Mobile Chargers to be Standardised (Finger to Apple)

chenks · 02-10-2013, 21:32

Quote:

I bet the breakage rate for these work PDAs would soon go down if the users were held properly responsible for them. Of course if they are being used in tough working conditions then they should be being given properly ruggedised versions.

they are rugged versions, but the weak point is still the micro USB port on the device, due to the little bit in the port - that's the weak point.

chenks · 02-10-2013, 21:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by PrinceGaz

You can pick up a MicroUSB cable on Amazon for next to nothing and they look far more sturdy than the Apple cable as the MicroUSB cable is essentially a moulded plastic plug which is part of the end of the cable, whereas Apple's cable has the plastic connector part, a sleeve behind it, and then the cable behind that.

as i've been saying, it's the NOT the cable that is the weak point with micro USB, it's the actual port on the device - due to that little bit inside the port that has a habit of bending or being broken.

for me this is not a lightning vs micro usb decision. i'd have any other type of port over micro USB providing it nothing in the actual port that could be damaged.

gomezz · 03-10-2013, 08:02

I am still wondering how the the inner flange gets bent or broken. On every device I use with one of these the plug does not get as far as touching the flange if offered up the the wrong way round. You have to wonder if people are poking other things in the socket? Not unknown for employees to break equipment in an obvious way if they want it replacing.

kidspud · 03-10-2013, 08:26

All the EU are trying to achieve is a reduction in the number of power supplies needed to charge phones, and therefore a reduction in waste. It is very sensible to have a standard connection at the power supply end and for that connector to be a removable one. Quite why they feel the need to try and dictate the connection at the phone end, which will restrict innovation and design is worrying and makes very little sense.

chenks · 03-10-2013, 08:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by gomezz

I am still wondering how the the inner flange gets bent or broken. On every device I use with one of these the plug does not get as far as touching the flange if offered up the the wrong way round. You have to wonder if people are poking other things in the socket? Not unknown for employees to break equipment in an obvious way if they want it replacing.

never mentioned anything about the cable being put in the wrong way round.

gomezz · 03-10-2013, 08:50

One other possibility is that the plug is being stressed after insertion. For example I sometimes use the cup-holder on the van at work to hold my mobile phone. But if I am charging the phone then I put it in the holder upside down so the plug is not being stressed by the bottom of the holder. Can make using the sat-nav interesting though with the map being the wrong way up. I keep meaning to fashion a spacer out of polystyrene to lift the phone up half an inch or so to sort this out. An L-shaped micro-USB plug would also help but couldn't seem to find anywhere that does them.

flagpole · 03-10-2013, 08:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by chenks

as i've been saying, it's the NOT the cable that is the weak point with micro USB, it's the actual port on the device - due to that little bit inside the port that has a habit of bending or being broken.

for me this is not a lightning vs micro usb decision. i'd have any other type of port over micro USB providing it nothing in the actual port that could be damaged.

what would you have to stick in there to break the tab inside the port.

on my phone the tab is about 5mm below the surface of the phone.

chenks · 03-10-2013, 09:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by flagpole

what would you have to stick in there to break the tab inside the port.

just the cable it seems

Quote:

Originally Posted by flagpole

on my phone the tab is about 5mm below the surface of the phone.

your phone must have a different design then, as the tab/flange on my nexus 4 and on the PDAs we use is in the middle/lower half of the hole, not below the surface of the phone.

wakey · 03-10-2013, 09:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stiggles

Is it? Ive seen loads of complaints about it.

A quick google shows this:-

https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=li...m=122&ie=UTF-8

Oh, and even on apples own site where you buy the cable!

http://store.apple.com/us/reviews/MD...g-to-usb-cable

Most of the reviews are poor! 2 stars out of 740 reviews! Still going to say you haven't seen anyone complain about it now?

I don't think you will find anyone who will disagree that Apples cables are value for money or for that matter that they are well built (there attempt to make the cable more 'stylish' makes it more fragile) BUT you aren't forced to buy them. Despite your claim they haven't blocked all cables just those that don't meet a minimum spec. I have 3 cheap non apple cables and all work perfectly on ios7.

And again I will point out my android phone won't charge on some micro usb cables I have which do work find for my kindle and my portable hard drives. These cables also won't power my raspberry pi on so its not just Apple

Quote:

Funny as i have never seen one destroy itself! I've tripped over countless usb cables and i have never bent or snapped one. Its also incorrect to say lightning will disengage when pulled. Just the other day at work i saw my pals iphone hanging from the desk still plugged in to the phone and the computer.

