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Dual-Tuner Freeview PVR Comparison


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Old 03-08-2005, 01:41
StuartB
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There's a Grundig twin coming out, see this post http://forum.digitalspy.co.uk/board/...d.php?t=256411 (sorry hyperlink edit tool seems to be broken on DS tonight). 150 Euros (£100) but not sure about an UK release. OSDs in English though.
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Old 13-08-2005, 07:25
The Eagle
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Emsee

Don't know whether you wish to update Panasonic TUTCH 100

Fan now only comes on (for about 20 minutes) at 12.05. According to Panasonic this is correct.
However the fan coming on at every 5 past each hour has been cured, but still comes on at random times (a couple of times a week) still at 5 minutes past the hour

I am surprised that it has a reliabilty marking of 2, especially compared to other PVRs. My Panasonic has certainly improved since the software update, pre that update I would have given it a marking of 5, since the update, now I think I could only give it 3 as it still misses recordings. However after the next update (late August) I think it will be perfect

With PIP it is worth mentioning that this can be used whilst watching a recording one can still view freeview channels. Some PVRs cannot do this.
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Old 13-08-2005, 08:54
David00
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Emsee

Very useful chart

You may be interested to know that Sagem have very cleverly? hidden the manual for the PVR 7280T in the manual for the PVR 6200T & 6600T.
Here- http://www.sagem.com/support/site/li...T_7280T_UK.pdf

This info will possibly help you to fill in some of the boxes in your comparison chart
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Old 13-08-2005, 10:27
PerryM
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Is there anybody that could add some (very) fringe area reception comparisons? I am interested in changing from a Humax to a 'Toppy' but my reception is barely usable as it is. (I'm officially in a 'not available' zone)
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Old 14-08-2005, 20:50
arh
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"confusing user interface" - simply cannot agree with that. It may be true to say "manual doesn't explain things very clearly" but the actual UI is fairly well structured and thought out.
I suppose it depends on what you mean by confusing. I find the thing damn hard to read at times, but that's probably down to the colours more than anything.

"slow response to remote" - that's just wrong. If there is a problem with the remote it is that the buttons are very cheap and nasty (they even squeak!) and it can be the case that you have to press twice to get it to register (it's also found by some, including me, to be very directional which exacerbates the problem). However when the boix registers a command from the remote (the LED flashes on the box) then response within the software is always virtually instantnaeous. So "slow response" is just plain wrong.
Just because that's not your experience it doesn't mean it's "plain wrong". I frequently find that the box can take well over a second to respond to commands (after the LED has blinked on the box). What usually happens is that I think that the key press hasn't registered so press it again and find myself where I don't want to be because it then processes the command several times.

[quote["No timer padding" - if it's going to say anything about that it's fairly important to say "no AUTOMATIC timer padding". You can pad manually - I ALWAYS do![/quote]

Fair comment, but you combine that with slow response from the remote and adding several programmes to the planner, which should be fairly quick and easy, actually becomes a right pain in the neck if you want to add padding as well.

My biggest beef was something that happened on the weekend. When you add a recording it wants to reserve the space at straight away. I had a few unwatched programmes, plus a few scheduled to record for the next couple of weeks, but it wouldn't let me schedule a programme for later that night because it couldn't reserve the space, even though there was only a few hours of recordings actually on the disk. I had to go in and delete some of other scheduled recordings and put them back in the following day.

I've only had my FVRT100 for about a month and it only took a week to start getting on my nerves.
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Old 15-08-2005, 11:15
CJL
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Originally Posted by arh
Just because that's not your experience it doesn't mean it's "plain wrong". I frequently find that the box can take well over a second to respond to commands (after the LED has blinked on the box).
Did you know that if the Fusion hard drive is having disk write problems then it enters a sort of "sticky toffee" mode where all operations take a considerable amount of time (presumably because of disk read/write timeouts/retries?). I've experienced this when having problems during HDD upgrades but now have a very reliable 160GB disk and don't get slow remote operation at all.

I guess what I'm saying is that if yours is slow to respond it (could!) be something to do with a disk problem.

A properly working Fusion just isn't slow to respond to remote commands such as when setting timers/padding/etc.

(hence my previous comment that you quoted)

Cliff
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Old 15-08-2005, 11:38
Ang
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Originally Posted by CJL
Did you know that if the Fusion hard drive is having disk write problems then it enters a sort of "sticky toffee" mode where all operations take a considerable amount of time (presumably because of disk read/write timeouts/retries?). I've experienced this when having problems during HDD upgrades but now have a very reliable 160GB disk and don't get slow remote operation at all.

