Is this the best regen sequence ever? It was on Watch again last night and I certainly think it is and love how it captures all the energy and emotions of The Doctor realising his time is about to end. The music used over the whole scene really adds to the atmosphere and gets you every time you see it even though you know what is coming.
David Tennant Regeneration
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Yes best by far, the sheer emotion as the 10th Doctor realised his time was up plus the incredible music from Mr Gold made for a heartrending scene.
Fifth Doctor to sixth was pretty good too.
Fifth Doctor to sixth was pretty good too.
Not for me, no....it was OTT self-indulgence with music I thought wasn't very good at all. Coupled with Ten's last line and the way is was delivered left a very bad taste in my mouth. I'd been waiting for 10 to leave for some time and even when he did it was just far too OTT.
Chris' regeneration was far better, delivered in a more positive way and actually felt like he was handing the mantle over to David....David's exit just felt like him and RTD saying "this is pinnacle of the show now, we are the best, always will be" which was instantly just putting a downer on Matt and Moffat before they'd even began...
It really wasn't very good at all...
Chris' regeneration was far better, delivered in a more positive way and actually felt like he was handing the mantle over to David....David's exit just felt like him and RTD saying "this is pinnacle of the show now, we are the best, always will be" which was instantly just putting a downer on Matt and Moffat before they'd even began...
It really wasn't very good at all...
It's weird that, despite being a fan since the early 80's, it wasn't until Tennant left that I felt I'd really experienced a proper regeneration.
The first I remember was Four to Five, and I was only 7 years old then so I don't remember having any real emotional investment in it. Davison was the first Doctor that I have specific memories of watching every week, and I guess that's when I first became a 'fan' of the show. But even when he left, I still don't think it was a big deal for the 11 year old me.
And then, of course, it was a while before we even had a noteworthy regeneration. Six to Seven was a pre-credit sequence, Seven to Eight happened in the first 20 mins of the movie and McCoy has all of about 5 lines prior to it happening and Eight to Nine happens off-screen.
And with Chris, we knew he was going almost immediately after he debuted. So even for his regeneration, as good as it was in the context of TPoTW, I still didn't feel like I was 'losing' a Doctor.
But with Ten, all those years and all those regenerations after Tom fell onto that grassy knoll, this one felt real. And certainly for me, all the build up to it worked. As Ten's last moments played out, it was like I suddenly realised he was going. Up until that point, I'd been all hyped about TEOT and how Ten was going to 'die' and our first glmpse at Eleven. But when Ten began his slow walk to the Tardis after saying hello/goodbye to Rose, it was like... "Oh hang on. He's really going. He's not going to be the Doctor any more."
It was like when a work friend is leaving and they're gonna have a party. You get all excited about the drinking and the dancing and inappropriate snogging. But then the evening draws to a close and it suddenly hits you that that person is leaving and you're gonna miss 'em and you get all emotional.
Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying I wish DT hadn't left. The time was right for 10 to go (even if he didn't wanna
) But in terms of how RTD wrote 10's regeneration, it was one of the very few things that TEOT did exactly right.
The first I remember was Four to Five, and I was only 7 years old then so I don't remember having any real emotional investment in it. Davison was the first Doctor that I have specific memories of watching every week, and I guess that's when I first became a 'fan' of the show. But even when he left, I still don't think it was a big deal for the 11 year old me.
And then, of course, it was a while before we even had a noteworthy regeneration. Six to Seven was a pre-credit sequence, Seven to Eight happened in the first 20 mins of the movie and McCoy has all of about 5 lines prior to it happening and Eight to Nine happens off-screen.
And with Chris, we knew he was going almost immediately after he debuted. So even for his regeneration, as good as it was in the context of TPoTW, I still didn't feel like I was 'losing' a Doctor.
But with Ten, all those years and all those regenerations after Tom fell onto that grassy knoll, this one felt real. And certainly for me, all the build up to it worked. As Ten's last moments played out, it was like I suddenly realised he was going. Up until that point, I'd been all hyped about TEOT and how Ten was going to 'die' and our first glmpse at Eleven. But when Ten began his slow walk to the Tardis after saying hello/goodbye to Rose, it was like... "Oh hang on. He's really going. He's not going to be the Doctor any more."
It was like when a work friend is leaving and they're gonna have a party. You get all excited about the drinking and the dancing and inappropriate snogging. But then the evening draws to a close and it suddenly hits you that that person is leaving and you're gonna miss 'em and you get all emotional.
Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying I wish DT hadn't left. The time was right for 10 to go (even if he didn't wanna
) But in terms of how RTD wrote 10's regeneration, it was one of the very few things that TEOT did exactly right.
I think it's a great regeneration scene, though I *still* find it too sad to watch again because I love 10 so much. 9's transformation into 10 is another favourite of mine - I find his bravery very touching, and it's visually stunning.
Originally Posted by bbll22:
“Not for me, no....it was OTT self-indulgence with music I thought wasn't very good at all. Coupled with Ten's last line and the way is was delivered left a very bad taste in my mouth. I'd been waiting for 10 to leave for some time and even when he did it was just far too OTT.
Chris' regeneration was far better, delivered in a more positive way and actually felt like he was handing the mantle over to David....David's exit just felt like him and RTD saying "this is pinnacle of the show now, we are the best, always will be" which was instantly just putting a downer on Matt and Moffat before they'd even began...
It really wasn't very good at all...”
“Not for me, no....it was OTT self-indulgence with music I thought wasn't very good at all. Coupled with Ten's last line and the way is was delivered left a very bad taste in my mouth. I'd been waiting for 10 to leave for some time and even when he did it was just far too OTT.
Chris' regeneration was far better, delivered in a more positive way and actually felt like he was handing the mantle over to David....David's exit just felt like him and RTD saying "this is pinnacle of the show now, we are the best, always will be" which was instantly just putting a downer on Matt and Moffat before they'd even began...
It really wasn't very good at all...”
It wouldn't have been so bad if it hadn't been preceded by the prolonged shouty self-pitying whinge from Ten and that fulsomely self-aggrandising Davies farewell tour that ensued. All taken together, it was the most emetic regeneration sequence ever.
And I loved the Tennant era.
So to the self-described soap fan, no, anything but.
Fortunately Matt's appearance left me with a big grin and a sense of fresh air at last.
It was the most moving and upsetting for me, only spoiled by the horrible spitting thing that followed on from it, completely ruined the moment.
The best old Who regen for me was 4 into 5.
The best old Who regen for me was 4 into 5.
Originally Posted by CoalHillJanitor:
“It wouldn't have been so bad if it hadn't been preceded by the prolonged shouty self-pitying whinge from Ten and that fulsomely self-aggrandising Davies farewell tour that ensued. All taken together, it was the most emetic regeneration sequence ever. And I loved the Tennant era.”
“It wouldn't have been so bad if it hadn't been preceded by the prolonged shouty self-pitying whinge from Ten and that fulsomely self-aggrandising Davies farewell tour that ensued. All taken together, it was the most emetic regeneration sequence ever. And I loved the Tennant era.”
It just felt like I was being forced into feeling sad about 10 regenerating....it just came across as "you should be sad now, he's leaving. Be sad." which when he's not your favourite can be a problem as you feel nothing for it and can seem OTT. His whinge and farewell tour didn't help things really as it made feel even more like it was the show ending rather than one era of it. I liked RTD's era, but as an ending to it, it seemed like it was trying to put itself on a pedestal that no-one could better which was just wrong to me...
Originally Posted by CoalHillJanitor:
“Fortunately Matt's appearance left me with a big grin and a sense of fresh air at last.”
“Fortunately Matt's appearance left me with a big grin and a sense of fresh air at last.”
As you say, Matt's first minute was such a breath of fresh air that was long overdue. It was just the right gear change after OTT soppiness in the preceding minutes that I instantly took a liking to him. It was a relief for sure...
I completely agree with bbll22's comments. It just seemed to me like they were pandering to the fan girls who think that Tennant is the be all and end all of Doctor Who. Especially with that last line, I almost threw my shoe at the screen the first time I saw it, and every time since...
Don't get me wrong, I love the RTD era as much as any era of Who, there were some great episodes and if it weren't for him we wouldn't have new Who, but that last episode was far too self congratulatory and egotistical for my liking. I know this may not be a popular opinion, but that's just how I feel about it unfortunately.
Don't get me wrong, I love the RTD era as much as any era of Who, there were some great episodes and if it weren't for him we wouldn't have new Who, but that last episode was far too self congratulatory and egotistical for my liking. I know this may not be a popular opinion, but that's just how I feel about it unfortunately.
Originally Posted by soapfan_1973:
“Is this the best regen sequence ever? It was on Watch again last night and I certainly think it is and love how it captures all the energy and emotions of The Doctor realising his time is about to end. The music used over the whole scene really adds to the atmosphere and gets you every time you see it even though you know what is coming.”
