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Sleepy Hollow (UK Pace) on Universal |
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#76 |
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Join Date: Aug 2013
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Author of The Book of Revelation
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Some Biblical scholars doubt that the John who supposedly wrote The Book of Revelation was not John the Apostle
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Book_of...ion#Authorship The important fact is it is regularly referenced in the TV show and often wrongly called "Revelations" which was my point of clarification. I only sited the the author and the book's placement in case someone wondered A. what i was talking about regarding the show, and B. where they could further read about it if they were curious. My intent was not for a theological discusion, but rather to suggest that "Sleepy Hollow" is not a horror show as some are insistant on calling it. But rather if one looks to who are the writers of the show's script, it seems clear to me to think of it as science fiction i.e. "Star Trek" and or something similiar to a fantasy such as "The Twilight Zone." And your views on that are??? Last edited by Judy_Hendrixon : 04-11-2013 at 06:50. Reason: To create defined paragraphs |
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#77 |
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Join Date: Apr 2007
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Who is insisting on calling it a horror snow?
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#78 |
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Join Date: Nov 2007
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Quote:
My intent was not for a theological discusion, but rather to suggest that "Sleepy Hollow" is not a horror show as some are insistant on calling it. But rather if one looks to who are the writers of the show's script, it seems clear to me to think of it as science fiction i.e. "Star Trek" and or something similiar to a fantasy such as "The Twilight Zone." And your views on that are???
I'd say it was a Fantasy show with elements of horror (like Buffy). Certainly not Sci-Fi. No self-respecting sci-fi show involves magic or the supernatural (unless it is explained through pseudo-science, of course, but that's not the case here). |
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#79 |
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Join Date: Dec 2010
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"Hang up if you understand"
Just got round to watching last weeks episode - it was a good one...with Abbie & Jenny teaming up, hope she's out soon.
![]() But the poor Barman...I could say Snookered, but it was a Pool Table. ![]() "We are everywhere" |
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#80 |
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Join Date: Aug 2013
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Quote:
Who is insisting on calling it a horror snow?
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#81 |
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In reading back several posts there are statements by others that it is not a horror show which which left me thinking they are either eluding to statements previous to theirs or someone "doth protest too much" which was why I was trying to be clear that I didn't think it was a horror show either. It's a good program and certainly does deserve the second season they've gotten.
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#82 |
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Join Date: Aug 2013
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Sci Fi magic
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I'd say it was a Fantasy show with elements of horror (like Buffy).
Certainly not Sci-Fi. No self-respecting sci-fi show involves magic or the supernatural (unless it is explained through pseudo-science, of course, but that's not the case here). |
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#83 |
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So then you're saying that in the early 90's the 5 year long Hugo and Emmy-award winning show "Babylon 5" written and produced by J. Michael Sstraczynski was not sci-fi? They had characters who used advanced technology in magical ways and were cast in the role of magicians, which may reach your qualifier of pseudo-science.
Babylon 5 was one of my favourite programmes on TV at the time and its spin-off, Crusade, featured the technomages quite heavily. It is quintessential sci-fi. As a famous Science Fiction author once wrote, "any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic". I think the technomages may even have mentioned that phrase in the show. The important distinction is whether the show portrays its fantastic events within a scientific framework or not. Another example is the Doctor Who episode, the Daemons, where the Master summons up an ancient horned beast called Azal through the use of a black magic ceremony complete with pentagrams, arcane chanting and ritual sacrifice But the Doctor goes to great pains to explain that magic doesn't exist, that it all has a scientific explanation. The horned beast is an ancient and powerful alien being who arrived in a space ship millennia ago to guide mankind's progress and the arcane rituals were provided to mankind as a means to trigger communication. Some people call Star Wars Fantasy because of the Force but it was all explained away using the pseudo-science of midi-chlorians. Sleepy Hollow on the other hand, at least as far as it's been presented so far, is definitely Fantasy. It portrays magic as magic with no scientific basis behind it. There's no suggestion that there is any science involved here and, as the name suggests, Science Fiction is all about Science. |
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#84 |
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What a pleasure it is to see James Frain appear as Rutledge in this excellent show. Even better that he plays one of the good guys - a real change for James, who's normally cast as a villain! Although he doesn't play a major part, his performance is brilliant. Adds a real touch of class.
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#85 |
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Join Date: Sep 2011
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Quote:
What a pleasure it is to see James Frain appear as Rutledge in this excellent show. Even better that he plays one of the good guys - a real change for James, who's normally cast as a villain! Although he doesn't play a major part, his performance is brilliant. Adds a real touch of class.
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#86 |
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Oops! He's in episode 6, The Sin Eater.
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#87 |
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Join Date: Aug 2013
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Thanks for the clarification:
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Of course, it does. It's a prime example of pseudo-science to describe something which appears to be magic but isn't.
