Nokia make €115m loss in 2nd quarter as it sells almost 3 Million less Smartphones

Everything Goes · 18-07-2013, 17:06

Nokia make €115m loss in the 2nd quarter of 2013 and has managed to sell less SmartPhones year on year.

Nokia's Lumia range of Windows Phone sales hit an all time high of 7.4 million for the quarter. Unfortunately this is below the 10.2 million sales it posted a year ago, when it was still selling Symbian devices.

Feature Phones continued to outperform smartphones, with the division posting sales of Eu1.40bn, down 39% on 2012.

http://www.mobiletoday.co.uk/News/25....D6Np5AZe.dpuf

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-23353959

swordman · 18-07-2013, 17:14

Windows phone just don't seem to be doing it for some reason. 7 million is pretty poor given just one model of their rivals trounce that.

I always expect WP to take off at least to some degree just never seems to happen.

Still could be worse they could be BB

enapace · 18-07-2013, 17:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by Everything Goes

Nokia make €115m loss in the 2nd quarter of 2013 and has managed to sell less SmartPhones year on year.

Nokia's Lumia range of Windows Phone sales hit an all time high of 7.4 million for the quarter. Unfortunately this is below the 10.2 million sales it posted a year ago, when it was still selling Symbian devices.

Feature Phones continued to outperform smartphones, with the division posting sales of Eu1.40bn, down 39% on 2012.

http://www.mobiletoday.co.uk/News/25....D6Np5AZe.dpuf

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-23353959

Ouch this a blow not just for nokia but for microsoft as well with them being the principle supplier of windows phones. Seems like WP8 isn't convincing enough for a lot of people to leave android/ios.

The Lord Lucan · 18-07-2013, 18:10

Ouch. Keep hoping Nokia get THE phone that will turn things around. Rarely see them in the wild and Windows just seems to have a stigma about it, unjustifiably so.

I wonder if say the 1020 were on Android.. would it sell a huge percentage more. Unlikely going by HTC who have one of the top 3 flagship phones on Android.

Nokia would have to ditch Windows totally and it would be such a huge risk that it would likely kill them off totally if it were anything but hugely successful. Hopefully someone will step in, they are a patent chest and have the right R&D/design team.

enapace · 18-07-2013, 18:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Lord Lucan

Ouch. Keep hoping Nokia get THE phone that will turn things around. Rarely see them in the wild and Windows just seems to have a stigma about it, unjustifiably so.

I wonder if say the 1020 were on Android.. would it sell a huge percentage more. Unlikely going by HTC who have one of the top 3 flagship phones on Android.

Nokia would have to ditch Windows totally and it would be such a huge risk that it would likely kill them off totally if it were anything but hugely successful. Hopefully someone will step in, they are a patent chest and have the right R&D/design team.

Can't they do something similar to HTC and make android and windows phone like HTC have made a sprint only HTC 8XT I believe it is called has beats audio a major selling point of the HTC one but includes WP8. I know it not a major thing but something similar to that for the 1020 an android equivalent of that. WP8 isn't selling to much better than BB10 at the moment. They do have a good basis in phones problem is that WP8 doesn't seem to have appealed to a lot of people [I like some parts like people hub but not the rest]. WP8 looks like it is going be a niche market and HTC and Samsung's way of selling it looks like the best option.

Stig · 18-07-2013, 18:21

It's amazing how people can make a news story positive or negative.

Here is the same story, with a positive spin:

Nokia sold 7.4 million Lumia phones in the recent quarter, its best performance so far, beating last quarter's record of 5.6 million.
It also managed to reduce its overall losses significantly, with the firm reporting a €227 million loss (around £196 million), from €1.2 billion this time last year.

swordman · 18-07-2013, 18:28

If WP8 doesn't fill the void left by other phones they will be in trouble not really a case of spin. 7 million WP's is not a lot that's a simple fact.

Zack06 · 18-07-2013, 18:34

Regardless of any positive or negative sales, the situation with Windows Phone must be terrifying for Microsoft and now Nokia who bet everything on it.

3 years have gone by now and Windows Phone has not shown any signs of becoming a viable competitor in the mobile market. iOS was an instant success thanks to the iPhone, and Android blew up within a year despite an iOS dominated market.