Never heard of that since they could as you say never ever tell.

You should see all the portable hard drives I've had to recover due to broken micro USB ports on the device. Either the plastic tab breaks through wear or the metal surround warps which causes a lose connection (which can cause data loss when writing to the disc) which eventually causes a terminal breakage.

And most manufacturers won't fix a broken port as they consider it to be due to misuse by the user rather than a fault with the device

gomezz · 03-10-2013, 11:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by gomezz

I keep meaning to fashion a spacer out of polystyrene to lift the phone up half an inch or so to sort this out. An L-shaped micro-USB plug would also help but couldn't seem to find anywhere that does them.

Just had a brainwave and threaded an old squash ball onto the USB lead to act as a spacer/stress-reliever. That may mean the phone now sits too high in the cup-holder to be secure in which case I will try it with half a squash ball. If that is too low than I have lots of old squash balls to play with and get the Goldilocks adaptation somewhere inbetween.

marknotgeorge · 28-10-2013, 20:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by gomezz

Just had a brainwave and threaded an old squash ball onto the USB lead to act as a spacer/stress-reliever. That may mean the phone now sits too high in the cup-holder to be secure in which case I will try it with half a squash ball. If that is too low than I have lots of old squash balls to play with and get the Goldilocks adaptation somewhere inbetween.

Why don't you just get yourself (or get your employer to get you) a proper holder?

gomezz · 28-10-2013, 22:26

It needs to be small, portable and secure. Such a beast does not exist.

The Lord Lucan · 28-10-2013, 22:45

This will change nothing. They are already complaint. The idea is to reduce different chargers needed, not cables. The Apple charger (both iPad & iPhone) can charge any USB device.

flagpole · 28-10-2013, 23:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Lord Lucan

This will change nothing. They are already complaint. The idea is to reduce different chargers needed, not cables. The Apple charger (both iPad & iPhone) can charge any USB device.

How do you know this?

Every commentator I have read disagrees with you. So where are you getting your information in order that you state it with such certainty?

swordman · 28-10-2013, 23:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Lord Lucan

This will change nothing. They are already complaint. The idea is to reduce different chargers needed, not cables. The Apple charger (both iPad & iPhone) can charge any USB device.

I would think with their profits falling yet again this quarter that these chipped leads are essential revenue for them.

zapod · 28-10-2013, 23:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by swordman

I would think with their profits falling yet again this quarter that these chipped leads are essential revenue for them.

Ironically, swordman hit the nail on the head.

Not only is lightning reversible, it's future proofed.

Enjoy your micro-USB 3 connectors, they look just perfect.

gomezz · 29-10-2013, 01:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by gomezz

It needs to be small, portable and secure. Such a beast does not exist.

In the end I got one of these. But I don't trust it to hold a valuable mobile in place on its own and still want to rest the bottom of the phone on/in the cupholder with the squash ball taking the strain off the USB connector.

The Lord Lucan · 29-10-2013, 08:00

By commentator you mean misinformed or biased tech journalists, like the one quoted by the OP? Oh like the ones I work with everyday, only mine are not misinformed..

flagpole · 29-10-2013, 08:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Lord Lucan

By commentator you mean misinformed or biased tech journalists, like the one quoted by the OP? Oh like the ones I work with everyday, only mine are not misinformed..

so that's your answer. you have secret sauces.

you had best have them tell the EU then. they are wasting all this time focusing on micro-USB. they're clearly looking at the wrong end.

kidspud · 29-10-2013, 10:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by flagpole

you had best have them tell the EU then. they are wasting all this time focusing on micro-USB. they're clearly looking at the wrong end.

The current recommendation going very slowly through the EU makes no reference to micro-USB, only that chargers should be interchangeable.

Mark in Essex · 29-10-2013, 11:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by daclick

People dissing micro USB, yes they break sometimes but ive seen more people moaning about they're broken lightning cable than I have micro usb plus micro USB is more readily available than a lightning charger

Same here.

My friend has broken 2 lighting cables already and he does not plug in and out that much where as I've got 2 Galaxy S3's and they are plugged in and out prob about 6 times a day each and have not had any problems over the last 18 months (also my HTC HD2 had no problems the 2 years I had that).

