Been watching a lot of Columbo recently and something occurred to me.. The bumbling eccentric who feigns scattiness and buffonery to wrong foot his foes and get them to underestimate him... columbo has a lot of similarities with the Doctor. And in that respect I think that helps explain why Tennants Doc (while undoubtedly popular with the fanbase, although I always assume its the newer fans) wasn't very Doctorish for me.
. DT was heroic. he always seemed to like to warn the villains how big and scary he was. All that Deifying him, and the "oncoming storm" stuff just allowed the writers to not allow the Doctor to figure things out. His reputation was used often as a plot device to allow him to just win.
In a way itd be like Jason Statham or someone being Columbo... It would still work as a crime drama.. people would think Columbo cool and hard.. But it wouldnt be columbo...
I should have left the house today Im sorry

The Columbo comparison works with the second Doc, the fourth (to a certain degree) and the eleventh. But none of the others really had that vibe.

Some of my favourite Ten moments have come from his "buffoonery". Tricking the Family of Blood, acting drunk with the Clockwork Droids. In fact right from the off I knew 10 would be a lot of fun!

I think Tennant was a great Doctor.

There's almost nothing you've written there that doesn't apply as much or even more so to Matt Smith's Doctor.

I really liked him but I keep having to remind myself that I really liked him. And the reason why I need to remind myself is that I was infuriated by the end of his era. And I have liked Matt Smith so much that I do feel eager to defend his interpretation which does remind me of some eccentric elements of the character that were in danger of being forgotten after the blokishness of 9 and 10.

But any way the main point about David Tennant's era was that he was a great actor who loved the show and helped consolidate its success. And there were some great episodes...

Tennant was a good Doctor, and is a very decent actor, but he really didn't do it for me. Credit where it's due, he was part of the success machine that made it all a successful revival along with Eccleston, Piper and RTD... but I can't avoid the fact he's my least favourite of the three incarnations of Nu-Who.

My problem with Tennant is how generic he is. As a character, I don't feel that he was ever particularly 'alien' nor was he fleshed out enough to be a particularly in-depth character either. He was lost somewhere between Eccleston's depth and Smith's quirkiness. For me, the Tenth Doctor was a Doctor best identified by his companions... his friends and allies were the absolute best of him. Rose, Martha and Donna absolutely made his era what it was, for me, and it's what I feel makes his final year so weak - the Tenth Doctor amounts to very little when he's going solo. Adding insult to injury, his romantic nature was stereotypically human, he was written to be charismatic and dashing...and as such never amounted to much more than your stereotypical heroic protagonist - an irony given how much his era spoke against old stereotypes. Tennant was great, but to me he isn't how I imagine The Doctor.

In contrast to that, I would say that the Eleventh Doctor is the best thing about himself. He's brilliant but doesn't quite realise it (he seems quite self-hating), he's endearing and friendly and smart and old and young all at once. He's so incredibly alien, and by comparison his companions have been woefully generic plot devices so far (again, credit where it's due...Amy's exit was powerful, and I like River Song).

Interesting point you make re the companions here. I remember quite a few threads and comments not long ago where people critiqued Moffat for making the show all about the companions. I don't see that. If anything his era has returned the Doctor front and centre of the show even despite the continues mystery's associated with Amy and Clara. The Doctor seems to do more now and is less defined by the companions. There were times in the RTD era where he was utterly ineffectual and the universe was saved by the companion. The best example of this is the S4 finale where is he is almost entirely useless and seems to blunder around with no defined plan of action and its only those around him that actually get things done.

I just don't get this "alien" thing at all. Matt's Doctor is eccentric, awkward, quirky etc, but they are all human traits and certainly don't make him "alien" IMO.

Well it depends how literal-minded you want to be. I have the distinct feeling that if there were an alien race of Time Lords they probably wouldn't resemble any of the incarnations of the doctor.

But it is quite common to think of eccentric human beings as other-worldly and we would be a bit disappointed if the Doctor was portrayed in the exact same manner as Ian Beale off Eastenders (is he even still in it?)

So the more eccentric doctors are often described as more alien, which seems perfectly reasonable.

Sorry I can't quote a post on this phone for some reason. But. I really didn't like the tenth doctor acting drunk.. I genuinely squirmed at that almost as much as the auton comedy arm fight in Rose or the burping bin.. Just didn't work for me.