Windows Phone on the other hand has just not picked up. Nokia and HTC marketed it quite heavily, and Samsung and LG also do WP phones but it just seems like no-one is really interested. The Lumia is not the hit device the platform needed to take off. I'm not sure what could kickstart Windows Phone and save Nokia at this stage to be honest.

Nokia should really be looking to break off some of those Microsoft chains and diversify their mobile line-up. It definitely would not hurt them to add an Android device alongside their Lumia range.

enapace · 18-07-2013, 18:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zack06

Regardless of any positive or negative sales, the situation with Windows Phone must be terrifying for Microsoft and now Nokia who bet everything on it.

3 years have gone by now and Windows Phone has not shown any signs of becoming a viable competitor in the mobile market. iOS was an instant success thanks to the iPhone, and Android blew up within a year despite an iOS dominated market.

Windows Phone on the other hand has just not picked up. Nokia and HTC marketed it quite heavily, and Samsung and LG also do WP phones but it just seems like no-one is really interested. The Lumia is not the hit device the platform needed to take off. I'm not sure what could kickstart Windows Phone and save Nokia at this stage to be honest.

Nokia should really be looking to break off some of those Microsoft chains and diversify their mobile line-up. It definitely would not hurt them to add an Android device alongside their Lumia range.

Agreed they do need add a couple of android devices but can't see it happening they are to focused on microsoft links.

Stig · 18-07-2013, 18:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zack06

Regardless of any positive or negative sales, the situation with Windows Phone must be terrifying for Microsoft and now Nokia who bet everything on it.

3 years have gone by now and Windows Phone has not shown any signs of becoming a viable competitor in the mobile market. iOS was an instant success thanks to the iPhone, and Android blew up within a year despite an iOS dominated market.

I think you will find that Windows Phone has overtaken Blackberry to become the 3rd most popular phone OS. The demise of Blackberry could be very significant as the providers of corporate mobiles look to see what will be replacing them.

Zack06 · 18-07-2013, 19:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stig

I think you will find that Windows Phone has overtaken Blackberry to become the 3rd most popular phone OS. The demise of Blackberry could be very significant as the providers of corporate mobiles look to see what will be replacing them.

I think that's not really a positive. Blackberry have been on a downward spiral for years now. It's concerning that it has taken Windows Phone this long to even overtake Blackberry. With all the promotion and money Microsoft and its partners have thrown at Windows Phone, it's kind of sad that Blackberry still managed to hold off Windows Phone for such a long time despite their own dramas.

Alarm bells should really be ringing for Nokia now, Windows Phone is not the lifeboat they thought it was. They could very well have jumped out of the frying pan and into the fire.

Zee_Bukhari · 18-07-2013, 19:14

People are getting confused, it is 7.4 Million Nokia Windows Phone's not 7.4 Million Windows Phones.

Zee_Bukhari · 18-07-2013, 19:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zack06

I think that's not really a positive. Blackberry have been on a downward spiral for years now. It's concerning that it has taken Windows Phone this long to even overtake Blackberry. With all the promotion and money Microsoft and its partners have thrown at Windows Phone, it's kind of sad that Blackberry still managed to hold off Windows Phone for such a long time despite their own dramas.

Alarm bells should really be ringing for Nokia now, Windows Phone is not the lifeboat they thought it was. They could very well have jumped out of the frying pan and into the fire.

Windows Phone has only been around for about 2.5 years, give it time, its growing.

booie · 18-07-2013, 19:27

To Nokia,
Make Android phones

Simples!!

The Lord Lucan · 18-07-2013, 19:27

iOS was such a success because of two things it was massive change of direction ie the whole iPhone package and second the app store/iTunes again although not new in an easy package.

This market is not the same, it's far different and even Apple is finding it hard. Nokia need to do both Android and Win8. I'm guessing they have huge contractual issues with Microsoft though.

Any idea of the sales difference between HTC's dual OS phone models?

Stig · 18-07-2013, 19:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zee_Bukhari

People are getting confused, it is 7.4 Million Nokia Windows Phone's not 7.4 Million Windows Phones.

