I did earmark Patrick out when the line up was announced as being possibly one of the better male celebs with potential to become a good dancer because I'd seen him perform on 'Let's dance for comic relief'. I think the producers would have known he had some potential because they do audition/interview the celebs. Is it that surprising that he doesn't have as much support as the younger celebs though? Generally even if an older celeb gets to the latter stages - their fan bases/support aren't as strong as the younger celebs.

The surprise for me this series though is the level of Susanna's support - she seems to be very popular. It's been discussed on another thread but I think it's a case of more people being able to relate to her.

Newbie here hope I'm doing this properly. Somehow I think it will be an all girl final this year shame really as it would be a bit boring

Nice to see a new poster I kind of agree what made the the years that Kara and Alesha won more exciting were they had male competitors who you knew could put up a decent challenge and there was an uncertainty about who would win right up to the finals.

Thanks for the welcome . I can't see Patrick getting through this week despite the judges marks

I thought Louis was a worthy winner. He did get a lot of stick on these forums though.

Me too, and they have been my favourites from the beginning.

I know it's not the same thing but an Olympic Gymnast being described as having two left feet makes me laugh.

Yes even if Susanna is in the dance off with him which I can't see happening because she seems to have lots of support, but if it did - I doubt very much they'd save him over her. The same applies to Sophie. It would be a very unpopular decision to eliminate either of those two just so they can have a token male in the finals.

He and Anya looked gutted to be in the dance off - they must have realised their public support was very low compared to the others to go from joint top of the LB to landing in the dance off. I really like Patrick and Anya but the over marking on Saturday night did them no favours.

I find it interesting that Patrick doesn't come over better on the VTs and on ITT. It may be editing, but I wonder whether like a number of actors that I've met, he's quite shy when not acting a role?

I backed Flavia last year and I'm backing Anya this year.

[But seriously, the pros are more interesting, famous and skilled than the so-called "celebrities")

lolz

true dat

"purposely cast weaker males" - that's a bit insulting to women, isn't it?

Do women only win when males are "weak"??

For me whoever wins must be a good dancer, irrespective of gender. I consider gender as irrelevant as a person's religion when it comes to dancing well. Sure, women and men take different roles on the dance floor - but for both to succeed the routines are equally demanding.

I honestly hadn't thought about the number of males versus number of women on SCD. I was simply very keen to see some brilliant dancing, male or female. But now you've mentioned it, isn't it about time men accepted the few occasions that women are the majority, 'cos sure as hell women have had to accept imposed male dominance for a very long time.

There is a gender imbalance in the number of judges, so who is complaining about that? No one. It's only when men lose a little of their dominant status that someone has to whine about it.

How is it insulting to women? Look at the male line up for this years Strictly and ask yourself could any of those realistically been contenders for the glitterball, and I say that as someone who actually liked most of the male line up.

And no females don't only win when males are 'weak' - see my earlier post about when Kara and Alesha won and this year they had a female winner on 'Dancing on Ice' who managed to win against quite a strong male line up - she was up against two males in the finals, which is why I think it's sad the producers on strictly didn't cast at least a few male contenders with potential to make it to the finals.

How on earth was anybody to know that the males this year would not excel? Or that the females would be so much better? Every year it is a mystery - that's the fun of SCD!

I really thought someone like Ben, or Julien, would be good - but it turned out I couldn't bear to watch either of them, they so lacked rhythm and momentum.

I cannot remember Kara or Alesha, of past contests I only really remember Mark (and Karen), and Chelsee (and Pasha), who were truly astonishing. Considering they both started from nothing, who could predict that they would be so good?

Fairly easy to tell just by looking at someone's posture and their walk. The producers had met them all and they chose them to be ringahs to come third, duds to do lifts or wear lion costumes; and a few with a chance of winning and g his generate ratings.

Remember Mark was a cricketer so used to being balanced and getting his arms and feet in position. But learning choreography was a problem early on.

I don't agree.

Why should Craig call Abbey "the biggest surprise of this entire competition.."? Simple: because he cannot predict how she - how anybody! - is going to turn out.