Was that meant to be comedy?

Alien doesn't have to be referring to his origins. It can simply be an adjective for displaying character traits that are "out of the norm".

A dictionary definition.

I'll admit that Ten is not my favorite Doctor, and I place the blame on RTD, and the direction he took the show. I really hope one day we'll see Tenth Doctor Big Finish stories, since they've done well with characters that were failed by the writers.

Also, "The Stolen Earth/Jounrey's End" is the worst thing I'd ever seen on Doctor Who. I legitimately cannot find one thing about this story I fully like.

Davros?

I think this an unrealistic expectation.

I wonder what is "alien" for you? A humanoid with a telescopic, slime dripping double jaws and acid for blood? What would the Doctor have to be like to be alien for you? Wouldn't you have to describe those traits in human terms anyway?

We humans tend to anthropomorphise everything, so if we ever encountered real, sentient aliens, we'd be ascribing human personality traits and motivations to them in an attempt to understand and relate to them.

Plus, Doctor Who is designed by humans to entertain humans. Make the protagonist too different, too unlikeable and too unrelateable and you'll "alienate" most of your audience. Make the central character just different and unusual enough to be interesting and you'll have a successful TV show with mass appeal.

The Ferengi in Star Trek were a prime example of something too alien for the audience. They were adjusted after their first appearance in TNG.

Well, yes, Davros was good. I loved the make up and prosthetics they used (though the metal hand looked too much like foam). But looking back I don't like how much he relied on precognition, and fate. He believed that he would win because destiny says so, while in the Classic series, he believed he would win because he himself would make it so.

I don't like how he went from a man who would shape his own fate, to being content with listening to the ramblings of a mad Dalek.

Yeah that always bothered me. I am a fan of that finale for the most part despite its myriad flaws...and there are alot...but you are right. It seemed odd for the Daleks let alone Davros who have always been characterised by their militaristic lack of feeling and belief in pure science to suddenly be relying upon the mystical destiny blatherings of a mad and disturbed Dalek. Never made much sense and seem completely out of character.

That being said they were clearly modelled on the Nazis and history has proved that there was a significant amount of mysticism floating around in that military machine so maybe it did sort of work in a round about way.

I agree that Davros was brilliantly portrayed though. Both visually and in the acting stakes he helped carry those episodes. The sooner they bring him back the better.

I agree with seanyboy180; I somehow just don't like David Tennant's style of delivery as an actor. It's difficult to put my finger on what it is that irritates me so much about him. It's certainly not that I think he's a poor/weak actor. He's very accomplished and professional, but....something still irritates me about him. It may just be me misinterpreting his style, but when I'm watching him (and this isn't just in Dr Who, I got the same feeling with 'Casanova') it's as if a hint of Tennant's own ego spills over into the character.
...But I'm not saying that I am "right" about this and that people who disagree are "wrong", it's merely my subjective feeling about him, that's all.

Not another "I didn't like Tennant" thread Surely if you are making comparisons with Columbo then Matt's Doctor is a far closer match.

sorry i think you may have missed my point. I was saying that the eccentricities of Columbo (of which I've been watching far too much recently probably ) are very Doctorish for the most part.and to that end Smiths Doctor WOULD be a closer match. And that DT's Doctor was more heroic and therefore a bit generic (for me obviously) and was making the point that you could get a cool actor to play Columbo but it would lose a fair degree of the spontanaity and character . I don't feel the urge to ever revisit DTs performances as the Doctor because they felt very predictable ( as were the scripts ) suddenly He'd have a "wait... no.. YES!!" moment were he'd suddenly remember who the Alien species were and therefore how to beat them. I didn't hate his Doctor ( indeed Human Nature was imho one of his best, though Id have loved him to play the Doc as he did the teacher).

So well said! As usual people take being a bit weird to mean alien. I'd just lve to know how many aliens they've actually met!

Well I wouldn't like to speak for anyone else but alien for me certainly isn't someone throwing their arms around a bit and not knowing a few British customs when he has spent more than enough time in 21st century Britain to know them!

I woudl agree, a cross between Columbo and Mr Bean.

^This^ x 1000