If I worked for Vodafone, you'd have a network that would be potentially rivalling EE's network - a network with 3G900, 3G2100, 4G800 and 4G1800 on every mast and 4G2600 on most masts. Very rural ones might just get 800 and 1800, because 2600 doesn't have great coverage... But I might put 2600 on the rural ones too, to future-proof the network.

2G900? 2G1800? If you want those (3G900/2100 would do all of the calls) long term, you'd be looking an alternative network. It'd be a gradual phase out though, not a sudden switch-off.

Oh, and VoLTE on every 4G frequency (not just 800) and Wifi calling that actually supports SMS.

That's how I'd run the network - but unfortunately, I don't... so there are swathes of the UK still on 2G and more people getting congested 3G/4G (due to no 1800/2100/2600).

One word. CapeX. Also, time.

Got Vodafone 2600MHz on the M25 near Brooklands Museum. 75mbps on just the 2600 carrier so not bad!

There is a cost to do all that work, and with loads of different equipment, I can see that it's not just as easy, of cheap, as doing everything everywhere (sic).

I assume the plan is to add 1800 and 2600 later, and we also know that a lot of 900 will be refarmed for 3G.

It won't happen overnight. No network can do it overnight.

What is it that needs typed in to open up the menu that tella you what band etc. that you're using? I've a Galaxy S7 Edge.

And yet today on Oxford Street I got my fastest speed test ever - hitting 90 down and 40 up on EE with my new Galaxy S7. Granted it isn't 180! But its a lot faster than the 30 I was seeing with Three with my old Galaxy S4. I wonder how much of that is down to the network and how much of that is down to the S7!

I'd say nearly all the network.

But you are all set for EE switching on its 600Mbps service one day. Although I expect that day is a fair bit off...

You do realise that 4G/LTE can run on 900 and 2100 and indeed does in a number of places? That is the long term plan.

In which cases, what would happen to 2G and 3G?

2G using the 900 band, so refarming that to 3G would lose 2G (not that that is a problem, anyway)

3G2100 and 3G900 being refarmed to 4G would result in the loss of calls and data on older devices.

I'm guessing that the long term plan would be to get VoLTE on every band and have every band on 4G?

Probably all network based - my S4 has got 90Mbps on some EE masts before, so the S4 is still a capable phone.

From my experience EE 4G is faster than Three 4G as well.

Yes I hazard a guess that eventually all networks in the UK would have 4G as their base layer.

Bits can be refarmed now whilst still maintaining backwards compatibility. Have a look, for example at Vodafone CZ's coverage map (click on the dropdown menu next to 4G/LTE
http://www.vodafone.cz/en/coverage-map/

At some point, people are going to have to give up their old devices in any case. The way tech is in the modern world, it's unrealistic to expect to hold onto something for years and still expect full functionality.

Which is why VF should re farm their 3G as they never invested in it so you could argue the least used

And end up with sub-optimal call quality and data that won't work?

If they need capacity, they should use their 1800 and 2600!

Agreed. There's a lot of talk on this thread about refarming another 5Mhz of 900 to 3G, whereas I think it would be a much better use of it to refarm it straight to 4G now. 3G is only going to be a stopgap until 4G adoption becomes more widespread in any case.

As you say, they could do the same with their 2100 - keep 10Mhz of it 3G for DC-HSPA for the time being, then use their remaining 5Mhz for 4G.

From what I've seen, they've gone for 2G/4G everywhere and not got much 3G.

Okay if people have got modern phones... but those 3G only phones would be made obsolete.

It may sound harsh, but my response to that would be 'Too bad - time to upgrade'. The 3G phones would still work on 2G anyway, so there's always voice, text and limited data fallback.

There are some very reasonably priced 4G phones available now, so it's not really a case of depriving people for economic reasons, it's more about tackling people's resistance to change.

3G now inevitably has a pretty limited shelf life - it was always a flawed technology due to the breathing and cell integration issues. Once voice is sorted on 4G and coverage is up to scratch, there's no compelling reason to use 3G any more. It's taking up spectrum which could be better used on 4G to give a more efficient service.

Presumably if there was never much 3G, people there wouldn't be that bothered and would have bought a 4G phone anyway?

And you can get a 4G phone for under £50 on PAYG anyway.

I disagree 3G data does not work now - it is only starting too because of the 4G overhaul. Cell breathing is going to affect call quality & data (ie can you use it or not).

That was my logic, you know better than me but VF lost their way with 3G but made firm commitment and investment from the beginning with 4G so it makes sense to leapfrog 2G > 4G which in effect is what they are doing with Beacon.

I was referring to the data flow on 2G, and the reasons why 2G should have been ditched...

2G doesn't support HD Voice as of yet. 3G does. And calls on 3G sound much better in terms of quality, anyway.

3G data is fine on upgraded sites and even on some non upgraded sites - well, it'll be better than GPRS @ 0.055Mbps!

Yes, 3G phones work on 2G, but 2G is terrible for data (55kbps or 220kbps - yeah right!) and call quality on 2G is worse than 3G. You will know the difference when you've been used to 3G quality calls and data.

