Connecting old tellies to Virgin set-top box. Problems.

ennui 57 · 14-09-2013, 16:52

Hello.
Apologies in advance for the lack of technical knowledge.

I have been using an ancient (1980s) tv with my Virgin set-top box for many years, with no problem, using a basic coaxial cable.

I was recently given a newer tv (approx 10 years old. Well, that's 'new' to me!!) But I cannot get it to recognise a signal from the set-top box.

I have tried using the coaxial cable, and tried scart to scart, with no success.

Anyone know what's going on?

Nigel Goodwin · 14-09-2013, 17:11

If you were using a 'basic coaxial cable' - presumably you mean an aerial cable?.

In which case you need to tune the new TV in, on the analogue channels to find it's RF modulator frequency.

But a SCART lead should work without doing anything, assuming it's not disabled in the box in some way? - presumably you switched the TV to the SCART socket?.

mac2708 · 14-09-2013, 17:14

If you're using co-ax and an RF output from the box then you'll need to tune an analogue channel on the TV to the output of the box.
If using SCART then you need to select the SCART/AV/External input on the TV

Ooops beaten to it - I type too slowly

ennui 57 · 14-09-2013, 17:28

Thank you both for your replies.

I think, from what you say, that it might be a problem tuning the tv.

I have the manual for the telly, and have tried various options, with no success.

(But I am a bit thick with tech stuff

)

Thanks again.

Tiexen · 14-09-2013, 18:13

Might help if you tell us the make/model of the TV

ennui 57 · 14-09-2013, 18:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tiexen

Might help if you tell us the make/model of the TV

It's a Philps (Model no)21PT6820/05

When I googled this model, I could only find copies of the manual that I already have.

I'm sure this is something really easy to fix, and that I'm missing something blindingly obvious!

On the 'ancient' tv, I changed the channel by hand to one that was compatible. But on this newer tv I'm stumped.

AidanLunn · 14-09-2013, 18:25

I'm an old TV collector. What have you done or are you doing with the old 80s set?

D.Page · 14-09-2013, 18:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by ennui 57

... I have tried using the coaxial cable, and tried scart to scart, with no success.

Have you tried connecting your box via this TV's side AV connections and ensuring the TV is switched to those inputs, just to see if that works?

ennui 57 · 14-09-2013, 18:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by AidanLunn

I'm an old TV collector. What have you done or are you doing with the old 80s set?

I don't know yet, but I will be loathe to part with it! (But I'm the same with old cars: I always get attached to them)

It's an old big black Pye, and I bought it second hand back around 1985 (?)! I'm so chuffed with the way it has lasted!

ennui 57 · 14-09-2013, 18:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by D.Page

Have you tried connecting your box via this TV's side AV connections and ensuring the TV is switched to those inputs, just to see if that works?

Yep, tried that. Fortunately, my son is a bit of a gamer, and he has all sorts of cables etc so he suggested that too.

As I say, it's probably something simple to do with my inability to tune the tv

D.Page · 14-09-2013, 18:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by ennui 57

... It's an old big black Pye, and I bought it second hand back around 1985 (?)! I'm so chuffed with the way it has lasted!

Not that surprising. TVs were built to last back then.

I bought a Sony KV-2132U in 1991, and it still works fine today, with only a couple of quite simple repairs needed in all that time!

D.Page · 14-09-2013, 18:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by ennui 57

Yep, tried that. Fortunately, my son is a bit of a gamer, and he has all sorts of cables etc so he suggested that too.

As I say, it's probably something simple to do with my inability to tune the tv

Just in case you didn't know, connecting via the TV's rear scarts or the side AV phono connections does not require you to tune in to a vacant RF channel. It's just a button press on the remote (assuming the TV doesn't automatically switch over to that signal).

ennui 57 · 14-09-2013, 18:59

The old telly, which I am using still, looks a bit like the one to the top right of this page from the 1985 Argos catalogue.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/lavalam...6330728/page4/

ennui 57 · 14-09-2013, 19:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by D.Page

Just in case you didn't know, connecting via the TV's rear scarts or the side AV phono connections does not require you to tune in to a vacant RF channel. It's just a button press on the remote (assuming the TV doesn't automatically switch over to that signal).

Thanks.
I wonder if the tv is automatically switching over?

And yes, they certainly did know how to make things in those days!

In fact I would carry on using the old thing, as it's still perfectly serviceable, but the light output is not as good as newer models. (My elderly parents have difficulty seeing it, but it is fine for me!)

