[kidspud]

Quote:

Originally Posted by swordman

The fact you don't understand what part the iphone plays in Apples strategy is not unusual.

And now just like every other product is declining in the same way

When a product makes you two thirds of your profits sometimes better left alone,

http://www.businessinsider.com/iphone-profit-2012-8

however you carry on with your comparison to every other failing apple product.

There is an old saying: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. is the definition of ..

I'm pretty happy with my understanding of their strategy, thanks.

Thanks for the link to the 18 month old article. By the way, it say "likely to account for two thirds", I don't think they are too sure themselves.

[swordman]

OK then 18 months old, given the failure of most of their products in that time ipad etc it may be more. But you hang on to 18 months and the word 'likely' as reasons I am wrong

[calico_pie]

Quote:

Originally Posted by swordman

OK then 18 months old, given the failure of most of their products in that time ipad etc it may be more. But you hang on to 18 months and the word 'likely' as reasons I am wrong

Only if your definition of "failure" is "anything other than record breaking success".

[swordman]

Has there been record breaking success over the last 18 months then? You must know something no one else does, do share.

[calico_pie]

Quote:

Originally Posted by swordman

Has there been record breaking success over the last 18 months then? You must know something no one else does, do share.

Not that I know of, but that's not what I said.

The point is that not having record breaking success does not equal failure.

[swordman]

Doesn't equal record breaking success either which you said. The simple fact is comparing the iPhone to any other product is folly simple as that. Claiming this was done for the Mac or iPad is irrelevant the iPhone is in smooth get league to all these. Not to mention that these products are already on a downward curve.

[kidspud]

Quote:

Originally Posted by swordman

Doesn't equal record breaking success either which you said. The simple fact is comparing the iPhone to any other product is folly simple as that. Claiming this was done for the Mac or iPad is irrelevant the iPhone is in smooth get league to all these. Not to mention that these products are already on a downward curve.

Comparing the strategy of a company and how it has applied it to every product it has brought out is only folly if you want to claim that they wouldn't have followed it if a dead man was still in charge.

You appear to have an advantage over anyone else because you appear to know the inner thoughts of this dead man. Shame there is no evidence to back it up.

I lose track of your definition of failure, it goes from the sublime to the rediculous (but mainly rediculous)

[swordman]

I think your lack of understanding was clearly demonstrated a post or two back.

Isn't it amazing that every single post of yours contains no actual point of view, no actual constructive argument no reason why things should be viewed differently. I wonder what actual contribution you actually make be interesting to find out.

However to answer your very silly point would jobs have brought out the 5c I doubt very much. I would expect he would have made the iPhone more desirable. I do however concede that is becoming an increasingly difficult task.

[kidspud]

Quote:

Originally Posted by swordman

I think your lack of understanding was clearly demonstrated a post or two back.

Isn't it amazing that every single post of yours contains no actual point of view, no actual constructive argument no reason why things should be viewed differently. I wonder what actual contribution you actually make be interesting to find out.

However to answer your very silly point would jobs have brought out the 5c I doubt very much. I would expect he would have made the iPhone more desirable. I do however concede that is becoming an increasingly difficult task.

I think your inability to see others points of view is blind ignorance.

[calico_pie]

Quote:

Originally Posted by swordman

Doesn't equal record breaking success either which you said. The simple fact is comparing the iPhone to any other product is folly simple as that. Claiming this was done for the Mac or iPad is irrelevant the iPhone is in smooth get league to all these. Not to mention that these products are already on a downward curve.

I did not say that.

You said:

"OK then 18 months old, given the failure of most of their products in that time ipad etc it may be more."

To which I replied:

"Only if your definition of 'failure' is 'anything other than record breaking success.'".

[swordman]

Yes and in the 18 months that my failure comment referred to there has been no "record breaking success". In fact all products have seen a downturn in their performance practically the opposite of "record breaking success"

[swordman]

Quote:

Originally Posted by kidspud

I think your inability to see others points of view is blind ignorance.

I apologise and your point is what I must have missed it.

[kidspud]

Quote:

Originally Posted by swordman

I apologise and your point is what I must have missed it.

Apology accepted.

[swordman]

That's a strange point, what does it mean

[calico_pie]

Quote:

Originally Posted by swordman

Yes and in the 18 months that my failure comment referred to there has been no "record breaking success". In fact all products have seen a downturn in their performance practically the opposite of "record breaking success"

Not really.

As I said originally, its absurd to define "failure" as "anything other than record breaking success".

Suppose you run a business, and in the first five years, your profits are:

1. £100k
2. £200k
3. £300k
4. £500k
5. £400k

Has year 5 been a failure?

[kidspud]

Quote:

Originally Posted by swordman

I apologise and your point is what I must have missed it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by swordman

That's a strange point, what does it mean

Have you got a comma missing? Not having trouble with your keyboard again?

In answer to the question I think you are asking. My point is and has always been that Apple have followed the same strategy with the iPhone, that they have with many of their products in recent memory. They have been consistent with their approach.

This was true when Jobs was in charge, and continues to be the case.

I'm still happy to accept your apology

[kidspud]

Quote:

Originally Posted by calico_pie

Not really.

As I said originally, its absurd to define "failure" as "anything other than record breaking success".

Suppose you run a business, and in the first five years, your profits are:

1. £100k
2. £200k
3. £300k
4. £500k
5. £400k

Has year 5 been a failure?

Have you used Samsungs financial results in that example

[swordman]

Quote:

Originally Posted by kidspud

Have you got a comma missing? Not having trouble with your keyboard again?

