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Doc Martin (Part 17 — Spoilers)
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Mofromco
09-05-2014
Originally Posted by Shop Girl:
“I wonder if he was able to talk them into pushing it back a year or two. By then Emily might be in school more and he and Philippa could spend a few months in London?”

I would wager that he could say "I might be available to do a play.." And the powers would say..."Which, what, when, where and whom..." Anything to be done in theater is MCs whim, not necessity....a lovely position to be in for our guy.
Shop Girl
10-05-2014
This week's episode thrown out of the surgery:

S5E5 Remember Me


Complete survey results: http://portwennonline.com/SurveyResults.html

New survey: http://portwennonline.com/SurveyCurrent.html

Episode title survey: http://portwennonline.com/SurveyEpisodeTitles.html

Latest available trivia page: http://portwennonline.com/TriviaS6E3.html
(I'll get them caught up soon!)
Zarwen
12-05-2014
Originally Posted by SusieSagitarius:
“Point of information: Anthony Minghella, Dominic's brother, died in 2008.”

Which means he was still living when DM S1 was filmed. Thanks for researching this, Susie.
NewPark
12-05-2014
Originally Posted by Zarwen:
“Which means he was still living when DM S1 was filmed. Thanks for researching this, Susie.”

Yes, I did know that, though I should have made it clear that it probably was a nod to a living brother instead of a tribute to a deceased one.

Here's a link to Dominic Minghella's blog -- it's a very interesting one. There's a part of it on Anthony.

http://www.minghella.com/tag/anthony-minghella/
Mofromco
14-05-2014
Action has really dropped off here lately.....it's sort of like the desert forum.
Lizzie_cUS
14-05-2014
Originally Posted by Mofromco:
“Action has really dropped off here lately.....it's sort of like the desert forum.”

