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Sherlock - BBC Drama (Part 3)


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Old 02-01-2017, 15:35
Versailles
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well I enjoyed it but they totally ruined the death scene by doing that absurd slow-mo bullet thing and her jumping in front of it , it ruined the reality of the moment .

.

btw - did we ever see the other 2 members of AGRA ?
We saw the one who was tortured to death. Or at least we saw his shadow.
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Old 02-01-2017, 15:36
anyonefortennis
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We saw the one who was tortured to death. Or at least we saw his shadow.
That was the same guy who escaped.
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Old 02-01-2017, 15:37
Versailles
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That was the same guy who escaped.
No? We saw what he saw. Unless it's another way of filming which I am too old to understand. That he is seeing his own shadow or soemthing like that..
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Old 02-01-2017, 15:38
Baz_James
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Definitely not Mary. Sian Brooke is credited as Elizabeth, rather than E, and it definitely looks like Sian.

Judging by newspaper photos she has scenes with Benedict Cumberbatch so I expect the meeting between E and Watson was no coincidence and will be part of the plot in the next two episodes.
Yes. Again. I didn't say it was Mary. I said it was someone deliberately chosen to resemble Mary.
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Old 02-01-2017, 15:40
Baz_James
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No? We saw what he saw. Unless it's another way of filming which I am too old to understand. That he is seeing his own shadow or soemthing like that..
Nah, you're alright. It was indeed the escapee's view of his erstwhile colleague being tortured.
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Old 02-01-2017, 15:49
Takae
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Really? Take another look. There's one shot where it's almost impossible to believe that it's not her, especially when the nonsense on the airplane is clearly there to suggest that Mary is capable of a disguise so effective that even her own husband couldn't see through it (we know that Sherlock is and she's clearly meant to be a match for him in the spy skills department).
The bus woman isn't Mary in disguise.

There are speculations that the bus woman may be working for Toby Jones's character named

(major spoiler)
Spoiler
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Old 02-01-2017, 15:59
iamian
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Lady Smallwood was in 3:3, I presume because Magnussen had some dirt on her? She was complicit in the cover-up but I'm confused as to what her part was in the AGRA plot.
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Old 02-01-2017, 16:02
Takae
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btw - did we ever see the other 2 members of AGRA ?
Gabriel and Alex were masked, so we never saw their faces. I think Mary was the only one who pulled her mask up during the embassy scenes.

Gabriel was killed at the embassy. Ajay and Alex were captured and tortured during their imprisonment. Ajay was the one in the chair and Alex's shadow can be seen on a wall. Ajay later said they tortured Alex to death. "I can still hear the sound of his back breaking."
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Old 02-01-2017, 16:04
Baz_James
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Lady Smallwood was in 3:3, I presume because Magnussen had some dirt on her? She was complicit in the cover-up but I'm confused as to what her part was in the AGRA plot.
She was responsible for calling AGRA in to save the ambassador. Norbury revealed the plan to the terrorists using the codeword 'amo' so that if the treachery was discovered it would point to Smallwood, whose codename is Love.
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Old 02-01-2017, 16:05
Baz_James
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The bus woman isn't Mary in disguise.

There are speculations that the bus woman may be working for Toby Jones's character named

(major spoiler)
Spoiler
And, once again, I didn't say she was!
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Old 02-01-2017, 16:13
performingmonk
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I think it would be best if the bus woman wasn't working for anyone, that it's simply a moment of weakness for John and she was JUST being nice (she doesn't know he's married so it's not her fault), that's it.

It's good that Mary is dead...but what a mess of an episode to get to that point! I thought the first 30 minutes were GREAT but then, as soon as we realise the story is going to be about Mary, it all goes to hell... Everything involving Sherlock was brilliant (and we are even seeing an evolution of the character, with him becoming more 'human', him berating Mycroft over his reaction to the baby being the most telling sign), but the rest.....?
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Old 02-01-2017, 16:14
gashead
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And, once again, I didn't say she was!
But neither were we necessarily meant to think she was, as you insist. I think you're the only one who made that leap, which you're trying to convince others of, hence why people think you think she might be Mary. She isn't, and chances are that was never intended.
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Old 02-01-2017, 16:21
gashead
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I think it would be best if the bus woman wasn't working for anyone, that it's simply a moment of weakness for John and she was JUST being nice (she doesn't know he's married so it's not her fault), that's it.
BIB - she (supposedly) didn't initially, but she does now. John told her he wasn't available, so who knows what will happen.

Thinking about it, she gave John her number, but he didn't give her his, so when he texted her with 'Hi', he knew who he was sending it to, but she wouldn't know who it came from, which makes her reply of 'Hi' a bit strange. Nice and friendly, but to a stranger nonetheless. Floozie.
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Old 02-01-2017, 16:21
Cylinder
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Seems I've been watching it wrong all these years! I didn't realise it was meant to be a documentary! I thought it was meant to be fictional comedy drama. My mistake.
I get that, obviously.
But there comes a point were it crosses the line and becomes ridiculous.
Like in this episode, in my view.
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Old 02-01-2017, 16:24
dearmrman
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Yes, it is lower than a snake's belly, but unfortunately it's all too common. Without getting too 'Relate' about it, sex is often the last thing on many new mum's minds, whereas men tend to want to get back to it asap. The trouble for me is that they never gave any hint of that, or indeed any reason why John would want to cheat. He's meant to be the most noble and upstanding of men, yet here he is seemingly fooling around with someone who just accosted him at the bus stop. The nature of that encounter suggests there most be more to it than simple 'adultery'. A set-up/ honey-trap of some sort.
That is assuming that it is in the same timeline when Mary was alive....it could quiet easily be after the event of Mary's death...showing John been able to move on with his life, though still seeing images of Mary all around him.

