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BBC to launch five new HD channels on Freeview


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Old 16-07-2013, 11:45
freetoview33
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It would make sense to make a date to convert to just T2 transmission, So another switchover just because the government never sorted things out and kept putting it off!
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Old 16-07-2013, 11:54
lbear
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I can't imagine them going to the cost of a second "switchover" so soon after analogue-switchoff - at least not for another 10 years, hoping that most STBs/TVs will come with T2 tuners by then. Even then, I suspect most people will have moved to IP-based TV by then, so I'm not sure if one last broadcast change will be squeezed in.
The OfCom report states that there is 20% market penetration of DVB-T2 tuners. This of course disregards those households that use another platform to receive HD but these further complicate calculations of when DVB-T switch-off can occur.

There has been a generational change in UK TV broadcasting roughly every 20 years since broadcasts restarted after WWII. VHF 405 line monochrome broadcasts were king until UHF 625 line PAL started in the late 1960s/early 1970s depending on your region. Widescreen sets became available in the mid 1990s and the first terrestrial digital transmissions started at the end of the 90s. So a target of 2020-2025 for the changeover period fits into this pattern. I have long suggested a single "legacy mux" for PSBs while all the others migrate to T2 and 2025 would be the final switchoff.

Remember with the number of countries outside the EU changing direct to DVB-T2 from analogue, it will become increasingly difficult to find a TV on sale without a T2 tuner.
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Old 16-07-2013, 12:00
ronant
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It will be interesting to see where they end up on the EPG. I think I'm right in saying they have to be between 101 and 120 and they are allocated on a first come, first serve basis.

Therefore we will presumably have -
101 - BBC1 HD
102 - BBC2 HD
103 - ITV HD
104 - Channel 4 HD
105 - BBC3 HD
106 - BBC4 HD
107 - CBBC HD
108 - CBeebies HD
109 - BBC News HD

Rather BBC dominant, but that's not their fault!
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Old 16-07-2013, 12:17
mossy2103
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It will be interesting to see where they end up on the EPG. I think I'm right in saying they have to be between 101 and 120 and they are allocated on a first come, first serve basis.

Therefore we will presumably have -
101 - BBC1 HD
102 - BBC2 HD
103 - ITV HD
104 - Channel 4 HD
105 - BBC3 HD
106 - BBC4 HD
107 - CBBC HD
108 - CBeebies HD
109 - BBC News HD

Rather BBC dominant, but that's not their fault!
You have forgotten that Channel 4 will have at least two channels (even if they have yet to make any public announcement) so those channels might shake up that order.
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Old 16-07-2013, 12:28
ronant
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You have forgotten that Channel 4 will have at least two channels (even if they have yet to make any public announcement) so those channels might shake up that order.
Not forgotten - but the fact they haven't made an announcement points to the possibility they won't be introduced before the BBC channels.

Digital UK currently have a consultation regarding the HD section of the EPG. The preferred way is first come first serve. There are also two options given for appropriate prominence of PSB channels. One option is to simply give them the best available slot, or the second option is to reserve space, but this would be difficult (although you would think reserving a space for C5 would be sensible).
http://www.digitaluk.co.uk/__data/as...L_8May2013.pdf
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Old 16-07-2013, 12:59
lbear
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Digital UK currently have a consultation regarding the HD section of the EPG. The preferred way is first come first serve. There are also two options given for appropriate prominence of PSB channels. One option is to simply give them the best available slot, or the second option is to reserve space, but this would be difficult (although you would think reserving a space for C5 would be sensible).
http://www.digitaluk.co.uk/__data/as...L_8May2013.pdf
For the HD genre, PSBs are not guaranteed the preferential LCN numbering they have for their SD channels. If Five want to have the considerable advantage of having LCN 105, they should apply for the licence now and bring it on stream when the new muxes start. "Dirty" Desmond should get out of his sweetheart deal with the Dirty Digger and make Five's HD offerings FTA and on DTT. "Use it or use it" will encourage that instead of still pandering to the channel's history on analogue.