Babylon 5 was one of my favourite programmes on TV at the time and its spin-off, Crusade, featured the technomages quite heavily. It is quintessential sci-fi. As a famous Science Fiction author once wrote, "any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic". I think the technomages may even have mentioned that phrase in the show. The important distinction is whether the show portrays its fantastic events within a scientific framework or not. Another example is the Doctor Who episode, the Daemons, where the Master summons up an ancient horned beast called Azal through the use of a black magic ceremony complete with pentagrams, arcane chanting and ritual sacrifice But the Doctor goes to great pains to explain that magic doesn't exist, that it all has a scientific explanation. The horned beast is an ancient and powerful alien being who arrived in a space ship millennia ago to guide mankind's progress and the arcane rituals were provided to mankind as a means to trigger communication. Some people call Star Wars Fantasy because of the Force but it was all explained away using the pseudo-science of midi-chlorians. Sleepy Hollow on the other hand, at least as far as it's been presented so far, is definitely Fantasy. It portrays magic as magic with no scientific basis behind it. There's no suggestion that there is any science involved here and, as the name suggests, Science Fiction is all about Science. I am very much enjoying "Sleepy Hollow" be it fantasy, sci fi or whatever. It is unique, fun, and surprising at times like last nights "The Sin Eater" was thought provoking in how it explained forgiveness, and the necessity for it. Crane's holding on to the past was (and these are my words/thoughts) like building a connecting bridge between he and the horseman, thus allowing him continuous access to Crane. Heck it was almost like having a GPS chip in him! I absolutely loved Babylon 5, and was hooked from the start; held my breath between seasons 4 & 5 in particular to see if it would get picked up, and now own all of the DVD's of the series and the movies. It's fun seeing the various actors showing up now on different shows like "Delen & Sheridin's" recent apperances on NCIS. I keep looking for and waiting to see if the B-5 series will be brought back for reruns at some point as it would be fun to watch them play out again. Granted I could play the DVD's, and do from time to time, it just would be interesting to watch B-5 in that venue again, and to see if would attract a new generation of viewers, what would they think of it now. Again thanks for your clarifcations and I look forward to reading yours and everyone else's views regarding "Sleepy Hollow". From what I've seen so far many on this forum are very knowledgeable about who has played other characters, what their talent brings to this show, and noticing how the other roles they have played may or may not be a part of how and what they do on this show. Looks like there will be much to talk about for quite a while to come. One thing for sure that can be said regarding "Sleepy Hollow" and it is best paraphrased by what "Ambsasador G'Kar" said regarding "B-5" in its first season opeing show. He said that B-5 was a curious and unique place where the strange and unusual could easily happen and that "nothing was as it seemed to be!" So it is with "Sleepy Hollow" too! |
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#88 |
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Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Kessingland, Suffolk
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Quote:
My intent was not for a theological discusion, but rather to suggest that "Sleepy Hollow" is not a horror show as some are insistant on calling it. But rather if one looks to who are the writers of the show's script, it seems clear to me to think of it as science fiction i.e. "Star Trek" and or something similiar to a fantasy such as "The Twilight Zone." And your views on that are???
Horror = Headless Horseman Sci-Fi = Time Travel Fantasy/Twilight Zone = hiddens agendas/people not being who they say they are Another of Washington Irving's stories Rip van Winkle had a similar mix of elements. Horror = He meets a bunch of ghosts Sci-Fi = He time travels in that he sleeps for 20 years |
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#89 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Aberdeen
Posts: 12,187
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Quote:
I'd say there are elements of all three concepts
Horror = Headless Horseman Sci-Fi = Time Travel Fantasy/Twilight Zone = hiddens agendas/people not being who they say they are Another of Washington Irving's stories Rip van Winkle had a similar mix of elements. Horror = He meets a bunch of ghosts Sci-Fi = He time travels in that he sleeps for 20 years |
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#90 |
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Join Date: Sep 2011
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Quote:
Thrombin, thank you so much for the clarifications that you gave, and I really do mean that! Must confess to not being up on these nuances, I guess at 70 years old if it looks like "Flash Gordon" i.e. from outer space, then its science fiction in my old school mind. However that said I am always willing to learn more, so teach on all of you.
I am very much enjoying "Sleepy Hollow" be it fantasy, sci fi or whatever. It is unique, fun, and surprising at times like last nights "The Sin Eater" was thought provoking in how it explained forgiveness, and the necessity for it. Crane's holding on to the past was (and these are my words/thoughts) like building a connecting bridge between he and the horseman, thus allowing him continuous access to Crane. Heck it was almost like having a GPS chip in him! I absolutely loved Babylon 5, and was hooked from the start; held my breath between seasons 4 & 5 in particular to see if it would get picked up, and now own all of the DVD's of the series and the movies. It's fun seeing the various actors showing up now on different shows like "Delen & Sheridin's" recent apperances on NCIS. I keep looking for and waiting to see if the B-5 series will be brought back for reruns at some point as it would be fun to watch them play out again. Granted I could play the DVD's, and do from time to time, it just would be interesting to watch B-5 in that venue again, and to see if would attract a new generation of viewers, what would they think of it now. Again thanks for your clarifcations and I look forward to reading yours and everyone else's views regarding "Sleepy Hollow". From what I've seen so far many on this forum are very knowledgeable about who has played other characters, what their talent brings to this show, and noticing how the other roles they have played may or may not be a part of how and what they do on this show. Looks like there will be much to talk about for quite a while to come. One thing for sure that can be said regarding "Sleepy Hollow" and it is best paraphrased by what "Ambsasador G'Kar" said regarding "B-5" in its first season opeing show. He said that B-5 was a curious and unique place where the strange and unusual could easily happen and that "nothing was as it seemed to be!" So it is with "Sleepy Hollow" too!