My excuse is that winter has ended, rendering me free of being cooped up in the house! Even the fanfics are slowing down a bit and new posts aren't coming but every few days. That's okay because it's still a long way until next fall when S7 comes out and we need our fix of M&L until then! Hopefully we get some new US writers/stories now that S6 has finally hit the airwaves here (for those who haven't had the luxury of a DVD or other means of seeing the series before now).
marchrand
14-05-2014
I have been bursting to tell you that my son and daughter took me (and my daughter-in-law) on a trip to England which included Port Isaac! We picked up a rental car at Heathrow which had a GPS on board (thank goodness!) For the purposes of this forum I am only going to tell you about the Port Isaac part of the trip. My son and daughter had been planning this trip for almost a year. As we drove into Port Isaac from the top of a hill we came upon a parking area and stopped for awhile. I am assuming this is the Clunes parking area as it looked very new. From the parking area we could see part of the village and the other part is obstructed by a hill. Then drove down a steep hill, through some narrow streets, to the Old Schoolhouse Hotel. When you actually first see the village from the vantage point of the Old Schoolhouse Hotel parking area (where we stayed two nights) you are struck by the beauty of the harbor, the small and large old homes several hundred years old; the shear height of the green hills behind the homes and the height of the cliffs at the entrance of the harbor---nothing prepares you for what lays in front of you. It is a feast for your eyes. What I noticed is how small the Surgery is, about one-third the width of the Large Restaurant just a few steps downhill. There was a blue car parked in the doc's spot. It was a cold & windy late day & night on Thursday, May 8th when we arrived so we ate in the restaurant in the hotel. Good food, two wonderful waitresses. Interesting about the hotel: there are 12 rooms, each w/ a name: English, Latin, Religious Studies, Physics, Geography, French, Mathematics, Biology, History, Chemistry, Music & Art. My daughter & I stayed in the English room, second floor the top half of the cathedral style windows overlooking the parking area (school playground) and my son & daughter-in-law stayed in the Latin room, second floor the top half of the cathedral style windows overlooking the harbor, and from their king-sized bed can see the doc's surgery. The hotel (circa 1854) had two entrances from the parking area, my son thinking it was built in stages. About 10 steps up to the second floor, the doors have very old-fashioned door handles, latches, (probably late 1800's) but was told not original to the building. The next day it was sunny-- somehow Port Isaac turned into Portwenn! We had lunch at the Krab Pot--apparently they allow dogs to come in w/ their owners. We ate on the second floor and a couple came upstairs w/ their dog which sat on the floor perfectly behaved. We walked from the Hotel down to the harbor and up to the Surgery. Not a bad walk (I am admitting to being Eileen Atkins' age). The only thing I was hesitant about was the walk downhill, steep around the doc's surgery and to the Large Restaurant. Uphill, beyond that white house, Roscarrock Hill road ends and there are two very large buildings (probably for guest lodgings, not sure) spaced apart, but there are also steps in the hill (no railing) you can go up to the very top of the hill, which my son & daughter-in-law did. My daughter & I did not go. They said the view was breathtaking from the top of the hill. We ate dinner at the Golden Lion which my children especially enjoyed, pub-like atmosphere, with locals and tourists having drinks and laughter. The dogs and their owners were out on the terrace. We bought some souvenirs at the Stowaway Gift Shop located behind the Schoolhouse Hotel and some at the gift shop which serves as Mrs. Tishell's Pharmacy during filming. I did not see Louisa's cottage but did see Aunt Ruth's and Robert Campbell's next door. We never closed the drapes at night (two nights) just wanted to enjoy the fairy-tale like views, beautiful at night with white lights on here and there. We drove to St. Nonna's Church in Altarnon built in the early 15th century. According to a booklet we have it was partly constructed of moorstone, that is not quarried stone, but granite lying on the moors. Inside the church there are 9 rows of pews w/ 4 sections separated by aisles. Behind the side entrance (where Louisa came in) there are a few additional pews; on a wall behind the church is a large glass picture frame with of pictures of the wedding of M & L taken, all of which I have seen posted here and elsewhere. That is the only indication I see of this event taken place at the church. Outside the path to the church is a stone footpath arching over a babbling brook and a few feet away is another stone footpath. My disappointment is that the graveyard connected is overgrown with weeds almost 2 feet high, but am hoping with the warmer weather arriving that a manicure will take place. I did not want to visit the village during filming because I think there would be too many crowds trying to get into the eating places, booking a room at the Schoolhouse Hotel and competing for the views. You guessed it, when I arrived I cried at the beauty and being given the fortunate opportunity to see this village and cried when I left. Hope this post prompts some of you to visit Port Isaac.
