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BT Sports Channel (Part 2)
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centuryporter
18-08-2014
Originally Posted by Cricketblade:
“Just me who's not offended or even that bothered by his co commentary? Some people need to chill out a bit in my opinion!”

I'm sorry but he really is truly awful i've switched over because his commentary is that bad
casinoman13
18-08-2014
Originally Posted by Igloo_Man:
“I wonder if there may be some sort of partnership between BT and BeIn when it comes to the CL and commentators?

I believe Sky and BeIn share commentaries at present for the CL, and this may be something worth looking at for BT - their loan of Andy Gray in the FA Cup last season indicates there's certainly room for some form of relationship. The best thing about such a partnership would be that BT wouldn't be able to fill their broadcast of the games with promotion of upcoming content!

Even without BeIn I reckon we could have a very strong roster of commentators on BT. Indeed the likes of Darke, Fletcher, Rae, Drury, Wilson and Pearce are all very much realistic possibilities.”

I could not agree more with that, ive said for a while now if it remains as it is at the moment then I would fully believe those commentators would be used and like you say it would be quite a decent line up, I would also include Steve Bower to that list.
mlt11
18-08-2014
Originally Posted by Gibsy:
“Forgive my ignorance here, but am I missing something? How can those figures be classed as impressive when you factor in ALL of BT Broadband customers get the channel free...how many households is that when you factor in Virgin XL customers.”

We don't know precisely but reports suggest approx 5 million households are receiving BT Sport:

- Just under 2m VM XL
- Approx or slightly more than 2m BT broadband for free (out of 7m BT broadband homes)
- Balance of approx 1m paying subs

Originally Posted by Gibsy:
“On a slightly different matter, has it ever been discussed what ROCE BT are receiving by the investments made in BT Sport? Yes they are stemming the loss of broadband customers but has it actually been worth it considering the amount paid out for rights.”

I wouldn't look at it in terms of ROCE because BT Sport isn't a highly capital intensive business - sports rights are a cost charged to the P&L as incurred. Investment in fixed assets is minimal.

It's a common misconception (fuelled by various media articles) that BT was losing broadband customers - it wasn't - it has consistently been growing its number of broadband customers every single quarter for many, many years.

It's hard to assess BT Sport because it all depends upon how the business would have done without it. However we can say that in the first year of BT Sport:

- BT's Consumer business has grown its revenues for the first time for many, many years
- Line losses have been massively reduced
- Market share of broadband net additions has risen substantially

In terms of profitability, BT Consumer EBITDA was down 14% for the year as a whole (y/e 31/03/14) though arguably it might have fallen anyway without BTS. In the final quarter (to 31/03/14), EBITDA was up 5%.

Slides 21 and 22:

http://www.btplc.com/Sharesandperfor...414-slides.pdf

In the first quarter of the current financial year (quarter ending 30/06/14), Consumer EBITDA rose 3% and revenue growth accelerated further.

Slide 16:

http://www.btplc.com/Sharesandperfor...114-slides.pdf

Adding in the factor that there were significant one-off launch costs for BTS in year 1, I think the fact that Consumer EBITDA is turning upwards (albeit only marginally) is evidence to suggest BTS can be considered at least broadly successful so far.

There is also the positive benefit on the Openreach business - this is hard to measure but it certainly has to be a positive to some degree (ie which is on top of what we see in the Consumer Division numbers posted above).
Igloo_Man
18-08-2014
Originally Posted by casinoman13:
“I could not agree more with that, ive said for a while now if it remains as it is at the moment then I would fully believe those commentators would be used and like you say it would be quite a decent line up, I would also include Steve Bower to that list.”

Of course what I've conveniently not mentioned is the likely co-comm line-up!
casinoman13
18-08-2014
Originally Posted by Igloo_Man:
“Of course what I've conveniently not mentioned is the likely co-comm line-up! ”

Well you might as well put names in a hat for that!
Gibsy
18-08-2014
Originally Posted by Igloo_Man:
“Of course what I've conveniently not mentioned is the likely co-comm line-up! ”

Originally Posted by mlt11:
“We don't know precisely but reports suggest approx 5 million households are receiving BT Sport:

- Just under 2m VM XL
- Approx or slightly more than 2m BT broadband for free (out of 7m BT broadband homes)
- Balance of approx 1m paying subs



I wouldn't look at it in terms of ROCE because BT Sport isn't a highly capital intensive business - sports rights are a cost charged to the P&L as incurred. Investment in fixed assets is minimal.