D.Page · 14-09-2013, 19:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by ennui 57

The old telly, which I am using still, looks a bit like the one to the top right of this page from the 1985 Argos catalogue.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/lavalam...6330728/page4/

My Dad had that one! A solid set, as I remember. I was in hospital for nine months back in the early nineties, and this TV was at the foot of my hospital bed. Thankfully, very dependable!

D.Page · 14-09-2013, 19:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by ennui 57

Thanks.
I wonder if the tv is automatically switching over?

And yes, they certainly did know how to make things in those days!

In fact I would carry on using the old thing, as it's still perfectly serviceable, but the light output is not as good as newer models. (My elderly parents have difficulty seeing it, but it is fine for me!)

Just cycle through the AV inputs using the bottom-left button on the remote, if you're not sure.

If you are coming out of the box via the scart output (rather than any rear phonos), then I would try to establish what type of signal it's sending out in the box's menu system (composite/PAL, RGB, S-Video) to see if the type of signal is appropriate for the connection and whether the TV accepts that type of signal (though I'm doubtful that an incorrect signal type would mean you didn't get any sort of picture at all, if the TV is set to display the connected AV source).

I am a rare breed, it seems, in that I prefer the CRT (tube) TV's picture quality, when it comes to watching standard definition TV material.

nomad2king · 14-09-2013, 21:17

If the SCART output is set to RGB and the TV input, isn't or can't be, set to RGB, then nothing will be seen.

I see that it has a DVD player built in. Could it be in DVD mode and not TV mode?

From the on-line version of the manual, setting the RF channels is on page 5. It can automatically search for the channel.
Link

I use the RF channel on my TV for general viewing, and use the V+ TV out SCART(set to RGB) to an external HDD/DVD recorder.

D.Page · 15-09-2013, 09:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by nomad2king

If the SCART output is set to RGB and the TV input, isn't or can't be, set to RGB, then nothing will be seen.

I see that it has a DVD player built in. Could it be in DVD mode and not TV mode?

From the on-line version of the manual, setting the RF channels is on page 5. It can automatically search for the channel.
Link

According to what I’ve established online about this TV, the EXT1 scart input accepts composite or RGB, and the EXT2 scart only accepts composite.

Again, according to what I’ve established online, this TV is automatically switched to ‘DVD mode’ when a disc is inserted.

So, ennui 57, if connecting TV via scart (and assuming nomad2king is correct), best to ensure you have connected scart to TV’s EXT1 scart (in case your box's scart output has been set to RGB), and also that there is no disc in the DVD player’s tray, and that you have not manually switched to ‘DVD mode’ via the remote.

Quote:

Originally Posted by nomad2king

I use the RF channel on my TV for general viewing, and use the V+ TV out SCART(set to RGB) to an external HDD/DVD recorder.

Is it not possible to use another scart for your general TV viewing, rather than the RF channel? I’d avoid using the RF channel if at all possible, and use scart for better picture/sound quality. Even the scart set to composite would be better than the RF channel.

Nigel Goodwin · 15-09-2013, 10:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by nomad2king

If the SCART output is set to RGB and the TV input, isn't or can't be, set to RGB, then nothing will be seen.

EXTREMELY unlikely - all setting RGB does (in almost all cases) is set pin 16 of the SCART socket high, this forces the TV from Composite to RGB.

In a small number of cases it may also enable the RGB output pins, but in most cases they are simply enabled at all times anyway.

But in all case the box continues outputting Composite as the TV uses this for Sync when on RGB - it's not actually RGB, more correctly it's RGB+Sync.

D.Page · 15-09-2013, 10:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nigel Goodwin

EXTREMELY unlikely - all setting RGB does (in almost all cases) is set pin 16 of the SCART socket high, this forces the TV from Composite to RGB.

In a small number of cases it may also enable the RGB output pins, but in most cases they are simply enabled at all times anyway.

But in all case the box continues outputting Composite as the TV uses this for Sync when on RGB - it's not actually RGB, more correctly it's RGB+Sync.

Can I jog your memory, Nigel. Any sign of a spare sony KV-21LS30U On/Off button, yet?

Nigel Goodwin · 15-09-2013, 10:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by D.Page

Can I jog your memory, Nigel. Any sign of a spare sony KV-21LS30U On/Off button, yet?

Afraid not

D.Page · 15-09-2013, 10:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nigel Goodwin

Afraid not

Sorted out the flyback/retrace lines problem, thanks. Just a tweak needed to the G2/Screen pot. You were right about it being a coarse adjustment. It only needed a minute amount of anti-clockwise turn.