I suspect we might see Pick TV being re-jigged to reflect a wider range of $ky channels and to become HD on Freeview/Youview. Almost certainly they will recycle series already shown in SD with the specific aim again of getting Sky subscriptions. (I also suspect that Sky will start offering at least their sports channels as IPTV services on YouView to add to their existing film service. Probably next year after their push to retain soccer fans in the coming season will not keep up their total subscriber base or at least sufficiently benefit the company by "upselling" extra packages)
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Old 16-07-2013, 13:06
freetoview33
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"More than 50% of homes in the UK are already HD-enabled. The BBC said it expected that figure to grow to 90% by 2019."

So there is potential!
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Old 16-07-2013, 13:45
ronant
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So what other channels do you think might go HD? This announcement might get the ball rolling.

E4? Film4? More4? C5? Dave? Sky News? Pick TV?
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Old 16-07-2013, 13:54
paul_m
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So what other channels do you think might go HD? This announcement might get the ball rolling.

E4? Film4? More4? C5? Dave? Sky News? Pick TV?
QVC have previously said they'd like to launch a HD version on Freeview, so I think they will be a likely candidate. I also expect E4 and Film4 to launch. For the remainder, I expect them to be either left unused, or taken by UKTV, Five or C4 for their remaining channels.
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Old 16-07-2013, 13:57
leslie123
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Here in London,digital multiplexes are broadcast using channels 22 -30 from Crystal Palace. Group A receiving aerials are the norm. I did read that there was a possibility that channel 42 might be used. This of course would bring reception problems for anyone with a Group A aerial. Group A receiving aerials were modified some years ago to accommodate Channel 5 on channel 37 in analogue. If additional multiplexes are used outside the Group A range then this might mean that some viewers would inevitably have to replace aerials with those of a wideband type.
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Old 16-07-2013, 14:10
tom558
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Here in London,digital multiplexes are broadcast using channels 22 -30 from Crystal Palace. Group A receiving aerials are the norm. I did read that there was a possibility that channel 42 might be used. This of course would bring reception problems for anyone with a Group A aerial. Group A receiving aerials were modified some years ago to accommodate Channel 5 on channel 37 in analogue. If additional multiplexes are used outside the Group A range then this might mean that some viewers would inevitably have to replace aerials with those of a wideband type.
Looks like RF channels 33/35 from Crystal Palace,for these services,see the PDF.
http://stakeholders.ofcom.org.uk/con...ward/statement
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Old 16-07-2013, 14:11
d'@ve
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And from the Ofcom press release:

"Arqiva has indicated that the new channels will be broadcast to up to 70% of the UK population – above the minimum requirement of 50%."
http://media.ofcom.org.uk/2013/07/16...errestrial-tv/

Also this space is only available until 2018, what happens to the HD services then?

However BBC Three HD and CBBC HD will presumably be using the space that the BBC have been trying to sell off for some time, which is currently being used for BBC Red Button HD.
Presumably by then everyone will have realised that broadcasting over the airwaves is sooo 20th Century and the great IPTV Switchover will be underway!
UK fibre coverage will by 2018 exceed the terrestrial HD coverage (67% fibre by 2014) so I agree with you that IPTV is the 'terrestrial' future.

If I had to decide, I'd sell off the terrestrial TV bandwidth altogether to mobile phone companies and use the money to push fibre to the rest of the Country. It wouldn't surprise me to discover that if they did that, fibre could achieve a similar or better coverage than Freeview.

IPTV via fibre could handle an unlimited number of HD channels, in theory, including all the BBC regions. As you say, it's the terrestrial future.
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Old 16-07-2013, 14:15
ntscuser
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Only two of them (BBC News and BBC Four/CBeebies). BBC Three/CBBC will use the space currently occupied by Red Button HD.
My understanding is that BBC News24 will be using the space currently occupied by Red Button HD...