It's a common misconception (fuelled by various media articles) that BT was losing broadband customers - it wasn't - it has consistently been growing its number of broadband customers every single quarter for many, many years.

It's hard to assess BT Sport because it all depends upon how the business would have done without it. However we can say that in the first year of BT Sport:

- BT's Consumer business has grown its revenues for the first time for many, many years
- Line losses have been massively reduced
- Market share of broadband net additions has risen substantially

In terms of profitability, BT Consumer EBITDA was down 14% for the year as a whole (y/e 31/03/14) though arguably it might have fallen anyway without BTS. In the final quarter (to 31/03/14), EBITDA was up 5%.

Slides 21 and 22:

http://www.btplc.com/Sharesandperfor...414-slides.pdf

In the first quarter of the current financial year (quarter ending 30/06/14), Consumer EBITDA rose 3% and revenue growth accelerated further.

Slide 16:

http://www.btplc.com/Sharesandperfor...114-slides.pdf

Adding in the factor that there were significant one-off launch costs for BTS in year 1, I think the fact that Consumer EBITDA is turning upwards (albeit only marginally) is evidence to suggest BTS can be considered at least broadly successful so far.

There is also the positive benefit on the Openreach business - this is hard to measure but it certainly has to be a positive to some degree (ie which is on top of what we see in the Consumer Division numbers posted above).”

Really comprehensive response - Thanks
foxinthebox
18-08-2014
Interesting that as part of the European Football show this week it is Boavista v Benfica that is the main game at 7.30, with Nantes v Monaco on BT Sport 2
wal28
19-08-2014
Maybe BT reckon that Boavista are still in the Champions League
Gray77
19-08-2014
Originally Posted by foxinthebox:
“Interesting that as part of the European Football show this week it is Boavista v Benfica that is the main game at 7.30, with Nantes v Monaco on BT Sport 2”

Maybe they feel the need to have the Portuguese league 'headline' the EFS to make it look like they are treating it seriously. It probably has something to do with Serie A starting the week after and that dominating the main Sunday night slot thereafter. It's a good chance to showcase the Portuguese league before it gets shunted off to BTS2 or ESPN for the remainder of the Autumn.
PaulLFC
19-08-2014
Originally Posted by Gray77:
“Maybe they feel the need to have the Portuguese league 'headline' the EFS to make it look like they are treating it seriously. It probably has something to do with Serie A starting the week after and that dominating the main Sunday night slot thereafter. It's a good chance to showcase the Portuguese league before it gets shunted off to BTS2 or ESPN for the remainder of the Autumn.”

Yes I think that will be it, maybe also that they don't want to show Monaco as their featured game 3 weeks in a row.
LOSG
19-08-2014
Wonder if they'll get a Portuguese Journo in and maybe put Julien on BTS2.
PaulLFC
19-08-2014
Originally Posted by LOSG:
“Wonder if they'll get a Portuguese Journo in and maybe put Julien on BTS2.”

Julien is apparently quite knowledgeable about the Primeira Liga, they've asked him about it a couple of times in past weeks too, so I assume they'll just keep him on EFS. The Monaco match is only scheduled for 2 hours which usually means they don't bother with studio coverage.
promo-only
19-08-2014
Originally Posted by Igloo_Man:
“I wonder if there may be some sort of partnership between BT and BeIn when it comes to the CL and commentators?

I believe Sky and BeIn share commentaries at present for the CL, and this may be something worth looking at for BT - their loan of Andy Gray in the FA Cup last season indicates there's certainly room for some form of relationship. The best thing about such a partnership would be that BT wouldn't be able to fill their broadcast of the games with promotion of upcoming content!

Even without BeIn I reckon we could have a very strong roster of commentators on BT. Indeed the likes of Darke, Fletcher, Rae, Drury, Wilson and Pearce are all very much realistic possibilities.”

beIN Sports doesn't have it's own English language commentary teams - it always uses the world feeds. The only 'in-house' comms teams it has are all Arabic for coverage on beIN Sports 1 etc - everything English goes out on beIN Sports 11. They bring in English studio guests but none of those are exclusive and can all be seen working on UK TV regularly.

