Al Jazeera Arabic

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Greebo

16-01-2014

Al Jazeera Arabic has appeared on COM7 in SD - LCN is 84.

This will only be available on Freeview HD receivers (in COM7 areas) despite it being in SD - this may cause some confusion!

eladkse

16-01-2014

That's... very surprising. How many slots does that leave on COM7 now? One and a half?

a516

16-01-2014

Originally Posted by eladkse:
“That's... very surprising. How many slots does that leave on COM7 now? One and a half?”

One HD slot and two SD slots.

jimbo

16-01-2014

What was 84 beforehand?

tomee

16-01-2014

Originally Posted by jimbo:
“What was 84 beforehand?”

It was empty.

Digi Man

16-01-2014

Originally Posted by tomee:
“It was empty.”

Before it was empty, wasn't it Al Jazeera 6-8 or something like that, or am I getting mixed up with another LCN?

jimbo

16-01-2014

thanks - so I realised when I scanned the box.

I did think that the entire content of these muxes were to be HD.

It now begs the question as to how long will it be bfore there is justification for changing ALL the freeview muxes to MPEG4. It would be a start

kev

16-01-2014

Originally Posted by a516:
“One HD slot and two SD slots.”

Is that actually true here? I know the local TV multiplexes are 1HD = 2SD because they keep the SD services in MPEG 4 for maximum compatability, but presumably on a DVB-T2 multiplex they have used MPEG-4? Is anyone able to confirm that?

Greebo

16-01-2014

Originally Posted by kev:
“...but presumably on a DVB-T2 multiplex they have used MPEG-4? Is anyone able to confirm that?”

If I understand this correctly, yes they have:

Code:

Video #4
ID                                       : 601 (0x259)
Menu ID                                  : 41056 (0xA060)
Format                                   : AVC
Format/Info                              : Advanced Video Codec
Format profile                           : High@L3.0
Format settings, CABAC                   : Yes
Format settings, ReFrames                : 4 frames
Codec ID                                 : 27
Duration                                 : 22s 40ms
Width                                    : 544 pixels
Height                                   : 576 pixels
Display aspect ratio                     : 1.85:1
Frame rate                               : 25.000 fps
Standard                                 : PAL
Color space                              : YUV
Chroma subsampling                       : 4:2:0
Bit depth                                : 8 bits
Scan type                                : MBAFF
Scan order                               : Top Field First
Color primaries                          : BT.601 PAL
Transfer characteristics                 : BT.470 System B, BT.470 System G
Matrix coefficients                      : BT.601

For comparison, here's BBC News HD's video:

Code:

Video #1
ID                                       : 101 (0x65)
Menu ID                                  : 40960 (0xA000)
Format                                   : AVC
Format/Info                              : Advanced Video Codec
Format profile                           : High@L4.0
Format settings, CABAC                   : Yes
Format settings, ReFrames                : 4 frames
Format settings, GOP                     : M=8, N=32
Codec ID                                 : 27
Duration                                 : 23s 80ms
Width                                    : 1 920 pixels
Height                                   : 1 080 pixels
Display aspect ratio                     : 16:9
Frame rate                               : 25.000 fps
Standard                                 : Component
Color space                              : YUV
Chroma subsampling                       : 4:2:0
Bit depth                                : 8 bits
Scan type                                : MBAFF
Color primaries                          : BT.709
Transfer characteristics                 : BT.709
Matrix coefficients                      : BT.709

Last edited by Greebo : 16-01-2014 at 15:59

chrisy

16-01-2014

Originally Posted by Greebo:
“

Code:

Width : 544 pixels Height : 576 pixels

”

WHAT??! They are using 3/4 resolution, even though it's a designated HD mux and an MPEG4 service?

zak2012

16-01-2014

what about Sky? is there any news about Al Jazeera arabic to come on sky?

lotrjw

16-01-2014

Originally Posted by jimbo:
“thanks - so I realised when I scanned the box.

I did think that the entire content of these muxes were to be HD.

It now begs the question as to how long will it be bfore there is justification for changing ALL the freeview muxes to MPEG4. It would be a start”

Oh I hope so, the other COMs 4-6 and especially 5 and 6 should start converting channels to AVC encoding!
Then DVB-T2 when each MUX has a full set of AVC channels!
This would certainly start take up of 'freeviewHD' equipment in the areas of the main transmitters!
Once all the COM MUXs are converted they could mandate that one more PSB MUX go DVB-T2!
The remaining DVB-T1 PSB MUX would then have to carry all PSB video channels!
That would mean 10 channels on there and no radio, but the BBC could start using its BBC B MUX for just its own HD channels then and might be able to squeeze its radio channels on there!

