Slightly disappointing for EM, can't believe the crappest ep of EE in a few weeks beat such compelling drama! Fair enough though, kudos to them.

It averaged 1.183m from 5.30 to 10.30pm 6.2% share

Itv4 beat Five in all day share yesterday 3.9% versus 3.7%

3.15m for the third Educating Yorkshire, down slightly on last week, but only by 150k, having retained 100% of it's 3.3m opening audience for ep 2. Probably down to the focus on Tom's bereavement story, there were complaints on twitter that it was depressing / wasn't as funny as funny as usual.

More likely to harm their perception of Barbara Windsor who seems to be dropping hints she would like to return full-time.All we need then is Ross Kemp back.

Ironic isn't it. I have to admit it took me by surprise. The 2nd ED was brilliant but I guess it was dented by the footie and WR.


Tuesday's episode was very well received and there has been a marked improvement in quality and pacing this month. Maybe the viewers are bored of serial killers taking their respective partners hostage before being arrested?


Is this the same ailing soap that topped the day yesterday?


She also praised the new governor who has taken over, if anyone can persuade her to return part-time he can.

A Saturday night family film slot over the summer seems like it would solve a lot of their problems. I suppose their concern might be that as things stand films in prime time on BBC1 are actually quite rare and so when it does happen it feels more like an event so running a weekly film over the summer undermines that. I suppose there's also the issue of whether they have a big enough variety of films to work with these days.


Unless I'm very much mistaken EastEnders itself didn't actually see a rise in its audience last night (at least not a significant one) rather it beat Emmerdale because Emmerdale's audience appears to have deserted it last night. With that in mind the quality (or lack thereof) of EastEnders is something of a moot point and we should instead be asking where Emmerdale's viewers went.

Also I'd just point out that EastEnders has been getting significantly better word of mouth over the past few weeks which is likely to tempt some old viewers back. However those viewers really have no control over the quality of the episode they happen to watch. If they get a duff one its not really their fault.


This is a fairly dramatic and over the top assessment particularly for something we see all the time with the soaps. All of the soaps. It wasn't that long ago that posters in this thread were gleefully predicting the death of Hollyoaks. I'm also fairly sure that a few years ago it was all doom and gloom for Emmerdale because it was on deaths door. I'd also wager if we were to go back even further we'd find predictions of Coronation Street's death and if we kept digging we'd find all the posts about the last time EastEnders was in this position. The truth is that the extreme peaks and toughs in quality are a side effect of the huge output that the soaps have to deliver each week. Eventually that catches up to everyone and things fall apart for a time and they have to go through the process of rebuilding. I won't be remotely surprised when in a couple of years time EastEnders has rebounded and Coronation Street is on a downward trajectory. Its what the soaps do.

Also the comparison to the Ferrirea storyline is a bit off track. Partly because this storyline doesn't appear to be a thrown together mess that was created in about five minutes to replace a much bigger storyline that fell apart and as a result allotted way too much time and prominence on the show. Secondly it doesn't appear to be scheduled to go on forever like the last kidney storyline. Thirdly this story actually seems to serve a purpose within the family unit it exists and thus serves to make that unit more interesting and fleshed out.


I suspect the general public is probably more focused on the fact that she's returning to the show in this evenings episode which sends a much stronger message than any comments she made on This Morning. "Its terrible now. So terrible that I'm willing to make an appearance on it and would quite like to do more..."

Soap ratings watch (officials - the only ones that count)

Past 4 weeks....

w/e 8 Sept

1 Corrie 9.36m
2 EE 7.82m
3 EF 6.52m plus unknown HD (total less than 7m)

w/e 1 Sept

1 Corrie 8.90m
2 EE 7.33m
3 EF 6.95m

w/e 25 Aug

1 Corrie 9.03m
2 EE 7.62m
3 EF 7.03m

w/e 18 Aug

1 Corrie 9.30m
2 EE 7.40m
3 EF 7.31m


Can someone explain this "EE now the third soap" business?

I'm not sure I follow it....

Add in iPlayer and same night repeats on other channels (BBC3 and ITV1+1 respectively) and EE could be biting at Corrie's ankles rather than EF seemingly nibbling at EE's.

Granted it's a bit close for comfort, but the two ITV soaps seem to be having a good spell, and of course, if Corrie is drawing them in then EF is bound to benefit from that.

