Apple Bug Alert

flagpole · 03-09-2013, 13:30

Quote:

Perhaps you could explain that to my phone, as I happen to use Siri every day, and rarely have a problem with it. Qualitatively I have far more serious problems with GMail.

Of course you do.

Perhaps you could explain the issues you have with GMail. I may well be able to help.

tdenson · 03-09-2013, 13:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by flagpole

Of course you do.

Perhaps you could explain the issues you have with GMail. I may well be able to help.

Well yes I do, whether you believe me or not (most days I go cycling and make extensive use of it in that context, other days I drive where I also use it). I also compose 95% of my text messages using voice recognition, which admittedly is not Siri - but is the part of Siri that tends to get mocked. On a decent length message I typically have to make one or at most two corrections.

As far as GMail is concerned, apart from the awful UI, and Google's propensity for changing it at a whim, my main concerns are its ability to send emails into a black hole. Quite often I send emails, they do not get delivered, I get no bounced error, and the recipient doesn't either (and it's not in spam). In fact I have about 4 people/organisations I deal with where this happens every time and I no longer use GMail to communicate with them, but use my Apple email.
Other times and this can be to any recipient, emails just get delayed by anything up to 24 hours. I don't get any of these problems with other email providers I use.

The only reason I stick with GMail is because I am locked into the Google ecosystem because I use Android and many other Googly things.

IslandNiles · 03-09-2013, 14:29

^^^

Interesting you should mention dictation. Oddly, I find the dictation function in Messages etc far, far more accurate than Siri. I know this shouldn't be the case at all, and they should use exactly the same processes, but it's not just my perception. I can say the same thing to dictation and to Siri, and Siri will be far more garbled or incorrect. I've tried it lots of times.

-GONZO- · 03-09-2013, 14:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by IslandNiles

^^^

Interesting you should mention dictation. Oddly, I find the dictation function in Messages etc far, far more accurate than Siri. I know this shouldn't be the case at all, and they should use exactly the same processes, but it's not just my perception. I can say the same thing to dictation and to Siri, and Siri will be far more garbled or incorrect. I've tried it lots of times.

Yes I've noticed this too.

tdenson · 03-09-2013, 15:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by IslandNiles

^^^

Interesting you should mention dictation. Oddly, I find the dictation function in Messages etc far, far more accurate than Siri. I know this shouldn't be the case at all, and they should use exactly the same processes, but it's not just my perception. I can say the same thing to dictation and to Siri, and Siri will be far more garbled or incorrect. I've tried it lots of times.

Hmmm, that's interesting, it sort of rings a bell with me, strange.

paulbrock · 03-09-2013, 17:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by tdenson

As far as GMail is concerned, apart from the awful UI, and Google's propensity for changing it at a whim, my main concerns are its ability to send emails into a black hole. Quite often I send emails, they do not get delivered, I get no bounced error, and the recipient doesn't either (and it's not in spam). In fact I have about 4 people/organisations I deal with where this happens every time and I no longer use GMail to communicate with them, but use my Apple email.
Other times and this can be to any recipient, emails just get delayed by anything up to 24 hours. I don't get any of these problems with other email providers I use.
.

Most (if not all) of that, (and you recognise that it is certain recipients it happens with) is down to the receiver, not to the sender (or their software)

Stiggles · 03-09-2013, 18:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by tdenson

This is getting tiresome, but to quote again from dictionary.com

"A profanity is the improper use of a sacred or divine name to express strong usually negative emotions such as anger or fear"

No, what is getting tiresome is your pathetic attempts to see something that isn't there. I'll post this again since you ignored it last time:-

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stiggles

There was no swearing in that post at all.

I however suggest that if 'oh christ' offends you because you are religious in any way shape or form (i'm not so it means nothing to me) you instead say, "do you mind not taking the lords name in vein as I'm religious" instead of coming out with nonsense like i was swearing which i clearly was not.

You do have this strange ability (like a few others on here in your camp) to see things in posts that just are not there then claim to be offended as a way of diverting the subject....

calico_pie · 03-09-2013, 18:36

Swearing or not, its certainly a just plain rude display of condescending impatience.

Stiggles · 03-09-2013, 18:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by calico_pie

Swearing or not, its certainly a just plain rude display of condescending impatience.

What? Saying oh christ? Don't be silly now!!....