Also, see how long it took Apple to sell 7 million iPhones in a quarter:

http://www.statista.com/statistics/1...-quarter-2007/

swordman · 18-07-2013, 19:51

Without even looking at that I know you will be comparing apples with oranges, the smartphone market bears not resemblance now to even 18 months ago let alone when the iphone launched.

clonmult · 18-07-2013, 21:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by booie

To Nokia,
Make Android phones

Simples!!

So the 1020 running Android would automatically sell?

I don't see how; the only companies doing well out of Android are ... Samsung and Google.

HTC and Sony aren't selling that well, despite having some darned good looking kit.

Zack06 · 18-07-2013, 21:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zee_Bukhari

Windows Phone has only been around for about 2.5 years, give it time, its growing.

In that same amount of time, Android had already become a real threat to iOS. It just doesn't seem to be happening for Windows Phone.

enapace · 18-07-2013, 21:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by clonmult

So the 1020 running Android would automatically sell?

I don't see how; the only companies doing well out of Android are ... Samsung and Google.

HTC and Sony aren't selling that well, despite having some darned good looking kit.

Not perhaps that but I think a variety on Android would sell well to do both would be the best idea.

Zee_Bukhari · 18-07-2013, 21:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zack06

In that same amount of time, Android had already become a real threat to iOS. It just doesn't seem to be happening for Windows Phone.

Its to do with the manufacturer. If Samsung, HTC, Sony were to launch all their handsets on Windows Phone, then Android would soon go down.

Nokia is the only real company pushing Windows Phone, all those people at the time were in 2 year contracts, those contracts will soon come to an end, many people don't want to commit to another long term contract and end up keeping their old device.

clonmult · 18-07-2013, 22:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by enapace

Not perhaps that but I think a variety on Android would sell well to do both would be the best idea.

The only way you can get Android running on Nokia hardware is unofficial - the N900 can boot up Android, Maemo, Meego ...

As for something official, as long as Nokia are under the control of MS, its just not going to happen

doom&gloom · 18-07-2013, 22:29

Nokia has shareholders though, you would think they would force Nokia to change direction and start selling Android phones.

Everything Goes · 18-07-2013, 22:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by doom&gloom

Nokia has shareholders though, you would think they would force Nokia to change direction and start selling Android phones.

That happened at the last financial results

Quote:

Shareholder Hannu Virtanen told Elop: 'You're a nice guy ... and the leadership team is doing its best, but clearly, it's not enough...Are you aware that results are what matter? The road to hell is paved with good intentions. Please switch to another road.'

However, Elop defended his strategy and said the business was on the right track. He said: 'We make adjustments as we go. But it's very clear to us that in today's war of ecosystems, we've made a very clear decision to focus on Windows Phone with our Lumia product line. And it is with that that we will compete with competitors like Samsung and [Google's operating system] Android.'

http://www.mobiletoday.co.uk/News/25...d_to_hell.aspx

http://forums.digitalspy.co.uk/showt...ia+shareholder

clonmult · 18-07-2013, 22:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by doom&gloom

Nokia has shareholders though, you would think they would force Nokia to change direction and start selling Android phones.

Consider that they just spent 1.7 billion buying out of NSN.

1.7 billion spent, yet they only made a 155 million loss? Thats actually not too bad - if it wasn't for that, they would have probably done quite well (by their recent standards).

And the NSN buyout is playing the longer game - thats betting on large take up of LTE, of which Nokia will be one of the larger providers.

Slapping Android on devices does not automatically make something sell unless you happen to be Samsung.

18-07-2013, 17:06	#1
Everything Goes Forum Member Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: In the future.... Posts: 11,259	Nokia make €115m loss in 2nd quarter as it sells almost 3 Million less Smartphones Nokia make €115m loss in the 2nd quarter of 2013 and has managed to sell less SmartPhones year on year. Nokia's Lumia range of Windows Phone sales hit an all time high of 7.4 million for the quarter. Unfortunately this is below the 10.2 million sales it posted a year ago, when it was still selling Symbian devices. Feature Phones continued to outperform smartphones, with the division posting sales of Eu1.40bn, down 39% on 2012. http://www.mobiletoday.co.uk/News/25....D6Np5AZe.dpuf http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-23353959

