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Doc Martin (Part 17 — Spoilers)


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Old 21-11-2013, 17:02
Lizzie_cUS
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I know that anything's possible in Portwenn Land, but does anyone feel that it's at all plausible that Martin might be OK with or actually choose living separately (as much as I feel that would be a mistake) until he gets himself together enough to decide that he probably won't screw it up this time?
I think it's plausible and I think watching him work through the issues might make it interesting to watch. While I'd prefer having he and Louisa living together and working through things together, it might help to see them both apart for some of the series but not all of the series. Louisa needs her Martin back! And I still think he can't bear to be without her, not necessarily in the carnal sense but just to have hers and JH's physical presence with him. Louisa also needs to talk her feelings through with someone and that would be interesting to watch as well.
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Old 21-11-2013, 18:50
Mofromco
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I told him that she was 43 (I think that's about right) and that Martin was 52 (for a little bit longer) but he answered back in that mumbly way where you can't understand the words but you know your conversational partner is blowing you off. You know, MC does that very well in his acting! Kenny cracks me up sometimes. It's hardly May-December but it might be getting to be Viagra time.....joking....joking....
I am laughing as I write this, but HOW can someone read this and not realize it's a joke! I TOLD you it was a joke! What more can I do?

Imagine this is a line for DM. Perfect eh? You guys.......
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Old 21-11-2013, 19:13
NewPark
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NP I think Martin would jump at the chance to live separately. But that can't be his ultimate goal. Part of what he has to learn in therapy is that he cannot be in control at all times as he was in surgery and in his neat and tidy pre-Louisa and James days. He can't control the imbeciles in Portwenn, fine he snarls at them. He can't control the hemophobia, fine he stays in Portwenn. He can't control James being a baby and Louisa being a bit messy and scattered, fine he --- no wait a minute he can't do what he has been doing. Shut down, not communicate with Louisa, sink back into his phobia, become a hypochondriac rather than facing his emotional issues. I know we have beaten the Asperger's issue into oblivion, but one marker of the condition is difficulty living in an environment one can't control.

As you say, anything is possible in Portwenn Land. But it would be more interesting if the writers actually worked through Martin's issues rather than glossing over them as they did with the improbable surgery on Louisa.
As Dr. Milligan said, being a surgeon is all about control, really. I do think that's the issue -- if he can't be in control, it's tremendously anxiety provoking and ultimately, to use another term, he decompensates.

So I think they both may agree not to live together for a while, but perhaps they'll spend a few weekends together? Will we see Martin eventually in a sport coat and open collar? Will pigs fly?
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Old 21-11-2013, 23:41
SusieSagitarius
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As Dr. Milligan said, being a surgeon is all about control, really. I do think that's the issue -- if he can't be in control, it's tremendously anxiety provoking and ultimately, to use another term, he decompensates.

So I think they both may agree not to live together for a while, but perhaps they'll spend a few weekends together? Will we see Martin eventually in a sport coat and open collar? Will pigs fly?
Such good analysis/ideas/examples floating around here. What a pleasure to read!
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Old 21-11-2013, 23:44
SusieSagitarius
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As Dr. Milligan said, being a surgeon is all about control, really. I do think that's the issue -- if he can't be in control, it's tremendously anxiety provoking and ultimately, to use another term, he decompensates.

So I think they both may agree not to live together for a while, but perhaps they'll spend a few weekends together? Will we see Martin eventually in a sport coat and open collar? Will pigs fly?
Pigs might not fly, but if Louisa can dream an open-throated shirt on Martin, who knows what's possible.

But then, she's only mentioned getting him out of his suit the one time (and then only into a wetsuit) so she might be quite happy with his attire. And she does now get him out of it at night.
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Old 22-11-2013, 00:09
Zarwen
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But it would be more interesting if the writers actually worked through Martin's issues rather than glossing over them as they did with the improbable surgery on Louisa.
YES, thank you!!!!!
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Old 22-11-2013, 00:13
Zarwen
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Pigs might not fly, but if Louisa can dream an open-throated shirt on Martin, who knows what's possible.

