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Doc Martin (Part 17 — Spoilers)
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Lizzie_cUS
14-04-2014
Originally Posted by NewPark:
“Does anyone know how to contact a help desk or tech support for DS? I'm having a really strange issue with respect to replying, whether quoting or not, and I've tried all I know to do (logging out and logging back in) without results.”

Does your browser need to be updated? Or have you updated your browser lately? Or are you using a different browser than you had before?
SusieSagitarius
14-04-2014
NewPark, scroll all the way down to the bottom of this page, and see the "Contact Us".
NewPark
14-04-2014
Originally Posted by Mofromco:
“I'm repetitive, I know, but I want a blockbusting therapist....a character of enormous power and charisma. I bet that is one secret that they will try to keep, because I bet they want your jaw to drop the first time Martin, or Martin and Louisa open that office door. So exciting.”

.Sorry -- testing to see whether my problem has disappeared -- it hasn't -- yet.
NewPark
14-04-2014
Thanks, Lizzie and Susie. I've logged in and out, cleared my caches, and now am about to contact DS. I did scroll down the page but gave up before I got to the contact item. We'll see if that works. I'm pretty confident it's not Google Chrome, tho. But could still turn out that way.
dcdmfan
14-04-2014
Originally Posted by Zarwen:
“In situations like this (of which it seemed there were many in S6), LE comes across to me as though she is trying to compete with DM rather than relate to him. Is this about still trying to prove how independent she is? Is being independent more important to her than being with DM? A question that might bear exploring with a counselor, surely. Anyone else out there have any thoughts on this?”

The whole drinking thing at the dinner party was so old fashioned. The guy doesn't drink, so what? She knows he doesn't drink. I guess she was embarrassed that he was taking the other couples' inventory about their drinking habits. He got defensive when the other guy questioned his choice not to drink. As a non-drinker, I never really blamed him for doing that, he doesn't have to justify himself. Also, if my spouse tried to shame me about not drinking - like Louisa did - that would be a total deal breaker. We would never have had a second date. Anyway, the plot point about their drinking could have been made without Louisa having a snit about Martin's drinking. If I were Martin I would have been really pissed off at her (I rarely use that phrase except in certain circumstances.) Also, it is very 20th century to question why someone doesn't drink. Nobody really does it in this part of the country anymore. It's one thing for the guests to rudely question his not drinking, but another for her to sort of shame him. It just wasn't necessary. He doesn't really question her drinking all that much. It's bad writing, not the character in my opinion. That's all I got on that.
NewPark
14-04-2014
(I would quote you if I could, dcdmfan)

Not only inferior writing, but the jump from honeymoon to this kind of quarrelsome behavior was just too abrupt. Pacing, even assuming they wanted to get to the end point they did, was off, imo.

Charitably, I would say that Louisa is super-sensitive to what others are thinking -- over sensitive in fact, and she is annoyed with DM b/c she feels like he is alienating someone she already dislikes but needs.

Their behavior at the table, though, resembles a couple who have just been having a big fight before guests arrive and are continuing the fight in a more passive-aggressive way after they arrive. But again, way too fast for this to happen, I think.
marchrand
14-04-2014
Originally Posted by NewPark:
“(I would quote you if I could, dcdmfan)

Not only inferior writing, but the jump from honeymoon to this kind of quarrelsome behavior was just too abrupt. Pacing, even assuming they wanted to get to the end point they did, was off, imo.

Charitably, I would say that Louisa is super-sensitive to what others are thinking -- over sensitive in fact, and she is annoyed with DM b/c she feels like he is alienating someone she already dislikes but needs.

Their behavior at the table, though, resembles a couple who have just been having a big fight before guests arrive and are continuing the fight in a more passive-aggressive way after they arrive. But again, way too fast for this to happen, I think.”