As for the sharing of CL comms - the Sky commentary goes out worldwide. It's certainly carried right across MENA and Sub-Saharan Africa on beIN Sports and SuperSport as well as the majority of other English-speaking countries. Not sure if it's in an official capacity or not but I'm pretty sure Sky effectively handle the English comms for the rest of the world.
Igloo_Man
19-08-2014
Originally Posted by promo-only:
“beIN Sports doesn't have it's own English language commentary teams - it always uses the world feeds. The only 'in-house' comms teams it has are all Arabic for coverage on beIN Sports 1 etc - everything English goes out on beIN Sports 11. They bring in English studio guests but none of those are exclusive and can all be seen working on UK TV regularly.

As for the sharing of CL comms - the Sky commentary goes out worldwide. It's certainly carried right across MENA and Sub-Saharan Africa on beIN Sports and SuperSport as well as the majority of other English-speaking countries. Not sure if it's in an official capacity or not but I'm pretty sure Sky effectively handle the English comms for the rest of the world.”

Excellent info.

It will be interesting to see who takes up the task of providing the bulk of the English commentaries around the world once Sky pack in the CL. I wonder if BT would be willing or capable of having their comms used globally? Or perhaps some overseas broadcasters may resort to using UEFA's own audio feeds, if this is possible.

What's for certain is that there are interesting times ahead.
promo-only
19-08-2014
Originally Posted by Igloo_Man:
“Excellent info.

It will be interesting to see who takes up the task of providing the bulk of the English commentaries around the world once Sky pack in the CL. I wonder if BT would be willing or capable of having their comms used globally? Or perhaps some overseas broadcasters may resort to using UEFA's own audio feeds, if this is possible.

What's for certain is that there are interesting times ahead.”

Well that's the thing - as far as I'm aware, there is no UEFA feed as such - they seem to send out the Sky comms around the world so effectively the Sky audio is the 'world feed'. You'll get the odd broadcaster (Fox Sports in the US, for example) who will have their own commentators for the blockbuster games or the main group match each week, but everything else has Sky audio. I imagine the BT team will just take over and become the international English feed from next season.
LOSG
19-08-2014
Originally Posted by promo-only:
“Well that's the thing - as far as I'm aware, there is no UEFA feed as such - they seem to send out the Sky comms around the world so effectively the Sky audio is the 'world feed'. You'll get the odd broadcaster (Fox Sports in the US, for example) who will have their own commentators for the blockbuster games or the main group match each week, but everything else has Sky audio. I imagine the BT team will just take over and become the international English feed from next season.”

There is an official Uefa feed used on its website.

The standard of the uefa feed is low and companies such as Supersport will pay Sky for their commentary. The same applies for the La Liga commentaries which I've seen used on some foreign streams.
Readingfan
19-08-2014
I've not seen anything of Neil Warnock on BT this season - does he still work for them?
PaulLFC
19-08-2014
Originally Posted by Readingfan:
“I've not seen anything of Neil Warnock on BT this season - does he still work for them?”

Hopefully not. The less of Colin on TV the better.
Jonny_Bentley1
19-08-2014
Originally Posted by Readingfan:
“I've not seen anything of Neil Warnock on BT this season - does he still work for them?”

I'm pretty sure he does but he will not be involved in the "big game" coverage. I'd expect him on PL games featuring the lower 13 teams as he as experience as a manager of the smaller PL clubs ie. Aston Villa v Newcastle, QPR v Stoke.
Opening day with Man Utd means heavy focus on Utd so no real need for Warnock's input.
casinoman13
19-08-2014
Originally Posted by Jonny_Bentley1:
“I'm pretty sure he does but he will not be involved in the "big game" coverage. I'd expect him on PL games featuring the lower 13 teams as he as experience as a manager of the smaller PL clubs ie. Aston Villa v Newcastle, QPR v Stoke.
Opening day with Man Utd means heavy focus on Utd so no real need for Warnock's input.”

