After Natalie I think Susanna is the best dancer, but it could be Ashley if he had more time to train.

On the night Sophie and Patrick could pull off the best performance (after Natalie), but they are not as consistent as Susanna or Ashley.

I don't see much improvement in Abbey's dancing and tbh for me she's almost at the same level as when she started. As the weeks go on I've started to doubt Allah as a teacher.

I would say Patrick.

In fact, I would order them:
Natalie
Patrick
Abbey
Sophie
Ashley
Susanna
Ben
Mark

Really? I would put Ashley above Abbey and Sophie . Even with little training he has improved every week, the two girls haven't.

After Natalie I would place Abbey, Sophie, Ashley, Mark and Ben.

Before Natalie I place Susanna and Patrick,

So therefore the "2nd best dancer after Natalie" is Sophie.

Come again Have you been hanging out with Giles Cohrens sister again?

Patrick.

I've been carefully going through a 200 page legal document and writing a report so my brain has been addled.

Anyway it is 03:30 and job done, time for a stiff drink and bed.

Googling I find that Giles Coren's sister is Victoria Coren. Has she (also) got an addled brain?

Oh on topic the survey was to seek out nominations for the "2nd best dancer after Natalie". As Natalie is the 3rd best dancer overall, the 2nd best dancer after Natalie must be the 5th best dancer overall and that is ... Sophie.

Ok, Throppy, I'll get my coat and hat. ...

Here is some Spanish Rock Merengue for you

http://youtu.be/7OalQIJtx_o

Nice lyrics and superb bass..

Aljaz

Hope there is no incoming fatwa ...

You -- all on your own -- keep me sane

You still here Pet? That's nice. My brain still hurts so I can't sleep ...

I'm just uploading the thing I've been working on. Tis done. I'll seem good by office hours tomorrow.

Have you tried visualising things? Come up with any wacky thing, such as a swan made of balsa wood, a yellow carpeted number 4, marshmallows floating in soup, more things... and try to see each one in perfect clarity, and smell them and imagine their textures, weights etc. Or imagine climbing onto them as if they're huge. Don't skip. You have to keep at it actively and imagine fully the object you decided to see. It's a really good way to fall asleep -- bizarrely. Even if I'm wide awake by the seventh or eighth object I'm off. Ten or fifteen minutes max. Better than alcohol.

Wonder if one of the wise people on this forum can say why it would work? Discovered it one night in helpless boredom.

I didn't think the question was about improvement, so I don't take that into account. Everyone has technical issues that they consistently struggle with, so it depends which issues each of us find more or less distracting to look at. For me, Abbey is quite graceful and her technical faults (like gapping) don't hugely distract from the dance.

Ashley's had three big issues from the start that he hasn't fully addressed: the arms, the head and the feet. Sometimes he gets the head right but he rarely maintains it for the whole dance. I've got no time for the guys that have bad head positioning, because the positioning for the women is more extreme, and yet they are all doing a better job of that than he is. Any time Ashley goes into an arm extension, he throws his arm out - he gets to the correct line in the end, but the process is inelegant. Unfortunately he's got big hands and feet, and that tends to show up mistakes even more - it looks like he's slapping his feet on the ground.

Sophie just tends to look lacklustre and lethargic in the feet but her top line, arms and ballroom footwork are usually ok. She's certainly better in the ballroom than Ashley; in the Latin I think her technique is better but he has more energy which can disguise his technical faults.

It's the same thing with Susanna - she has a persistent balance issue in that any time she does a heel lead, she goes off-balance then settles back into the right place. I'm actually preferring the look of her cha cha training in terms of technique because you don't have the heel leads like in the ballroom and the paso. But because she's done so few Latin dances, I just associate her with that consistent wobble off balance that she does with heel leads.

Patrick and then Abbey.

Nothing to do with personalities and based entirely on talent, ability, technique and performance.

All the others are just OK.

Bottom two dance-wise, Mark and Susanna.