Louisa was totally wrong in this episode. DM's sense of smell is as sharp as his hearing, and he was annoyed that Dennis & Karen showed up for dinner with a head start on drinking. Louisa sensed this and feared what remark DM would come out with and ruin her chances on building the playground. Dennis commented to Louisa as they were leaving that they have never seen eye to eye and now it's out in the open. I think DM sized him up as soon as they sat down with "Have you seen any major sporting events recently?" He realized Dennis was not capable of carrying on a conversation about current events so he kept it as light as possible. Louisa was stumbling all over herself in trying to please (and butter up) Dennis and making excuses for her non-drinking husband.
Mofromco
14-04-2014
Originally Posted by marchrand:
“Louisa was totally wrong in this episode. DM's sense of smell is as sharp as his hearing, and he was annoyed that Dennis & Karen showed up for dinner with a head start on drinking. Louisa sensed this and feared what remark DM would come out with and ruin her chances on building the playground. Dennis commented to Louisa as they were leaving that they have never seen eye to eye and now it's out in the open. I think DM sized him up as soon as they sat down with "Have you seen any major sporting events recently?" He realized Dennis was not capable of carrying on a conversation about current events so he kept it as light as possible. Louisa was stumbling all over herself in trying to please (and butter up) Dennis and making excuses for her non-drinking husband.”

Martin wasn't such an angel either....given the circumstances, he could have been more subtle about attempting to cut off Dennis' and Karen's drinking. Giving her the tiny glass and all was not subtle and invited repercussions, but on the other hand, Martin doesn't have repertoire of appropriate or clever behavior...the whole scenario was a disaster.
Lizzie_cUS
14-04-2014
Originally Posted by NewPark:
“(I would quote you if I could, dcdmfan)

Not only inferior writing, but the jump from honeymoon to this kind of quarrelsome behavior was just too abrupt. Pacing, even assuming they wanted to get to the end point they did, was off, imo.”

I would agree with you there. Total disconnect between the end of E1 to all the goings on in E2. Left the viewer thinking why they even got married. We were left at the end of E1 with Martin just about ready to apologize for the disaster of a honeymoon, to a house full of annoyances and no real resolution to the horrid honeymoon because all of a sudden you had a terse good-bye between L and M when she left to go back to work at the school. It was like the love was suddenly gone.
saxon57
14-04-2014
Sorry to bump my way into the conversation but you have posted the exact word that I have been searching for in describing what was "off" with series 6 for me : "pacing". While the overall mood of the series seemed so uncharacteristically gloomy; it was more than that. As you said it was the total disconnect from E1 to E2 and exponentially continued through the rest of the episodes that made the series a downer. Having so much enjoyed previous series I'm not ready to jump ship. As well the supporting cast remains such a pleasure to watch. Lets hope series 7 returns with the same magic of the past.
Zarwen
15-04-2014
Originally Posted by saxon57:
“Sorry to bump my way into the conversation but you have posted the exact word that I have been searching for in describing what was "off" with series 6 for me : "pacing". While the overall mood of the series seemed so uncharacteristically gloomy; it was more than that. As you said it was the total disconnect from E1 to E2 and exponentially continued through the rest of the episodes that made the series a downer. Having so much enjoyed previous series I'm not ready to jump ship. As well the supporting cast remains such a pleasure to watch. Lets hope series 7 returns with the same magic of the past.”

Welcome to the discussion, no apology necessary! Agree with all of your comments, although I fear I am not very optimistic about the last part, as I have been waiting for the magic to return since S4, to no avail.
NewPark
15-04-2014
Originally Posted by Lizzie_cUS:
“Does your browser need to be updated? Or have you updated your browser lately? Or are you using a different browser than you had before?”

you were right, Lizzie. The first clue was that the help desk said they had never heard of this problem before. Then I logged in with Firefox and the problem went away. I've been using Chrome for months, and I do have the latest version, so I don't know what in the world happened. I really don't like FF, though. What to do, what to do....
Mofromco
15-04-2014
Originally Posted by Zarwen:
“Welcome to the discussion, no apology necessary! Agree with all of your comments, although I fear I am not very optimistic about the last part, as I have been waiting for the magic to return since S4, to no avail. ”

