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Windows 8 Pro - 8.1 Pro ... unable to upgrade.


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Old 30-09-2013, 03:23
DJGM
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I have a laptop has Windows 8 Pro installed, and I want to upgrade to 8.1 Pro using one of the recently released ISO
image files setup to install from a USB flash drive. When I've entered the product key and agreed to EULA, it brings
up the "Choose what to keep" screen, with the options to "Keep personal filles only" or "Nothing", but no option to
keeps all my installed apps and desktop programs, as if I was attempted to upgrade from a Preview release.

Thing is, the Windows 8 installation isn't one of the preview versions, it's the RTM build released last year. I want to
do a straight forward upgrade install, keeping everything in place, not an install where I have to reinstall everything.
I'd rather not wait until the upgrade appears in the Windows Store, I prefer to install from physical install media.

If I was upgrading from XP or Vista, then fair enough, as that's a much bigger upgrade path that would work best
using a "wash-n-wipe" install method ... but this is more of a step up, rather than a full on system upgrade . . .
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Old 30-09-2013, 06:58
IvanIV
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32 vs 64 bit could be a problem.
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Old 30-09-2013, 08:37
jem101
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This is normal behaviour. Currently if you try to upgrade from 8 to 8.1 using the ISO image, it will remove all of your installed applications and you will need to re-install them afterwards.

It basically does a clean install of 8.1 and then moves your documents etc. across but it can't do this with applications.

You will need to wait until 8.1 is properly released to the public, what you have gotten is the RTM version intended only for developers to test programmes before 8.1 is made generally available. If you wait until it is properly released as a Windows Store application (probably late October) then you will be able to do an in-place upgrade which will retain everything.
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Old 30-09-2013, 15:01
DJGM
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32 vs 64 bit could be a problem.
It's a 64bit system. I was trying to install from the 64bit ISO.

This is normal behaviour. Currently if you try to upgrade from 8 to 8.1 using the ISO image, it
will remove all of your installed applications and you will need to re-install them afterwards.

It basically does a clean install of 8.1 and then moves your documents etc.
across but it can't do this with applications.
Well, that's no good. There was never this problem with the upgrade from Windows 7 Home Premium that came
pre-installed on the laptop. One straight forward in-place upgrade to Windows 8 Pro, everything was preserved.
Going from Windows 7 Home Premium to Windows 8 Pro was a bigger upgrade than W8 to 8.1 is.

Like I said, it's merely a step-up rather than an upgrade. Even upgrading Windows Server 2012 RTM to the R2
version did not present this problem in the testbed server VM I'd setup in VMware, so there is absolutely NO
need whatsoever to apply this particular limitation to the step-up from W8 to 8.1.

You will need to wait until 8.1 is properly released to the public, what you have gotten is the RTM
version intended only for developers to test programmes before 8.1 is made generally available.
If you wait until it is properly released as a Windows Store application (probably late October)
then you will be able to do an in-place upgrade which will retain everything.
This is stupid. An utterly pointless limitation. I prefer to use proper install media from an ISO image, like a DVD
or a pen drive, rather than wait for the digital download to appear to appear in the online app-store. I'm going to
have to find a hack to get around this nonsense. If I was an ordinary end user, there'd be no problem, but this
is a Technet ISO image ... it shouldn't have this limitation, unless I was upgrading from the Preview release.

This is just the latest in a long line of stupid boneheaded "Let's p**s everyone off!" decisions from Microsoft.
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Old 30-09-2013, 17:54
IvanIV
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W8.1 was originally supposed to be available around the end of October, no TechNet, no MSDN. Take it as a goodwill of MS that they released something. It's only a couple of weeks. You can wait or re-install everything.
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Old 30-09-2013, 19:41
DJGM
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W8.1 was originally supposed to be available around the end of October, no TechNet, no MSDN.
Take it as a goodwill of MS that they released something. It's only a couple of weeks.
You can wait or re-install everything.
No. That isn't the point. When I upgraded from W7HP to W8Pro on the laptop, with the installer on a pen drive, it was
about as straight forward as it could be. Run the "setup.exe" file, answer the questions, enter the product key, agree
to the license, then walk away for about half an hour, go for a walk, have a brew, come back, job done.

With W8 to W8.1 being a mere step up with a few extra features and cosmetic enhancements added, rather than a
total upgrade, I should have the choice to install from real actual physical install media without having to re-install
everything from scratch. Like I said earlier, if this was a big upgrade procedure from an older version of Windows,
like XP or Vista, fair enough, I'd expect to have to re-install everything, and would prepare accordingly.

Same goes if I was migrating from 32bit to 64bit . . .
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Old 30-09-2013, 20:08
Stig
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No. That isn't the point. When I upgraded from W7HP to W8Pro on the laptop, with the installer on a pen drive, it was
about as straight forward as it could be. Run the "setup.exe" file, answer the questions, enter the product key, agree
to the license, then walk away for about half an hour, go for a walk, have a brew, come back, job done.