18-07-2013, 17:14	#2
swordman Forum Member Join Date: Oct 2010 Posts: 6,342	Windows phone just don't seem to be doing it for some reason. 7 million is pretty poor given just one model of their rivals trounce that. I always expect WP to take off at least to some degree just never seems to happen. Still could be worse they could be BB

18-07-2013, 17:16	#3
enapace Forum Member Join Date: Mar 2013 Posts: 4,249	Quote: Originally Posted by Everything Goes Nokia make €115m loss in the 2nd quarter of 2013 and has managed to sell less SmartPhones year on year. Nokia's Lumia range of Windows Phone sales hit an all time high of 7.4 million for the quarter. Unfortunately this is below the 10.2 million sales it posted a year ago, when it was still selling Symbian devices. Feature Phones continued to outperform smartphones, with the division posting sales of Eu1.40bn, down 39% on 2012. http://www.mobiletoday.co.uk/News/25....D6Np5AZe.dpuf http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-23353959 Ouch this a blow not just for nokia but for microsoft as well with them being the principle supplier of windows phones. Seems like WP8 isn't convincing enough for a lot of people to leave android/ios.

18-07-2013, 18:10	#4
The Lord Lucan Forum Member Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Scotland Posts: 4,966	Ouch. Keep hoping Nokia get THE phone that will turn things around. Rarely see them in the wild and Windows just seems to have a stigma about it, unjustifiably so. I wonder if say the 1020 were on Android.. would it sell a huge percentage more. Unlikely going by HTC who have one of the top 3 flagship phones on Android. Nokia would have to ditch Windows totally and it would be such a huge risk that it would likely kill them off totally if it were anything but hugely successful. Hopefully someone will step in, they are a patent chest and have the right R&D/design team.

18-07-2013, 18:19	#5
enapace Forum Member Join Date: Mar 2013 Posts: 4,249	Quote: Originally Posted by The Lord Lucan Ouch. Keep hoping Nokia get THE phone that will turn things around. Rarely see them in the wild and Windows just seems to have a stigma about it, unjustifiably so. I wonder if say the 1020 were on Android.. would it sell a huge percentage more. Unlikely going by HTC who have one of the top 3 flagship phones on Android. Nokia would have to ditch Windows totally and it would be such a huge risk that it would likely kill them off totally if it were anything but hugely successful. Hopefully someone will step in, they are a patent chest and have the right R&D/design team. Can't they do something similar to HTC and make android and windows phone like HTC have made a sprint only HTC 8XT I believe it is called has beats audio a major selling point of the HTC one but includes WP8. I know it not a major thing but something similar to that for the 1020 an android equivalent of that. WP8 isn't selling to much better than BB10 at the moment. They do have a good basis in phones problem is that WP8 doesn't seem to have appealed to a lot of people [I like some parts like people hub but not the rest]. WP8 looks like it is going be a niche market and HTC and Samsung's way of selling it looks like the best option.

18-07-2013, 18:21	#6
Stig Forum Member Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Sandy Heath, Beds. UK Posts: 10,383	It's amazing how people can make a news story positive or negative. Here is the same story, with a positive spin: Nokia sold 7.4 million Lumia phones in the recent quarter, its best performance so far, beating last quarter's record of 5.6 million. It also managed to reduce its overall losses significantly, with the firm reporting a €227 million loss (around £196 million), from €1.2 billion this time last year.

18-07-2013, 18:28	#7
swordman Forum Member Join Date: Oct 2010 Posts: 6,342	If WP8 doesn't fill the void left by other phones they will be in trouble not really a case of spin. 7 million WP's is not a lot that's a simple fact.

18-07-2013, 18:34	#8
Zack06 Forum Member Join Date: Aug 2009 Posts: 27,438	Regardless of any positive or negative sales, the situation with Windows Phone must be terrifying for Microsoft and now Nokia who bet everything on it. 3 years have gone by now and Windows Phone has not shown any signs of becoming a viable competitor in the mobile market. iOS was an instant success thanks to the iPhone, and Android blew up within a year despite an iOS dominated market. Windows Phone on the other hand has just not picked up. Nokia and HTC marketed it quite heavily, and Samsung and LG also do WP phones but it just seems like no-one is really interested. The Lumia is not the hit device the platform needed to take off. I'm not sure what could kickstart Windows Phone and save Nokia at this stage to be honest. Nokia should really be looking to break off some of those Microsoft chains and diversify their mobile line-up. It definitely would not hurt them to add an Android device alongside their Lumia range.