I guess what I'm saying is that if yours is slow to respond it (could!) be something to do with a disk problem.

A properly working Fusion just isn't slow to respond to remote commands such as when setting timers/padding/etc.

(hence my previous comment that you quoted)

Cliff
I agree, and mine is very quick to respond (original hard drive). It is only the calendar key that sometimes takes a bit longer than you'd expect, but the hourglass appears in the upper left immediately so I know I've pushed the button.
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Old 15-08-2005, 13:28
poshmoggy
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Originally Posted by CJL
Did you know that if the Fusion hard drive is having disk write problems then it enters a sort of "sticky toffee" mode where all operations take a considerable amount of time (presumably because of disk read/write timeouts/retries?). I've experienced this when having problems during HDD upgrades but now have a very reliable 160GB disk and don't get slow remote operation at all.

I guess what I'm saying is that if yours is slow to respond it (could!) be something to do with a disk problem.


A properly working Fusion just isn't slow to respond to remote commands such as when setting timers/padding/etc.

(hence my previous comment that you quoted)

Cliff
Do you regularly format your drive to keep it working quickly?

If so, does this revert the software to 1.6.3?

Also, you've got a 160GB drive in it? What make and model? And have you had to upgrade your power supply?
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Old 15-08-2005, 15:29
CJL
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PM,

Nope I've never formatted the Samsung 160GB since I fitted it to the Fusion in about March (I've even still got a couple of Wallace & Gromits on it that I recorded on virtually the first day of operation!). Since then it has virtually filled and seldom has more than 10% free. In fact I keep taking it to 0% and then back again. In all that time speed of operation has never been a problem and I've never felt the need to reformat it (too much to lose!).

It's kind of a testament to the 4TV/ST disk operating system that it works so well without obvious fragmentation despite heavy use operating it close to capacity all the time.

See the Fusion hard drive upgrade thread for details of my 160GB HDD (that's just 128GB useable by the way!). Like almost everyone else I went for a Samsung Spinpoint SP1604N for an initial upgrade but despite working with Ash to get the firmware downgrade that would make it work for everyone else (see my page at http://www.ourcottage.plus.com/samsung/) I could never get it to work for me so in the end I'm using a Seagate ST3160023A with an external PSU

Cliff
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Old 18-08-2005, 12:08
scottbown
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Hi all,

I've been looking for a Twin Freeveiw tuner PVR for a few months now and I've been disappointed with the offerings. The Toppfield looks good, but is expensive and there's no way to try before you buy. Also read a review in home cinema mag which poo pooed it.

I had a search around and heard rumours about the Humax PVR9200T. I contacted Humax (sales-info@humax-digital.co.uk) they confirmed it is due for release end of September 2005 and will cost approx £230. It will also be available in John Lewis, Comet etc

Humax also supplied me with some nice specs:
- Twin tuner Personal Video Recorder
- 160GB Hard Disc(100 Hours of recording)
- Live Pause & TSR (Time shifted recording)
- Recording two channels whilest watching a live TV
- Trick play (Pause, Play, Fast fiorwardm, Fast rewind, Replay, Skip)
- Plug & Play
- 8 days Electronic programme guide
- Easy record scheduleing in EPG
- One touch instant recoding
- RF modulators/Twin scarts(Scart cable included)
- USB 2.0 connectivity for PC
- Mpeg AV file transfer between PVR and PC
- Digital Photo album and MP3 play
- A/V file editing ( Split or Delete an appointed parts)
- Dolby digital 5.1 optical output
- PIP (Picture in Picture)
- VFD display
- 5 fabourite channel groups
- No need loopthru to 2nd tuner ( Internal 2nd tuner)
- Software Upgrade via OAD and serial connection (RS-232)
- Digital Teletext and DVB subtitle
- Over 30 FREE TV channels
- Common Interface (TopUpTV Caompatibale)
+more Hardware specs. I've uploaded it to my website feel free to download it http://www.scottbown.co.uk/Humax_PVR98000T_Specs.pdf

Sounds good eh? (although an ethernet port would have been nice, no pleasing some people )

Could this be the one we've all been waiting for?

What to others think?

