail.
She was 'fighting' her corner. This 'prize' means a lot to her. She was most likely over awed and mixed up at the time. She knew this interview meant more than all the others. Remember he didnt dismiss her because of this, neither did LS and neither should anyone else including you.

I believe Francesca does not (or did not) understand the word "turnover"; and the way she spoke to Claude about turning over profit suggests she did not even realise it is a technical term with a particular meaning. Claude did not tear her a new one because it was clear Francesca was misusing the word out of ignorance rather than fraud.

If you watch Dragons Den, you will know Francesca is not alone in this among successful business people.

Edit to add link to Claude making series 5 winner Yasmina sweat over her accounts.

Probably Francesca has someone else do the books, and since her businesses are profitable, she may never have had a bank loan.

And Francesca's weakness with figures in the interviews is consistent with what we have already seen in the beer task.

Francesca is running three successful businesses. Her proposal was easily the safest of the three women's, and likely at least as profitable. The problem was Lord Sugar was not confident Francesca could carry it out.

To be fair, most of the winners have been safe, uncontroversial choices.

Fran struck me as the most "normal" and genuine of the final five. The others all loved themselves and spoke utter nonsense. She didn't like Luisa's manipulative, controlling behaviour (nor did I). Probably too soft to be a serious business woman, but that's no bad thing really.

Please see my own new thread about the 'winners' and perhaps reply to them with your opinions about them.

I can only say to you that I dont believe it. So unless we hear what Francesca herself says we shall never know.

It is a paradox that Lord Sugar favours sales droids and shouty types through the process but right at the end opts for people like the ones he has worked with for the past thirty years or so -- Nick and Margaret.

It's interesting to note Francesca made up parts of her CV and this was her undoing whereas Lee McQueen made up parts of his CV and Sugar didn't care. McQueen won series four of The Apprentice even though he was a bit economical with the truth.

Saira bragged about consistently lying on her CV when applying for jobs, and it was handwafted off. Ruth was accused of inflating her CV as well, and it didn't stop her making the final and nearly winning. I don't think it's something that bothers Lordalan generally to be honest, especially if people are contrite about it, which Lee was (albeit when caught out).