Really, that's a bit of a come down for him, if he cant comment on bigger games then he may as well move on.
He didn't even do Monday night which was a feature last season for him with Darren Fletcher.
Steve Williams
19-08-2014
Originally Posted by promo-only:
“Well that's the thing - as far as I'm aware, there is no UEFA feed as such - they seem to send out the Sky comms around the world so effectively the Sky audio is the 'world feed'. You'll get the odd broadcaster (Fox Sports in the US, for example) who will have their own commentators for the blockbuster games or the main group match each week, but everything else has Sky audio. I imagine the BT team will just take over and become the international English feed from next season.”

Of course, there's nothing to say that many of the freelancers Sky use won't defect over to BT anyway when they take over the rights. I know Sky like to keep their staff exclusive and have suggested in previous years that if they work for other channels they wouldn't be warmly welcomed back to Sky, but next season BT'll have plenty to offer them so some of them could well decide that they can do without Sky now and just stick with BT and other freelance work.
promo-only
19-08-2014
Originally Posted by LOSG:
“There is an official Uefa feed used on its website.

The standard of the uefa feed is low and companies such as Supersport will pay Sky for their commentary. The same applies for the La Liga commentaries which I've seen used on some foreign streams.”

I'm not sure if that's correct or not but I'll have to take your word on it!

Tonight, again, the English language channels I've checked (Fox Sports 1 & 2 US, beIN Sports 11 MENA, SBS One Australia) are broadcasting the Arsenal and Napoli matches live with the Sky commentary teams.

Originally Posted by Steve Williams:
“Of course, there's nothing to say that many of the freelancers Sky use won't defect over to BT anyway when they take over the rights. I know Sky like to keep their staff exclusive and have suggested in previous years that if they work for other channels they wouldn't be warmly welcomed back to Sky, but next season BT'll have plenty to offer them so some of them could well decide that they can do without Sky now and just stick with BT and other freelance work.”

I thought the majority of them just worked for PLP/IMG. Not sure we'd be able to hear the majority of them on BT because of the Sky UK exclusivity aspect... if they defected to BT then surely the ones that are asked to do CL coverage alongside PL would have to forgo working on the PL world feed because they'd be heard on Sky's Game of the Day and Match Choice in the evening?
The Difference
19-08-2014
Originally Posted by LOSG:
“There is an official Uefa feed used on its website.

The standard of the uefa feed is low and companies such as Supersport will pay Sky for their commentary. The same applies for the La Liga commentaries which I've seen used on some foreign streams.”

UEFA do indeed produce international feed commentaries on Champions League games from the Play-Off Round onwards. I can assure anyone who is sceptical that LOSG is definitely correct to state this.

I know they have been criticised on Digital Spy and elsewhere in the past, but personally I think the standard of the UEFA.com commentaries is generally very high - certainly I've enjoyed listening to those from their Champions League Matchday Live radio programme that is available as a live stream on their website, albeit this is separate to the main world feed service - and many of the commentators used will be familiar to people who watch European club games on Sky Sports, BT Sport and ESPN or listen to football coverage on UK commercial radio stations.

The problem some international broadcasters like SuperSport may have is that all of UEFA's international feed commentaries are done off-tube from London, unlike Sky Sports who are on-site for most games involving British clubs and from the business end of the competition. There is also the issue of the commentators being required by UEFA to call teams by their native names (so they are required to say Bayern Munchen rather than the anglicised Bayern Munich for example) and to avoid making opinion-based comment on potentially contentious incidents.
bwfcol
19-08-2014
I don't think UEFA World Feed ever seems that bad but I think it's safe to say that the Sky commentaries are of a higher standard and it uses co-comms, the world feed doesn't.

Not being able to offer opinions on the game is wrong but it's classic UEFA
Steve Williams
19-08-2014
Originally Posted by promo-only:
“I thought the majority of them just worked for PLP/IMG. Not sure we'd be able to hear the majority of them on BT because of the Sky UK exclusivity aspect... if they defected to BT then surely the ones that are asked to do CL coverage alongside PL would have to forgo working on the PL world feed because they'd be heard on Sky's Game of the Day and Match Choice in the evening?”

Well, maybe, but that's their call and BT may well offer them more work on the various foreign leagues they cover. If all Sky can offer them is one Premier League match a week than they might think BT is the better prospect. And Sky might have to be a bit less choosy.
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