“Is this the best regen sequence ever? It was on Watch again last night and I certainly think it is and love how it captures all the energy and emotions of The Doctor realising his time is about to end. The music used over the whole scene really adds to the atmosphere and gets you every time you see it even though you know what is coming.”
No it is one of the worst
Even 6 to 7 was better
Too self-indulgent and overly-dramatic. I recall a similar thread where the positives and negatives of Ten's exit did battle.
Originally Posted by bbll22:
“It just felt like I was being forced into feeling sad about 10 regenerating....it just came across as "you should be sad now, he's leaving. Be sad." which when he's not your favourite can be a problem as you feel nothing for it and can seem OTT. ”
“It just felt like I was being forced into feeling sad about 10 regenerating....it just came across as "you should be sad now, he's leaving. Be sad." which when he's not your favourite can be a problem as you feel nothing for it and can seem OTT. ”
A writer who is writing for a character established as long as the 10th Doctor was and a show as familiar as New Who was by then (i.e. five years in the running) is bound to assume that the majority of people watching care and have empathy for the character. It would be an insult to the majority of the viewers and to DT's popularity (which however much people may deny it has proven time and time again to be vast) not to acknowledge a sense of loss and apprehension at the end of an era.
Matt Smith isn't my personal favourite but will I be annoyed when SM writes his finale as if people liked his Doctor and are sad to see him go. Absolutely not because the majority will have liked him and be sad to see him go.
It's a combination of beautiful music and it is beautifully acted out by David, but personally I feel meh about it because by the point I got there I was rather exasparated with Ten's character (I had a love-hate relationship with him throughout his whole tenure and there were quite a few moments, especially in series 3, when I just wanted to slap him really hard, but at around that "it's not fair" scene with Wilf I totally lost it with him) and I actually wanted him to go.
For me it doesn't come anywhere near Five's regeneration in Caves of Andrazoni throughout which I had a huge lump in my throat and tears in the corners of my eyes. Or Nine's regeneration where I had a smile on my face. With Ten's the main thing I felt was annoyance tbh.
But I guess different stuff appeals to different people.
For me it doesn't come anywhere near Five's regeneration in Caves of Andrazoni throughout which I had a huge lump in my throat and tears in the corners of my eyes. Or Nine's regeneration where I had a smile on my face. With Ten's the main thing I felt was annoyance tbh.
But I guess different stuff appeals to different people.
Originally Posted by 2shy2007:
“It was the most moving and upsetting for me, only spoiled by the horrible spitting thing that followed on from it, completely ruined the moment.
The best old Who regen for me was 4 into 5.”
“It was the most moving and upsetting for me, only spoiled by the horrible spitting thing that followed on from it, completely ruined the moment.
The best old Who regen for me was 4 into 5.”
What horrible spitting thing? I haven't seen End Of Time in a while.
I always thought Two had the best regeneration, mostly because I thought it was the Doctor's biggest loss.
He's forcibly regenerated, and banished to a single planet and time, by the very people he had not wanted to see again, the people he had to contact because he knew he couldn't solve the problem at hand by himself. After they captured him, he knew he was done.
Then there's Jamie and Zoe. Not so much that they got their memories wiped, but rather that Two knew that they would get their memories wiped.
"They'll forget me, won't they?"
I always rather found that whole scene sad, Two knew he could do nothing, that he would never see Jamie and Zoe again, that nothing he could do would change anything, and seeing him on the ground, playing cards, I knew that he'd given up. But then Jamie and Zoe begged him to try and escaped, and even though he knew there was no point in doing so, he tried it anyway. He didn't want their last memories of him at his lowest, and decided to give them a bit of hope before the inevitable.
Then the Time Lords sent them home, leaving them with no memories, and sent him to Earth with a new Earth, stranded.
Goddamn Time Lords.
He's forcibly regenerated, and banished to a single planet and time, by the very people he had not wanted to see again, the people he had to contact because he knew he couldn't solve the problem at hand by himself. After they captured him, he knew he was done.
Then there's Jamie and Zoe. Not so much that they got their memories wiped, but rather that Two knew that they would get their memories wiped.
"They'll forget me, won't they?"