Also that coming from you is hysterical

tdenson · 03-09-2013, 19:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stiggles

No, what is getting tiresome is your pathetic attempts to see something that isn't there. I'll post this again since you ignored it last time:-

It did read that, But you obviously didn't bother to read the dictionary definition which quite clearly states that one of the definitions of swearing is profanity.

Putting aside the semantics of definitions, I have to agree with Calico, you are just plain rude.

swordman · 03-09-2013, 19:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by tdenson

I have to agree with Calico

Never there's a first

calico_pie · 03-09-2013, 19:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stiggles

What? Saying oh christ? Don't be silly now!!....

Also that coming from you is hysterical

Nothing silly about it - I can't think of any other tone in which anyone would say "oh Christ".

In the context, the meaning was perfectly clear - frustrated disbelief that someone could be such an idiot. Which only ever comes across as rude.

calico_pie · 03-09-2013, 20:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by swordman

Never there's a first

Actually, I don't think it is.

hungover · 03-09-2013, 21:18

With regard to swearing or not. If one uses a term that another finds offensive. Would it not be sufficient to accept that no offence on religious grounds was intended and then move om?

Stiggles · 03-09-2013, 22:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by calico_pie

Nothing silly about it - I can't think of any other tone in which anyone would say "oh Christ".

In the context, the meaning was perfectly clear - frustrated disbelief that someone could be such an idiot. Which only ever comes across as rude.

Now you are just making stuff up for the sake of it which isn't unusual for you....

You do know different people from different areas say things without thinking there is anything wrong with it right? Here in Dundee and in many places in Scotland people say that all the time. We also say bloody a lot. Find that rude as well i suppose? We don't all talk the same you know!

Yes, i said it in disbelief, but to add on to it i think he is an idiot is bang out of order frankly. I may disagree with him over things, but he is not an idiot. Not even close.

I suggest you jump off your moral high horse and keep your daft opinions to yourself in future.

Stiggles · 03-09-2013, 22:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by hungover

With regard to swearing or not. If one uses a term that another finds offensive. Would it not be sufficient to accept that no offence on religious grounds was intended and then move om?

You would think so!!!

What i find odd is, if he found it offensive based on religion i would simply have apologised and indeed moved on.

calico_pie · 03-09-2013, 22:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stiggles

Now you are just making stuff up for the sake of it which isn't unusual for you....

You do know different people from different areas say things without thinking there is anything wrong with it right? Here in Dundee and in many places in Scotland people say that all the time. We also say bloody a lot. Find that rude as well i suppose? We don't all talk the same you know!

Yes, i said it in disbelief, but to add on to it i think he is an idiot is bang out of order frankly. I may disagree with him over things, but he is not an idiot. Not even close.

I suggest you jump off your moral high horse and keep your daft opinions to yourself in future.

I don't think it was that daft - even if it wasn't what you meant, that was how it came across to me, and obviously to tdenson.

I'm sure you do say it a lot - in the name of regional slang, what do you mean when you say it, in that context?

As for my high horse, whether you meant it the way it was taken or not, it wouldn't have hurt to just apologise.

And now you're just being rude to me too, so I'll butt out now.

Stiggles · 03-09-2013, 22:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by calico_pie

I don't think it was that daft - even if it wasn't what you meant, that was how it came across to me, and obviously to tdenson.

I'm sure you do say it a lot - in the name of regional slang, what do you mean when you say it, in that context?

I can say it instead of "oh no!" etc.

Quote:

As for my high horse, whether you meant it the way it was taken or not, it wouldn't have hurt to just apologise.

As i have said, if he said it bother him for religious reasons then yes, i have already said i would apologise. If it isnt for that reason, there is no need to apologise.

Quote:

And now you're just being rude to me too, so I'll butt out now.

Oh what a surprise!!!

And you were not being rude by insinuating that i meant something else by what i said were you?

calico_pie · 03-09-2013, 23:05

A surprise? I think we both know what you meant. I could carry on if you like, but then you'll have a go at me for not dropping it, so I can't really win can I?

flagpole · 04-09-2013, 10:21

if anyone is interested in the details of what caused the bug there is a decompilation of the code here:
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2013/09...f_death_crash/

tdenson · 05-09-2013, 00:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stiggles

As i have said, if he said it bother him for religious reasons then yes, i have already said i would apologise.

And I accept your apology thank you. Let's move on.

paulbrock · 05-09-2013, 02:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by flagpole

if anyone is interested in the details of what caused the bug there is a decompilation of the code here:
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2013/09...f_death_crash/

would be a third of the length if they binned all the decompilation stuff and just said which functioned passed which parameters...

hungover · 05-09-2013, 09:25

wow. Apple's are just so intuiutive...