Scott
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Old 18-08-2005, 12:18
Boinng
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Originally Posted by scottbown
- Recording two channels whilest watching a live TV
It seems implausible, but is it possible that Humax have again ommitted to include the ability to watch an old recording while recording something else? It only mentions watching live TV while recording here, which is just like the 8000 (albeit with two tuners recording rather than one).
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Old 18-08-2005, 12:32
creddish
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Originally Posted by Boinng
It seems implausible, but is it possible that Humax have again ommitted to include the ability to watch an old recording while recording something else? It only mentions watching live TV while recording here, which is just like the 8000 (albeit with two tuners recording rather than one).
Surely they would not make that mistake again would they.?Had the 8000 not had that shortcoming I suspect it would be the most popular PVR. In fact it may still be the most popular even with that limitation. The Pricerunner site shows it as most popular:-

http://www.pricerunner.co.uk/sound-a...trial&a_2345=1

Colin
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Old 18-08-2005, 12:35
rhubarbe
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If it ends up being any better than the Toppy I'll get my wife to eat my hat.

RE mag review: some of us have serious doubts that the reviewer bothered to go into "settings" and change the scart output to RGB. Imagine, if he'd had it set to "composite" what a horrible picture he'd have got.......... Picture quality on my Toppy is stunning.

Toppy is going to be stocked by Euronics centres, so presently there will be loads of places locally where you can go and see one being demonstrated.
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Old 18-08-2005, 12:50
CJL
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Originally Posted by scottbown
- Recording two channels whilest watching a live TV
Usually that would suggest THREE tuners unless they're doing the Toppy cleverness of allowing you to view another thing on the same Muxes as the two recordings that are already hogging the two tuners.

Maybe it's an error and meant to say "record two, watch library" ? Though if it can't do THAT it does seem like a shot in the foot.

Cliff
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Old 18-08-2005, 12:52
rhubarbe
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Maybe that's why it hasn't been released.....
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Old 24-08-2005, 15:22
bampsam
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Originally Posted by rhubarbe
Maybe that's why it hasn't been released.....
Just a thought...........your site still shows Unbeatable prices?Nothing to do with the quote above!
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Old 24-08-2005, 16:26
Markycauli
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Originally Posted by rhubarbe
If it ends up being any better than the Toppy I'll get my wife to eat my hat.

Toppy is going to be stocked by Euronics centres, so presently there will be loads of places locally where you can go and see one being demonstrated.
I think it has something to do with the Toppy price tag that it has always got to be the best, and it always will be by some who will always find that PiP function, watch third channel or a TAP that they like makes it 'better' in their terms. Thats OK.

Thats fine if it justifys the expenditure. For me, I just want a quiet PVR that can record 2 things and has a good EPG which is very user friendly and is good value. Under these terms only the Humax has the 'capability' to fulfill my requirements. If it does it will be the best for me.

Dont think the Toppy will ever be the market leader in volume sales, but it will probably always be on the expensive side unless they really want to attack the market.
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Old 24-08-2005, 16:52
pulledplonker
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as good as you champion the Humax, its all academic until it goes to production. Then do the comparison, not speculate on "press releases" which are notorious for over hyping the product.
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Old 24-08-2005, 17:51
Markycauli
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Agreed. Although my expectations of 2 tuners with good EPG wish list is not pushing the boat out too much really given they already have good EPG on previous 8000T.
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Old 24-08-2005, 21:22
rhubarbe
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But wasn't that all that the guys on the cursed other thread wanted, all those months ago?
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Old 25-08-2005, 08:50
pulledplonker
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I can't see that they can produce all on the list at the price they claim, when other more competative companies can't (see inverto/topfield/fusion) humax isn't that different from paying for staff, promotions, materials
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Old 25-08-2005, 09:42
CJL
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Originally Posted by pulledplonker
when other more competative companies can't (see inverto/topfield/fusion) humax isn't that different from paying for staff, promotions, materials
Not entirely sure I understand what makes those little companies "more competitive" than a larger company with the component buying power of Humax. The fact is that THEY are over-priced and Humax seem to be offering the 9200 at a "realistic" price. Good on 'em - I say - should put the cat amongst the pigeons!

Cliff
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Old 25-08-2005, 10:55
pulledplonker
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i dont think Humax is as large a company as you envisage. I dont think Topfield/, Inverto (lemon) and Fusion are as small as you think. I think you have based yourself on advertising penetration. but we'll see when it comes out!
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Old 25-08-2005, 11:10
CJL
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PP,

Have a look at:

http://www.humaxdigital.com/global/a...04_English.pdf

Global revenue of $1billion and products in 90 countries is not MY idea of a small company.

Cliff
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Old 25-08-2005, 13:37
pulledplonker
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just says they are confident of a 1 billion revenue by 2006, so i guess they haven't confirmed this then? maybe it was written by the fella who wrote the release dates for the products
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