18-07-2013, 18:48	#9
enapace Forum Member Join Date: Mar 2013 Posts: 4,249	Quote: Originally Posted by Zack06 Regardless of any positive or negative sales, the situation with Windows Phone must be terrifying for Microsoft and now Nokia who bet everything on it. 3 years have gone by now and Windows Phone has not shown any signs of becoming a viable competitor in the mobile market. iOS was an instant success thanks to the iPhone, and Android blew up within a year despite an iOS dominated market. Windows Phone on the other hand has just not picked up. Nokia and HTC marketed it quite heavily, and Samsung and LG also do WP phones but it just seems like no-one is really interested. The Lumia is not the hit device the platform needed to take off. I'm not sure what could kickstart Windows Phone and save Nokia at this stage to be honest. Nokia should really be looking to break off some of those Microsoft chains and diversify their mobile line-up. It definitely would not hurt them to add an Android device alongside their Lumia range. Agreed they do need add a couple of android devices but can't see it happening they are to focused on microsoft links.

18-07-2013, 18:58	#10
Stig Forum Member Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Sandy Heath, Beds. UK Posts: 10,383	Quote: Originally Posted by Zack06 Regardless of any positive or negative sales, the situation with Windows Phone must be terrifying for Microsoft and now Nokia who bet everything on it. 3 years have gone by now and Windows Phone has not shown any signs of becoming a viable competitor in the mobile market. iOS was an instant success thanks to the iPhone, and Android blew up within a year despite an iOS dominated market. I think you will find that Windows Phone has overtaken Blackberry to become the 3rd most popular phone OS. The demise of Blackberry could be very significant as the providers of corporate mobiles look to see what will be replacing them.

18-07-2013, 19:05	#11
Zack06 Forum Member Join Date: Aug 2009 Posts: 27,438	Quote: Originally Posted by Stig I think you will find that Windows Phone has overtaken Blackberry to become the 3rd most popular phone OS. The demise of Blackberry could be very significant as the providers of corporate mobiles look to see what will be replacing them. I think that's not really a positive. Blackberry have been on a downward spiral for years now. It's concerning that it has taken Windows Phone this long to even overtake Blackberry. With all the promotion and money Microsoft and its partners have thrown at Windows Phone, it's kind of sad that Blackberry still managed to hold off Windows Phone for such a long time despite their own dramas. Alarm bells should really be ringing for Nokia now, Windows Phone is not the lifeboat they thought it was. They could very well have jumped out of the frying pan and into the fire.

18-07-2013, 19:14	#12
Zee_Bukhari Forum Member Join Date: Apr 2013 Posts: 1,319	People are getting confused, it is 7.4 Million Nokia Windows Phone's not 7.4 Million Windows Phones.

18-07-2013, 19:15	#13
Zee_Bukhari Forum Member Join Date: Apr 2013 Posts: 1,319	Quote: Originally Posted by Zack06 I think that's not really a positive. Blackberry have been on a downward spiral for years now. It's concerning that it has taken Windows Phone this long to even overtake Blackberry. With all the promotion and money Microsoft and its partners have thrown at Windows Phone, it's kind of sad that Blackberry still managed to hold off Windows Phone for such a long time despite their own dramas. Alarm bells should really be ringing for Nokia now, Windows Phone is not the lifeboat they thought it was. They could very well have jumped out of the frying pan and into the fire. Windows Phone has only been around for about 2.5 years, give it time, its growing.

18-07-2013, 19:27	#14
booie Forum Member Join Date: Dec 2002 Posts: 370	To Nokia, Make Android phones Simples!!

18-07-2013, 19:41	#16
Stig Forum Member Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Sandy Heath, Beds. UK Posts: 10,383	Quote: Originally Posted by Zee_Bukhari People are getting confused, it is 7.4 Million Nokia Windows Phone's not 7.4 Million Windows Phones. Also, see how long it took Apple to sell 7 million iPhones in a quarter: http://www.statista.com/statistics/1...-quarter-2007/

18-07-2013, 19:51	#17
swordman Forum Member Join Date: Oct 2010 Posts: 6,342	Without even looking at that I know you will be comparing apples with oranges, the smartphone market bears not resemblance now to even 18 months ago let alone when the iphone launched.

