Digital Spy

Search Digital Spy
 

DS Forums

 
 

Tupac - Was he that great?


Reply
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 14-11-2013, 10:49
Shadow2009
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 10,340

I was born in 1993 and don't think my family listened to him when I was growing up. I've heard people rave about him for years, saw people "share" his quotes and lyrics on Facebook ever since I registered with it and am always reading his name somewhere. He seems like he was a massive icon. I read a bit about him last night but I don't really know where to begin. The impression I got from everyone over the years is that he was an angelic guy with alot of morals and was basically a very good man, but if that was the case then why did he get into so much trouble with the police? Did he really rape a woman? Apparently he beat someone up with a baseball bat, shot police offers, was involved in a shooting that accidentally killed a six year old child and told Biggie that he slept with his wife and kept provoking him with disses. There's also a video of him before he was famous saying he had respect for women and always would have respect for women yet when he was famous he always called them "bitches" and "hoes" (and apparently raped one).

I'm kinda fascinated because he obviously is held in high regard by the public and today's generation of rappers but I just don't understand why. What makes him so special from the other rappers? Is it because he died young? On the surface he just seems like a criminal and gangster but obviously I must be missing something.
Shadow2009 is offline   Reply With Quote
Please sign in or register to remove this advertisement.
Old 14-11-2013, 11:46
unique
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 5,828
2pac is perhaps to rap what cobain was to rock. he released a small amount of music that was pretty good, and then he died. then the jeff buckley syndrome kicks in where people think that just because what was released was good, then potentially what would come next would have been phenomenal. however based on the unfinished buckley stuff it disproves that idea.
2pac wasn't really a huge huge (note double huge) artist commercially before he died, at least not like say eminem or kayne at the height of thier popularity and sales, but at the same time wasn't an underground artist. who knows if he would have kept up the success or faded away, for example like nelly who was huge at one point, but like many artists the huge success doesn't last long and later releases aren't a patch on the best stuff. when an artist dies young they don't "spoil" their career with poor releases, so no bad amy winehouse album. although when the family milk leftovers for all they can, to the degree of using unfinished tracks and voicemail messages it doesn't help the legacy.
as for what he did or didn't do, who knows. he wrote about stuff in lyrics, but it could have been just shock value like eminem

and it's a bit of the same for biggie, but he died just before an album came out, a double, and one that had some pretty good tracks. in both cases the next album and subsequent albums could have flopped, same with nirvana, but dying young leaves that mystery
unique is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 14-11-2013, 12:01
Microkorg
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Sussex
Posts: 1,725
No
He was shite
Microkorg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 14-11-2013, 12:10
Rae_Amury
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Posts: 344
Just listen to his lyrics. That's all it takes to make an opinion on him not only as an artist, but also as a person.

He was involved in a lot of stuff like shootings, beatings, drug trade etc. and ended up in prison. On the other hand, when you listen to his lyrics, then you can see how honest, intelligent and sensitive he could be. He was a gangster, but he was also a philosopher. He had a wierd moral compass, but in the end I think he was not that bad. Everyone makes mistakes and nothing is only black or white, you know.
Rae_Amury is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 14-11-2013, 15:09
cnbcwatcher
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: At college, in L.A.'s office
Posts: 50,767
I don't really know. I've never listened to or heard any of his music. I had a friend once who used to talk about him though.
cnbcwatcher is offline Follow this poster on Twitter   Reply With Quote
Old 14-11-2013, 15:40
sjp07
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 3,059
I don't really know. I've never listened to or heard any of his music. I had a friend once who used to talk about him though.
Not trying to be mean, but did this really add anything to the conversation?


Anyway, Tupac wasn't the greatest lyricist, but he was a story teller. He could paint a picture like no other in his lyrics. He didn't need to use a ton of metaphors and different rhyme structures to make you understand just how great he was. He put out five albums while alive and that is enough to tell the kind of artist he was. The six more released after his death solidified it.