You have indicated your conspiracy theories. Carry on with them! I prefer the plain truth - that no one can predict how brilliant some individuals will turn out to be - or how hopeless.

In additition to what henry said - it's the producers job to know whether they've got potential to go the distance - they audition and interview the celebs. Do you really think someone like Ben who has a muscular frame and hearing disability would excel at dance? I'm not knocking what he achieved on Strictly I actually think he did quite well all things considering but he was never going to be a great dancer.

Do you really think someone like Ashley who had a hectic work schedule and impending fatherhood for the second time would have had enough time for training? Again I'm not knocking him, in the circumstances I think he did ok and I think he really could have been contender if his producers at Hollyoaks had given him some time off so he could devote more time to training but he didn't and the Strictly producers should have known that - or I suspect they did know and didn't care!

I thought Julien would be good too because I'd heard he'd done some dancing in his youth but even then I didn't consider him a contender because he's a marmite character and not many middle aged celebs on striclty have turned out to have huge support - as it turned out he was marmite, unpopular and a poor dancer.

I don't agree, who knows what candidates said or did at their auditions? They could have been begging to appear, for all I know, and genuinely promoting their dancing potential!

Again, it is Conspiracy Theory v. the Plain Truth. As I said, Craig had no idea he would be so impressed with Abbey, and I reckon the other judges are just as prepared to be surprised.

You are going to great lengths to justify the men's poor results. Trouble is, I don't understand why a "muscular frame", for example, should inhibit a grown man from throwing himself into the rhythm and the music and I don't think the judges do either! I see no substantial difference between Ben's frame and Robin's or Artem's.

I meant to say too (but I was temporarily called away from my pc) that being overworked etc. (as in Ashley's case for example) is not really a good excuse for being a poor dancer. Dancing is fundamentally about instinct and surrendering to the rhythm and beat - and letting them take over one's body. That ultimately makes it very RELAXING, and EASY to do. And most importantly, it is therapeutic. Good for the body and the mind.

I haven't posted a 'concpiracy theory' - just as you haven't posted 'the plain truth'. All we're doing is exchanging views and opinions on how we think the strictly producers select a cast. I don't think any of us are privy to what acutally happens - we can only speculate.

I only responded to your post because you seemed to jump down a poster's throat for daring to suggest that the producers had deliberately picked a poor male line up because they wanted a female winner. All I did was asked you to consider how the current male line up had performed.

Is it so hard to believe that celebs audition for Strictly and that producers would recognise which celebs would be good, average, poor etc? If you want to believe that celebs are radomly chosen that's fine - I don't think anything I could say would change your mind.

As for Artem and Robin they are trained dancers - Ben isn't and with the short time of training and his hearing disablity which I mentioned I don't think it was possible for him to excel at dance - he had has a similar rugby man's frame to Kenny Logan - who never became a great dancer either although he did quite well and was very entertaining.

So you think the fact that he seemed knackered most of the time on his VTs didn't contribue to some of the below par/average performances? Sorry but that's just nonsense. You can't just turn up become a good dancer without sufficient training. Yes you do have to have some talent but if a celeb doesn't have the time, energy and discipline to devote to training - then they're not going to turn up on Saturday night and put on a great performance.

In one's own leisure time perhaps, but not with the constraints and pressures of this show. Not the same thing at all.
In fact I doubt any of the celebs find it RELAXING and EASY to learn choreography in less than a week and perform it in front of millions. Sorry it's a very strange view

You 'haven't posted a conspiracy theory'? Then why are you supporting one of the arguments behind this thread, which certainly is a Conspiracy Theory, based on the idea that " the producers purposely cast weaker males" in order to obtain a female winner?

BTW, I am not convinced that hearing disability prevents people responding to rhythm. At school I had a friend who was deaf and she definitely could respond to rhythm, and dance to it. And what about Evelyn Glennie, the world-renowned percussionist who is deaf? Arguably, she responds to rhythm better than most.

What is this if it is not a Conspiracy Theory?