The Lord Lucan · 29-10-2013, 11:40

I've never heard of or seen a broken iPhone or iPad with a faulty lightening port. My S2 had to go back to Samsung as the USB Port broke as did the LG whatever it was I had before that.
The cable should always die before the device. Personally never heard of the lightening connector bit of an Apple cable breaking.. Fake ones the cables break and I've had after about a years hard use ie always plugged charging in to tether a cable has started to come away at one end but never the port and certianly not the 'spade'

All ports can suffer dirt ingress.. With the lightening port this will manifest in a random charge secuence of loops.

marknotgeorge · 29-10-2013, 14:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by gomezz

In the end I got one of these. But I don't trust it to hold a valuable mobile in place on its own and still want to rest the bottom of the phone on/in the cupholder with the squash ball taking the strain off the USB connector.

If it didn't need to be portable, I'd suggest a solution like my Arkon mount bolted to a Brodit vehicle-specific bracket. The Arkon mount did also contain bits to mount it on the vent, though, which looked a little more secure than the single point of attachment that yours has. Cheaper, too.

gomezz · 29-10-2013, 14:08

Of course I could modify the cupholder on each van I use by punching a hole in the bottom.

Wouldn't be the most drastic unofficial modification I have seen these vans undergo.

Stiggles · 29-10-2013, 14:37

My dads port broke on his ipad mini last night. Is that a lightning port on the mini?

Anyway, apparently he tripped over the charger and something has snapped inside the hole which he can't get out. He's taking it to the apple store in Aberdeen today to see if he can get it fixed.

02-10-2013, 21:32	#101
chenks Forum Member Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: North Ayrshire Posts: 11,399	Quote: Originally Posted by gomezz I bet the breakage rate for these work PDAs would soon go down if the users were held properly responsible for them. Of course if they are being used in tough working conditions then they should be being given properly ruggedised versions. they are rugged versions, but the weak point is still the micro USB port on the device, due to the little bit in the port - that's the weak point.

02-10-2013, 21:33	#102
chenks Forum Member Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: North Ayrshire Posts: 11,399	Quote: Originally Posted by PrinceGaz You can pick up a MicroUSB cable on Amazon for next to nothing and they look far more sturdy than the Apple cable as the MicroUSB cable is essentially a moulded plastic plug which is part of the end of the cable, whereas Apple's cable has the plastic connector part, a sleeve behind it, and then the cable behind that. as i've been saying, it's the NOT the cable that is the weak point with micro USB, it's the actual port on the device - due to that little bit inside the port that has a habit of bending or being broken. for me this is not a lightning vs micro usb decision. i'd have any other type of port over micro USB providing it nothing in the actual port that could be damaged.

03-10-2013, 08:02	#103
gomezz Forum Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Buckingham Posts: 28,590	I am still wondering how the the inner flange gets bent or broken. On every device I use with one of these the plug does not get as far as touching the flange if offered up the the wrong way round. You have to wonder if people are poking other things in the socket? Not unknown for employees to break equipment in an obvious way if they want it replacing.

03-10-2013, 08:26	#104
kidspud Forum Member Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 11,501	All the EU are trying to achieve is a reduction in the number of power supplies needed to charge phones, and therefore a reduction in waste. It is very sensible to have a standard connection at the power supply end and for that connector to be a removable one. Quite why they feel the need to try and dictate the connection at the phone end, which will restrict innovation and design is worrying and makes very little sense.

03-10-2013, 08:38	#105
chenks Forum Member Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: North Ayrshire Posts: 11,399	Quote: Originally Posted by gomezz I am still wondering how the the inner flange gets bent or broken. On every device I use with one of these the plug does not get as far as touching the flange if offered up the the wrong way round. You have to wonder if people are poking other things in the socket? Not unknown for employees to break equipment in an obvious way if they want it replacing. never mentioned anything about the cable being put in the wrong way round.

03-10-2013, 08:50	#106
gomezz Forum Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Buckingham Posts: 28,590	One other possibility is that the plug is being stressed after insertion. For example I sometimes use the cup-holder on the van at work to hold my mobile phone. But if I am charging the phone then I put it in the holder upside down so the plug is not being stressed by the bottom of the holder. Can make using the sat-nav interesting though with the map being the wrong way up. I keep meaning to fashion a spacer out of polystyrene to lift the phone up half an inch or so to sort this out. An L-shaped micro-USB plug would also help but couldn't seem to find anywhere that does them.