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#91 |
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I wouldn't call either of these scenarios time travel in the sci fi sense. It's not like they travelled through time at a different speed than the rest of humanity. They just happened to be in a state of unconsciousness/hibernation, by supernatural means.
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#92 |
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Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Edgware, Middlesex
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Quote:
Thrombin, thank you so much for the clarifications that you gave, and I really do mean that! Must confess to not being up on these nuances, I guess at 70 years old if it looks like "Flash Gordon" i.e. from outer space, then its science fiction in my old school mind. However that said I am always willing to learn more, so teach on all of you.
![]() It is still possible for shows to combine Fantasy and Sci-Fi, of course. Smallville, for example, featured super-heroes with science-based explanations such as Flash and Superman along with magic-wielding types like Zatanna. The Marvel universe also has its science-based heroes and the magic-wiedling Doctor Strange. So it's possible to combine the two but I'd say it's pretty rare. Right now, I don't think there are any science fiction elements in Sleepy Hollow. Even if it featured proper time travel (unlike the hibernation type that was actually featured) the concept is only sci-fi if it has a scientific explanation for it. If people travel in time via a magic spell then it is still pure Fantasy. |
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#93 |
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Join Date: Aug 2013
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Once again, thanks everyone for the clarifications especially my opps on an unintended spoiler, truly apologies for that one! The way you broke it down RebelScum into the catagories was the most helpful. I tend to be a visual learner. I truly never meant to offend anyone when I refrenced the remarks about a horror part of the show. My error was to not check further back than a reference or two which really inferred that it was "not" a horror show. I tend to think of horror shows as something like "Friday the 13th" or "Chainsaw Murders" and yes swords cutting heads off of horsemen is horrible in the moment. This show certainly does encompass many nuances but I also see now where it really isn't science fiction either, but it sure is facinating isn't it! Thanks again.
Last edited by Judy_Hendrixon : 07-11-2013 at 07:15. Reason: Just to clarify |
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#94 |
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Join Date: Aug 2013
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Trainee question: spoiler alert timing for U.S.?
So someone please "splain" something to me so as a "colonist" with British ties, my dad was born there and I still have family in the area as well as my husband was stationed there for 3 years. Long way round to say I get it about the time difference.
I get "Sleepy Hollow" on Monday nights here in Texas at Central Time at 8:00 p.m. In Texas lingo, Ya'll are roughly 7-9 hours ahead of us time wise. So a little over 2 evennings ago (it is now (1:45 a.m. Thursday 11-6-13) I saw the eposode, "Sin Eater" on Sleepy Hollow. When does it appear there for you?? What's the, for lack of a better word, time lag for me not to accidently do a spoiler alert?? Thanks for any advice on this one, from one who learned early from my London born grandmother how to make a proper cup of tea! And certainly not in a microwave, or a "replicator" by speaking Earl Grey, hot please. |
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#95 |
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Join Date: Sep 2011
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Quote:
So someone please "splain" something to me so as a "colonist" with British ties, my dad was born there and I still have family in the area as well as my husband was stationed there for 3 years. Long way round to say I get it about the time difference.
I get "Sleepy Hollow" on Monday nights here in Texas at Central Time at 8:00 p.m. In Texas lingo, Ya'll are roughly 7-9 hours ahead of us time wise. So a little over 2 evennings ago (it is now (1:45 a.m. Thursday 11-6-13) I saw the eposode, "Sin Eater" on Sleepy Hollow. When does it appear there for you?? What's the, for lack of a better word, time lag for me not to accidently do a spoiler alert?? Thanks for any advice on this one, from one who learned early from my London born grandmother how to make a proper cup of tea! And certainly not in a microwave, or a "replicator" by speaking Earl Grey, hot please. |
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#96 |
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Quote:
I see Ken Olin directed 'Sin Eater'. Didn't realise he'd moved into directing.
![]() Whilst he did the odd single episode here and there of shows he was in, as many actors are allowed to do, he did quite a big stint of directing on Alias. |
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#97 |
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Quote:
He actually moved about 20 years ago.
![]() Whilst he did the odd single episode here and there of shows he was in, as many actors are allowed to do, he did quite a big stint of directing on Alias.
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#98 |
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Join Date: Jun 2003
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Quote:
'Sin Eater' is on next Wednesday here. The episode with James Frain. 'John Doe' was aired last night. I see Ken Olin directed 'Sin Eater'. Didn't realise he'd moved into directing.
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#99 |
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Quote:
Sin Eater is the episode with James Frain, not John Doe
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#100 |
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Join Date: Jun 2003
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Quote:
I didn't say it was. I said the Sin Eater is the episode with James Frain.
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