Its not Ben or Kristina's fault.

When Mark and Iveta did their 'Salsa' Bruno said 'It wasn't a Salsa!'
to which Len replied ' What are you talking about! Salsa is a party dance! It was fun! It's a Salsa!'

So Dave's CCC was actually a Salsa.

I have said before that I like the celeb to actually attempt to dance the dance they were supposed to dance.
This series seems to me to be a shift further away from that.

If the pro want's to choreograph a dance with very little proper content in it for the celeb, then the judges should reflect in their scores (with a bit of scoring included for the entertainment value) and leave it to the public to rescue the couple because the routine was so entertaining.

Well here's the routine - but remember to keep your eyes open

That's true. It used to be the other way around, the male professional could hide a lot of the female celebrity's deficiencies by keeping her off the ground.
Like others, I didn't see much content from Ben. Impressive lifts though, but I was surprised the judges let them off so lightly.

This is my hobby horse do don't get me started.

There was NO salsa. But then there rarely is on Strictly. Only Bryan Fortuna and a dark haired lady pro from an early series (name forgotten) have ever done a proper salsa. Janette was the only person last night who produced anything salsa like at any point..

Salsa has a recognisable basic step - in fact more then one if you consider the various styles casino, Cali, NY etc. Its a dance about playing with poly-rhythms. So a really good salsa would have the dancers changing body movements to pick out phrasing or rhythms from the many layers of percussion (all of which are playing a slightly different 'beat') linked together by a core beat which the dancers use a bit like a metronome I suppose.

Although as a show piece lifts are included, the judges are always saying it is a club dance and because it is a club dance lifts are almost never included. It would be far to dangerous in a club environment to have a ladies feet suddenly revolving around the dancers heads.

Because it is a club dance it is very compact and dancers stay on the spot or in a slot depending on the style, Travelling around the room is not part of salsa not even in show or performance salsas. I can see why it becomes necessary to include some progression to fill a TV studio floor. But its not salsa.

If they must include the style it would lend itself better to one of those later stage jobbies where all the dancers start on the floor at the beginning and the judges eliminated them one by one.

I think women can hide in ballroom where they're dragged around the floor and men can hide in the Latin where their pro can wiggle around them while they sway gently from side to side.

So evens up in my mind.

As another poster mentioned, Len regards the salsa as a party dance, so it needs to be fun, which Ben's routine was.

Almost all the other dances, of course, aren't going to suit Ben at all, so I think we should let him have his one week in the top half of the leaderboard - and I'm pretty sure this will be his only week there.

A Non-dance for Ben! It was all Kristina wrapping herself around him, while he kinda stood there.

I couldn't believe the judges did not comment on his lack of movement.

Over-marked for sure.

This! Perfect summary. Have no idea what the judges were on about.

He is a lovely man, and I like his enjoyment of the whole thing, but he does not dance much and, this time, he didn't dance at all!

Think of Ben as the lumberjack of Strictly Come Dancing and Kristina as a mischevious fanny-flashing hyperactive woodland nymph trying to lead him into temptation. That would explain all the fanny and dead wood about anyway.

Thanks, some very informative comments there. I've been to Salsa clubs/bars and (as you say) it was nothing like we generally see on Strictly.

This really annoyed me. Ben stood around doing the odd turn and about 4 bars of the most basic salsa step. Mark's was full of content but obviously isn't as pretty for Craig to look at.

Very little, which is a shame as he showed in last week's rumba that he can loosen up.

this sums it up for me!

I don't begrudge Ben his achievement in that dance, but when Craig gave him an 8 I thought he was voting with a part of his anatomy that certainly wasn't his brain...

I will interested to see Craig's justification for his marking on ITT tomorrow.

Craig will still be in hospital tomorrow.

It was a cringemaking exhibition of non dancing from Ben and shame especially on Craig and Darcey for giving it an 8, but then again I think those two were judging him with their hormones .

Shame on Kristina for putting that appalling embarressing thing together . Has she no shame .

Male celebs can hide in Ballroom too! Remember Ricky Whittle admitting that Natalie holds his arms up in Ballroom and then she drops them and he realises how much leading she does.

Len also has said that lots of the male celebs don't actually lead and are led by their female Pro, and I'm sure the other judges know this too.

It annoys me (in general) when people only talk about women celebs being dragged around the floor. Female Pros prompt and pull their male celebs around too. None of the crap male celeb dancers ever lead, and sometimes not even the good ones do either. The female Pros have to lead their celebs and trust amateurs to lift them.

Certainly female celebs can hide behind very long dresses (regarding footwork), which is fault first of the wardrobe that don't hem it to a length where feet are visible.

Some of the better ones don't, either - Matt Dawson admitted that he lead in none of his dances with Lilia and that she simply shoved him around the dance floor!

Yes, you could tell that just by watching some of his dances that she was, despite her being tiny and him not. I never got the hype of his dancing, but as person I liked him.

Surely even a showdance has to contain dancing? He didn't really dance at all.

He wasn't exactly a natural but became pretty competent by virtue of sheer application - as you might expect of a top flight sportsman.

I really like Ben but he was so overmarked. I thought Julien did more in his salsa than Ben delivered in his!

Louis had dancing in his showdance?

I've watched it dozens of times too- he manages it by simultaneously holding on to her left hand (I think it's her left- it's obscured because of the camera angle) whilst he takes the weight of her neck on the back of his ankle. Clever Salsa move.

Julien definitely had more dance content and in terms of improvement, his is a much bigger leap than Ben's.