03-10-2013, 08:56	#107
flagpole Inactive Member Join Date: Jan 2003 Posts: 43,524	Quote: Originally Posted by chenks as i've been saying, it's the NOT the cable that is the weak point with micro USB, it's the actual port on the device - due to that little bit inside the port that has a habit of bending or being broken. for me this is not a lightning vs micro usb decision. i'd have any other type of port over micro USB providing it nothing in the actual port that could be damaged. what would you have to stick in there to break the tab inside the port. on my phone the tab is about 5mm below the surface of the phone.

03-10-2013, 09:19	#108
chenks Forum Member Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: North Ayrshire Posts: 11,399	Quote: Originally Posted by flagpole what would you have to stick in there to break the tab inside the port. just the cable it seems Quote: Originally Posted by flagpole on my phone the tab is about 5mm below the surface of the phone. your phone must have a different design then, as the tab/flange on my nexus 4 and on the PDAs we use is in the middle/lower half of the hole, not below the surface of the phone.

03-10-2013, 09:45	#109
wakey Forum Member Join Date: Apr 2002 Posts: 2,763	Quote: Originally Posted by Stiggles Is it? Ive seen loads of complaints about it. A quick google shows this:- https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=li...m=122&ie=UTF-8 Oh, and even on apples own site where you buy the cable! http://store.apple.com/us/reviews/MD...g-to-usb-cable Most of the reviews are poor! 2 stars out of 740 reviews! Still going to say you haven't seen anyone complain about it now? I don't think you will find anyone who will disagree that Apples cables are value for money or for that matter that they are well built (there attempt to make the cable more 'stylish' makes it more fragile) BUT you aren't forced to buy them. Despite your claim they haven't blocked all cables just those that don't meet a minimum spec. I have 3 cheap non apple cables and all work perfectly on ios7. And again I will point out my android phone won't charge on some micro usb cables I have which do work find for my kindle and my portable hard drives. These cables also won't power my raspberry pi on so its not just Apple Quote: Funny as i have never seen one destroy itself! I've tripped over countless usb cables and i have never bent or snapped one. Its also incorrect to say lightning will disengage when pulled. Just the other day at work i saw my pals iphone hanging from the desk still plugged in to the phone and the computer. Never heard of that since they could as you say never ever tell. You should see all the portable hard drives I've had to recover due to broken micro USB ports on the device. Either the plastic tab breaks through wear or the metal surround warps which causes a lose connection (which can cause data loss when writing to the disc) which eventually causes a terminal breakage. And most manufacturers won't fix a broken port as they consider it to be due to misuse by the user rather than a fault with the device

03-10-2013, 11:12	#110
gomezz Forum Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Buckingham Posts: 28,590	Quote: Originally Posted by gomezz I keep meaning to fashion a spacer out of polystyrene to lift the phone up half an inch or so to sort this out. An L-shaped micro-USB plug would also help but couldn't seem to find anywhere that does them. Just had a brainwave and threaded an old squash ball onto the USB lead to act as a spacer/stress-reliever. That may mean the phone now sits too high in the cup-holder to be secure in which case I will try it with half a squash ball. If that is too low than I have lots of old squash balls to play with and get the Goldilocks adaptation somewhere inbetween.

28-10-2013, 20:13	#111
marknotgeorge Forum Member Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Back home... Posts: 2,085	Quote: Originally Posted by gomezz Just had a brainwave and threaded an old squash ball onto the USB lead to act as a spacer/stress-reliever. That may mean the phone now sits too high in the cup-holder to be secure in which case I will try it with half a squash ball. If that is too low than I have lots of old squash balls to play with and get the Goldilocks adaptation somewhere inbetween. Why don't you just get yourself (or get your employer to get you) a proper holder?

28-10-2013, 22:26	#112
gomezz Forum Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Buckingham Posts: 28,590	It needs to be small, portable and secure. Such a beast does not exist.

28-10-2013, 22:45	#113
The Lord Lucan Forum Member Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Scotland Posts: 4,966	This will change nothing. They are already complaint. The idea is to reduce different chargers needed, not cables. The Apple charger (both iPad & iPhone) can charge any USB device.

28-10-2013, 23:18	#114
flagpole Inactive Member Join Date: Jan 2003 Posts: 43,524	Quote: Originally Posted by The Lord Lucan This will change nothing. They are already complaint. The idea is to reduce different chargers needed, not cables. The Apple charger (both iPad & iPhone) can charge any USB device. How do you know this? Every commentator I have read disagrees with you. So where are you getting your information in order that you state it with such certainty?