But then, she's only mentioned getting him out of his suit the one time (and then only into a wetsuit) so she might be quite happy with his attire. And she does now get him out of it at night.
Well, Susie, I am not totally convinced. IMHO, those horrid Pajamas of Steel are simply a nocturnal version of a suit.
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Old 22-11-2013, 00:23
Zarwen
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Thinking back on all of Season 6, I recently realized that the opening scene of ep1 really told the whole story in a nutshell. DM is examining a patient who thinks she needs the help of a specialist, but DM does not even believe there is anything wrong with her. This is a metaphor for what happened to him and to the marriage over the course of the season: clearly DM and LE DO need expert help, but DM won't even admit anything is wrong, much less getting specialist help for it! And the fact that he is examining a patient for a "female problem" . . . . yes, Jack Lothian does have a way with metaphors!
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Old 22-11-2013, 02:46
Mofromco
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Thinking back on all of Season 6, I recently realized that the opening scene of ep1 really told the whole story in a nutshell. DM is examining a patient who thinks she needs the help of a specialist, but DM does not even believe there is anything wrong with her. This is a metaphor for what happened to him and to the marriage over the course of the season: clearly DM and LE DO need expert help, but DM won't even admit anything is wrong, much less getting specialist help for it! And the fact that he is examining a patient for a "female problem" . . . . yes, Jack Lothian does have a way with metaphors!
Your analogy escapes me, Zarwen, any chance you could elaborate? I always saw that scene as a demonstration of how a physician needs to compartmentalize stimuli. After staring at "privates" in the morning, Martin has to get ready for his "honeymoon" in the afternoon. I can share a personal experience. My first husband and I met in Medical School and had a torrid affair through the whole experience. The month that he was doing his gynecology and obstetrics rotation we had little, if any sex. He was unable to divorce himself from the fact that he was looking at pussy all day and then had no desire for it. It is a profound memory. I also wondered about those who did breast augmentations and other procedures.....but those guys were married and had kids. Compartmentalization is an absolutely necessary skill...without it, no physician can survive.

Maybe Martin's compartmentalization mechanism is broken..to a certain extent.....hmmmm
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Old 22-11-2013, 03:24
NewPark
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Thinking back on all of Season 6, I recently realized that the opening scene of ep1 really told the whole story in a nutshell. DM is examining a patient who thinks she needs the help of a specialist, but DM does not even believe there is anything wrong with her. This is a metaphor for what happened to him and to the marriage over the course of the season: clearly DM and LE DO need expert help, but DM won't even admit anything is wrong, much less getting specialist help for it! And the fact that he is examining a patient for a "female problem" . . . . yes, Jack Lothian does have a way with metaphors!
Just rewatched E1. what struck me about it, again, was the very odd expression on Martin's face, as he drove up to the church. It looked anything but happy. that, I thought, was another clue as to how things were going to go. I just don't understand why he looked so sad.
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Old 22-11-2013, 03:46
Mofromco
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Just rewatched E1. what struck me about it, again, was the very odd expression on Martin's face, as he drove up to the church. It looked anything but happy. that, I thought, was another clue as to how things were going to go. I just don't understand why he looked so sad.
He also had that enigmatic, slightly sad expression when he was looking at Louisa and James Henry across the room when Chippy Miller gave his best wishes and asked about his clicking leg at the reception. Louisa was gorgeous...James Henry was thriving but he couldn't be content...he seemed almost sad. It was a tough moment to watch.
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Old 22-11-2013, 10:29
cc.cookie
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I know that anything's possible in Portwenn Land, but does anyone feel that it's at all plausible that Martin might be OK with or actually choose living separately (as much as I feel that would be a mistake) until he gets himself together enough to decide that he probably won't screw it up this time?
NP I think Martin would jump at the chance to live separately. But that can't be his ultimate goal. Part of what he has to learn in therapy is that he cannot be in control at all times as he was in surgery and in his neat and tidy pre-Louisa and James days. He can't control the imbeciles in Portwenn, fine he snarls at them. He can't control the hemophobia, fine he stays in Portwenn. He can't control James being a baby and Louisa being a bit messy and scattered, fine he --- no wait a minute he can't do what he has been doing. Shut down, not communicate with Louisa, sink back into his phobia, become a hypochondriac rather than facing his emotional issues. I know we have beaten the Asperger's issue into oblivion, but one marker of the condition is difficulty living in an environment one can't control.

