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Sophie's swan song
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Spin turn
13-10-2013
The running promenades need quite a lot of energy just to keep timing and get into a reasonable position (although they're also complicated by confusing footwork, which I guess matters less on Strictly). So I think it is a bit unfair to say she was dragged around. No she didn't excel,but it's her first latin. Getting samba as a first latin is a pretty tough deal.

Actually I was more disappointed by her ballroom last week which was very soft and pretty, but which needed work on posture/hold, although to be fair, other aspects of the technique were quite good (hence its smoothness, which you don't get if the technique is poor).
Stuart25
13-10-2013
To be fair to her, she did have a dress malfunction and fell over in the dress rehearsal yesterday, so perhaps that knocked her confidence a bit.

But I really don't think the Charleston is the only dance she'll be good at. I can imagine some really great Ballroom and a nice Paso Doble and Jive. Let's just wait and see.
Caramel Crunch
13-10-2013
Originally Posted by tinselgirl:
“As a member of the GBP who knows nothing about the technical aspects of dancing - I am stunned by fabulist's comment ! I am not a particular Sophie supporter and appreciate that Sophie!s samba was not traditional, but IMO she did brilliantly for the 3rd week of an amateur dance competition. She took it seriously, tried to do what she was taught, put her own spin on it and added to the general overall entertainment of the programme. Maybe it wasn't as knockout as the Charleston, but that!s all to the good as far as I am concerned.

SCD is so much better when people evolve and grow with the odd set back on the way. Starting off as Natalie has done looking as though she could easily stand in for one of the pro dancers if one was suddenly taken ill makes for dull, dull, dull television.


I'm loving this series so far.”

Totally agree
duckylucky
13-10-2013
Originally Posted by isledance:
“Surely it is evident by now that Sophie's charleston is the only dance she will excel at.........
I do think it is time Brendon had another win,but his partner, could not execute ballroom and her samba was lacking depth and energy tonight. Freestyle (which is what Charleston really is) appears to be all that she excels in.......”

Surely nothing is yet evident when she has only danced three dances .? How on earth could you come to the conclusion that its evident ? For all we know she could do a stunning Rhumba or Jive yet .

Actually I was surprised she was good last night , not brilliant but very enjoyable to watch . My joy in Strictly is watching people get better, learn and move forward . .
Starpuss
13-10-2013
Sambas are hard to dance. Sophie did very well (especially as she was dressed like Emu) and brought her own, cool personality to the dance. I liked that too.

I've spent much time in Samba schools/events as my sister-in-law is a semi-professional samba dancer (I had the less glamourous role of resewing tears in costumes and carrying feathers ) and have seen samba danced in many styles. Sophie did well.
-Sid-
13-10-2013
Originally Posted by Spin turn:
“Tend to agree. Generally speaking her samba wasn't bad at all I thought. Lots of content and reasonably well executed. It would be easy to pick holes in the technique, but then it is early days. Maybe the mood wasn't exactly carnival/party dance. I.e. She could have let go more, but I think that's asking for quite a lot at this stage.

Cha cha is a sharper, flirty dance, but very slinky (sort of oily) hip, leg movements. The common issue with Strictly cha chas is the lack of floor contact, which for the basic movements and much of the more advanced should be contnuous and very "into the floor".”

Originally Posted by Spin turn:
“The running promenades need quite a lot of energy just to keep timing and get into a reasonable position (although they're also complicated by confusing footwork, which I guess matters less on Strictly). So I think it is a bit unfair to say she was dragged around. No she didn't excel,but it's her first latin. Getting samba as a first latin is a pretty tough deal.

Actually I was more disappointed by her ballroom last week which was very soft and pretty, but which needed work on posture/hold, although to be fair, other aspects of the technique were quite good (hence its smoothness, which you don't get if the technique is poor).”

Interesting, thanks Spin

Originally Posted by An Thropologist:
“Well I am no samba expert but do dance all the other Latin American styles in some shape or form and in my opinion cool and laid back is at odds with the style of the dance.

When the pros use a characterisation which is different to the one that belongs with the dance style it is usually to masque piss poor dancing. But Sophie isn't bad so there is no need to disguise her dancing with such distractions.

For me the mood/style are integral to the dance and if you mess with this element, the essence of the dance goes for a burton too. One could dance a waltz in the style of an excited terrier or a pantomime horse but that's not what a waltz is supposed to be like.”