Do these reasonably priced 4G phones support VoLTE - i.e. the thing that you need to use to make reasonable quality calls if 3G is absent?

I agree that 3G could go when voice is sorted on 4G - however, the same would be said for 2G. When voice is sorted on 4G, you won't need any other technology - because of cell breathing and efficiency/coverage issues on 3G, and terrible call quality/data flow on 2G.

When we get 4G sorted, with voice on all phones, then both 2G and 3G can be refarmed. If you've got an old legacy device, you'll need to switch.

Seems crazy that people are supporting 2G, when in fact 3G outperforms 2G in all of the main areas, with the exception of coverage (2G outperforms 3G in coverage terms, due to cell breathing).

I for one fully support 2G in the terms of being able to use a phone to phone someone which was its original purpose. The VF 2G network is the best network to perform this task in my opinion. I would rather make a SD call than not be able to make a HD call so I do not think it is crazy being able to use a phone to make a call, I also think with the amount of devices out there being 2G it needs to stay for a while but am in no way suggestion this is the way forward for the future as that will be 4G, 5G whatever.

It would be crazy to think that 2G devices would need to be changed into 3G devices then to be later changed in to 4G devices, for example looking at the bigger picture there are tens if not hundreds of thousands of M2M applications out running VO2 2G which to switch off because of the need for 3G does not make sense as the need for 3G is not there as 4G has the ability to overtake and replace it.. Let 2G stay and move the 3G users to 4G and this will allow 4G M2M to penetrate the market as this is in its infancy the same with 4G femtocells for personal as this tech needs time to mature and drop in price.

The bigger picture says GPRS is OK for these M2M applications as that is what they were built around they do not Gb/s to work just the ability to send a few K of data.

Turning off 2G before 3G would be insanity and it won't happen. 2G is a perfectly good legacy technology and one that works particularly well on VO2. It means you can use the phone as a phone. 3G on the other hand needs to go. It causes more problems than it solves in the long term. It's a real shame that 4G has to rely on VoLTE to do voice.

Of course there are going to be people left with old 3G only phones, or 4G ones which can't do VOIP but that number will be falling rapidly as of this year and in a fairly short time (couple or 3 years), only a hard core will remain. VOD is improving 3G as it upgrades masts to 4G too cater for the current market but there is no doubt that the plan will be to gradually re-farm that 3G to 4G (or even 5G) and leave 2G in place. We'll get to a stage where everyone with a phone will be able to make or take a call, anyone with a 4G VoLTE phone will be able to call on that too At some point anyone stuck with a non 4G phone will find that 3G gets worse and worse until they are forced to upgrade or stick with EDGE and calls.

Remember when Analogue TV was turned off? There was a lot of hoo ha about how was against people's human rights but they did it and it was fine. Some people bought a cheap STB and some upgraded their TV. But nobody (or very few people) actually died because of it.

Your only defence of 3G seems to be that the call quality is better than 2G. So what? If someone cares so little about data that they are walking around with a Nokia 6310i in their pocket because it suits their needs perfectly, are they really going to worry about HD voice? Nope. I know a few like that and they are perfectly happy. I call them and can have a decent voice conversation over 2G. It's fine. It works. They don't need saving. I'll tell you what will hack them off more and that is 2G being turned off and being forced to upgrade to some sort of fancy new phone. Anyone who needs data will surely get a 4G phone at some point.

What will happen is that 2G will stay, 4G will improve and 3G at some point will fade away and be re-farmed. The 2G guys will not notice. The 4G people will be happy. The very small core of users who refuse to upgrade their 2/3G phone but demand a good data service will be disappointed but they'll find in the end that all the networks are doing the same thing.

Not sure if this has been mentioned, but vodafone seem to be doing an EE-type thing where they're giving out 50GB of free data on new sims?

I found something about it, and it seemed to say on the order page that it was only for residents of Northern Ireland (which I am). In the postcode bit, it also said, this must be a Northern Ireland postcode.

However here, http://www.vodafone.co.uk/terms-and-...tra-50GB-data/

it doesn't mention NI, so maybe anyone can get it?

Anyway, I ordered this promo sim, it came today. I didn't top it up or anything.

I have no mins or texts, but data works. There seems to be no way to see how much data I have used (other than built in phones one). Voda sent a text to the sim saying something like, you've been given 50GB as part of our extravaganza! or something..

Anyway I thought I'd mention it? Cos I have 50GB of data with absolutely no top up

Here's the order page:

https://freesim.vodafone.co.uk/north...tracker=PRBNGX

EDIT: Just found a GB order page I think, it certainly mentions it here anyway:

http://www.vodafone.co.uk/shop/bundl...lans/index.htm

(really sorry if everyone already knows about this and I'm being stupid )

Pretty sure I've seen SIMs that offer 50GB in supermarkets in GB.

I believe NI has different laws regarding promotions etc (that's why the TV giveaways always say "not available in NI") - maybe Vodafone have to run two separate but equal ones?