As you say, anything is possible in Portwenn Land. But it would be more interesting if the writers actually worked through Martin's issues rather than glossing over them as they did with the improbable surgery on Louisa.
I think they will start with DM and LG living separately and probably even continue it until the last minute of s7, just to drive us insane. But I really think DM and LG would have to live together for DM to learn how to let go of his control issues and learn how to function in a noisy house full of kids and dogs and nanny's and village people.

I really hope they show DM working through his issues and also show LG realising she has some issues that need to be addressed too. I will not be impressed if they have LG giving up her job as a possible option. I would also prefer the final option to remain in Portwenn rather than having DM going back to London as a surgeon with LG.

Not sure why I am so against that scenario, I just hope it doesn't happen. I guess it is because I truly believe you can have a successful happy life without living in a huge city with a highly glossy profession providing all the creature comforts of life.
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Old 22-11-2013, 14:02
Bloodphobia
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New Park If Martin had a somber demeanor on the way to his wedding, that might be appropriate. But he looked as if he were going to his execution. With the spoilers about his breakdown, I thought it would occur at the wedding, and season 6 would show Martin and Louisa learning how to live together. The wedding would be in the last 3 minutes of Ep 8

Instead, any relationship they had deteriorated in season 6 and season 7 will presumably show how the rebuild it with professional help

Cookie. One thing Martin must renoncile in season 7 is his inability to return to surgery. Hope didn't want London as a place to liver but as a place to be the best surgeon. Creature comforts mean little to him. In fact his asceticism is another thing that must be resolved in their relationship. He has nice clothing and a car, but I don't believe he thinks of them as creature comforts but simply what you wear in drive when you wre raised in his economic class.

With that said, he must reconcile living in Portwenn. I don't think it is the location, but the people
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Old 22-11-2013, 14:23
Lizzie_cUS
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DM is always in control when it comes to life and death situations but can't seem to handle the mundane. It's like there is a switch that gets turned on when something dire is happening.

The high stress situations aren't just affecting his bloodphobia, they are also affecting matters of the heart.
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Old 22-11-2013, 14:45
NewPark
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New Park If Martin had a somber demeanor on the way to his wedding, that might be appropriate. But he looked as if he were going to his execution. With the spoilers about his breakdown, I thought it would occur at the wedding, and season 6 would show Martin and Louisa learning how to live together. The wedding would be in the last 3 minutes of Ep 8

Instead, any relationship they had deteriorated in season 6 and season 7 will presumably show how the rebuild it with professional help

Cookie. One thing Martin must renoncile in season 7 is his inability to return to surgery. Hope didn't want London as a place to liver but as a place to be the best surgeon. Creature comforts mean little to him. In fact his asceticism is another thing that must be resolved in their relationship. He has nice clothing and a car, but I don't believe he thinks of them as creature comforts but simply what you wear in drive when you wre raised in his economic class.

With that said, he must reconcile living in Portwenn. I don't think it is the location, but the people
I thought it looked like he was going to a funeral of his nearest and dearest, but agree -- it was way more than appropriate, for a groom, and the minute I saw it in the trailer, I was worried for the series.

He has lived like a monk, with his nice suits his habit, so to speak. That does have to change. If he begins to let go of his rigid character armor, (instead of it crumbling as he disintegrates), I wonder if his choice of clothes will symbolize this?

Let's hope S7 brings into Portwenn some new characters, who he can at least actually tolerate. Everybody needs some friends, outside of their spouse!
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Old 22-11-2013, 14:49
NewPark
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DM is always in control when it comes to life and death situations but can't seem to handle the mundane. It's like there is a switch that gets turned on when something dire is happening.