28-10-2013, 23:24	#115
swordman Forum Member Join Date: Oct 2010 Posts: 6,342	Quote: Originally Posted by The Lord Lucan This will change nothing. They are already complaint. The idea is to reduce different chargers needed, not cables. The Apple charger (both iPad & iPhone) can charge any USB device. I would think with their profits falling yet again this quarter that these chipped leads are essential revenue for them.

28-10-2013, 23:49	#116
zapod Forum Member Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Glasgow Posts: 656	Quote: Originally Posted by swordman I would think with their profits falling yet again this quarter that these chipped leads are essential revenue for them. Ironically, swordman hit the nail on the head. Not only is lightning reversible, it's future proofed. Enjoy your micro-USB 3 connectors, they look just perfect.

29-10-2013, 01:33	#117
gomezz Forum Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Buckingham Posts: 28,590	Quote: Originally Posted by gomezz It needs to be small, portable and secure. Such a beast does not exist. In the end I got one of these. But I don't trust it to hold a valuable mobile in place on its own and still want to rest the bottom of the phone on/in the cupholder with the squash ball taking the strain off the USB connector.

29-10-2013, 08:00	#118
The Lord Lucan Forum Member Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Scotland Posts: 4,966	By commentator you mean misinformed or biased tech journalists, like the one quoted by the OP? Oh like the ones I work with everyday, only mine are not misinformed..

29-10-2013, 08:36	#119
flagpole Inactive Member Join Date: Jan 2003 Posts: 43,524	Quote: Originally Posted by The Lord Lucan By commentator you mean misinformed or biased tech journalists, like the one quoted by the OP? Oh like the ones I work with everyday, only mine are not misinformed.. so that's your answer. you have secret sauces. you had best have them tell the EU then. they are wasting all this time focusing on micro-USB. they're clearly looking at the wrong end.

29-10-2013, 10:35	#120
kidspud Forum Member Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 11,501	Quote: Originally Posted by flagpole you had best have them tell the EU then. they are wasting all this time focusing on micro-USB. they're clearly looking at the wrong end. The current recommendation going very slowly through the EU makes no reference to micro-USB, only that chargers should be interchangeable.

29-10-2013, 11:02	#121
Mark in Essex Forum Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 3,644	Quote: Originally Posted by daclick People dissing micro USB, yes they break sometimes but ive seen more people moaning about they're broken lightning cable than I have micro usb plus micro USB is more readily available than a lightning charger Same here. My friend has broken 2 lighting cables already and he does not plug in and out that much where as I've got 2 Galaxy S3's and they are plugged in and out prob about 6 times a day each and have not had any problems over the last 18 months (also my HTC HD2 had no problems the 2 years I had that).

DS Forums

Mobile Chargers to be Standardised (Finger to Apple)

29-10-2013, 11:40	#122
The Lord Lucan Forum Member Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Scotland Posts: 4,966	I've never heard of or seen a broken iPhone or iPad with a faulty lightening port. My S2 had to go back to Samsung as the USB Port broke as did the LG whatever it was I had before that. The cable should always die before the device. Personally never heard of the lightening connector bit of an Apple cable breaking.. Fake ones the cables break and I've had after about a years hard use ie always plugged charging in to tether a cable has started to come away at one end but never the port and certianly not the 'spade' All ports can suffer dirt ingress.. With the lightening port this will manifest in a random charge secuence of loops.

29-10-2013, 14:03	#123
marknotgeorge Forum Member Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Back home... Posts: 2,085	Quote: Originally Posted by gomezz In the end I got one of these. But I don't trust it to hold a valuable mobile in place on its own and still want to rest the bottom of the phone on/in the cupholder with the squash ball taking the strain off the USB connector. If it didn't need to be portable, I'd suggest a solution like my Arkon mount bolted to a Brodit vehicle-specific bracket. The Arkon mount did also contain bits to mount it on the vent, though, which looked a little more secure than the single point of attachment that yours has. Cheaper, too.

29-10-2013, 14:08	#124
gomezz Forum Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Buckingham Posts: 28,590	Of course I could modify the cupholder on each van I use by punching a hole in the bottom. Wouldn't be the most drastic unofficial modification I have seen these vans undergo.

29-10-2013, 14:37	#125
Stiggles Forum Member Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: Dundee, Scotland Posts: 9,293	My dads port broke on his ipad mini last night. Is that a lightning port on the mini? Anyway, apparently he tripped over the charger and something has snapped inside the hole which he can't get out. He's taking it to the apple store in Aberdeen today to see if he can get it fixed.