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No IPhone 5S discussion? |
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#76 |
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Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 13,091
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Quote:
Quick question. Do you actually have to use the fingerprint scanner? Or can it be turned off?
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#77 |
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Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: 🇬🇧
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Quote:
Very secure.
http://support.apple.com/kb/HT5949 They also said this which was probably nonsense and sheer guess work. Quick question. Do you actually have to use the fingerprint scanner? Or can it be turned off? |
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#78 |
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Join Date: May 2002
Location: Crystal Palace TX
Posts: 19,702
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So if someone clones my fingerprint they also need to enter a PIN ? I wasnt aware it worked that way ?
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#79 |
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Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Dundee, Scotland
Posts: 9,293
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You can have no security, or a passcode, or Touch ID (with a passcode).
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You don't have to activate it if you don't want to. You can just carry on using a passcode (or not)
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#80 |
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Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 9,428
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Quote:
Very secure.
http://support.apple.com/kb/HT5949 They also said this which was probably nonsense and sheer guess work. Quick question. Do you actually have to use the fingerprint scanner? Or can it be turned off? The scanner is optional, just as the passcode is optional. Why? |
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#81 |
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Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Dundee, Scotland
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Which part of that article do you disagree with?
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The scanner is optional, just as the passcode is optional. Because i wanted to know. Is that ok?! Why? |
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#82 |
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Join Date: May 2002
Location: Crystal Palace TX
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Just to be clear - if you do use TouchID then you are forced to also create a PIN - the PIN is not optional (it's a backup if the fingerprint fails).
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#83 |
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Join Date: Oct 2012
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Controlled environment? I have all the stuff to do that at my work which is a hotel!!
1. They had access to a good quality print. 2. They knew what equipment and materials they needed to make a good enough copy. 3. They knew how to make a good enough copy. 4. They were using a phone that wasn't about to be wiped remotely. I would wager that the typical opportunistic thief would be quite so knowledgeable or fortunate. |
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#84 |
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Join Date: Oct 2012
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Did i say i disagree with any part of it?
![]() Because i wanted to know. Is that ok?! Yes, of course it's OK. Why wouldn't it be? Defensive, much! ![]() I just wondered what the relevance was. |
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#85 |
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Join Date: Jan 2011
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Controlled insomuch as:
1. They had access to a good quality print. 2. They knew what equipment and materials they needed to make a good enough copy. 3. They knew how to make a good enough copy. 4. They were using a phone that wasn't about to be wiped remotely. I would wager that the typical opportunistic thief would be quite so knowledgeable or fortunate. I think you're missing the point here. Its been cracked. Simple as that. Like any fingerprint scanner, it can be spoofed one way or another. Doesnt matter whether its easy or not. |
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#86 |
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Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Dundee, Scotland
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I just wasn't sure what you feel Apple have claimed that doesn't stand up to scrutiny.
Yes, of course it's OK. Why wouldn't it be? Defensive, much! ![]() I just wondered what the relevance was. |
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#87 |
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Join Date: Oct 2012
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i do think its a great little novelty item at face value. i just worry that if its not been made secure enough then it screws up fingerprint biometric use forever. someone figures out how to harvest all the apple fingerprint data and thats fingerprint use for online banking (etc) knackered. All for a quick unlock.
and thats not a dig at Apple - same goes for the HTC One Max (with fingerprint) and Dell laptops etc. Dont forget Apple arent the first to do this. Look at the recent news about the US monitoring calls and texts - stuff happens ! |
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#88 |
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Join Date: Oct 2012
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You asked me why i wanted to know which was a strange thing to ask. Thats all.
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#89 |
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Join Date: Sep 2011
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Quote:
Just to be clear - if you do use TouchID then you are forced to also create a PIN - the PIN is not optional (it's a backup if the fingerprint fails).
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#90 |
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Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 4,214
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It wasn't strange at all. Whilst this is a fun exchange where you first got defensive, and now find option strange, I'm still not sure what the relevance was.
I am in Kenya ATM doing quite a lot of traveling. It would seem sensible to put a lock code on my phone, right ? (i am actually one of those people who never bothered with one pre Touch id). I spent 8 hours yesterday self driving a 4WD on dirt tracks strewn with boulders and stream crossings using Google Maps for navigation. As it happens I forgot to bring my cigar lighter plug with me so my phone kept timing out and locking the screen. I was able to reactivate it without even looking at it. The thought of having to type a passcode, well .... |
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#91 |
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Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 13,091
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Point is i guess is it's not even close to as secure as apple made out.
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How secure did Apple make it out to be?
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Which part of that article do you disagree with?