The high stress situations aren't just affecting his bloodphobia, they are also affecting matters of the heart.
I was just having this conversation with my son last night, who is a critical care nurse. He said that ICU crises are not anxiety provoking, compared with other life situations, outside the ICU. Maybe that's not uncommon with people who have to perform daily in these high stress situations. Maybe it's because you're so well-trained and practiced that you just step into the drill routine, and that protects you to some extent from being overwhelmed with anxiety. Anyway, interesting.
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Old 22-11-2013, 15:20
dcdmfan
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Just rewatched E1. what struck me about it, again, was the very odd expression on Martin's face, as he drove up to the church. It looked anything but happy. that, I thought, was another clue as to how things were going to go. I just don't understand why he looked so sad.
Earlier you said that you were so disappointed in this series that you wouldn't be able to watch it again. I am glad you decided to give it another go.
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Old 22-11-2013, 15:34
Mofromco
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I think they will start with DM and LG living separately and probably even continue it until the last minute of s7, just to drive us insane. But I really think DM and LG would have to live together for DM to learn how to let go of his control issues and learn how to function in a noisy house full of kids and dogs and nanny's and village people.

I really hope they show DM working through his issues and also show LG realising she has some issues that need to be addressed too. I will not be impressed if they have LG giving up her job as a possible option. I would also prefer the final option to remain in Portwenn rather than having DM going back to London as a surgeon with LG.

Not sure why I am so against that scenario, I just hope it doesn't happen. I guess it is because I truly believe you can have a successful happy life without living in a huge city with a highly glossy profession providing all the creature comforts of life.
There is a mitigating factor that is easily overlooked in these discussions...and that is the existence of James Henry Ellingham. I realize that 2 parent families are swiftly becoming the the exception rather than the norm but in the case of Martin and Louisa, who both suffered less than perfect childhoods, a priority in their minds may be providing their son the best and most loving situation that they can. This is good...a compelling reason for them to stay together.....but only if they can. A crappy good situation is as bad as a good crappy situation...I'm not sure what that means, but I think the point gets across. As to surgery....being a good functional surgeon is intrinsic to Martin's character, and he realizes, makes him the best man he can be. A lot of S7 will likely be delving into the blood phobia and getting him back to what he is the best at...saving lives by being a surgeon. It doesn't have to be a lost cause.
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Old 22-11-2013, 15:40
dcdmfan
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I was nervous as heck before my wedding ceremony and I may have looked a little somber, too.

As he is waiting for Louisa to arrive, however, he is concerned when she is late. I think he was looking forward to getting married.

I don't recall that a move to London was brought up in series 6. If series 7 is the last, I don't think they will focus on that. And, if it is the last, I hope they will focus a lot on Martin and Louisa and allow some time to show us more about her feelings when she is apart from Martin. I am grateful to have seen her trying to reach out to him. I felt that showed her in a better light than series 5 did. They gave us a little of insight to her feelings in S6 when she tells Margaret off and when she is high on the premed in the hospital. I hope they make time for more of that next series. It is time we have the opportunity to know what is going on with her.

Oh, but I forgot, I am not supposed to praise this series unless I am prepared to get my head chopped off and accused of being a mole for Buffalo Pictures. If you are one of those who feel that way - you know who you are - you are not going to run me off of here with your insults.
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Old 22-11-2013, 15:45
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Your analogy escapes me, Zarwen, any chance you could elaborate? I always saw that scene as a demonstration of how a physician needs to compartmentalize stimuli. After staring at "privates" in the morning, Martin has to get ready for his "honeymoon" in the afternoon. I can share a personal experience. My first husband and I met in Medical School and had a torrid affair through the whole experience. The month that he was doing his gynecology and obstetrics rotation we had little, if any sex. He was unable to divorce himself from the fact that he was looking at pussy all day and then had no desire for it. It is a profound memory. I also wondered about those who did breast augmentations and other procedures.....but those guys were married and had kids. Compartmentalization is an absolutely necessary skill...without it, no physician can survive.