Here is a "fix" for deleting offending emails from your Mac's mail app.

Remove the message from mailbox using a webmail interface (use firefox ,not Chrome or Safari as both of them use the CoreText library.
Perform a TimeMachine of the system.
from a terminal go to ~/Library/Mail/V2/MailData/ and remove the "Envelope\Index" (or move it to another location)
Launch the Mail.app , it will rebuild all the index of the mails (can take hours if you have a large mailbox)
in my calse Mail.app fails at the end , with a message of damaged index, but after launching again the program , (said "no " to the open windows message) I was able to use Mail.app again.

Kudos to francisco.monserrat

https://discussions.apple.com/messag...23456#22897555

What happens though if you only own an iphone and ipad (ie no PC)?

kidspud · 05-09-2013, 09:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by flagpole

if anyone is interested in the details of what caused the bug there is a decompilation of the code here:
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2013/09...f_death_crash/

Does this mean it wasn't the security services

Stiggles · 05-09-2013, 16:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by tdenson

And I accept your apology thank you. Let's move on.

No problem. Let move on indeed

Quote:

Originally Posted by kidspud

Does this mean it wasn't the security services

Haha!

03-09-2013, 13:30	#126
flagpole Inactive Member Join Date: Jan 2003 Posts: 43,524	Quote: Originally Posted by tdenson Perhaps you could explain that to my phone, as I happen to use Siri every day, and rarely have a problem with it. Qualitatively I have far more serious problems with GMail. Of course you do. Perhaps you could explain the issues you have with GMail. I may well be able to help.

03-09-2013, 13:49	#127
tdenson Forum Member Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 4,214	Quote: Originally Posted by flagpole Of course you do. Perhaps you could explain the issues you have with GMail. I may well be able to help. Well yes I do, whether you believe me or not (most days I go cycling and make extensive use of it in that context, other days I drive where I also use it). I also compose 95% of my text messages using voice recognition, which admittedly is not Siri - but is the part of Siri that tends to get mocked. On a decent length message I typically have to make one or at most two corrections. As far as GMail is concerned, apart from the awful UI, and Google's propensity for changing it at a whim, my main concerns are its ability to send emails into a black hole. Quite often I send emails, they do not get delivered, I get no bounced error, and the recipient doesn't either (and it's not in spam). In fact I have about 4 people/organisations I deal with where this happens every time and I no longer use GMail to communicate with them, but use my Apple email. Other times and this can be to any recipient, emails just get delayed by anything up to 24 hours. I don't get any of these problems with other email providers I use. The only reason I stick with GMail is because I am locked into the Google ecosystem because I use Android and many other Googly things.

03-09-2013, 14:29	#128
IslandNiles Forum Member Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 13,091	^^^ Interesting you should mention dictation. Oddly, I find the dictation function in Messages etc far, far more accurate than Siri. I know this shouldn't be the case at all, and they should use exactly the same processes, but it's not just my perception. I can say the same thing to dictation and to Siri, and Siri will be far more garbled or incorrect. I've tried it lots of times.

03-09-2013, 14:39	#129
-GONZO- Forum Member Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Kent Posts: 8,954	Quote: Originally Posted by IslandNiles ^^^ Interesting you should mention dictation. Oddly, I find the dictation function in Messages etc far, far more accurate than Siri. I know this shouldn't be the case at all, and they should use exactly the same processes, but it's not just my perception. I can say the same thing to dictation and to Siri, and Siri will be far more garbled or incorrect. I've tried it lots of times. Yes I've noticed this too.

03-09-2013, 15:41	#130
tdenson Forum Member Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 4,214	Quote: Originally Posted by IslandNiles ^^^ Interesting you should mention dictation. Oddly, I find the dictation function in Messages etc far, far more accurate than Siri. I know this shouldn't be the case at all, and they should use exactly the same processes, but it's not just my perception. I can say the same thing to dictation and to Siri, and Siri will be far more garbled or incorrect. I've tried it lots of times. Hmmm, that's interesting, it sort of rings a bell with me, strange.