Overnights will include any opt-outs, so whether the UK-wide figure is higher or lower than it would have been without the opt-out will depend on whether the opt-out outperformed or underperformed against the network.

Eh? Showing an hour long Emmerdale, an hour long Corrie and two hours of Downton Abbey, exactly as they did last year, would mean "technically only two hours of the ITV schedule would be the same as last year"? I'm baffled.


I totally disagree, BBC2 has been earmarked as the home of BBC Films and films like The Damned United, Made In Dagenham and Starter For Ten have all received prominent slots with extensive promotion. The same will also be true with the Partridge film. They also did the same for The History Boys when it was premiered, so it's not as if was "buried" at 11.45 initially. You see far more British films in primetime on BBC2 than you do American films.

Sadly a lot of British films aren't particularly mainstream fare and it's not as if BBC1 are showing Hollwood bollocks in its place, they're showing original British dramas.


No chance of Citizen Khan getting a Christmas Day slot, it's nowhere near as popular as Miranda or Outnumbered and they've never gone out on Christmas Day.


But of course when Despicable Me 1 was premiered on ITV on Saturday night three months ago, it didn't do much at all and was beaten heavily by The Voice (that week it rose because there was "no competition"). Films on Saturday teatime would barely rate that much better than repeats of Pointless, to be honest.


No, they used to give the proceeds for Children In Need but stopped after all the phone-in business where they decided that unless it's a specific appeal, phone calls must cost as little as possible and they're not done to make money (hence the apparent arrival of free web voting on Strictly). So unless it was The Voice for Comic Relief they couldn't do it. The value of Let's Dance, and before that Fame Academy, though, is that it serves as build-up for the event and allows them to preview the official single and show some of the aid films, giving them several bites of the cherry to get money. Even before that there would be numerous build-up shows, and clearly it's decided they do need to remind people it's happening. Comic Relief is now not just the day itself.


But the Beeb did a series in Battersea Dogs Home ten years ago, and had Animal Hospital, and this Ronnie series looks most like something like Rolf's Amazing World Of Animals. These things come in cycles, in the nineties the Beeb were having success with this genre and ITV did Mad About Pets with John Noakes. ITV have now had some success with it and the genre seems to be back in fashion, so the Beeb are coming up with something like it.

All channels do it, and have always done it. The Beeb wouldn't have commissioned Fame Academy had Pop Idol hadn't been a success, and similarly ITV wouldn't have done 3-2-1 if it wasn't for the Generation Game. There are only so many ideas knocking around.

The other bit of business I wanted to catch up on - how long did it take for The Chase to overcome Pointless in the end?

I know George assured us all it would take the lead by the end of the week I went away, but I assume it took a couple days more?

They are still valliantly trying aww bless

Its a bit rude of you to bring actual facts into the thread isn't it, its not the done thing at least not often.

Also, it's the fact that this week on ITV you can watch Emmerdale, Corrie and Downton as three of the big fish offerings. And next week. And the next week. And the next week (and so on).

And then on Christmas Day - yes, why not more Emmerdale, Corrie and Downton. :yawn:

A fun and festive Strictly special aside, and the Christmas night staple that is EE, you could hardly say BBC1's festive line up, even if it contains a well established core each year, is a routine throw out of tinselled-up regular shows that have been on air anyway for the 3 months running up.


I can't see any "rip off" when one show is about a dogs home and one show is about Britain's obsession with a range of wacky animals. There's a bloody parrot on the trailer for Ronnie's show. How can anyone therefore say it's a rip off of POG's Dogs?!

Anyway, when is Pets Win Prizes coming back? (the Danny Baker version please)

Looks like Itv's major new period drama Breathless is launching on Thursday 10th October. It will have a lead-in of about 2.2million from Cabbage and Pat, air against BBC2's hit drama Peaky Blinders and competitive shows on all other channels. This is destined to underperform massively in the ratings. Could've been a 5-7million overnight success in the right slot but will be down to 3-5million there. Statistically, Itv has not had a successful new drama series airing on a night other than Sunday/Monday in 7 years. So this is another itv drama we can write off this autumn.

Marchlands was on Thursdays and wasn't that a success, so much so it got and admittedly rubbish sequal.