Maybe Martin's compartmentalization mechanism is broken..to a certain extent.....hmmmm
i thought this scene was harkening back to his first shot at a wedding, when he spent the morning dealing with a man in the same way. (The guy said something like "you really want to be doing this on your wedding day"?). The more things change, the more they stay the same.
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Old 22-11-2013, 15:49
NewPark
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Earlier you said that you were so disappointed in this series that you wouldn't be able to watch it again. I am glad you decided to give it another go.
I think that I admired S6, because I did think it was compelling story and wonderfully acted, and also b/c they took quite a risk, going into such a dark place. But I have now convinced myself, and others have made convincing arguments, that they won't end on a down note, that I thought I should probably give it another chance I think probably the people who said that if you watch it without preconceived notions of what you want to happen, it's a better experience, are right. Otherwise, it was just too painful to want to re-experience.
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Old 22-11-2013, 15:58
Mofromco
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I was just having this conversation with my son last night, who is a critical care nurse. He said that ICU crises are not anxiety provoking, compared with other life situations, outside the ICU. Maybe that's not uncommon with people who have to perform daily in these high stress situations. Maybe it's because you're so well-trained and practiced that you just step into the drill routine, and that protects you to some extent from being overwhelmed with anxiety. Anyway, interesting.
When I was in my pediatric residency, when we were faced with a patient that was trying to die and we needed to resuscitate, the first step was "take your own pulse". Not literally but just keep your head about you. Your son is right.
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Old 22-11-2013, 16:18
Lizzie_cUS
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As he is waiting for Louisa to arrive, however, he is concerned when she is late. I think he was looking forward to getting married.
The look on his face though when he saw her at the doorway. His face softened and you knew right then how he really feels about Louisa. They need quiet time together, alone without a crying baby, moaning patients, school busywork to be done, or annoying village gossipers. You can see a deep connection between the two of them when they shut the world out when the world is whizzing around them. Even the last scene of S6E1 when everyone in their kitchen was blathering they were able to talk with one another and shut all that other noise off.
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Old 22-11-2013, 16:49
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I thought it looked like he was going to a funeral of his nearest and dearest, but agree -- it was way more than appropriate, for a groom, and the minute I saw it in the trailer, I was worried for the series.

He has lived like a monk, with his nice suits his habit, so to speak. That does have to change. If he begins to let go of his rigid character armor, (instead of it crumbling as he disintegrates), I wonder if his choice of clothes will symbolize this?

Let's hope S7 brings into Portwenn some new characters, who he can at least actually tolerate. Everybody needs some friends, outside of their spouse!
I have two thoughts about his demeanor in the taxi. I think he really wants this marriage, but the wedding - not so much. But he knows it is important to Louisa. So he spends his time in the taxi getting himself steeled for what is to come: being the center of attention, professing his love to Louisa in front of a lot of people, etc. All he wants to do is get through the day.

But I also think, in a production sense, they did this to try to fool us over where he was going and what was happening. When he stepped out of the cab, the church with the archway of flowers and everyone all dressed up was supposed to be a big reveal - a "gotcha!" But I suspect it was ITV who decided that they would promote the start of the series by promoting the wedding. Back in March-April when they were filming these scenes I suspect they thought they were going to surprise us.

That's just my take, for what it's worth...
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Old 22-11-2013, 17:43
Lizzie_cUS
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I have two thoughts about his demeanor in the taxi. I think he really wants this marriage, but the wedding - not so much. But he knows it is important to Louisa. So he spends his time in the taxi getting himself steeled for what is to come: being the center of attention, professing his love to Louisa in front of a lot of people, etc. All he wants to do is get through the day.

But I also think, in a production sense, they did this to try to fool us over where he was going and what was happening. When he stepped out of the cab, the church with the archway of flowers and everyone all dressed up was supposed to be a big reveal - a "gotcha!" But I suspect it was ITV who decided that they would promote the start of the series by promoting the wedding. Back in March-April when they were filming these scenes I suspect they thought they were going to surprise us.

That's just my take, for what it's worth...
Interesting thought. I would have never guessed that, due in part to all of the ITV pre-series promo hype. Maybe that should teach us all not to watch or read the spoilers or promos! Actually, it doesn't bother me ahead of time to know things. I don't want the details, leave that to my viewing pleasure...an overview will suffice.
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