Don't you think that they can replace the old magic with new magic? After seeing the end of S6 and being shown the depth of their love...particularly Martin's but less obviously Louisa's. Can anybody tell me that she was not just waiting for a word...a hint...anything that meant, "Louisa, please don't go."...during the departure sequence. I have my hopes up for a bit of romance in S7. A new "magic". Not to mention Bert and Jennifer and Al and Morwenna......lots of fun.
marchrand
15-04-2014
The biggest story gap for me came from the end of S5 and the beginning of S6. I am assuming 3 or 4 months elapsed between the series by the looks of JH. In S5 marriage was never mentioned, only preparations for the christening. Towards the end of S5 I am assuming LG moved out of the surgery and back to her home. At the beginning of S6 they are still living apart as DM arrived at the church-- he wondered if Louisa arrived. They managed to arrange a lovely wedding in a different church, no bridesmaids or best man. I assume they arranged a very small service with few invitees. In that space of time LG selected a lovely dress, rings were purchased by the doc, flowers were in the church and the same vicar who fell in S3 and fractured his hip agreed to officiate once again for this wedding, no mention of any music selected by Louisa. A lovely reception was also arranged, but the plan was no honeymoon as they wanted to get back home to JH (I assume). Of course, Bert managed to muck up as he drove off from the honeymoon lodge with their clothes. Questions for me now is how did they agree to the wedding and reception with such smoothness? does Louisa still own that home in town (or is it rented by someone)? Will she go back to the surgery or will she move back to her home if vacant? With her arm in a sling, recovering from the surgical procedure, a little baby and no nanny, she can't do it on her own.
Lizzie_cUS
15-04-2014
Originally Posted by Mofromco:
“Don't you think that they can replace the old magic with new magic? After seeing the end of S6 and being shown the depth of their love...particularly Martin's but less obviously Louisa's. Can anybody tell me that she was not just waiting for a word...a hint...anything that meant, "Louisa, please don't go."...during the departure sequence. I have my hopes up for a bit of romance in S7. A new "magic". Not to mention Bert and Jennifer and Al and Morwenna......lots of fun.”

I think that's what we'll get in S7. At least I'm hopeful of that. Maybe it won't be blatantly obvious, but they'll find a way to show us that there is something much deeper than what we're given to think. It's that cerebral thing that BP has said about how American audiences interpret and read into what they're trying to do. I think they might be conscious of us in their writing, directing and acting. IMHO.
Mofromco
15-04-2014
Originally Posted by marchrand:
“The biggest story gap for me came from the end of S5 and the beginning of S6. I am assuming 3 or 4 months elapsed between the series by the looks of JH. In S5 marriage was never mentioned, only preparations for the christening. Towards the end of S5 I am assuming LG moved out of the surgery and back to her home. At the beginning of S6 they are still living apart as DM arrived at the church-- he wondered if Louisa arrived. They managed to arrange a lovely wedding in a different church, no bridesmaids or best man. I assume they arranged a very small service with few invitees. In that space of time LG selected a lovely dress, rings were purchased by the doc, flowers were in the church and the same vicar who fell in S3 and fractured his hip agreed to officiate once again for this wedding, no mention of any music selected by Louisa. A lovely reception was also arranged, but the plan was no honeymoon as they wanted to get back home to JH (I assume). Of course, Bert managed to muck up as he drove off from the honeymoon lodge with their clothes. Questions for me now is how did they agree to the wedding and reception with such smoothness? does Louisa still own that home in town (or is it rented by someone)? Will she go back to the surgery or will she move back to her home if vacant? With her arm in a sling, recovering from the surgical procedure, a little baby and no nanny, she can't do it on her own.”


I have do disagree. I believe that Louisa had most certainly moved back in after the Castle in Series 5 and they spent that number of months cohabitating and enjoying each other in the way couples should. When Morwenna had said she had packed their bags Martin had said, "What? You mean you've been in OUR bedroom?" They had made their wedding plans and fallen into a comfortable sexual relationship as demonstrated with their behavior at the honeymoon lodge. It seemed like Louisa was not with him going to the church because it's traditional that the couple separate the night before their wedding....or at least arrive separately, the OUR bedroom tells the story.
marchrand
15-04-2014
Originally Posted by Mofromco:
“I have do disagree. I believe that Louisa had most certainly moved back in after the Castle in Series 5 and they spent that number of months cohabitating and enjoying each other in the way couples should. When Morwenna had said she had packed their bags Martin had said, "What? You mean you've been in OUR bedroom?" They had made their wedding plans and fallen into a comfortable sexual relationship as demonstrated with their behavior at the honeymoon lodge. It seemed like Louisa was not with him going to the church because it's traditional that the couple separate the night before their wedding....or at least arrive separately, the OUR bedroom tells the story.”