NewPark
14-05-2014
Originally Posted by marchrand:
“I have been bursting to tell you that my son and daughter took me (and my daughter-in-law) on a trip to England which included Port Isaac! We picked up a rental car at Heathrow which had a GPS on board (thank goodness!) For the purposes of this forum I am only going to tell you about the Port Isaac part of the trip. My son and daughter had been planning this trip for almost a year. As we drove into Port Isaac from the top of a hill we came upon a parking area and stopped for awhile. I am assuming this is the Clunes parking area as it looked very new. From the parking area we could see part of the village and the other part is obstructed by a hill. Then drove down a steep hill, through some narrow streets, to the Old Schoolhouse Hotel. When you actually first see the village from the vantage point of the Old Schoolhouse Hotel parking area (where we stayed two nights) you are struck by the beauty of the harbor, the small and large old homes several hundred years old; the shear height of the green hills behind the homes and the height of the cliffs at the entrance of the harbor---nothing prepares you for what lays in front of you. It is a feast for your eyes. What I noticed is how small the Surgery is, about one-third the width of the Large Restaurant just a few steps downhill. There was a blue car parked in the doc's spot. It was a cold & windy late day & night on Thursday, May 8th when we arrived so we ate in the restaurant in the hotel. Good food, two wonderful waitresses. Interesting about the hotel: there are 12 rooms, each w/ a name: English, Latin, Religious Studies, Physics, Geography, French, Mathematics, Biology, History, Chemistry, Music & Art. My daughter & I stayed in the English room, second floor the top half of the cathedral style windows overlooking the parking area (school playground) and my son & daughter-in-law stayed in the Latin room, second floor the top half of the cathedral style windows overlooking the harbor, and from their king-sized bed can see the doc's surgery. The hotel (circa 1854) had two entrances from the parking area, my son thinking it was built in stages. About 10 steps up to the second floor, the doors have very old-fashioned door handles, latches, (probably late 1800's) but was told not original to the building. The next day it was sunny-- somehow Port Isaac turned into Portwenn! We had lunch at the Krab Pot--apparently they allow dogs to come in w/ their owners. We ate on the second floor and a couple came upstairs w/ their dog which sat on the floor perfectly behaved. We walked from the Hotel down to the harbor and up to the Surgery. Not a bad walk (I am admitting to being Eileen Atkins' age). The only thing I was hesitant about was the walk downhill, steep around the doc's surgery and to the Large Restaurant. Uphill, beyond that white house, Roscarrock Hill road ends and there are two very large buildings (probably for guest lodgings, not sure) spaced apart, but there are also steps in the hill (no railing) you can go up to the very top of the hill, which my son & daughter-in-law did. My daughter & I did not go. They said the view was breathtaking from the top of the hill. We ate dinner at the Golden Lion which my children especially enjoyed, pub-like atmosphere, with locals and tourists having drinks and laughter. The dogs and their owners were out on the terrace. We bought some souvenirs at the Stowaway Gift Shop located behind the Schoolhouse Hotel and some at the gift shop which serves as Mrs. Tishell's Pharmacy during filming. I did not see Louisa's cottage but did see Aunt Ruth's and Robert Campbell's next door. We never closed the drapes at night (two nights) just wanted to enjoy the fairy-tale like views, beautiful at night with white lights on here and there. We drove to St. Nonna's Church in Altarnon built in the early 15th century. According to a booklet we have it was partly constructed of moorstone, that is not quarried stone, but granite lying on the moors. Inside the church there are 9 rows of pews w/ 4 sections separated by aisles. Behind the side entrance (where Louisa came in) there are a few additional pews; on a wall behind the church is a large glass picture frame with of pictures of the wedding of M & L taken, all of which I have seen posted here and elsewhere. That is the only indication I see of this event taken place at the church. Outside the path to the church is a stone footpath arching over a babbling brook and a few feet away is another stone footpath. My disappointment is that the graveyard connected is overgrown with weeds almost 2 feet high, but am hoping with the warmer weather arriving that a manicure will take place. I did not want to visit the village during filming because I think there would be too many crowds trying to get into the eating places, booking a room at the Schoolhouse Hotel and competing for the views. You guessed it, when I arrived I cried at the beauty and being given the fortunate opportunity to see this village and cried when I left. Hope this post prompts some of you to visit Port Isaac.”