Fair points Anth!
tortoiseperson
13-10-2013
Sophie is indeed a beautiful elegant swan and this dance was full of Samba content, as Len pointed out. Better authentic steps with a more restrained attitude, IMVHO, than "fun fun funnity fun" trying to mask lack of content.
cwickham
13-10-2013
The thread start keeps using the term "swan song". I do not think it means what he thinks it means.
nwbrfc
13-10-2013
Originally Posted by musicangel:
“That is the most un educated post about dance quality I have ever seen on this forum... Dragging her around?? Have you danced a samba a or learnt it in a week.. The opening post is appauling and nice to see Sophie got positive comments following it, it wasn't a ten but for week three was a good effort I really hope they get to finals

To then say I have nothing against her but... You obviously do, I remember Chris Charleston as overrated and full of silly moves, nickys I don't even remember, sophies was classic and in another week would have been all tens”

Actually I agree with fabulist and find your comment that his/her views are "uneducated" as unnecessarily insulting. You could simply say you disagree.

I was enthralled by her Charleston last week and will remember it for a long time, but found her Samba very disappointing.

As was stated by fabulist, our issue was that the judges chose to over inflate their comments and scores - it was never a 31. It was like they were too scared to bring someone down from such an amazing high the week before. IMH (but educated) O.
Becky245
13-10-2013
I am a dancer and Sophie is a lot like I was. The potential is there, she's got good hip rotations, natural rhythm and impeccable timing, but I think her problem is just letting ago. With a Samba, you really need to enjoy it, focus on having fun and not the steps. You could see how concentrated Sophie was last night and she was clearly nervous, but if Sophie just let go she would walk away with this (her being popular with the audience is a real plus for her). I used to be exactly like Sophie, stiff because I was afraid to let go and enjoy it... but it does go away and with time she'll loosen up.
evangeline007
13-10-2013
Originally Posted by earthling13:
“She danced well this week, just not quite the same standard as last week. I think she will be there for a while yet but there's something about her I just can't warm to. A touch of the Denise Van Outens maybe?”

I think it could be be because she is beautiful and clever at the same time. She does not rest on her looks and act sexy/flirty. I like Sophie.
bornfree
13-10-2013
I like Sophie. She looks like a swan, but is clumsy IMO. Can't understand how someone so delicate looking can be so clumsy.
tortoiseperson
13-10-2013
Like a swan walking around the edge of the pond ... sometimes she gets to look like a swan on water. I hope as the series progresses and she gains confidence, we'll see more of the water swan and less the land swan.
Demi_pointes
13-10-2013
I thought she coped really well with a difficult dance, especially as she is also tall and long-limbed. Her samba seemed to have a lot of content, with quite a few different steps, and Brendan wasn't trying to hide her or twirl her around for most of the dance. For somebody who has genuinely started from scratch at the beginning of the programme, I think that is promising, and she has room to improve. I am looking forward to seeing how far she can go.
Monaogg
13-10-2013
Once Sophie truly gets the SCD bug she will really shine. Suspect she hasn't quite been swept away by the experience just yet. A couple more weeks and she will be hooked.
Chelle21
13-10-2013
Originally Posted by nwbrfc:
“Actually I agree with fabulist and find your comment that his/her views are "uneducated" as unnecessarily insulting. You could simply say you disagree.

I was enthralled by her Charleston last week and will remember it for a long time, but found her Samba very disappointing.

As was stated by fabulist, our issue was that the judges chose to over inflate their comments and scores - it was never a 31. It was like they were too scared to bring someone down from such an amazing high the week before. IMH (but educated) O.”

I don't think last week's score came into it, almost all the scoring last night was off IMO.

It's a bit unfair to expect a sensational dance every week from someone with limited dance experience at the start, even after that charleston. Some dances will be easier to get into, others will be harder. The samba is a hard dance but I thought Sophie coped really well with it. I don't think it was as good as the charleston but that doesn't mean it was a bad samba!

It's only week 3 and I have every confidence that Sophie will have more stronger dances to come particularly in ballroom and the jive. It's far too early (and foolish) to write her off at this stage but if that's what some people want to do then suit themselves.
halfnelson2709
13-10-2013
Originally Posted by MrJames:
“Doesn't swansong mean the final thing that you do? The Charleston wasn't the final dance that she danced.

She said throughout the week that she was struggling with the Samba, which is notoriously the most difficult dance and a tall and lean body shape is known for not being the ideal shape for a latin dance. Despite this, she still got great scores and great comments, particularly for the content and especially for week three.

Ballroom is obviously going to be better suited to her and she could end up creating some particularly special moments. I think she is going to keep getting better and better in the latin and may even become a master of that too.

We shouldn't penalise her just because she had a fantastic dance one week, and a slightly less fantastic dance the next week. It is only week three after all.”