I completely forgot that line! Thanks for clarifying.
NewPark
15-04-2014
Marchrand: The question about where she'll be living at the start of S6 is one I've puzzled over, too. Surely she can't manage on her own, but Eleanor could come flying in from Portugal, to the rescue. But that also depends on whether she actually still does have a place to live, or whether she's sublet her lease from Mr. Routledge. One thing seems clear -- however they decide to open, with them living apart, and DM trying to woo her back to the surgery, or living together, conditional on couples therapy working out -- we won't hear anything about how they got to that point, between the end of S6 and S7.

Mofromco: The trouble with keeping exposition via words to a minimum, as this series does, and depending on characters' actions and choices to tell the story (as Nigel Cole said in a recent interview) is that often there is more than one plausible story to be told about any particular incident. I think the pre-departure scenes are a good example. It's very plausible that she would have wavered if he had plucked up the courage to ask her to stay, say he was sorry, and so on. It's also plausible that she stayed behind that bathroom door b/c she DIDN'T want to be talked out of going -- she felt she needed to think things through and although she knew he was in pain, she had come to doubt that he was really capable of being the husband she wanted/needed, and she didn't want to turn him down if he got desperate enough to plead with her. She did say in the cab, "we've gone over all this." But then, some think she looked hopeful that he was "coming after her" when he barged onto the plane. We'll never know!
Lizzie_cUS
15-04-2014
Originally Posted by Mofromco:
“I have do disagree. I believe that Louisa had most certainly moved back in after the Castle in Series 5 and they spent that number of months cohabitating and enjoying each other in the way couples should. When Morwenna had said she had packed their bags Martin had said, "What? You mean you've been in OUR bedroom?" They had made their wedding plans and fallen into a comfortable sexual relationship as demonstrated with their behavior at the honeymoon lodge. It seemed like Louisa was not with him going to the church because it's traditional that the couple separate the night before their wedding....or at least arrive separately, the OUR bedroom tells the story.”

On screen we're never given the whole story, only enough to imagine what else is going on. I think they were "together" S5. Though they didn't show us anything, they did show them in the bedroom together, sharing the same bed, in bits and pieces, throughout the series. We can only assume they got closer (maybe not sexually intimate, but intimate nonetheless). Obviously the scenes at the lodge showed that they had become "comfortable" with each other. The fireplace kiss seemed the most comfortable than some of those we had seen before.
Lizzie_cUS
15-04-2014
Originally Posted by NewPark:
“ Mofromco: The trouble with keeping exposition via words to a minimum, as this series does, and depending on characters' actions and choices to tell the story (as Nigel Cole said in a recent interview) is that often there is more than one plausible story to be told about any particular incident. I think the pre-departure scenes are a good example. It's very plausible that she would have wavered if he had plucked up the courage to ask her to stay, say he was sorry, and so on. It's also plausible that she stayed behind that bathroom door b/c she DIDN'T want to be talked out of going -- she felt she needed to think things through and although she knew he was in pain, she had come to doubt that he was really capable of being the husband she wanted/needed, and she didn't want to turn him down if he got desperate enough to plead with her. She did say in the cab, "we've gone over all this." But then, some think she looked hopeful that he was "coming after her" when he barged onto the plane. We'll never know! ”

The program wouldn't be as rich as it is if it wasn't for the minimalism of the script. The actors tell the story via their actions. It would be boring if what we expected or wanted to happen actually happened on screen. Not only would it be predictable, but it would be like spoon-feeding the audience every little detail. Does that make sense? It all goes along with the cerebral-ness of the show.
SusieSagitarius
15-04-2014
Originally Posted by Lizzie_cUS:
“The program wouldn't be as rich as it is if it wasn't for the minimalism of the script. The actors tell the story via their actions. It would be boring if what we expected or wanted to happen actually happened on screen. Not only would it be predictable, but it would be like spoon-feeding the audience every little detail. Does that make sense? It all goes along with the cerebral-ness of the show.”