Oh Marchrand, I am so happy that you got to do this trip! My husband took me last summer during filming (which we did not really see any of) and we also stayed at the Old Schoolhouse Hotel which is a great place to stay I think. It was funny, wasn't it, how much smaller the "schoolyard" looks "in person." A beautiful, beautiful area.
Mofromco
14-05-2014
Great story marchrand, I'm envious. I plan on going to Buckham Fair next year.
Lizzie_cUS
15-05-2014
You two lucky ones Marchrand and Mofromco! I hope someday to get over there. It's on my bucket list!
SusieSagitarius
15-05-2014
I'm so happy for you, marchrand. Your recounting took me back to my visit there in April, 2012. It is the loveliest of places.

I'm sorry you didn't see Louisa's White Rose cottage. You would have driven right past it when you approached the school. See the picture here of it, with the school behind the 3 girls, with Doc at the door: http://portwennonline.com/LocationsS3.html .

Looking at Shop Girl's site will take on a whole new meaning for you now, I bet.
Bloodphobia
15-05-2014
Marchand. Thank you for the lovely description
marchrand
15-05-2014
Thank you all for your lovely comments.
NewPark - yes, the parking area is very small. I counted 14 spots against the wall and about 4 against the hotel, only a car length's width between for pulling out. Also, there is no blue gate at the entrance either--that, I am guessing is just for filming. The filming angles of the parking area make it look twice as large as it really is--kudos to those responsible for that.
ShopGirl - I failed to mention that my son printed out the maps you prepared w/ the sites indicated. They were such a great help.
whale
15-05-2014
This confirms his latest venture, no mention of Caroline Catz in the article.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/t...nan-Doyle.html
Lizzie_cUS
15-05-2014
Originally Posted by whale:
“This confirms his latest venture, no mention of Caroline Catz in the article.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/t...nan-Doyle.html”

I will NOT be a happy camper if they don't cast Caroline as Jean. There's way too much chemistry between the two and after reading the Barnes' book and the screenplay she's a good fit for the part. Plus it would be neat to see them do something other than DM.
Shop Girl
15-05-2014
Originally Posted by marchrand:
“I have been bursting to tell you that my son and daughter took me (and my daughter-in-law) on a trip to England which included Port Isaac!”

How wonderful marchrand! Sounds like a dream come true. I hope to get there in the next year or two myself. I loved hearing your experiences wandering around the village because I am a bit physically challenged and that is my biggest concern.

Please, tell us more!
NewPark
16-05-2014
Thinking again about that painful last scene of S6:

Watching it for the first few times, I put the most dismal interpretation possible on it. I thought that when Louisa said "This doesn't change anything...." what she meant was, "I'm still leaving you, even if it's just back to my own cottage, and I don't know when or if I'll be back", (because of course, that's how you deal with serious problems in a marriage -- run first and ask questions later..) And it really bothered me, b/c he had just heroically saved her life, and in the pre-op scene had promised to try to change so he could be a better husband. So for nothing to have changed, either she didn't hear or remember the speech at all (but then why does he make it?) or heard it but it didn't matter to her or she didn't believe him (why?) So my conclusion was that S7 was going to be a long and frustrating exercise in him trying to get her back, probably ending at the last remotely plausible moment with the big reconciliation.

But here's my new thinking: What Louisa is saying (or thinking) might really be that "this" - 1)- his heroism, for which she is grateful and which also reminds her of what really draws her to him, and 2) his recognition that he needs to change, which she heard and remembers -- are important to her, but they both have to face the fact that there are serious problems in their marriage, and he needs to understand that she is unwilling to continue as they were before. Things have to change. But now she is not saying, I'm out of here. I think she is ready to give him a chance to show her that he is prepared to try to change. so, in my new, optimistic thinking, I believe they will start S7 living together, but in the couples counseling that Martin Clunes has talked about. In fact, a good possibility for the first scene of S7 is them in a counselor's office!

Thoughts? (other than that I must have changed my meds... )