With regards to the texts, that could quiet easily have been Sherlock.
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Old 02-01-2017, 16:35
Cylinder
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Perhaps in the following episodes, we'll find out why Mary chose to sacrifice herself for Sherlock?
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Old 02-01-2017, 16:38
Virgil Tracy
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I thought the bus woman looked like Mary too .

can I ask a coupla questions -

how did the whole meeting between Sherlock and the Receptionist at the aquarium come about ?

and what was the point of Mary drugging Sherlock to go off and do what ?
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Old 02-01-2017, 16:52
gashead
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That is assuming that it is in the same timeline when Mary was alive....it could quiet easily be after the event of Mary's death...showing John been able to move on with his life, though still seeing images of Mary all around him.
True. With this show, you can't always be sure that what you're seeing is as it appears to be.

With regards to the texts, that could quiet easily have been Sherlock.
Again, it's possible, but Sherlock and John have never struck me as having the sort of bromance where they spontaneously text 'Hi' to each other. I think we were also shown John either thinking back and/ or reading the girl's number, so I believe we were certainly meant to assume it was to her.

how did the whole meeting between Sherlock and the Receptionist at the aquarium come about ?

and what was the point of Mary drugging Sherlock to go off and do what ?
Q1: Do you mean why the receptionist, or why the aquarium? I can't remember why the aquarium (although since it was one of the receptionist's favourite places, it may have been her idea), but Sherlock twigged it was her after Lady Whatsit was adamant it wasn't her that betrayed AGRA. Sherlock put English Lady + is privvy to all Lady Whatsit's meetings + Mary's remark that receptionists know everything together and came up with the receptionist.

Q2: She drugged him simply to be able to get away with the USB stick he had. Her plan was to disappear, but John and Sherlock had put a tracker on the USB stick. As you do.
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Old 02-01-2017, 16:58
dearmrman
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True. With this show, you can't always be sure that what you're seeing is as it appears to be.


Again, it's possible, but Sherlock and John have never struck me as having the sort of bromance where they spontaneously text 'Hi' to each other. I think we were also shown John either thinking back and/ or reading the girl's number, so I believe we were certainly meant to assume it was to her.


Q1: Do you mean why the receptionist, or why the aquarium? I can't remember why the aquarium (although since it was one of the receptionist's favourite places, it may have been her idea), but Sherlock twigged it was her after Lady Whatsit was adamant it wasn't her that betrayed AGRA. Sherlock put English Lady + is privvy to all Lady Whatsit's meetings + Mary's remark that receptionists know everything together and came up with the receptionist.

Q2: She drugged him simply to be able to get away with the USB stick he had. Her plan was to disappear, but John and Sherlock had put a tracker on the USB stick. As you do.
That's not to say John knows it is Sherlock.....
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Old 02-01-2017, 17:08
sw2963
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Toby's face at the bus stop billboard reminded me of John Simm's Saxon in Doctor Who S3
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Old 02-01-2017, 17:31
lady_mary
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Can someone explain why Mary disguised herself as an obnoxious American and feigned illness to be wheelchaired off the plane - which really brought attention to herself?
.
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Old 02-01-2017, 18:02
Versailles
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Can someone explain why Mary disguised herself as an obnoxious American and feigned illness to be wheelchaired off the plane - which really brought attention to herself?
.

I am at loss regarding every Mary movement in this, so I would like to know too
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Old 02-01-2017, 18:03
Mark39London
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Can someone explain why Mary disguised herself as an obnoxious American and feigned illness to be wheelchaired off the plane - which really brought attention to herself?
.
It was to get the attention od the cabin crew, in order to give them the feeling that she was an anxious flyer (people who are anxious or scared often talk too much/talk gibberish and American was just a cover). She then did the 'oh my god, I'm dying' routine, knowing that they would take care of her sympathetically. She also picked the member of crew who looked similar enough for her to imitate.
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Old 02-01-2017, 18:05
Virgil Tracy
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Can someone explain why Mary disguised herself as an obnoxious American and feigned illness to be wheelchaired off the plane - which really brought attention to herself?
.
I think she swapped places with the stewardess , but it was a bit of a pointless scene , it was like - oh the actress does this funny American character lets put it in .
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Old 02-01-2017, 18:26
Normandie
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It was to get the attention od the cabin crew, in order to give them the feeling that she was an anxious flyer (people who are anxious or scared often talk too much/talk gibberish and American was just a cover). She then did the 'oh my god, I'm dying' routine, knowing that they would take care of her sympathetically. She also picked the member of crew who looked similar enough for her to imitate.
Yes, I agree - that was my interpretation too.

But what was the purpose of the switch? That made no sense to me other than giving us a mini-reveal of Mary not being in the wheelchair - suddenly she's the stewardess. It was almost like a comedy skit. It was a self-indulgent filler for a story and plot that couldn't fill the time without the padding.

(I didn't hate the episode, I just think the show is a bit of a victim of its own success and it shows).
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