Im guessing if it does go something like this, then the last PSB MUX still in DVB-T1 mode, would be easily converted to DVB-T2 in 2018!

a516

16-01-2014

Originally Posted by kev:
“Is that actually true here? I know the local TV multiplexes are 1HD = 2SD because they keep the SD services in MPEG 4 for maximum compatability, but presumably on a DVB-T2 multiplex they have used MPEG-4? Is anyone able to confirm that?”

I assume you meant MPEG2 when referring to local TV mux, where it is 1 HD or 2 SD. But MPEG4 should be around 3 SD or 1 HD if full resolution is used. Obviously, if they're using reduced resolution than it's going to be far more than that!

Winston_1

16-01-2014

Originally Posted by jimbo:
“What was 84 beforehand?”

CNN part time, a while back though.

a516

16-01-2014

Originally Posted by Winston_1:
“CNN part time, a while back though.”

After that, on 22nd August 2012, Al Jazeera English moved to 84. A week later it moved to 83, with Al Jazeera 6-8 taking on channel 84 until it was axed at the end of September 2012.

Raymondthebest

16-01-2014

Why cant it have 6am-8am slot on freeview national on channel 84 instead having it on multiplex for hd and many people have this channel

eladkse

16-01-2014

Originally Posted by Raymondthebest:
“Why cant it have 6am-8am slot on freeview national on channel 84 instead having it on multiplex for hd and many people have this channel”

Because 6-8am are useless hours. At least on COM7 it gets to broadcast 24/7.

lotrjw

16-01-2014

Originally Posted by Raymondthebest:
“Why cant it have 6am-8am slot on freeview national on channel 84 instead having it on multiplex for hd and many people have this channel”

Originally Posted by eladkse:
“Because 6-8am are useless hours. At least on COM7 it gets to broadcast 24/7.”

The other thing is I bet its cheaper even for the 24 hours on COM 7 than if it was on COMs 4, 5 or 6 with just 6-8 hours!
I think other less popular channels from COMs 4-6, should go onto COMs 7 and 8 and have COMs 4, 5 and 6 gradually cleared, so that a conversion to DVB-T2 can occur asap!

technologist

16-01-2014

Originally Posted by lotrjw:
“........
This would certainly start take up of 'freeviewHD' equipment in the areas of the main transmitters!
Once all the COM MUXs are converted they could mandate that one more PSB MUX go DVB-T2!
The remaining DVB-T1 PSB MUX would then have to carry all PSB video ........”

I think it more likely that the PSB will go T2 /AVC before the comm as it is in the BBC (at least) financial interest to do so at contract breakpoint ....
..... Hence BBC commitment to com 7 ...
But t that point Arqiva could easily slip in AVC coders on its/ the comm muxes after all it is not regionalised ,,
And thus say 40 coder max ,..
And it all happens a at the retune needed for DSO 2 which also keeps the costs down.

kasg

16-01-2014

Originally Posted by chrisy:
“WHAT??! They are using 3/4 resolution, even though it's a designated HD mux and an MPEG4 service? ”

That is pretty shocking and sets an unfortunate precedent.

christoFar

16-01-2014

Originally Posted by kasg:
“That is pretty shocking and sets an unfortunate precedent.”

Actually, given the huge costs of Freeview broadcasts, and the declining cost of IPTV/Cable broadcast, it could well save terrestrial in my view.

kasg

16-01-2014

Originally Posted by christoFar:
“Actually, given the huge costs of Freeview broadcasts, and the declining cost of IPTV/Cable broadcast, it could well save terrestrial in my view.”

Well I think most of us were hoping that the move to DVB-T2 would at least see the end of the horrors of 544*576 resolution.

Kargo

16-01-2014

Originally Posted by a516:
“One HD slot and two SD slots.”

Wow only room for 1 more HD channel?

Thought they said there would be room for 10 on this new mux

kasg

16-01-2014

Originally Posted by Kargo:
“Wow only room for 1 more HD channel?

Thought they said there would be room for 10 on this new mux ”

No, 10 on COM7 and COM8, 5 on each. COM8 still has nothing.

gottago

16-01-2014

Interestingly this doesn't seem to have a license on the Ofcom page and they're usually quick to update that list.

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