P.S. Of course, too awful to contemplate, but she could also have been saying: thank you very much for coming after me .....but I'm still leaving you, because we can't go on as we were.
mmDerdekea
16-05-2014
Originally Posted by marchrand:
“I have been bursting to tell you that my son and daughter took me (and my daughter-in-law) on a trip to England which included Port Isaac! We picked up a rental car at Heathrow which had a GPS on board (thank goodness!) For the purposes of this forum I am only going to tell you about the Port Isaac part of the trip. My son and daughter had been planning this trip for almost a year. As we drove into Port Isaac from the top of a hill we came upon a parking area and stopped for awhile. I am assuming this is the Clunes parking area as it looked very new. From the parking area we could see part of the village and the other part is obstructed by a hill. Then drove down a steep hill, through some narrow streets, to the Old Schoolhouse Hotel. When you actually first see the village from the vantage point of the Old Schoolhouse Hotel parking area (where we stayed two nights) you are struck by the beauty of the harbor, the small and large old homes several hundred years old; the shear height of the green hills behind the homes and the height of the cliffs at the entrance of the harbor---nothing prepares you for what lays in front of you. It is a feast for your eyes. What I noticed is how small the Surgery is, about one-third the width of the Large Restaurant just a few steps downhill. There was a blue car parked in the doc's spot. It was a cold & windy late day & night on Thursday, May 8th when we arrived so we ate in the restaurant in the hotel. Good food, two wonderful waitresses. Interesting about the hotel: there are 12 rooms, each w/ a name: English, Latin, Religious Studies, Physics, Geography, French, Mathematics, Biology, History, Chemistry, Music & Art. My daughter & I stayed in the English room, second floor the top half of the cathedral style windows overlooking the parking area (school playground) and my son & daughter-in-law stayed in the Latin room, second floor the top half of the cathedral style windows overlooking the harbor, and from their king-sized bed can see the doc's surgery. The hotel (circa 1854) had two entrances from the parking area, my son thinking it was built in stages. About 10 steps up to the second floor, the doors have very old-fashioned door handles, latches, (probably late 1800's) but was told not original to the building. The next day it was sunny-- somehow Port Isaac turned into Portwenn! We had lunch at the Krab Pot--apparently they allow dogs to come in w/ their owners. We ate on the second floor and a couple came upstairs w/ their dog which sat on the floor perfectly behaved. We walked from the Hotel down to the harbor and up to the Surgery. Not a bad walk (I am admitting to being Eileen Atkins' age). The only thing I was hesitant about was the walk downhill, steep around the doc's surgery and to the Large Restaurant. Uphill, beyond that white house, Roscarrock Hill road ends and there are two very large buildings (probably for guest lodgings, not sure) spaced apart, but there are also steps in the hill (no railing) you can go up to the very top of the hill, which my son & daughter-in-law did. My daughter & I did not go. They said the view was breathtaking from the top of the hill. We ate dinner at the Golden Lion which my children especially enjoyed, pub-like atmosphere, with locals and tourists having drinks and laughter. The dogs and their owners were out on the terrace. We bought some souvenirs at the Stowaway Gift Shop located behind the Schoolhouse Hotel and some at the gift shop which serves as Mrs. Tishell's Pharmacy during filming. I did not see Louisa's cottage but did see Aunt Ruth's and Robert Campbell's next door. We never closed the drapes at night (two nights) just wanted to enjoy the fairy-tale like views, beautiful at night with white lights on here and there. We drove to St. Nonna's Church in Altarnon built in the early 15th century. According to a booklet we have it was partly constructed of moorstone, that is not quarried stone, but granite lying on the moors. Inside the church there are 9 rows of pews w/ 4 sections separated by aisles. Behind the side entrance (where Louisa came in) there are a few additional pews; on a wall behind the church is a large glass picture frame with of pictures of the wedding of M & L taken, all of which I have seen posted here and elsewhere. That is the only indication I see of this event taken place at the church. Outside the path to the church is a stone footpath arching over a babbling brook and a few feet away is another stone footpath. My disappointment is that the graveyard connected is overgrown with weeds almost 2 feet high, but am hoping with the warmer weather arriving that a manicure will take place. I did not want to visit the village during filming because I think there would be too many crowds trying to get into the eating places, booking a room at the Schoolhouse Hotel and competing for the views. You guessed it, when I arrived I cried at the beauty and being given the fortunate opportunity to see this village and cried when I left. Hope this post prompts some of you to visit Port Isaac.”