In answer to the question I think you are asking. My point is and has always been that Apple have followed the same strategy with the iPhone, that they have with many of their products in recent memory. They have been consistent with their approach.

This was true when Jobs was in charge, and continues to be the case.

I'm still happy to accept your apology

Oh so your point was a statement, not an actual point, I see.

Well we shall see how this strategy pans out shall we, you seem content with its sound basis, do the same thing again and again. I am doubting it.

[swordman]

Quote:

Originally Posted by calico_pie

Not really.

As I said originally, its absurd to define "failure" as "anything other than record breaking success".

Suppose you run a business, and in the first five years, your profits are:

1. £100k
2. £200k
3. £300k
4. £500k
5. £400k

Has year 5 been a failure?

Pie I haven't got the energy for more lists full of nonsensical and hypothetical figures that bear no resemblance to reality.

Mind you I am surprised I never had your answer to the one I posed you

[clonmult]

Quote:

Originally Posted by calico_pie

Not really.

As I said originally, its absurd to define "failure" as "anything other than record breaking success".

Suppose you run a business, and in the first five years, your profits are:

1. £100k
2. £200k
3. £300k
4. £500k
5. £400k

Has year 5 been a failure?

Depends on your targets. For quite a lot of companies that would be deemed a failure. Any form of downturn should be treated seriously, the company should stop resting on their laurels (as Apple are doing, but then so are most Android vendors) and try something radical.

[kidspud]

Quote:

Originally Posted by swordman

Oh so your point was a statement, not an actual point, I see.

Well we shall see how this strategy pans out shall we, you seem content with its sound basis, do the same thing again and again. I am doubting it.

What a strange thing to say your point is only a statement, what else do you think it is.

I'm happy for you to doubt their strategy (if I'm honest, I don't think they are listening to you). It is when you try and claim you know what Jobs (or Steve to you) would have done that it starts to get silly.

[calico_pie]

Quote:

Originally Posted by swordman

Pie I haven't got the energy for more lists full of nonsensical and hypothetical figures that bear no resemblance to reality.

Mind you I am surprised I never had your answer to the one I posed you

Nothing complicated about it.

Year 5 less than year 4, but still substantial and more than years 1-3.

Not really a failure.

Which part don't you understand?

Apologies if I missed something earlier - remind me and I'll certainly answer.

[calico_pie]

Quote:

Originally Posted by clonmult

Depends on your targets. For quite a lot of companies that would be deemed a failure. Any form of downturn should be treated seriously, the company should stop resting on their laurels (as Apple are doing, but then so are most Android vendors) and try something radical.

Fair enough, but people are happy to use headline figures alone for Apple.

The smartphone and tablet markets have seen huge growth in the last few years - it would be unrealistic to expect that rate of growth continue indefinitely.

[Zack06]

Quote:

Originally Posted by calico_pie

Nothing complicated about it.

Year 5 less than year 4, but still substantial and more than years 1-3.

Not really a failure.

Which part don't you understand?

Apologies if I missed something earlier - remind me and I'll certainly answer.

Complicated no, irrelevant and wholly inaccurate, yes.

Apple isn't just some entrant in the mobile market chugging along and experiencing some minor fluctuations, they are haemorrhaging profit and market share at a very noticeable rate.

Your analogy makes no sense as Apple have not started from a low point in the mobile market like Google did. Apple was the very first entrant into the modern form of the mobile market. The iPhone redefined the smartphone segment and gave Apple an unparalleled head start.

To say or insinuate that Apple's current predicament is just a minor blip not only shows lack of thinking and understanding, it shows a severe oversight on the issues and factors that are causing this for Apple on your part.

Their profits have been falling for 3 years consecutively and their market share has rapidly diminished worldwide. The only reason their shareholders are placated is because of the large cash reserves Apple has. But at this rate of deterioration, it may not be long before they are forced to access those reserves, alarming shareholders and causing panic and doubt in the process. The iPhone 5S sold less than the 5 at launch and there has been no evidence whatsoever that the iPhone 5C is a success.

It's plainly obvious that Apple are heading towards a very difficult situation in the mobile market, Android has a grip on all areas of the market from the top down, and Apple seems to be finding it harder and harder to compete with it in the high-end. Developers are flocking to Android and they are losing one of their remaining trump cards in quality apps and good returns for developers. This really is going to turn into the Mac vs. Windows scenario from the late 80s and 90s.

Apple made the mistake of arrogance then, and allowed Windows to take 90% of the market and force them into bankruptcy, and the same will happen again with Android. The iPhone seems to be heading towards a niche product future, highly priced with sales vastly incomparable to the market leader. All this shows is that Apple haven't learned from their mistakes, and neither it seems, have their supporters.

[clonmult]

Quote:

Originally Posted by calico_pie

Fair enough, but people are happy to use headline figures alone for Apple.

The smartphone and tablet markets have seen huge growth in the last few years - it would be unrealistic to expect that rate of growth continue indefinitely.

There has been huge growth, but there hasn't been anything really "new" for years. Each iteration brings a minor spec bump and nothing truly interesting.

Thats not to say that Android or iOS are particularly bad. I've got a 4S, its a usable device. I've had Android phones, they've been okay.

MS have attempted something different on the interface, and for ages prior to actually using it, I thought it was ugly, garish and different for the sake of being different. But in reality it does actually work extremely well. WP is experiencing the largest growth and is definitely the third "major" ecosystem. Its possible (maybe not probable) that in a year or two they'll be rivalling Apple on sales.