03-09-2013, 17:35	#131
paulbrock Forum Member Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Wapping, London Posts: 16,222	Quote: Originally Posted by tdenson As far as GMail is concerned, apart from the awful UI, and Google's propensity for changing it at a whim, my main concerns are its ability to send emails into a black hole. Quite often I send emails, they do not get delivered, I get no bounced error, and the recipient doesn't either (and it's not in spam). In fact I have about 4 people/organisations I deal with where this happens every time and I no longer use GMail to communicate with them, but use my Apple email. Other times and this can be to any recipient, emails just get delayed by anything up to 24 hours. I don't get any of these problems with other email providers I use. . Most (if not all) of that, (and you recognise that it is certain recipients it happens with) is down to the receiver, not to the sender (or their software)

03-09-2013, 18:23	#132
Stiggles Forum Member Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: Dundee, Scotland Posts: 9,293	Quote: Originally Posted by tdenson This is getting tiresome, but to quote again from dictionary.com "A profanity is the improper use of a sacred or divine name to express strong usually negative emotions such as anger or fear" No, what is getting tiresome is your pathetic attempts to see something that isn't there. I'll post this again since you ignored it last time:- Quote: Originally Posted by Stiggles There was no swearing in that post at all. I however suggest that if 'oh christ' offends you because you are religious in any way shape or form (i'm not so it means nothing to me) you instead say, "do you mind not taking the lords name in vein as I'm religious" instead of coming out with nonsense like i was swearing which i clearly was not. You do have this strange ability (like a few others on here in your camp) to see things in posts that just are not there then claim to be offended as a way of diverting the subject....

03-09-2013, 18:36	#133
calico_pie Forum Member Join Date: Oct 2012 Posts: 9,428	Swearing or not, its certainly a just plain rude display of condescending impatience.

03-09-2013, 18:48	#134
Stiggles Forum Member Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: Dundee, Scotland Posts: 9,293	Quote: Originally Posted by calico_pie Swearing or not, its certainly a just plain rude display of condescending impatience. What? Saying oh christ? Don't be silly now!!.... Also that coming from you is hysterical

03-09-2013, 19:25	#135
tdenson Forum Member Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 4,214	Quote: Originally Posted by Stiggles No, what is getting tiresome is your pathetic attempts to see something that isn't there. I'll post this again since you ignored it last time:- It did read that, But you obviously didn't bother to read the dictionary definition which quite clearly states that one of the definitions of swearing is profanity. Putting aside the semantics of definitions, I have to agree with Calico, you are just plain rude.

03-09-2013, 19:41	#136
swordman Forum Member Join Date: Oct 2010 Posts: 6,342	Quote: Originally Posted by tdenson I have to agree with Calico Never there's a first

03-09-2013, 19:59	#137
calico_pie Forum Member Join Date: Oct 2012 Posts: 9,428	Quote: Originally Posted by Stiggles What? Saying oh christ? Don't be silly now!!.... Also that coming from you is hysterical Nothing silly about it - I can't think of any other tone in which anyone would say "oh Christ". In the context, the meaning was perfectly clear - frustrated disbelief that someone could be such an idiot. Which only ever comes across as rude.

03-09-2013, 20:08	#138
calico_pie Forum Member Join Date: Oct 2012 Posts: 9,428	Quote: Originally Posted by swordman Never there's a first Actually, I don't think it is.

03-09-2013, 21:18	#139
hungover Forum Member Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 144	With regard to swearing or not. If one uses a term that another finds offensive. Would it not be sufficient to accept that no offence on religious grounds was intended and then move om?

03-09-2013, 22:03	#140
Stiggles Forum Member Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: Dundee, Scotland Posts: 9,293	Quote: Originally Posted by calico_pie Nothing silly about it - I can't think of any other tone in which anyone would say "oh Christ". In the context, the meaning was perfectly clear - frustrated disbelief that someone could be such an idiot. Which only ever comes across as rude. Now you are just making stuff up for the sake of it which isn't unusual for you.... You do know different people from different areas say things without thinking there is anything wrong with it right? Here in Dundee and in many places in Scotland people say that all the time. We also say bloody a lot. Find that rude as well i suppose? We don't all talk the same you know! Yes, i said it in disbelief, but to add on to it i think he is an idiot is bang out of order frankly. I may disagree with him over things, but he is not an idiot. Not even close. I suggest you jump off your moral high horse and keep your daft opinions to yourself in future.

03-09-2013, 22:04	#141
Stiggles Forum Member Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: Dundee, Scotland Posts: 9,293	Quote: Originally Posted by hungover With regard to swearing or not. If one uses a term that another finds offensive. Would it not be sufficient to accept that no offence on religious grounds was intended and then move om? You would think so!!! What i find odd is, if he found it offensive based on religion i would simply have apologised and indeed moved on.