Great description! Biff and I were thinking of going last year but things came up and we couldn't go. But, we hope to one day.
marchrand
16-05-2014
For those of you who are thinking of going sometime in the future to Port Isaac, I wish you would make definite plans. The older you get the more ailments crop into your life. If you have two good feet, in decent health and a fit person along to assist you if you need to lean on an arm if you are up in age, it's do-able. Keep in mind that if you go during the year they are filming another series, it's a roll of the dice as to whether you will be there on that day to see any of the cast members. I have to believe that with each series they film and more fans accrue, the crowds can be pretty big. You have to deal with getting a room, long lines at the very good eating places in town, bathroom facilities, getting near the filming sites, etc. Another thing, my daughter booked the Old Schoolhouse Hotel rooms in January at a price of about $240. per night US $$. Those same rooms now are $600 plus. It will have be a long-range plan on your part to keep the costs down.
NewPark
16-05-2014
Originally Posted by marchrand:
“For those of you who are thinking of going sometime in the future to Port Isaac, I wish you would make definite plans. The older you get the more ailments crop into your life. If you have two good feet, in decent health and a fit person along to assist you if you need to lean on an arm if you are up in age, it's do-able. Keep in mind that if you go during the year they are filming another series, it's a roll of the dice as to whether you will be there on that day to see any of the cast members. I have to believe that with each series they film and more fans accrue, the crowds can be pretty big. You have to deal with getting a room, long lines at the very good eating places in town, bathroom facilities, getting near the filming sites, etc. Another thing, my daughter booked the Old Schoolhouse Hotel rooms in January at a price of about $240. per night US $$. Those same rooms now are $600 plus. It will have be a long-range plan on your part to keep the costs down.”

I don't think we paid $240 a night in June 2013. Maybe $150 a night, which I thought at the time was more than fair, considering on-site parking. $240 is a lot for what you get, and $600 a night strikes me as excessive, if not outright gouging.

However, whatever the market will bear is the way things go in general and I do understand that. . I gather there's mixed feelings in PI about Buffalo Productions, but those in the hospitality trade there, ought to be thanking their lucky stars.
marchrand
16-05-2014
Originally Posted by NewPark:
“I don't think we paid $240 a night in June 2013. Maybe $150 a night, which I thought at the time was more than fair, considering on-site parking. $240 is a lot for what you get, and $600 a night strikes me as excessive, if not outright gouging.

However, whatever the market will bear is the way things go in general and I do understand that. . I gather there's mixed feelings in PI about Buffalo Productions, but those in the hospitality trade there, ought to be thanking their lucky stars.”

I am afraid I gave the wrong information about the rate of the rooms at the Old Schoolhouse Hotel. The price did not change from January to now. However, the rooms are not all the same price but in the $200 a night range. Our rooms in London, however, did increase in price. Sorry, for the incorrect figure.

NewPark - I am in agreement with you on the second full paragraph of your post above as to what Louisa was thinking in the hospital bed in S6E8. You almost have to take each word of that conversation w/ Martin and watch their expressions very closely to interpret what is meant - and also that walk down the hospital hall by DM. great writing by Jack Lothian.
Mofromco
16-05-2014
Originally Posted by NewPark:
“Thinking again about that painful last scene of S6:

Watching it for the first few times, I put the most dismal interpretation possible on it. I thought that when Louisa said "This doesn't change anything...." what she meant was, "I'm still leaving you, even if it's just back to my own cottage, and I don't know when or if I'll be back", (because of course, that's how you deal with serious problems in a marriage -- run first and ask questions later..) And it really bothered me, b/c he had just heroically saved her life, and in the pre-op scene had promised to try to change so he could be a better husband. So for nothing to have changed, either she didn't hear or remember the speech at all (but then why does he make it?) or heard it but it didn't matter to her or she didn't believe him (why?) So my conclusion was that S7 was going to be a long and frustrating exercise in him trying to get her back, probably ending at the last remotely plausible moment with the big reconciliation.

But here's my new thinking: What Louisa is saying (or thinking) might really be that "this" - 1)- his heroism, for which she is grateful and which also reminds her of what really draws her to him, and 2) his recognition that he needs to change, which she heard and remembers -- are important to her, but they both have to face the fact that there are serious problems in their marriage, and he needs to understand that she is unwilling to continue as they were before. Things have to change. But now she is not saying, I'm out of here. I think she is ready to give him a chance to show her that he is prepared to try to change. so, in my new, optimistic thinking, I believe they will start S7 living together, but in the couples counseling that Martin Clunes has talked about. In fact, a good possibility for the first scene of S7 is them in a counselor's office!