Nigel Goodwin · 15-09-2013, 12:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by D.Page

Sorted out the flyback/retrace lines problem, thanks. Just a tweak needed to the G2/Screen pot. You were right about it being a coarse adjustment. It only needed a minute amount of anti-clockwise turn.

Makes it tricky doesn't it

D.Page · 15-09-2013, 13:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nigel Goodwin

Makes it tricky doesn't it

You're not wrong! Actually, when I tried to carefully insert the screwdriver into the pot, I found the pot to be so unweighted (easy to turn), I unintentionally nudged it anti-clockwise slightly, and virtually to it's final position anyway! It would help if they had some weight to these pots. I think you could turn it with the end of your little finger

Nigel Goodwin · 15-09-2013, 13:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by D.Page

You're not wrong! Actually, when I tried to carefully insert the screwdriver into the pot, I found the pot to be so unweighted (easy to turn), I unintentionally nudged it anti-clockwise slightly, and virtually to it's final position anyway! It would help if they had some weight to these pots. I think you could turn it with the end of your little finger

To be fair, while all A1 pots were a bit 'touchy' those particular ones seemed worse than most.

14-09-2013, 16:52	#1
ennui 57 Forum Member Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: Not from around here Posts: 797	Connecting old tellies to Virgin set-top box. Problems. Hello. Apologies in advance for the lack of technical knowledge. I have been using an ancient (1980s) tv with my Virgin set-top box for many years, with no problem, using a basic coaxial cable. I was recently given a newer tv (approx 10 years old. Well, that's 'new' to me!!) But I cannot get it to recognise a signal from the set-top box. I have tried using the coaxial cable, and tried scart to scart, with no success. Anyone know what's going on?

14-09-2013, 17:11	#2
Nigel Goodwin Forum Member Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: North Derbyshire Posts: 41,789	If you were using a 'basic coaxial cable' - presumably you mean an aerial cable?. In which case you need to tune the new TV in, on the analogue channels to find it's RF modulator frequency. But a SCART lead should work without doing anything, assuming it's not disabled in the box in some way? - presumably you switched the TV to the SCART socket?.

14-09-2013, 17:14	#3
mac2708 Forum Member Join Date: May 2009 Posts: 3,196	If you're using co-ax and an RF output from the box then you'll need to tune an analogue channel on the TV to the output of the box. If using SCART then you need to select the SCART/AV/External input on the TV Ooops beaten to it - I type too slowly

14-09-2013, 17:28	#4
ennui 57 Forum Member Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: Not from around here Posts: 797	Thank you both for your replies. I think, from what you say, that it might be a problem tuning the tv. I have the manual for the telly, and have tried various options, with no success. (But I am a bit thick with tech stuff ) Thanks again.

14-09-2013, 18:13	#5
Tiexen Forum Member Join Date: Sep 2010 Posts: 425	Might help if you tell us the make/model of the TV

14-09-2013, 18:21	#6
ennui 57 Forum Member Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: Not from around here Posts: 797	Quote: Originally Posted by Tiexen Might help if you tell us the make/model of the TV It's a Philps (Model no)21PT6820/05 When I googled this model, I could only find copies of the manual that I already have. I'm sure this is something really easy to fix, and that I'm missing something blindingly obvious! On the 'ancient' tv, I changed the channel by hand to one that was compatible. But on this newer tv I'm stumped.

14-09-2013, 18:25	#7
AidanLunn Forum Member Join Date: Apr 2010 Posts: 5,045	I'm an old TV collector. What have you done or are you doing with the old 80s set?

14-09-2013, 18:39	#8
D.Page Forum Member Join Date: Dec 2011 Location: London Posts: 1,523	Quote: Originally Posted by ennui 57 ... I have tried using the coaxial cable, and tried scart to scart, with no success. Have you tried connecting your box via this TV's side AV connections and ensuring the TV is switched to those inputs, just to see if that works?

14-09-2013, 18:45	#9
ennui 57 Forum Member Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: Not from around here Posts: 797	Quote: Originally Posted by AidanLunn I'm an old TV collector. What have you done or are you doing with the old 80s set? I don't know yet, but I will be loathe to part with it! (But I'm the same with old cars: I always get attached to them) It's an old big black Pye, and I bought it second hand back around 1985 (?)! I'm so chuffed with the way it has lasted!