03-09-2013, 22:10	#142
calico_pie Forum Member Join Date: Oct 2012 Posts: 9,428	Quote: Originally Posted by Stiggles Now you are just making stuff up for the sake of it which isn't unusual for you.... You do know different people from different areas say things without thinking there is anything wrong with it right? Here in Dundee and in many places in Scotland people say that all the time. We also say bloody a lot. Find that rude as well i suppose? We don't all talk the same you know! Yes, i said it in disbelief, but to add on to it i think he is an idiot is bang out of order frankly. I may disagree with him over things, but he is not an idiot. Not even close. I suggest you jump off your moral high horse and keep your daft opinions to yourself in future. I don't think it was that daft - even if it wasn't what you meant, that was how it came across to me, and obviously to tdenson. I'm sure you do say it a lot - in the name of regional slang, what do you mean when you say it, in that context? As for my high horse, whether you meant it the way it was taken or not, it wouldn't have hurt to just apologise. And now you're just being rude to me too, so I'll butt out now.

03-09-2013, 22:21	#143
Stiggles Forum Member Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: Dundee, Scotland Posts: 9,293	Quote: Originally Posted by calico_pie I don't think it was that daft - even if it wasn't what you meant, that was how it came across to me, and obviously to tdenson. I'm sure you do say it a lot - in the name of regional slang, what do you mean when you say it, in that context? I can say it instead of "oh no!" etc. Quote: As for my high horse, whether you meant it the way it was taken or not, it wouldn't have hurt to just apologise. As i have said, if he said it bother him for religious reasons then yes, i have already said i would apologise. If it isnt for that reason, there is no need to apologise. Quote: And now you're just being rude to me too, so I'll butt out now. Oh what a surprise!!! And you were not being rude by insinuating that i meant something else by what i said were you?

03-09-2013, 23:05	#144
calico_pie Forum Member Join Date: Oct 2012 Posts: 9,428	A surprise? I think we both know what you meant. I could carry on if you like, but then you'll have a go at me for not dropping it, so I can't really win can I?

04-09-2013, 10:21	#145
flagpole Inactive Member Join Date: Jan 2003 Posts: 43,524	if anyone is interested in the details of what caused the bug there is a decompilation of the code here: http://www.theregister.co.uk/2013/09...f_death_crash/

05-09-2013, 00:13	#146
tdenson Forum Member Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 4,214	Quote: Originally Posted by Stiggles As i have said, if he said it bother him for religious reasons then yes, i have already said i would apologise. And I accept your apology thank you. Let's move on.

DS Forums

Apple Bug Alert

05-09-2013, 02:15	#147
paulbrock Forum Member Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Wapping, London Posts: 16,222	Quote: Originally Posted by flagpole if anyone is interested in the details of what caused the bug there is a decompilation of the code here: http://www.theregister.co.uk/2013/09...f_death_crash/ would be a third of the length if they binned all the decompilation stuff and just said which functioned passed which parameters...

05-09-2013, 09:25	#148
hungover Forum Member Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 144	wow. Apple's are just so intuiutive... Here is a "fix" for deleting offending emails from your Mac's mail app. Remove the message from mailbox using a webmail interface (use firefox ,not Chrome or Safari as both of them use the CoreText library. Perform a TimeMachine of the system. from a terminal go to ~/Library/Mail/V2/MailData/ and remove the "Envelope\Index" (or move it to another location) Launch the Mail.app , it will rebuild all the index of the mails (can take hours if you have a large mailbox) in my calse Mail.app fails at the end , with a message of damaged index, but after launching again the program , (said "no " to the open windows message) I was able to use Mail.app again. Kudos to francisco.monserrat https://discussions.apple.com/messag...23456#22897555 What happens though if you only own an iphone and ipad (ie no PC)?

05-09-2013, 09:47	#149
kidspud Forum Member Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 11,501	Quote: Originally Posted by flagpole if anyone is interested in the details of what caused the bug there is a decompilation of the code here: http://www.theregister.co.uk/2013/09...f_death_crash/ Does this mean it wasn't the security services

05-09-2013, 16:46	#150
Stiggles Forum Member Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: Dundee, Scotland Posts: 9,293	Quote: Originally Posted by tdenson And I accept your apology thank you. Let's move on. No problem. Let move on indeed Quote: Originally Posted by kidspud Does this mean it wasn't the security services Haha!