Thoughts? (other than that I must have changed my meds... )

P.S. Of course, too awful to contemplate, but she could also have been saying: thank you very much for coming after me .....but I'm still leaving you, because we can't go on as we were.”

My present theory is that Louisa heard the first part of their OR conversation. She heard that he had tried to go to Spain..to follow her. However, she was amnesiac to the part of being a better husband. New Park, I think he said it because he had to hear himself say it...for clarity...for determination. He was telling himself what he needed to do.

Louisa saying, "This doesn't change anything." Yes, you are Superman, but I'm not starry eyed....their lives couldn't go on that way. The shocker was his reply...I agree....apparently Ruth had smacked his psyche enough that he realized he was wrong. This time, however, he's ready to try to change....very exciting and not so much of a downer. On a casual view it may seem depressing, but it really isn't.
NewPark
17-05-2014
Originally Posted by Mofromco:
“My present theory is that Louisa heard the first part of their OR conversation. She heard that he had tried to go to Spain..to follow her. However, she was amnesiac to the part of being a better husband. New Park, I think he said it because he had to hear himself say it...for clarity...for determination. He was telling himself what he needed to do.

Louisa saying, "This doesn't change anything." Yes, you are Superman, but I'm not starry eyed....their lives couldn't go on that way. The shocker was his reply...I agree....apparently Ruth had smacked his psyche enough that he realized he was wrong. This time, however, he's ready to try to change....very exciting and not so much of a downer. On a casual view it may seem depressing, but it really isn't.”

Well, I think that rationally and medically, you're right -- she didn't hear or remember the better husband part, and he said it to make things clear to himself -- a promise to her, whether or not she remembers.

But I'm going to clap my hands and believe in the Portwenn Effect fairy here, and so think that Louisa does remember!
NewPark
17-05-2014
I am taking both sides of this position in my own head -- (whilst arguing for one side in another venue)

Does Louisa really "know" that Martin loves her, but diagnoses the problem between them as his inability to express that, to show it, to be truly intimate with her -- and then sometimes get impatient at this, or decide that he can never truly give her what she needs from him, whether he love her or not and therefore, she has to leave him?--

or is she insecure about his feelings for her, and when he is with-holding, distant, off-putting, lapsing into medical jargon instead of acknowledging feelings, etc., she takes this to mean that he really does not love her, and leaves him in despair.

I'm thinking of the scene in the schoolyard at end of S4 -- clearly, she is waiting for something from him, and clearly she is deeply disappointed that he can't give her anything at that moment other than a spreadsheet and post-dated checks. Does she know that he loves her, and wants to be with her, but cannot acknowledge it, and thus, it's pointless to give him cues or ask directly for what she needs -- as in, "I'm sorry you have to go, I'm sorry we didn't connect more, are you sure this is what you want?" Or does she really believe that he doesn't care about her and is waiting for some sign that in fact he does?

Or both, or each at different times?

I find it so hard to believe that she does not know how much he cares about her -- I've always felt that her frustrated anger and sadness about him is with his limitations with respect to expressing or doing anything about it.

Yet, she never has read him as well as she thinks, and she is at least as insecure as the rest of us I suppose (though I am not one who believes this is her major character flaw), so maybe she just can't see how much he really loves her.
Bloodphobia
17-05-2014
New Park

I am not blaming the writers for what they write, they are following the general direction of the story dictated -- presumably -- by Martin and Philippa and probably some programmer at ITV. From series 5 onward -- except for the last few minutes of S 5, E8 and the first half of S 6, E1, Martin did not seem at all loving toward Louisa. In S 5 he seemed paternalistic toward both her and James. In S 6 he seemed like he wanted to escape both of them. He apologized to James for his behavior in S. 6, but he hasn't apologized to Louisa when she was conscious.

Why does BP always resort to the prop of Martin telling Louisa how he feels only indirectly.

He loves her when he is drunk.

He loves her but tells Mrs. Tishell instead.

He loves her but she is anesthetized.
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