He was a kid who went to art school when he was young, he was an actor(poetic justice is still one of my favorite movies), but he was a human being. We all have our problems. Some more than others, but he put it in his music. He had a crack fiend mother, absent father, and had to figure out a lot on his own. You should watch the movie about his life. It'll give you more insight. It's called Tupac: Ressurection. They are supposed to making another one too soon.
sjp07 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 14-11-2013, 15:50
NicoleRich
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 1,146
Yes. His lyrics were is forte. He spoke the truth.
NicoleRich is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 14-11-2013, 17:54
DEADLY_17
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: London
Posts: 9,069
Yes he spoke the truth his raps actually meant something.
DEADLY_17 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 14-11-2013, 18:31
Grabid Rannies
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 3,214
He was involved in a lot of stuff like shootings, beatings, drug trade etc. and ended up in prison. On the other hand, when you listen to his lyrics, then you can see how honest, intelligent and sensitive he could be. He was a gangster, but he was also a philosopher. He had a wierd moral compass, but in the end I think he was not that bad. Everyone makes mistakes and nothing is only black or white, you know.
So as not to make this personal to the late Mr Shakur, I would say that anyone involved in 'a lot' of one, let alone the three things you cite could not ever merely be 'not that bad' - I find that a bit of a moral compass contradiction in itself! It would take one hell of an evidenced redemption/reformation to convince me otherwise. Maybe I'm too outraged of Tunbridge Wells, but that's just my thoughts.
Grabid Rannies is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 14-11-2013, 19:12
fkinhell
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: My London Bunker
Posts: 456
TAKE THAT BACK!!!!!!
fkinhell is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 14-11-2013, 19:14
Microkorg
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Sussex
Posts: 1,725
Jog on
Microkorg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 14-11-2013, 19:26
fkinhell
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: My London Bunker
Posts: 456
Are you more of a Lil Wayne fan then?
fkinhell is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 14-11-2013, 20:44
Squatch
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Posts: 269
When celebrities die young, people see them through rose-tinted glasses and they are often unjustly worshipped. It becomes blasphemy to criticise them. So no, he wasn't particularly great.

He also was not a nice person. I don't care if you're mum did drugs and you're dad was absent. Those are common problems, it doesn't mean you then have free reign to be completely evil.