With W8 to W8.1 being a mere step up with a few extra features and cosmetic enhancements added, rather than a
total upgrade, I should have the choice to install from real actual physical install media without having to re-install
everything from scratch. Like I said earlier, if this was a big upgrade procedure from an older version of Windows,
like XP or Vista, fair enough, I'd expect to have to re-install everything, and would prepare accordingly.

Same goes if I was migrating from 32bit to 64bit . . .
Actually, if you think of Windows 8.1 as a Service Pack it makes sense. If you installed a DVD of Windows 7 with SP1 over Windows 7 you would expect a new install.

As mentioned above, MS put out the ISO of W8.1 only after developers complained. It's not designed for in-place upgrades.
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Old 30-09-2013, 20:25
IvanIV
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Yes, in-place-upgrade is not supported by this early ISO image. Rather than rushing it and possibly cocking it up to get the upgrade functionality in, they released it without it. Much simpler, fewer chances something goes wrong. A lot of time now is spent on testing the upgrade process and making final adjustments.
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Old 30-09-2013, 20:34
DJGM
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Fine ... as long I have to choice to use standard physical install media from release day, and still be able to keep
all my apps and programs, without having to rely on a digital download from the online store, I can live with that.

Re-installing the Modern UI apps isn't so bad, but reinstalling/reconfiguring a ton of desktop apps is a ball-ache!
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Old 01-10-2013, 11:40
IvanIV
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Do not quote me on that, I do not work for MS, but it makes sense that way. If they are going to sell upgrade DVDs they need to have an ISO that supports in-place upgrade.
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Old 01-10-2013, 13:42
DarkestHour
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Er, I did an inplace upgrade on my Windows 8 Pro install using the MSDN ISO just fine.
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Old 01-10-2013, 17:44
jem101
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Do not quote me on that, I do not work for MS, but it makes sense that way. If they are going to sell upgrade DVDs they need to have an ISO that supports in-place upgrade.
The original plan (and as far as I know this is still the case) was that MS were not intending to sell upgrade DVDs - the only way to get 8.1 was either via the Windows Store to upgrade 8 to 8.1 or to purchase a retail copy of 8.1 and do a clean install.
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Old 01-10-2013, 23:07
Sexbomb
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Is this 8.1 upgrade going to be free in 2 weeks or are we going to be ripped off into buying it?
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Old 01-10-2013, 23:18
call100
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Is this 8.1 upgrade going to be free in 2 weeks or are we going to be ripped off into buying it?
Yes it's free. So, you wasted 10 minutes being annoyed, for nothing.....
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Old 02-10-2013, 12:40
jem101
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Reading between the lines and I have to stress that this really is just my opinion, I think that MS did originally intend to charge a nominal sum for this but decided to make it free when Windows 8 become somewhat less that a stellar success and it became mired down with complaints about start menu and start screen, things which 8.1 do go a little to rectifying.

It does look as if MS are going to go down the Apple route and roll out new versions of Windows 8 quite regularly, which will be more than a traditional service pack but most of the changes will be behind-the-scenes so to speak. So instead of a big jump (XP to Vista, Vista to W7, W7 to W8) every few years, they'll be a more gradual slow 'evolution' of Windows and these upgrades will be chargeable.

It wouldn't surprise me in the slightest if Windows 8.2 upgrade doesn't appear sometime late next year at a smallish cost.
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Old 02-10-2013, 13:15
IvanIV
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I think they intend free upgrades when a minor version number changes and paid ones when major version number changes, thus:

if you had 8.0 then 8.1, 8.2, etc. are for free.

if you had 8.1 then 8.2, etc. are for free, etc.

you will pay for 9.0.
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Old 02-10-2013, 14:25
TheBigM
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Well the latest news is that they are moving to the GDR model used by Windows Phone.
GDR for Win8.1 is supposed to be due out in Spring, a similar time to Windows Phone 8.1 release.

Their long term ambition is to make money from devices (higher margin) rather than through selling software.

I can picture them selling Windows as a subscription however, any and all updates are included so long as you keep subscribing.
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Old 02-10-2013, 15:36
DJGM
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Back to the original point of this topic ... although I'm still unable to upgrade from W8 Pro to W8.1 Pro on the laptop,
for my main desktop PC which runs W8 Enterprise as it's main OS, the standard install media for W8.1 Enterprise
appears to allow me to do the upgrade the way I want, preserving everything that I want to keep.

Screengrabs:
Windows 8.1 Pro installer on the laptop.
Windows 8.1 Enterprise installer on main PC.

I'm wondering if the fact that I have the Windows Media Center add-on installed is preventing Setup from showing
the option I want to use, and whether I should uninstall that first (if possible) before continuing with the step-up.
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