Implementing VideoPlus wouldn't be cheap - it requires licensing fees. It wouldn't be simple, either - many of the digital channels don't have VideoPlus codes, and so they'd have to make arrangements with GemStar to create them; the codes themselves would rapidly end up over-long, because of the number of channels and start times (which is why a different algorithm is used for the UK codes). And, of course, you'd have different codes necessary for Freeview and Sky, due to differing channel numbers.

VideoPlus is a complete non-starter for systems like Freeview and Sky; that's what the EPG is there for.

Incidentally, you keep throwing out statistics Barry; in another thread you made confident assertions about how many of TUTV's subscribers are on special offers, here you're quoting figures about PVR sales, saying how much adding digital technology to kit would cost the manufacturers, and telling us you know what the ordinary person wants.

Care to explain who you are and how you know all these things? Do you have some industry or market research background that provides you with all this useful information?

Nigel.

Umm where exactly? The lowest I know of are about £25 retail and at that price they're often end of line dumped stock.

By the way Gemstar, the originators of VideoPlus, recognised that VideoPlus was not sufficient for this EPG driven age which is why they developed Guide+ which is a FAR better system for setting recordings than VideoPlus!! (http://www.europe.gemstartvguide.com...guideplus.html)

Cliff
(who works for Amstrad who consider/use a lot of these things and who knows about component costings)

Its perfectly possible to build in an STB for £10. Remember thats cost price.

If you take Retail STB and take out the Retail Packaging, PSU, Cables, Case etc which account for most of the cost you can see that £10 is easilly possible.

Yes but whatever you pay for BOM at cost price, it's the end user (inc VAT and everything price) the customer is interested in. Whether you put a digital tuner in a separate plastic box or bury it within the guts of a telly you are hard pressed to make this availble to the end customer for much less than £30 (maybe £25 at a pinch). You may only be paying £8-10 for the components but your (valid) argument was why do iDTVs cost £80 more than their analogue equivalents and I'm saying that the hike in the RETAIL price should only be £25-£30 and that a hike of just £10 is not achievable (though I guess you do save a BIT by leaving out the analogue tuner)

Cliff

Hi, can this discussion be taken to a new thread? A bit OT for this one. thanks

I've downloaded both Excel comparison tables but both links produce the same dual tuner/dual record table. The single record table appears to be inaccesible...

Both tables are on the spreadsheet - just click the tab in the bottom left to change the view.

Doh!

Thanks.

Update to Humax PVR-9200T info...

Additional Function and Fixed Problem

PGXTF 1.00.04 - 29 MAR 2006

1. Fixed hang up problem with BBC services
2. Fixed no sound problem on recordings.
3. Improved radio recordings from Standby.
4. Improved editing scheduled recordings.
5. Fixed MP3 Playback problem on the SPDIF connection.

Addresses...

* Sometimes doesn't record radio programmes from timer if unit

* Some people have experianced no sound on

Also incorrect statements...

* Can't start watching programme while it's still being recorded

... I can watch programmes while they are being recorded!

Resume playback from where you left off

This was added to the top field natively in the decumbent update

5.12.25, 2005-12-08 (December update)

This firmware was released in December, and made available as an OTA update. No serious issues have been reported, and it appears to be fairly stable. It offers improved reliability of dual recordings, compared to the previous version, and changes to the MHEG engine, including an option to disable interactive services completely. Additionally, this firmware provides a resume playback feature, where pressing Play in the Archive list will resume playback from the previous position; pressing OK plays from the start, as before.

Can you add a line for "Pattern Match Recording" i.e. recording based on keywords. Various addon TAPs for Toppy offer this and its a big differentiation factor over other boxes. You could also call it "Series Link" if you like.

If you do add this then I'd vote for "Recording based on keywords" as even a dunderhead like me understands what that means while "pattern match recording" is beyond me (well it was until I read the next sentence! ). I guess the 9200 also qualifies a bit in that it has a keyword EPG search facility.

(I would steer clear of "series link" though or we'll never hear the end of it from the Tivo owners! )

Cliff

You are too modest Cliff


lol; Or even more worryingly their legal department.

Richard

Will the 9200 actually store the search and record anything that comes onto the EPG in future days ? If it does then agree qualifies, otherwise not.

No it just lets you find things to record in the EPG data but it's not as good as some Toppy TAPS or a Tivo but it's better than nothing (as (not) found in most PVRs) so probably deserves a mention I think as a differentiator between PVRs

Cliff

New info for Thomson DHD4000

Price + £100
Rewind live TV = up to 2 hours
Lock Recordings = N
Volume Control Scart Output = Y
VCR scart output = CVBS only
Current Firmware = 2.3.9
Chase Play = now starts at beginning of recording
Timer Slots = limited by the estimated time free i.e. (saved recordings) + (scheduled recordings) - (recordings scheduled for deletion)
Scheduled Recordings = can now be edited

Other annoyance = scheduled archiving via the s-video and RCA audio sockets, does not output the audio [ not sure how widespread this is, but mine does ]

Just a suggestion. I see that some of the twin tuners have issues with poor signal strength/quality. It would be good to have some form of tuner sensitivity added to the comparison chart.

I only have around 42% Strength, but usually >80% quality, and I occasionally get blips (RF Interference) on Channel 4 and others on that Mux, (particularly when my son uses his toy drill!). I'm told the NetGem I-Player has a sensitive tuner, which is why I get consistent picture normally.

I'm in the market for a twin tuner PVR, but I'm a huge window shopper in that I want to evaluate all aspects before I purchase. I don't want to find that my chosen model actually won't work because my signal strength is too low.

I think this signal strength thing has come up before and I think the problem is the different boxes do not use a common standard for their strength /quality readouts. 60% on one is not the same as 60% on another.

Richard

I understand. Of course, manufacturers use different ways of indicating the signal strength and the type of tuner makes a difference too.

Perhaps I'll ask a separate question in the main area about a couple of specific models.

Thanks
Charles

Can You add a column for Does is allow Scart Input from external source? Are there any that do?

It would be "NO" in every column. None of them do because to do so requires an MPEG encoder silicon and an MPEG encoder royalty. No "PVR" has this but every DVD recorder DOES - so if you want to make digital recording of an external analogue SCART source what you need is a DVDR not a PVR

Cliff

Nothing stopping someone bringing one out then is there - if a £70 DVDR can include the encoder and royalty then so can a PVR.

Do these HDD/DVDR combos allow SCART recording to the HDD?

This has been discussed here before, at some length. It's not as straightforward, or such a wonderful idea, as it may at first appear. If you want the reasons, I suggest you have a trawl through the forum...


Yes.

Had a trawl, and found out that Humax have had such a unit since last year, and may release it later this year in the UK.

Surely there is no fundamental reason these devices cannot be produced, it is just the availability of particular chipsets at this particular moment in time that make it not quite so cost effective, but chipsets are being developed all the time to provide desired solutions.

What is the Humex model and does anyone have experience in using one (what the external input like on recording) Costs? p.s. - can't find link in forum