Favourite personalities - Mark, Natalie and Sophie.

Patrick no question

Abbey/Sophie
Susanna/Ashley
Ben/Mark

Ah I am with you. You challenge the orthodoxy that Natalie is the best dancer - ohhh errrr controversial!

But now it makes sense pushing Natalie down the batting order means the next best after her is not second but fourth.

Victoria Coren chairs a TV quiz that is about extrapolating the answer from connections between known answers. Not an ideal analogy but best I could think of.

Thanks for the link - lovely. Fun but comes under my heading of Latin pop ( TBH I am not a huge lover of Merengue as done here in the UK - danced with a Latino it is a whole different ball game) Reminded me of Carlos Manuel Malo Cantidad
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=91CBOcS1Oag

BIB made me LOL. He has three problems the head, the arms and the feet - but the bit in the middle is fine.

I know what you mean about Suzanna and balance because I do it to. The big balance things I can deal with focussing on the core but that slight wobble before the feet find their stability I haven't worked out how to correct. I suspect its to do with ankle strength (mine often give way slightly) but how you go about strengthening you ankles I haven't figured.

I've suffered really badly in the past with insomnia, and the technique that works for me is to get engrossed in a story line in my head. Similar thing I suppose; the trick must be to get wrapped up in something else to stop yourself thinking that you need to go to sleep, and then you paradoxically nod off! Wonderful thing the brain

Really interesting!! I often am carrying way too much shopping up our very steep hill (resent the cost of public transport and I don't drive) and when it gets too heavy, or if I'm sick and achey, I think over-dramatically about hell and torment until I start telling a story in my head. Suddenly I'm home and all the aches had disappeared. Story seems to fit to my feet somehow. Oh but I am glad to hear that stories work for insomnia too. And that they works for you, for someone else... Brains are fabulous beasts


On topic
My favourite dancer is Patrick. Simply not knowing enough to say where he stands in the lists. Lovin' the thread though

Radical choice henrywilliams. If you happen to see this post it would be interesting to know why you consider Susanna and Patrick are better dancers than Natalie. My theory is it's related to their expressive enjoyment/enthusiasm.

My own opinion is that Patrick is a great dancer and over time and with training he could be superb. The joy on his face when he's dancing now. He seems to have discovered during his DO how much he enjoys dancing and the experience of it on SCD. I'm so glad that he was saved in the DO so that he could continue feeling that and sharing it with the audience.

Darcey has said a number of times that Sophie has natural timing and that it appears to be innate. I know she has danced inconsistenly but I wonder how much she would improve with more time than the competition will give her.

Of those remaining I least enjoy watching Ashley and Abbey. Both are competent but dull to watch.

I would order them:
Natalie
Susanna
Patrick
Ashley
Sophie
Abbey
Ben
Mark

But I think it is very close for the 2nd spot and Susanna only achieved it last week. It is still to be seem whether she can maintain it or even increase her lead. I think she might. She and Kevin seem very focused.

Thanks for the link. The link I gave you is by the Spanish group Seguridad Social. Notice the Spanish pronunciation of "presencia" rather than Venezolano / Dominicano style. Spaniards get cross when referred to as "Latin" (incl. Paso Doble).

Basically I was being a bit anarchistic

But seriously dancing IMHO is not gymnastics - whatever happened last year. It is more than doing it by numbers and learning and repeating sequences. There has to be feeling both felt and demonstrated through the body.

I don't see any feeling in Natalie's dances. Perfectly competent but soulless.

I was also bugged by the title "2nd best dancer after Natalie" rather than "best dancer after Natalie". I'm an incorrigible pedant when let loose late at night. So sorry

It sounds to me like you might enjoy a relaxing foot massage.

I need to take a bit more of a look at Patrick, he has eluded me so far.

No need to apologise. I've read elsewhere about what makes you enjoy dancing with a woman and so applied that to why Natalie might not feature as your fav dancer. I'm not part of the nat brigade.