Successful, as in a show which ended up coming back year after year. No drama which has launched on Itv on a night other than Sunday/Monday has ended up coming back successfully year after year for a long time. Breathless will, according to the odds and statistical probability, be a ratings flop. If it had been shown in Doc Martin's slot or Vera's current slot straight after XFactor, its odds of succeeding would've been much better.

I assume they're hoping that it'll grow with a move to prime time for series two. And its not as if they have a lot of other comedy options for Christmas Day at this point unless they can convince McIntyre to do a Christmas Comedy Roadshow or something. I'd also suggest that the BBC would much prefer to have a Miranda Christmas special for the big day but since she doesn't seem to want or have time to write one that's pretty much out of the question and really the only reason it hasn't and won't appear on BBC1 is because she hasn't or isn't doing it.


A lack of Let's Dance doesn't mean a lack of other build up shows though. They'll still have those and if they really want a Saturday night entertainment show linked to Comic Relief etc. they could try something that isn't a phone vote series. I'd be tempted to suggest they rip-off Gameshow Marathon and have Comic Relief Presents... a different classic gameshow every week. That also has the added advantage of giving them the chance to air unofficial pilots for reviving some of these formats. Also surely in theory The Voice serves as a better launching pad for the official single than Lets Dance would? If they were feeling particularly clever they might try and convince one or more of The Voice coaches to do the official single this year.

With dancing on ice finishing, is it time for the beeb to revive strictly on ice?

Firstly I don't imagine there's a whole lot of crossover between the perspective audience for Breathless and the audience for Peaky Blinders. I'd also like to point out that there's still a few weeks between now and October 10 by which time Peaky Blinders might not be such a hit for BBC2. In addition to that and more importantly an October debut means that Breathless can get weeks of promotion during Doc Martin. The X Factor and Downton Abbey which is a pretty damn impressive promotional platform that covers a whole lot of bases. As things stand I'd probably bet on Breathless at least opening well. How it holds up will depend on how good it is and not on the fact its scheduled for Thursday night.

Im fairly certain Breathless will not open well [i.e. 5m+ excl+1] even with the promotion it'll get during Doc martin, xf, abbey etc. No new Itv drama on a weeknight has opened over 4.5million, without a Coro St. lead-in, for a long long time. This is how new dramas have been launching without that all-important Coro St lead in:

Murders on the Home front: 4.5million
Love and marriage: 4.5m
Bletchly code: 4.1m
Mrs biggs: 3.8m
Lightfields: 3.7m
The guilty: 3.6m
Homefront: 3.1m
Panto: 2.7m

Many of those shows had promotion during XFactor, Downton, BGT and other high rating shows. But it didnt prevent them from launching with underwhelming ratings. Breathless is a very expensive drama series, major stuff for Itv studios who are hoping to flog this to broadcasters worldwide, so it is a huge surprise that this is getting such bad treatment slot wise. Maybe it is a turkey after Itv execs saw the clips? If not, this shouldve been given a monday or sunday night slot to give it maximum chance of succeeding because we have seen time and time again, that the Coro St/XF lead in can boost a show by about a million viewers. Burning it off on a Thursday night after Pat and Cabbage's 2.3m lead in will result in it getting very mediocre ratings, mark my words.

This is probably one for Steve, but wasn't there an ITV Christmas Day (which fell on a Sunday) where they aired back to back Em Fm, Corrie and Poirot - after a short run of Sunday nights where they aired Em Fm, Corrie and Poirot?

Perhaps it was some other Agatha Christie sleuther.

Perhaps it's just wishful thinking on my part....

Welcome back Robbie. Over the last couple of weeks I have been trying to point out that EE is winning in consolidated most of the time and that of course does not include the BBC3 figures which are never included - but some people dont want to listen - I think you know who they are.

Same here

Surely it's testament to Emmerdale that we're now shocked when its big episodes DON'T beat EastEnders; not long ago, it would still lose even if EastEnders aired a test card against a £10m apocalypse in the Dales.

The fact we now see it as a given ED will beat EE on a fairly regular basis is telling.

Didn't the £10m apocalypse (which saw the "Farm" dumped in favour of all the Geordie Shore types) bring in 16m viewers a night, bettering EE that week - nearly 20 years ago?