I always rather found that whole scene sad, Two knew he could do nothing, that he would never see Jamie and Zoe again, that nothing he could do would change anything, and seeing him on the ground, playing cards, I knew that he'd given up. But then Jamie and Zoe begged him to try and escaped, and even though he knew there was no point in doing so, he tried it anyway. He didn't want their last memories of him at his lowest, and decided to give them a bit of hope before the inevitable.
Then the Time Lords sent them home, leaving them with no memories, and sent him to Earth with a new Earth, stranded.
Goddamn Time Lords.
I thought it was mawkish but that fitted the tone of the rest of End of Time which was pretty bloody awful.
I liked DT very much up to that point but the End of Time left a bad taste in the mouth. Hoping that they dont try to bludgeon the viewers into submission when it comes to Matt's imminent departure. Less is more sometimes.
I liked DT very much up to that point but the End of Time left a bad taste in the mouth. Hoping that they dont try to bludgeon the viewers into submission when it comes to Matt's imminent departure. Less is more sometimes.
Utterly awful. It almost competes with the 'Bewigged Sylvester McCoy to unbewigged Sylvester McCoy regeneration' for the worst regeneration. It's only redemption was Matt Smith's bit at the end.
Originally Posted by tomwozhere:
“What horrible spitting thing? I haven't seen End Of Time in a while.”
“What horrible spitting thing? I haven't seen End Of Time in a while.”
A bit of debris landed in Matt Smith's mouth and he spat it out as the TARDIS was crashing. Clearly, an erosion of all that is moral and good.
Originally Posted by louise_stokes1:
“ It just seemed to me like they were pandering to the fan girls .”
“ It just seemed to me like they were pandering to the fan girls .”
Yay! I got a mention!!!
Originally Posted by KezM:
“Wow not even 1 page and that phrase appears!”
“Wow not even 1 page and that phrase appears!”
Originally Posted by rwebster:
“A bit of debris landed in Matt Smith's mouth and he spat it out as the TARDIS was crashing. Clearly, an erosion of all that is moral and good.”
“A bit of debris landed in Matt Smith's mouth and he spat it out as the TARDIS was crashing. Clearly, an erosion of all that is moral and good.”
I must have watched TEoT dozens of times, and this never even registered.
Originally Posted by KezM:
“A writer who is writing for a character established as long as the 10th Doctor was and a show as familiar as New Who was by then (i.e. five years in the running) is bound to assume that the majority of people watching care and have empathy for the character. It would be an insult to the majority of the viewers and to DT's popularity (which however much people may deny it has proven time and time again to be vast) not to acknowledge a sense of loss and apprehension at the end of an era.
Matt Smith isn't my personal favourite but will I be annoyed when SM writes his finale as if people liked his Doctor and are sad to see him go. Absolutely not because the majority will have liked him and be sad to see him go.”
“A writer who is writing for a character established as long as the 10th Doctor was and a show as familiar as New Who was by then (i.e. five years in the running) is bound to assume that the majority of people watching care and have empathy for the character. It would be an insult to the majority of the viewers and to DT's popularity (which however much people may deny it has proven time and time again to be vast) not to acknowledge a sense of loss and apprehension at the end of an era.
Matt Smith isn't my personal favourite but will I be annoyed when SM writes his finale as if people liked his Doctor and are sad to see him go. Absolutely not because the majority will have liked him and be sad to see him go.”
To be honest, it should have been done a lot more subtle rather than ramming it into our faces. That's the problem I have with it, it feels so forced that we should feel sad for him. The whole placing him on a pedestal above the others and making him out to be this wonderful man that can't be bettered is not the right way to go about it. The whinge at Wilf and the whole way it was played out was wrong. If it was done more low key and subtle then perhaps I may have been sad but the 'song singing you to sleep' etc was just OTT.
It wasn't exactly dignified either considering everything. I understand he is well liked as a Doctor in the show's history, but it should have been done a lot better than it was.
I think each doctor is induvidual so each regeneration will be too. Course it will be sad. 11 doesn't want to die. Being the doctor is not easy. Knowing your freinds will die before you. However christmas is the time of miracles. 11 becomes 12 new doctor for new adventures.
Deary me. I dare to mention fan girls and suddenly it's the only part of my post people focus on. They do exist you know. It doesn't mean I'm calling all Tennant fans fan girls. I'm a huge fan of Tennant's Doctor, but above that I'm a huge fan of Doctor Who, and I feel like 10s regen sequence smacked of "look he's leaving, it's the end of the world and future Doctors will never be as wonderful as him". It just wasn't in the spirt of a show which has always embraced change.
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