Amen! Lizzie!! I so agree. I get very bored with a show that does what I'd expect it to do. I want to be surprised. Many years ago, I tried reading a romance novel. Then I did a second and third one, and I was done. There were no surprises, they were so dead predictable. There is so much good literature out there that contains a romance story but has much more story to it as well, that I just can't bother with the Harlequin version. (BTW, I don't mean to offend anyone who takes pleasure in reading the bodice rippers; just not my taste.)
Mofromco
16-04-2014
Originally Posted by Lizzie_cUS:
“On screen we're never given the whole story, only enough to imagine what else is going on. I think they were "together" S5. Though they didn't show us anything, they did show them in the bedroom together, sharing the same bed, in bits and pieces, throughout the series. We can only assume they got closer (maybe not sexually intimate, but intimate nonetheless). Obviously the scenes at the lodge showed that they had become "comfortable" with each other. The fireplace kiss seemed the most comfortable than some of those we had seen before.”

There were some months between the end of S5 and the beginning of S6. James was possibly 4 months old at the castle and around 8 months at the time of the wedding. The "pajamas of steel" were symbolic of the chastity between them in S5. Those few months between the series was profound.....and it was during that time that Martin and Louisa truly fell in love and when something happened to Martin to lead into his decline. Just the way their interaction changed showed a lot. S5 was a conundrum..that's for sure. But the months in between were key.
saxon57
16-04-2014
I think that I am going to have to rewatch series 6. I can understand the frustration with the enormous leap from S5 to S6 with little explanation but somehow that seemed forgivable to me in comparison with the sudden cheerless mood that seemed to engulf the episodes past E1 of S6. I felt as if DM went from being brazen and snippy to on the verge of a breakdown. But maybe that was the intent of the writers? Taking him to the darkest point before he realizes that some change must come. I still wish that they had been able to accomplish this with a sort of "secret" slightly softer Doc seen only by his family. Instead I find myself blaming Louisa for being so critical of behaviour she certainly shouldn't have been surprised by.
But as I said, I remain hopeful and it is made somewhat easier by the fact that I enjoy the supporting cast so much as well.
Just wondering...does anyone know if the intention was to have the entire series end this way? I kept reading in advance of its' airing that S6 might be the last.
Mofromco
16-04-2014
Originally Posted by saxon57:
“I think that I am going to have to rewatch series 6. I can understand the frustration with the enormous leap from S5 to S6 with little explanation but somehow that seemed forgivable to me in comparison with the sudden cheerless mood that seemed to engulf the episodes past E1 of S6. I felt as if DM went from being brazen and snippy to on the verge of a breakdown. But maybe that was the intent of the writers? Taking him to the darkest point before he realizes that some change must come. I still wish that they had been able to accomplish this with a sort of "secret" slightly softer Doc seen only by his family. Instead I find myself blaming Louisa for being so critical of behaviour she certainly shouldn't have been surprised by.
But as I said, I remain hopeful and it is made somewhat easier by the fact that I enjoy the supporting cast so much as well.
Just wondering...does anyone know if the intention was to have the entire series end this way? I kept reading in advance of its' airing that S6 might be the last.”

S7 is being written and planned as we speak...right from the MC's lovely mouth...it's a definite.
NewPark
16-04-2014
Said Lizzie: .The program wouldn't be as rich as it is if it wasn't for the minimalism of the script. The actors tell the story via their actions. It would be boring if what we expected or wanted to happen actually happened on screen. Not only would it be predictable, but it would be like spoon-feeding the audience every little detail. Does that make sense? It all goes along with the cerebral-ness of the show.

Yes, I agree. I had a poor choice of words. Instead of saying "the trouble is" I should have said something like, "the challenge is..." because in fact, like you, that's what I really like about it -- that you have to pay attention and think about it to figure out what's going on. I think that's part of what gets people so hooked.
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