14-09-2013, 18:48	#10
ennui 57 Forum Member Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: Not from around here Posts: 797	Quote: Originally Posted by D.Page Have you tried connecting your box via this TV's side AV connections and ensuring the TV is switched to those inputs, just to see if that works? Yep, tried that. Fortunately, my son is a bit of a gamer, and he has all sorts of cables etc so he suggested that too. As I say, it's probably something simple to do with my inability to tune the tv

14-09-2013, 18:51	#11
D.Page Forum Member Join Date: Dec 2011 Location: London Posts: 1,523	Quote: Originally Posted by ennui 57 ... It's an old big black Pye, and I bought it second hand back around 1985 (?)! I'm so chuffed with the way it has lasted! Not that surprising. TVs were built to last back then. I bought a Sony KV-2132U in 1991, and it still works fine today, with only a couple of quite simple repairs needed in all that time!

14-09-2013, 18:58	#12
D.Page Forum Member Join Date: Dec 2011 Location: London Posts: 1,523	Quote: Originally Posted by ennui 57 Yep, tried that. Fortunately, my son is a bit of a gamer, and he has all sorts of cables etc so he suggested that too. As I say, it's probably something simple to do with my inability to tune the tv Just in case you didn't know, connecting via the TV's rear scarts or the side AV phono connections does not require you to tune in to a vacant RF channel. It's just a button press on the remote (assuming the TV doesn't automatically switch over to that signal).

14-09-2013, 18:59	#13
ennui 57 Forum Member Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: Not from around here Posts: 797	The old telly, which I am using still, looks a bit like the one to the top right of this page from the 1985 Argos catalogue. http://www.flickr.com/photos/lavalam...6330728/page4/

14-09-2013, 19:11	#14
ennui 57 Forum Member Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: Not from around here Posts: 797	Quote: Originally Posted by D.Page Just in case you didn't know, connecting via the TV's rear scarts or the side AV phono connections does not require you to tune in to a vacant RF channel. It's just a button press on the remote (assuming the TV doesn't automatically switch over to that signal). Thanks. I wonder if the tv is automatically switching over? And yes, they certainly did know how to make things in those days! In fact I would carry on using the old thing, as it's still perfectly serviceable, but the light output is not as good as newer models. (My elderly parents have difficulty seeing it, but it is fine for me!)

14-09-2013, 19:12	#15
D.Page Forum Member Join Date: Dec 2011 Location: London Posts: 1,523	Quote: Originally Posted by ennui 57 The old telly, which I am using still, looks a bit like the one to the top right of this page from the 1985 Argos catalogue. http://www.flickr.com/photos/lavalam...6330728/page4/ My Dad had that one! A solid set, as I remember. I was in hospital for nine months back in the early nineties, and this TV was at the foot of my hospital bed. Thankfully, very dependable!

14-09-2013, 19:19	#16
D.Page Forum Member Join Date: Dec 2011 Location: London Posts: 1,523	Quote: Originally Posted by ennui 57 Thanks. I wonder if the tv is automatically switching over? And yes, they certainly did know how to make things in those days! In fact I would carry on using the old thing, as it's still perfectly serviceable, but the light output is not as good as newer models. (My elderly parents have difficulty seeing it, but it is fine for me!) Just cycle through the AV inputs using the bottom-left button on the remote, if you're not sure. If you are coming out of the box via the scart output (rather than any rear phonos), then I would try to establish what type of signal it's sending out in the box's menu system (composite/PAL, RGB, S-Video) to see if the type of signal is appropriate for the connection and whether the TV accepts that type of signal (though I'm doubtful that an incorrect signal type would mean you didn't get any sort of picture at all, if the TV is set to display the connected AV source). I am a rare breed, it seems, in that I prefer the CRT (tube) TV's picture quality, when it comes to watching standard definition TV material.

14-09-2013, 21:17	#17
nomad2king Forum Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 7,605	If the SCART output is set to RGB and the TV input, isn't or can't be, set to RGB, then nothing will be seen. I see that it has a DVD player built in. Could it be in DVD mode and not TV mode? From the on-line version of the manual, setting the RF channels is on page 5. It can automatically search for the channel. Link I use the RF channel on my TV for general viewing, and use the V+ TV out SCART(set to RGB) to an external HDD/DVD recorder.