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Did i say i disagree with any part of it?
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#92 |
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Join Date: Sep 2011
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All. I can say is that the proof of the pudding is in the eating.
I am in Kenya ATM doing quite a lot of traveling. It would seem sensible to put a lock code on my phone, right ? (i am actually one of those people who never bothered with one pre Touch id). I spent 8 hours yesterday self driving a 4WD on dirt tracks strewn with boulders and stream crossings using Google Maps for navigation. As it happens I forgot to bring my cigar lighter plug with me so my phone kept timing out and locking the screen. I was able to reactivate it without even looking at it. The thought of having to type a passcode, well .... ![]()
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#93 |
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Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 13,091
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Quote:
So not controlled at all then!!
I think you're missing the point here. Its been cracked. Simple as that. Like any fingerprint scanner, it can be spoofed one way or another. Doesnt matter whether its easy or not. The exploit that's been demonstrated requires you to have both the phone AND the owner's fingerprint, and enough time and the materials required to create the latex finger. Okay, maybe if you have the phone you can get a workable fingerprint from somewhere on that phone. But you still need the materials. And you can't switch the phone off and come back to it later, because it'll ask for your passcode when you switch it back on. Meanwhile, if the owner notices it missing, they can put the phone in lost mode and/or wipe it remotely. EDIT: For me, the biggest potential flaw is that Touch ID is completely optional, even when it's enabled. You can still choose to use the passcode instead. And, as the support document that you linked to mentioned, that's a less secure method if it's a four digit number. I've changed mine now to a longer alphanumeric code, given the convenience that Touch ID provides. |
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#94 |
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Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 3,474
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I think it's more than novelty. It's pretty secure, it's very convenient, it works pretty much flawlessly, and the chances of it being hacked are incredibly slim.
And Im aware that the print info is stored locally and is encrypted but we all know that 'things happen' ... an app starts harvesting details ... an encryption key is broken .... if it was the government asking to store your fingerprint info there would (quite rightly) be uproar ! Just look at the latest headlines about apple being able to read imessages ! i dont know if they can or cant but for some people out there security is made to be broken. a regularly changed passcode is a much safe bet surely ? |
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#95 |
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Join Date: May 2002
Location: Crystal Palace TX
Posts: 19,702
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Quote:
Controlled insomuch as:
1. They had access to a good quality print. 2. They knew what equipment and materials they needed to make a good enough copy. 3. They knew how to make a good enough copy. 4. They were using a phone that wasn't about to be wiped remotely. I would wager that the typical opportunistic thief would be quite so knowledgeable or fortunate. |
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#96 |
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Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 3,153
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Quote:
Since the fingerprint is stored locally on the phone and isn't backed up to the cloud, nobody's going to harvest all the Apple fingerprints.
It's more about convenience than security. It provides the same level of security as a passcode lock but saves time, particularly as it can also be used for iTunes and App Store purchases. It's worked really well for me so far, anyway. I just press the home button as I normally would to unlock, then keep my thumb on the button and I'm straight in. The whole thing takes under a second and is tied to an action that I would have taken anyway. like you say the fingerprint is stored locally on device and most probably encrypted using an irreversible SHA-1 style hashing algorithm. If the hackers can get an iPhone and actually reverse engineer a picture of the fingerprint by hacking into the chip then that would be impressive. I couldn't imaging any system that really needs super high security could work with a fingerprint scan ( it would perhaps be one element if it ) as fingerprints can be duplicated. |
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#97 |
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Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 13,091
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Quote:
Its pretty secure for you or I where nobody wants to get into our phones THAT much but for someone who really wants to get on a phone its perfectly do-able and then always repeatable.
And Im aware that the print info is stored locally and is encrypted but we all know that 'things happen' ... an app starts harvesting details ... an encryption key is broken .... if it was the government asking to store your fingerprint info there would (quite rightly) be uproar ! Just look at the latest headlines about apple being able to read imessages ! i dont know if they can or cant but for some people out there security is made to be broken. a regularly changed passcode is a much safe bet surely ? |
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#98 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 3,474
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Quote:
I thought iMessages were encrypted end to end and therefore pretty secure? I'm sure I remember reading that Apple can't read them even if they wanted to. Might be wrong though.
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#99 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 404
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Was there this much fuss and negativity over samsungs face id?
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#100 |
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Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: 🇬🇧
Posts: 60,865
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Quote:
to be honest i dont know either way. i'd hope they were secure. but lots of news articles flying around currently stating otherwise. My point was that just because someone tries to build it safe, and says its safe .... doesnt always mean it IS safe.
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