18-07-2013, 21:04	#18
clonmult Forum Member Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: UK Posts: 3,291	Quote: Originally Posted by booie To Nokia, Make Android phones Simples!! So the 1020 running Android would automatically sell? I don't see how; the only companies doing well out of Android are ... Samsung and Google. HTC and Sony aren't selling that well, despite having some darned good looking kit.

18-07-2013, 21:11	#19
Zack06 Forum Member Join Date: Aug 2009 Posts: 27,438	Quote: Originally Posted by Zee_Bukhari Windows Phone has only been around for about 2.5 years, give it time, its growing. In that same amount of time, Android had already become a real threat to iOS. It just doesn't seem to be happening for Windows Phone.

18-07-2013, 21:16	#20
enapace Forum Member Join Date: Mar 2013 Posts: 4,249	Quote: Originally Posted by clonmult So the 1020 running Android would automatically sell? I don't see how; the only companies doing well out of Android are ... Samsung and Google. HTC and Sony aren't selling that well, despite having some darned good looking kit. Not perhaps that but I think a variety on Android would sell well to do both would be the best idea.

18-07-2013, 21:40	#21
Zee_Bukhari Forum Member Join Date: Apr 2013 Posts: 1,319	Quote: Originally Posted by Zack06 In that same amount of time, Android had already become a real threat to iOS. It just doesn't seem to be happening for Windows Phone. Its to do with the manufacturer. If Samsung, HTC, Sony were to launch all their handsets on Windows Phone, then Android would soon go down. Nokia is the only real company pushing Windows Phone, all those people at the time were in 2 year contracts, those contracts will soon come to an end, many people don't want to commit to another long term contract and end up keeping their old device.

18-07-2013, 22:12	#22
clonmult Forum Member Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: UK Posts: 3,291	Quote: Originally Posted by enapace Not perhaps that but I think a variety on Android would sell well to do both would be the best idea. The only way you can get Android running on Nokia hardware is unofficial - the N900 can boot up Android, Maemo, Meego ... As for something official, as long as Nokia are under the control of MS, its just not going to happen

DS Forums

Nokia make €115m loss in 2nd quarter as it sells almost 3 Million less Smartphones

18-07-2013, 22:29	#23
doom&gloom Inactive Member Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 8,791	Nokia has shareholders though, you would think they would force Nokia to change direction and start selling Android phones.

18-07-2013, 22:44	#24
Everything Goes Forum Member Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: In the future.... Posts: 11,259	Quote: Originally Posted by doom&gloom Nokia has shareholders though, you would think they would force Nokia to change direction and start selling Android phones. That happened at the last financial results Quote: Shareholder Hannu Virtanen told Elop: 'You're a nice guy ... and the leadership team is doing its best, but clearly, it's not enough...Are you aware that results are what matter? The road to hell is paved with good intentions. Please switch to another road.' However, Elop defended his strategy and said the business was on the right track. He said: 'We make adjustments as we go. But it's very clear to us that in today's war of ecosystems, we've made a very clear decision to focus on Windows Phone with our Lumia product line. And it is with that that we will compete with competitors like Samsung and [Google's operating system] Android.' http://www.mobiletoday.co.uk/News/25...d_to_hell.aspx http://forums.digitalspy.co.uk/showt...ia+shareholder

18-07-2013, 22:47	#25
clonmult Forum Member Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: UK Posts: 3,291	Quote: Originally Posted by doom&gloom Nokia has shareholders though, you would think they would force Nokia to change direction and start selling Android phones. Consider that they just spent 1.7 billion buying out of NSN. 1.7 billion spent, yet they only made a 155 million loss? Thats actually not too bad - if it wasn't for that, they would have probably done quite well (by their recent standards). And the NSN buyout is playing the longer game - thats betting on large take up of LTE, of which Nokia will be one of the larger providers. Slapping Android on devices does not automatically make something sell unless you happen to be Samsung.