Which one is the pro and which the celeb Nina?

The woman is the celebrity. I don't know her background though - she's obviously had some training

Ballet judging by her ability to do a perfect arabesque and get her leg up to her armpits! I will have a detailed look.

Just had a quick check on Wiki. She was a professional cheerleader.

And as for her flexibility...I seem to remember her Paso consisting of: walk, walk, high kick, stomp, stomp, high kick

Aaarghhh! I know. I am so with you on this!

The kicks and flicks thing gets up my nose, and having people claim they see lots of AT in each routine when those of us who actually dance it are at loss to find any!

Maybe they are all watching show tango extreme or variations thereon?

Lordy I hated that!

She has a fabulous face but I doubt she'd have gone far in ballet. Her legs are too short and not balanced with her torso. However, she has had dance training. She can find her axis and finishes really well. I could be wrong: I've never heard of her.

EDIT: dance training - cheerleader so I guess we are talking stage dance with los of eyes and teeth. Yup.

Godawful routine though *barf*!

Could you guys take a look at this and critique it?

First off it from DWTS (so of course points deducted off the top and I know he has made many mistakes but where does he go wrong? His pro is blindfolded so he doesn't have her visual cues to help him. No dance experience from this celeb and he is a race car driver. I am curious as to what is wrong in this routine. Thanks. I know it will be torn apart but I am still interested to know the specifics.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z5zwCjbD_Ps

I did see this one and thought it was very atmospheric and creative routine. I have no idea of the technical merits (if any).

I don't watch DWTS so these were quite interesting to see.Of the two I prefered James whatsit to Melissa whatsit in terms of how Argentine Tangoey it felt. But that is just personal taste.

Both and most SCD ATs give me the same problem they get overly focused on adornos and tricks and there is precious little dancing linking them together. Its a bit like me offereing you some cake. You would expect some sort of spongy baked stuff made of flour, eggs, sugar etc. To make it interesting I might throw in some sultanas or nuts or spice or maybe a cherry or two. If i really wanted to impress you I might bake in cherries, nuts AND sultanas. But if I were to just give you a pile of cherries, sultanas and nuts when offering a slice of cake I think you may feel a bit cheated. Thats how I feel about the AT in these shows.

It also makes it hard to critique because all that we get is Argentinesque poses and I am not sure how to evaluate that anymore than I would know how to judge the Mona Lisa construcated from pieces of toast. http://www.mrbreakfast.com/breakfast...n3-390x466.jpg At a glance it looks like the real thing.

Having said that Melissa is very athletic and she did the tricks well. At about 45 seconds there are a series of sacadas and they do seem to be genuiine displacements. The essence of a sacada is that the lead leads the lady to leave her axis point and at the very split second she changes weight and leaves that axis point, he places his foot in the exact spot she left. When done quickly and with split second timing it gives a visual illusion of legs being kicked out of the way. He is genuinely occupying her vacated axis point which is impressive.

The James-dance I prefered despite the blind fold and he does some walking too. His forward walks aren't bad but his backwards walks at about 1 min 10 secs you could drive a bus between his legs (not good). I think the reason this dance is more evocative is the music. You would have to be made of stone not to feel a tingle listening to that track.

Thank you for your cake analogy - was definitely an interesting insight into how hollow AT can look on these shows!

The sacadas you mentioned did look impressive to me, especially for a beginner. Equally for the hooks (ganchos?), she seemed to perform them quickly and precisely.

A shame it didn't contain enough recognisable elements to be a real AT - because it's one of few celebrity performances that I've found truly goose bump-inducing (maybe I have low standards )

I don't think there is anything wrong with yoru standards Nina. Dance is after all subjective and it was a well performed, well choreographed routine, what's not to like. My only issue with it is that it is misleading because it flies under the AT flag. But then I bet I have loved Viennese Waltzes or Foxtrots that are fairly far removed from the genuine article. Certainly when it comes to Paso I tend to be happy if I get all the trimmings, give me fire, flamenco, man in gold trimmed bolero (Traje de Luces), guitar, castenets and I am like a pig in muck.

I watched the ganchos and enganches (yes - hooks and hitches) several times at half and quarter speed but with the camera angle I really can't tell if they are properly constriucted or just pasted on so to speak.

Yes, I'm sure it can be irksome to watch bastardised versions of something you love and have dedicated a lot of time to.

I'm certainly ignorant to a lot of the technique required for the dances on Strictly - so tend to base my judgement primarily on how it made me feel watching it.

Which to be fair is all that matters. That is what art is supposed to do and dance is art. My take, for the dances I do, is that I don't care so much about how it looks but how it makes me feel. But I am at odds with many of my dance chums on that. But I guess what this says is that I am a social dancer and not a would be performer. This I knew anyway

FYI, the only Pro on DWTS who has studied AT - and she did it after she started doing DWTS, but was so taken with it that she continues - was Cheryl Burke.

I don't know if she is still a Pro on the show. However, the quality of her AT's would have to vary depending on the abilities of her Celeb partner.

I'd suggest looking for some of her dances on Youtube to see if she was able to bring more to her choreography due to having studied it, or if the Show's values over rode choreographic integrity.

Perhaps the AT dancers could have a look at this one too? https://youtu.be/rfgp6r2rYU8

Pop/hip-hop singer with extensive tap experience.

Looked very clean and sharp to me, looked like some nice sacadas and ganchos (look at me, pretending to know anything ) Question is, does it look like a real AT to those in the know?

Just in case anybody is inspired to take up Argentine Tango in the new year just so as to manage expectations:

1> The bloke makes the choreography up live on listening to the music

2> There is a sustained close embrace, chest to chest, throughout the dance. Though some people and places are more liberal on this. Disconnected bits (soltadas) are sniggered at in most places.

3> The lead / choreography is transmitted though gentle movements of the bloke's chest.

4> The arms / hands don't come into play

5> There are NO lifts allowed. Definitely get you banned.

6> Kicks / Ganchos can get you banned at some milongas. Maybe a sneaky one or two in a 3:30 minute song. In any event they are not kicks. Think of a gymnast against a bar - the legs just swing through on meeting an obstacle and swing back and not kick.

Probably a few other things.

Here are a couple of professional couples dance. These are some of my favourite Argentine Tango dance performances. I smile continuously watching them. This is what I am trying to emulate. And they'll tone it down a lot if they dance socially on a crowded dance floor.

Tango

https://youtu.be/2A03_VhrbIE

https://youtu.be/Mq43RQKICeE

Tango Vals (elegant waltz)

https://youtu.be/uhKYNBmL15M

Tango Milonga (more fun)

https://youtu.be/8fut41L4Be0

Very different from anything ever seen on Strictly isn't it? But very addictive. This weekend I'll dance about 15 hours in 5 milongas (social dances). I'll be knackered both physically and mentally. It gets really intense especially trying to interpret some of the music. But really enjoyable.

This is not to "diss" anything on Strictly. It is all very good fun. But very different from real world Argentine Tango.

I've posted it just to manage expectations should you be inspired to take it up and expect to kick and lift or be lifted. But others have posted something very similar above.

Do take it up and report back.