I am suspicious of any "I had a hard life" stories rappers come out with anyway, because many of them have turned out to not be true and they're trying to make themselves look hard or like troubled artistes.
Squatch is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15-11-2013, 02:35
SuperAPJ
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 8,529
jeff buckley syndrome kicks in where people think that just because what was released was good, then potentially what would come next would have been phenomenal.
Same with Aaliyah.
SuperAPJ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15-11-2013, 11:20
cnbcwatcher
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: At college, in L.A.'s office
Posts: 50,767
When celebrities die young, people see them through rose-tinted glasses and they are often unjustly worshipped. It becomes blasphemy to criticise them. So no, he wasn't particularly great.
That happened when Michael Jackson died. Everyone was saying he was a 'legend' and blah blah blah and nobody dared criticise him. Then they were all buying his songs from iTunes and buying his CDs. The TV news coverage went on for several days as well.
cnbcwatcher is offline Follow this poster on Twitter   Reply With Quote
Old 15-11-2013, 11:28
mialicious
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: London
Posts: 2,954
He would knock out an album in a day, he had a couple of classic heartfelt songs but overall, musically i don't think he was that great. i never really liked his voice that much.but when it comes to passion and dedication he had that by the bucketful.he was extremely charismatic.I think he would have gone on to be one of the great actor's.
He was young and good looking when he was murdered and this always gives musicians/actors iconic status.
mialicious is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15-11-2013, 12:57
unique
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 5,828
Same with Aaliyah.
not really as she was nowhere in the same type of league as the other artists mentioned who were writers in particular. aaliyah was just another in a long stream of female vocalists with good looks who's success is owed to the writers and producers who could have replaces the vocals with another female artist with good looks and still had a hit. remove r kelly, missy and timbaland and there isn't much left in her music. whether she make another good album or not was dependant on other people to write, produce and perform her music and make videos for her. the same goes for a few of the current top female artists from rihanna to katy perry. to compare them to buckley and cobain is ludicrous (no, not the wrapper)
unique is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15-11-2013, 13:11
Super_Steve
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 4,149
That happened when Michael Jackson died. Everyone was saying he was a 'legend' and blah blah blah and nobody dared criticise him. Then they were all buying his songs from iTunes and buying his CDs. The TV news coverage went on for several days as well.
I'm not really sure you can use that argument for Jackson. He is arguably the Elvis of our generation, he sold zillions of albums. The coverage was justified as was the fanfare from Joe Public.
Super_Steve is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15-11-2013, 17:57
speedy_gonzales
Forum Member
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 718
yeah he was that great and he had a fantastic pair of gnashers.
speedy_gonzales is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15-11-2013, 18:26
Delboy219
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Scotland
Posts: 2,914
I was a massive Tupac fanboy when i was a kid, but now i can see that he was very overrated. But i will say this, his album Strictly 4 My Niggaz still stands up if you prefer the older sound of rap. This was before he went all west coast and got in bed with Suge.
Delboy219 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16-11-2013, 12:02
Shadow2009
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 10,340
It's interesting how so many people on here have agreed he was over rated, yet when I look on something like Yahoo Answers or a rap forum there's overwhelming praise for him.
Shadow2009 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16-11-2013, 16:07
JasonWatkins
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Posts: 40,627
I personally don't think he was overrated at all. I've listened to most of his stuff and while some of it is the usual dross about "gettin' money", there's stuff like "Brenda's got a Baby" that will always stand head and shoulders above a lot of other rap tracks - especially most of, if not all, of the rap stuff that's produced nowadays.
JasonWatkins is offline Follow this poster on Twitter   Reply With Quote
Old 16-11-2013, 16:24
sootysoo
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Espaņa
Posts: 6,314
He was a poet that did not know of it.
sootysoo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16-11-2013, 16:56
Inspiration
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 45,216
I'm kinda fascinated because he obviously is held in high regard by the public and today's generation of rappers but I just don't understand why. What makes him so special from the other rappers? Is it because he died young? On the surface he just seems like a criminal and gangster but obviously I must be missing something.
Regarding a few of the crimes you listed. He was found not guilty of the rape. And the police shooting involved two off duty cops who were drunk and in possession of stolen fire arms. The charges were dropped.

As for where he stands in terms of the greats of rap. IMHO Tupac was a poet. His lyrics meant something. He isn't just stringing together words that rhyme and making it sound good. He told stories. He talked about his past. His upbringing etc. He was a poet from the heart. He was writing poems at high school. I think Biggy was probably the better pure rapper. He had the gift of stringing the words together. Tupac had a the gift of making the words mean something. And for that he stands out amongst everyone else. Only Eminem has come close to both imho.

I think Tupac was a nice guy. Yes he got involved in some bad incidents and made mistakes. He admitted to that himself. And a lot of the stuff surrounding him was just an image and an act. It's often difficult to know what is real and what was an act. But he was a nice guy. I believe that. I say that having watched lots of interviews. Here are a couple:

Tupac at 17: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Is2a7oPTVzk
Another Tupac interview: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DTQU1gsTcVY

And Biggy at 17: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wehb1FJNEdI

Tupac's "Dear Mama": http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mb1ZvUDvLDY

They were both geniuses with words in their own ways. Rap was a much poorer industry after they were killed.
Inspiration is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16-11-2013, 19:18
Kayleigh2010
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Wales
Posts: 979
I love 2 Pac, Me Against The World is my favourite album of his.

He did a lot of stupid stuff while he was alive that is inexcusable yes but when it came to making music he was a genius.

You wont find many rappers out there today with as much passion, charisma and talent as him. It's a shame he died so young.
Kayleigh2010 is offline   Reply With Quote
 
Reply



Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

 
Forum Jump


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 04:48.