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-23326709
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Old 16-07-2013, 14:20
mossy2103
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Not forgotten - but the fact they haven't made an announcement points to the possibility they won't be introduced before the BBC channels.
Or that the BBC announcement was timed to coincide with the release of the BBC's Annual Report & Accounts (but the lack of any word concerning C4 on either the Arqiva or Ofcom Press Release does point more to C4 not being ready to commit)
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Old 16-07-2013, 14:22
mossy2103
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My understanding is that BBC News24 will be using the space currently occupied by Red Button HD...

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-23326709
I think that you are wrong there. From that link:

Two of the BBC's new channels - BBC Three HD and CBBC HD - will utilise existing unused capacity,
so that indicates the Red Button capacity surely.

The BBC Press Release states that BBC News channel will be on new capacity:

On digital terrestrial television (Freeview HD and YouView), BBC Three HD and CBBC HD will use capacity on the BBC’s existing HD multiplex, which has 98.5 per cent coverage of UK homes. BBC News HD, BBC Four HD and CBeebies HD will use new HD capacity,
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Old 16-07-2013, 14:29
ntscuser
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I think that you are wrong there. From that link:



so that indicates the Red Button capacity surely.

The BBC Press Release states that BBC News channel will be on new capacity:
I stand corrected. Probably should have worn my reading glasses
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Old 16-07-2013, 15:24
dj999
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and yet this is the company that cut back on red button services
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Old 16-07-2013, 15:38
technologist
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Because the organistion representing the LF payer pointed out the spend ...and told them to do something
But the executive then planned and are launching a very cost effective and far more widespread RB service.
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Old 16-07-2013, 16:37
MeMeMeI
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Freeview needs more new content not just endless repeats of existing channels done in HD..
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Old 16-07-2013, 16:45
mossy2103
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Freeview needs more new content not just endless repeats of existing channels done in HD..
Except that, generally, whenever Freeview space has become available, new content channels have not launched.

You cannot force the market to do what it does not want to do, especially if it does not see as a profitable move, or if contracts with other platforms preclude a DTT launch.

The fifth HD channel space seems to have had no takers, even allowing for the space being used for a number of SD channels.

And, since the disappearance of the BBC HD channel, many folk on DS have been calling for BBC Three HD, BBC Four HD, a return of BBC HD, BBC News HD, Cbeebies HD, CBBC HD ......
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Old 16-07-2013, 16:47
noise747
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Presumably by then everyone will have realised that broadcasting over the airwaves is sooo 20th Century and the great IPTV Switchover will be underway!
LOL, yeah that is really going to work with broadband in the 3Mb/s or less range, come to think of it it is not going to work in families if you got 10Mb/s

I think you should have thought about that a little bit more.
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Old 16-07-2013, 16:49
noise747
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Right, so people will have to buy a new Tv set or box again. for crying out loud do they think people are made of money?
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Old 16-07-2013, 16:52
noise747
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Why do people want the news in HD? TBH, Hd is pretty naff on Freeview and not much better on Dsat, Most channels are broadcast at the lowest quality they can get away with, and that includes SD,.
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Old 16-07-2013, 17:18
mossy2103
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LOL, yeah that is really going to work with broadband in the 3Mb/s or less range, come to think of it it is not going to work in families if you got 10Mb/s

I think you should have thought about that a little bit more.
You are right, but sadly some people seem wedded to the idea of IPTV, whilst ignoring those irritances (as well as the minor problem of an ongoing cost, and that every household that wanted IPTV would have to sign up to a fibre broadband package (if available in their vicinity of course)
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Old 16-07-2013, 17:32
MeMeMeI
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That's the thing lots of people just think IPTV but many places cannot get a good enough line speed or afford the added cost of Fibre broadband..

How many of the roughly 10.3 million Freeview homes might want or like a low cost Pay TV service on DTT as a addition, instead of having to subscribe to IPTV, SKY or Cable.. ?
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