I agree!!
girlcrisis
13-10-2013
I don't think any realistic person could have expected her Samba to equal her Charleston. As others have already stated, it's a difficult dance (particularly for her first Latin) and not ideally suited to her body type and personality. I don't know enough to pick apart the finer points of technique but I thought she coped well and out of all the female celebrities (excluding Natalie for obvious reasons) I thought she looked the most confident and least awkward dancing a Latin dance.

All of the celebrities who are learning to dance from scratch are going to have up and down weeks and encounter dances that just don't suit them. I don't think we should write Sophie off just because she's faltered a little the week after a triumph. I think there are still loads of dances that she could do well at and I think her Latin will improve, as will her ability to perform.



Originally Posted by Pet Monkey:
“He did that side-steppy, fast, lean-against-the-bar thing. That's if it's not another dance entirely that I'm remembering. It was not a hot, party samba but a kind of cool almost menacing feel... I'm sure some of the people who supported him last year will be able to say. But maybe it is possible to go against the usual emotional tenor of a dance???”

You're right Pet, Louis did do a "cool" Samba too but I think it worked a little better in his case than in Sophie's. I thought it was a shame that Brendan decided to go for the "cool" and "sophisticated" vibe (assuming it was intentional and not just Sophie's natural demeanour) because on the rare moments that she did smile it was lovely and really lifted the performance.

I also think the whole performance was a bit too insular. I think Sophie only connects with Brendan when she's dancing and doesn't reach out to the audience enough so it felt a bit like they might as well have been dancing alone in an empty room.
Miriam_R
13-10-2013
She's still better than plenty of the others who, on even more lack of technique, even more lack of depth and even more lack of energy deserve the prediciton of having had their swansong dance already (on day one for some still).
Cadiva
13-10-2013
Originally Posted by Starpuss:
“Sambas are hard to dance. Sophie did very well (especially as she was dressed like Emu) and brought her own, cool personality to the dance. I liked that too.

I've spent much time in Samba schools/events as my sister-in-law is a semi-professional samba dancer (I had the less glamourous role of resewing tears in costumes and carrying feathers ) and have seen samba danced in many styles. Sophie did well.”

I agree, I thought she did well with the choreography she was given and is just lacking a bit in central core strength which will come with practise and time.
RichmondBlue
13-10-2013
Originally Posted by nwbrfc:
“Actually I agree with fabulist and find your comment that his/her views are "uneducated" as unnecessarily insulting. You could simply say you disagree.

I was enthralled by her Charleston last week and will remember it for a long time, but found her Samba very disappointing.

As was stated by fabulist, our issue was that the judges chose to over inflate their comments and scores - it was never a 31. It was like they were too scared to bring someone down from such an amazing high the week before. IMH (but educated) O.”

Yes, but fabulist didn't describe her performance in your perfectly reasonable fashion.

"Brendan dragged her limp, lifeless body around like a corpse, in between her clumsy flat footed and out of time steps. For me, you could even argue that Dave was better tonight. At least he entertained."

Of course, everyone's entitled to their opinion, but do you honestly think those comments were "reasonable" ?
If you're going to post blatant nonsense, you have to expect to receive some flack.
MrsGraham
13-10-2013
Originally Posted by MrJames:
“Doesn't swansong mean the final thing that you do?”

Yes it does - a final or farewell performance.

When I read the thread title, I thought it was going to be suggesting that for some reason Sophie deserved to be leaving this week.

I didn't think she was that bad!
goldberry1
13-10-2013
I thought her dance was cool and classy - she's always interesting to watch.
biscuitfactory
13-10-2013
Originally Posted by Miriam_R:
“She's still better than plenty of the others who, on even more lack of technique, even more lack of depth and even more lack of energy deserve the prediciton of having had their swansong dance already (on day one for some still).”

She wasn't better than Ben or Abby, yet she scored more, which baffles me.
Tangerine_82
13-10-2013
Watch it again. I think you'll be surprised how well she coped with the technique of the traditional samba steps. However, if you're just moaning because you don't like Sophie and don't really know much about dancing, then there's no point in watching it again because you won't know what to look for.
Originally Posted by biscuitfactory:
“She wasn't better than Ben or Abby, yet she scored more, which baffles me.”

Abby really disappointed me last night. I did not expect her to be bad, and I'm afraid that's what she was. I'm hoping it was nerves, I really am, because she was one of my picks in week one, and even last week where I could tell she'd just hit a wall and it wasn't that she couldn't actually do it. But last night, she was actually really quite bad
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