15-09-2013, 09:45	#18
D.Page Forum Member Join Date: Dec 2011 Location: London Posts: 1,523	Quote: Originally Posted by nomad2king If the SCART output is set to RGB and the TV input, isn't or can't be, set to RGB, then nothing will be seen. I see that it has a DVD player built in. Could it be in DVD mode and not TV mode? From the on-line version of the manual, setting the RF channels is on page 5. It can automatically search for the channel. Link According to what I’ve established online about this TV, the EXT1 scart input accepts composite or RGB, and the EXT2 scart only accepts composite. Again, according to what I’ve established online, this TV is automatically switched to ‘DVD mode’ when a disc is inserted. So, ennui 57, if connecting TV via scart (and assuming nomad2king is correct), best to ensure you have connected scart to TV’s EXT1 scart (in case your box's scart output has been set to RGB), and also that there is no disc in the DVD player’s tray, and that you have not manually switched to ‘DVD mode’ via the remote. Quote: Originally Posted by nomad2king I use the RF channel on my TV for general viewing, and use the V+ TV out SCART(set to RGB) to an external HDD/DVD recorder. Is it not possible to use another scart for your general TV viewing, rather than the RF channel? I’d avoid using the RF channel if at all possible, and use scart for better picture/sound quality. Even the scart set to composite would be better than the RF channel.

15-09-2013, 10:01	#19
Nigel Goodwin Forum Member Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: North Derbyshire Posts: 41,789	Quote: Originally Posted by nomad2king If the SCART output is set to RGB and the TV input, isn't or can't be, set to RGB, then nothing will be seen. EXTREMELY unlikely - all setting RGB does (in almost all cases) is set pin 16 of the SCART socket high, this forces the TV from Composite to RGB. In a small number of cases it may also enable the RGB output pins, but in most cases they are simply enabled at all times anyway. But in all case the box continues outputting Composite as the TV uses this for Sync when on RGB - it's not actually RGB, more correctly it's RGB+Sync.

15-09-2013, 10:08	#20
D.Page Forum Member Join Date: Dec 2011 Location: London Posts: 1,523	Quote: Originally Posted by Nigel Goodwin EXTREMELY unlikely - all setting RGB does (in almost all cases) is set pin 16 of the SCART socket high, this forces the TV from Composite to RGB. In a small number of cases it may also enable the RGB output pins, but in most cases they are simply enabled at all times anyway. But in all case the box continues outputting Composite as the TV uses this for Sync when on RGB - it's not actually RGB, more correctly it's RGB+Sync. Can I jog your memory, Nigel. Any sign of a spare sony KV-21LS30U On/Off button, yet?

15-09-2013, 10:33	#21
Nigel Goodwin Forum Member Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: North Derbyshire Posts: 41,789	Quote: Originally Posted by D.Page Can I jog your memory, Nigel. Any sign of a spare sony KV-21LS30U On/Off button, yet? Afraid not

DS Forums

Connecting old tellies to Virgin set-top box. Problems.

15-09-2013, 10:43	#22
D.Page Forum Member Join Date: Dec 2011 Location: London Posts: 1,523	Quote: Originally Posted by Nigel Goodwin Afraid not Sorted out the flyback/retrace lines problem, thanks. Just a tweak needed to the G2/Screen pot. You were right about it being a coarse adjustment. It only needed a minute amount of anti-clockwise turn.

15-09-2013, 12:42	#23
Nigel Goodwin Forum Member Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: North Derbyshire Posts: 41,789	Quote: Originally Posted by D.Page Sorted out the flyback/retrace lines problem, thanks. Just a tweak needed to the G2/Screen pot. You were right about it being a coarse adjustment. It only needed a minute amount of anti-clockwise turn. Makes it tricky doesn't it

15-09-2013, 13:01	#24
D.Page Forum Member Join Date: Dec 2011 Location: London Posts: 1,523	Quote: Originally Posted by Nigel Goodwin Makes it tricky doesn't it You're not wrong! Actually, when I tried to carefully insert the screwdriver into the pot, I found the pot to be so unweighted (easy to turn), I unintentionally nudged it anti-clockwise slightly, and virtually to it's final position anyway! It would help if they had some weight to these pots. I think you could turn it with the end of your little finger

15-09-2013, 13:30	#25
Nigel Goodwin Forum Member Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: North Derbyshire Posts: 41,789	Quote: Originally Posted by D.Page You're not wrong! Actually, when I tried to carefully insert the screwdriver into the pot, I found the pot to be so unweighted (easy to turn), I unintentionally nudged it anti-clockwise slightly, and virtually to it's final position anyway! It would help if they had some weight to these pots. I think you could turn it with the end of your little finger To be fair, while all A1 pots were a bit 'touchy' those particular ones seemed worse than most.